The former bears the 'Bungie' name, that's all what needs to be said.
On the other hand, The Division's retention wasn't that great.
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Microsoft Studios (& Partners) Current and Future Landscape
- Thread starter Banjo-Kazooie
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On the other hand, The Division's retention wasn't that great.
Jaguar Victory
Member
Because the Dark Zone was a shit show of frustration. The game was really fun though and I enjoyed it until the end game was all that was left.
SOT has been €25 on Amazon Spain for several months now, €30 on Amazon Germany. Been like that way too long to be a cock up.
Some people were asking who is doing Phantom Dust HD, Kotaku UK has Code Mystics listed as the people who are working on that. They did work on KI Definitive Edition
Bits N Pieces
Member
No it won't.
Somebody ask if this is Phantom Dust HD or the supposed revived sequel
This deserves its own thread. Shannon Loctis, GM of Microsoft Studios Publishing confirms Phantom Dust is still in the works and we'll be seeing it soon. If I had to guess it's going to get a 2017 release.
I thought there was a good chance the game was long gone.
She's talking about the HD remaster. Not the remake.
Its just the remaster beeing done by Code Mystics
daTRUballin
Member
So much fear mongering going on in this thread about Rare and Sea of Thieves. If SoT really does bomb, are we really sure Rare will be shut down? During all of these 15 years at MS, Rare has never been shut down after the failures of games like Grabbed by the Ghoulies, Kameo, Viva Piñata, BK: Nuts & Bolts, Kinect Sports Rivals, etc. Virtually every Rare game on Xbox consoles besides the first two Kinect Sports games have been commercial failures. What makes us think they will shut them down after SoT?
I reckon Rare's legacy might be enough to keep them from being shut down. Like others have said, it would be a huge PR disaster for MS if they were to ever close down Rare. I think the worst case scenario if SoT bombs would be that Rare could face another wave of layoffs, or MS might relegate them to working on whatever latest gimmicks MS has, like the Hololens or something. Similar to how they relegated them to Kinect after all of their OG Xbox and 360 games didn't meet sales expectations.
I reckon Rare's legacy might be enough to keep them from being shut down. Like others have said, it would be a huge PR disaster for MS if they were to ever close down Rare. I think the worst case scenario if SoT bombs would be that Rare could face another wave of layoffs, or MS might relegate them to working on whatever latest gimmicks MS has, like the Hololens or something. Similar to how they relegated them to Kinect after all of their OG Xbox and 360 games didn't meet sales expectations.
SneakersSO
Member
The Kinect sports games Rare produced actually sold really well, at least the first two. Rivals didn't do well though, and like you said, Rare hasn't had the most successful history as an MS studio. This is just a much more budget strapped MS than most people are used to seeing - if SoT doesn't deliver, don't think Rare is gonna get to coast onto a new project so easily.
When was the last time we heard about the game? I thought it was long cancelled and if it's been in development for this long then maybe it's more than just a simple HD Remaster?
Silver lining is that they could probably cash in by reviving an old IP? Something that was guaranteed to sell decently, regardless if quality, on name alone. (Banjo comes to mind)
I still think Sea of Thieves is going to do well.
HeisenbergWW62
Banned
I remake was announced at E3 2014, got cancelled
An HD remaster was announced at E3 2016, no word since
DriftingSpirit
Member
The remake was cancelled. The remaster is still a go and the last we heard about it was at E3 last year.
SneakersSO
Member
I mean, you don't need the studio to revive an old Rare IP, but I guess that would come across as shitty. But it worked for KI. And Banjo didn't sell well and it had the name - I doubt you see MS ever revisit those SP focused older Rare games. It's just not what they want right now.
And nah, SOT won't take off. I really wouldn't get invested in it being successful because there is a much larger chance it flips than not.
Samurai G0SU
Member
no love for the confirmation about the voodoo vince remaster doing well? dang yall!
PanicFreak
Member
Fable Legends had the "it's pretty good but I'd rather play something else" feel to it. The impressions I'm seeing around SoT are way more positive than for Fable Legends.
If it gets great reviews, it will probably do well. We'll see.
I have always wondered why Microsoft can't take the old Rare IP, like a Banjo or a Jet Force Gemini, and make 20 or 30 dollar digital entries for those series. I think that people would be receptive toward that approach (as long as they were good games) and it improve people's opinions of their first party output. It seems like Microsoft can't seem to wrap their heads around having a number of small successful games to wrap around their core franchises. They only seem to want to develop more core franchises.
Yeah, as others said, its not the same project announced in 2014. That one is dead since Darkside games was dropped from the project.
Phantom Dust HD was announced at E3 last year, after the press conference.
Yeah I know there isn't a remake anymore.
Bits N Pieces
Member
The negativity around SoT on this board is something else.
Crayon
Member
shinobi602
Member
Maybe some but don't lump everyone together. I think it's going to be a great game. Rare's still got talent and everything I've seen so far looks wonderful and good fun.
What I'm not sure of is if it'll speak to the Xbox fanbase. It's got the MMO factor going on, it's not story driven, it's pirate themed with a colorful persona. A large part of the Xbox audience is busy with Destiny, COD and Battlefield. First person shooters with heavy marketing and widespread appeal. Will there be a large enough contingent to support Sea of Thieves on the platform? And on PC when it's relegated to Windows 10?
That's my thinking, not "lol I looove being negative".
It doesn't have to be the most played game ever on the console. But stuff like Ark and Elder scrolls online have found a solid niche and are doing fairly well on the system. If you could find that area and while not be a top most played thing, be relatively high and have MT's that are desirable, I think it'd be fine. Basically imo that means like 1.5-2 million copies sold and good retention rate. But also I have no idea of the budget as you might
Bits N Pieces
Member
This weeks lottery numbers, please
Im not picking out specific individuals just more a general tone I've noticed, somebody says its going to bomb and the next 20 comments chime in to sayI agree or there it is or something similar.
If games like Ark, The Division, Destiny can get get good numbers then why cant Rare with SoT? If the game was gathering negative press then I could agree with the sentiment but its not, everyone that plays it seems to love it. That must mean its going to bomb!
And just to add another Phil tweet into this thread because, why not....
Someone asked him
And his response was
Im not being a deluded fanboy here but I have a pretty good feeling that SoT is going to be a lot bigger than a lot of people (not all!) on this board think. Watch this space
LordRaptor
Member
And his response was
Im not being a deluded fanboy here but I have a pretty good feeling that SoT is going to be a lot bigger than a lot of people (not all!) on this board think. Watch this space
You're going to take this as an unwarranted display of negativity towards SOT, but what were the other titles in contention for that endorsement?
As in something new that might blow up and has been announced.
Crayon
Member
This weeks lottery numbers, please
If picking lotto numbers was as easy as predicting sot bombing, we'd have to all split the winnings and everyone would get a buck.
Bits N Pieces
Member
Well out of the titles we know about - SoT, State of Decay 2, Crackdown 3. I would give it to SoT as well. I cannae see Phil announcing a new game to some random dude on Twitter
Bits N Pieces
Member
I agree with mostly everything you just said, the art style is definitely a problem but I think a damn good beta can turn the game around. If I'm looking at it right now then yeah, the games gonna flop big time, but I still believe the Beta is gonna have glowing impressions and people will come around on this game big time. When that happens I think MS will give SOT a bigger marketing budget than they anticipated aswell.
And I know I'm probably the only one on this forum that thinks this way but I don't think the Windows 10 store will hurt it as much as people think. Sure it's gonna hurt it, but at the end of the day if it's a good game people will buy it wherever. See Origin, early Steam days with CS, League, Minecraft, Blizzard games, all those MMOs like Runescape, SWTOR, RIFT, LOTRO and so on. There's definitely a lot of problems with the W10 store that need fixed but we're a year out I think they will fix a lot of them before then. The store won't be perfect but it'll be serviceable. Would the game sell more on Steam? Absolutely, but that's not to say it can't do decent numbers on the Win 10 store either.
I think the difference with Halo, Forza, Gears is most people already bought Xbox's for those games before they planned to put their games on PC and with Gears not having crossplay I don't see many people buying it on the W10 store (plus.. Gears kind of came and went) and I bet a lot of people still think they're only on xbox but I have nothing to back that claim up just a hunch. Sea of Thieves on the other hand is a brand new IP, if it's among the top games on Twitch like I expect people will google "buy sea of thieves on PC" and get redirected to the Win10 store, the vast majority of people aren't even gonna know about the stores problems or anything, they'll just buy it. If MS was smart they'd even offer a free trial of like an hour from the get go, aswell.
And this is coming from someone who was down on the E3 reveal and thought it looked boring (I expected more exploration etc) so it's not like I particularly care for the game that much, though I will get it just to support Rare.
Bits N Pieces
Member
Some of the things that people are using to say that SoT is going to bomb has me scratching my head.
It's not about being negative about a Rare game, or just for giggles, but infact because historically speaking it doesn't seem like a surefire bet for success.
Talking about risk indeed...
It's a New IP, Pirate Themed, Pay to Play MMO, on a console (also on PC). And on Xbox (known for its big FPS/ TPS/ Sports US centric player base).
Let that sink in for a minute, and you'll understand why some might have concerns imo, as great as the game will (hopefully) be.
Steelyuhas
Member
No doubt they messed up the endgame and it hurt player retention, still an excellent selling game.
Not saying that Sea of Thieves is a auto-home run by any means, but the idea that the shared world co-op focused genre is a niche genre seems to be obviously not true to me.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
They had a quick trailer at e3 2016, stating it's a 2017 release.
Hard to gauge on this forum because you have people either not mentioning it as a release and just straight up saying it's cancelled. The release was never cancelled, the scope of the release was changed.
Bits N Pieces
Member
New IP can sell if its marketed properly, receives good reviews and has good WoM.
Pirates aren't popular?
Its a shared world adventure game. Lets call it SWAG for short
On more than one platform limits its chance of success?
Ark is doing really really well on Xbox.
I get that people dont think it will sell 5 million on day one but the number of posts I see and the subsequent number of posts who agree with them that SoT will bomb and Rare are getting shut is just absurd.
I think when people say bomb I think they mean fail to meet MS expectations by a large margin and to that extent I agree. I don't see them making their investment back on this title. They're going to need alot of micro transactions to make up what they don't in sales to break even.New IP can sell if its marketed properly, receives good reviews and has good WoM.
Pirates aren't popular?
Its a shared world adventure game. Lets call it SWAG for short
On more than one platform limits its chance of success?
Ark is doing really really well on Xbox.
I get that people dont think it will sell 5 million on day one but the number of posts I see and the subsequent number of posts who agree with them that SoT will bomb and Rare are getting shut is just absurd.
Edit: to elaborate whether or not SoT sales hit 5mil+ copies it could very well be a flop to MS if they're goal with the investment was to make another Minecraft size franchise. To me if the games as a service talk is to be believed this is exactly what they're after.
If that's what they want in my opinion take the RISK and release it at Minecraft price point. If your going to bet on micro transactions go all in.
I think SoT has the potential, MS just have to know how to market that game bettter.
Their trailers for the game are not getting numbers that indicate the hit it could be. Heck, they had a cool new video talking about co-op just two days ago and barely no one is talking about it.
Also, yeah, if Win10 doesnt change more before its out people wont bother. This game would for sure be a huge deal on Steam tho
Their trailers for the game are not getting numbers that indicate the hit it could be. Heck, they had a cool new video talking about co-op just two days ago and barely no one is talking about it.
Also, yeah, if Win10 doesnt change more before its out people wont bother. This game would for sure be a huge deal on Steam tho
wapplew
Member
It's fine. Give it early access treatment, let famous twitch steamers play it, it'll grow from there.
That's usually how those games get huge following, with rare polish and budget, it will be the biggest among them.
uncledonnie
Banned
I know exclusives are huge on GAF, but I look at the difference in software marketshare between Sony and Microsoft here (7% for Sony vs. 6% for MS), and it really seems like they don't make much difference at all. Especially when you take into account the install base difference. And you have to assume the overwhelming majority of Microsoft's share is Forza/Gears/Halo so it seems like they'd be just fine to continue that with the additional new IP here and there like Ori.
SneakersSO
Member
Getting good reviews does not guarantee success, at all. We have seen a ton of games get good, even great reviews, and do absolutely awful at retail. Its not uncommon. And its not like MS hasn't produced great reviewing games that did poorly at retail either, especially this generation.
Exclusives had a rough year last year.
New IP can sell if its marketed properly, receives good reviews and has good WoM.
Pirates aren't popular?
Its a shared world adventure game. Lets call it SWAG for short
On more than one platform limits its chance of success?
Ark is doing really really well on Xbox.
I get that people dont think it will sell 5 million on day one but the number of posts I see and the subsequent number of posts who agree with them that SoT will bomb and Rare are getting shut is just absurd.
I'm not saying it will bomb (wouldn't be surprised either way), but how many "SWAG" games are already out? It doesn't seem to have any hype and will have a ton of already established competition, competition that already has it's players hooked with 10s if not 100s of hours worth of building their character, it'll be a tough sell and these games need a good sized playerbase or they'll die quick. Though on the other hand it seems different enough that it could cut-out it's own little audience in an incredibly popular genre.
uncledonnie
Banned
True, but that seems like a trend that will continue.
It's the usual people, the same people that leaped out and concern trolled when Scalebound was canned.
SoT looks really good, my only request is a solid single player campaign (or online), but a campaign none the less.
If they gave a single fuck about prolonging the life of their games and nurturing/expanding player base for their games, they would. But initial profits & ecosystem control far outweigh anything for them currently.