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Oculus CEO: The headset and computer to run it will cost you ~$1,500

Not "recommended", minimum. You must have a 970 or better to use the Rift. Those specs were what Oculus was telling developers to design their apps around, to expect all computers to have. Oculus wants the Rift to be a "plug and play" experience, like a game console, and to do that they want to make sure all people have the same minimum experience (and 90fps, at the Rift resolution, in 3D, requires a beefy system).
No they did say recommended, not minimum. You're totally right that it's the minimum to ensure good performance on intensive games and for devs to target but there will be games and experiences that run on less than a 970. They just can't guarantee good enough performance on lesser cards for all games so it isn't recommended.
 
I imagine if the HMD's are priced well enough, adoption even on PC could be surprisingly good. Rudimentary rigs will be able to run 360 movies and on rail media, laptops included I'd imagine. I think VR as a whole will do just fine


yes but they won't price it as such for those types of functions. if they can release an oculus meant for only videos, or minecraft games then it will take off.

they probably don't want to introduce tiers to the oculus.
 
Cause some people think all VR should be as good as console VR.

lol Someones bitter :p VR will come in a massive range of experiences that all require different levels of hardware. I imagine anyone making content for Gear VR / Cardboard will have no troubles running it on any other hardware. Obviously a game utilizing every inch of performance out of a 970 won't run on the PS4 or Gear VR, what remains to be seen though, is how many of those we'll see, hopefully plenty.

For all we know, the PS4 could become the new "recommended spec" to give the greatest target audience as it would run on a wider range of PC's. We'll see.
 

Nipo

Member
The % of people that own a 970 on Steam is actually 5%, for some reason the DX11 category is split into two

I don't know what the sample size is. Steam has a huge user base, so even 5% could be hundreds of thousands of people.

There is a decent size market for oculus for sure but it isn't anywhere near "most people who game on PC." In reality it is probably less than 10% of active PC gamers.
 

LiquidMetal14

hide your water-based mammals
It all makes sense to me. This will be enthusiast driven initially. I'm not on board with this like I am with Vive but my set up is more than up to the task today and that's before my GPU upgrades.
 

Somnid

Member
Put me under "sounds about right." I expect Valve to clock in higher and I expect Sony to be cheaper but have difficulty driving their headset to the degree people might expect.
 

888

Member
Sounds cheap actually. Estimating 300 for the oculus. That's like 1200 for the PC which will land you a pretty decent pc.
 

Buggy Loop

Member
Console players are whining when they get 900p with graphics equivalent of low/medium from PC.

I'd wait to see what a VR PS4 game running 1080p @ 120fps looks like before already declaring winners lol. It likely wont be pretty, or very on-rail.

For most existing PC gamers it will not require an upgrade, or if so, very minor.
 
Are they even really competing with Sony? It's not like you have the choice of going Rift or Morpheus on PS4. If you have a PC, you're not going to buy a Morpheus for it. Their competition is the Vive, and you can expect around the same price point if not higher on that front.

The cost of the PS4 becomes negligible in this equation. If your PC isn't powerful enough Morpheus is an attractive option.
 
I was never expecting a Wii like "overnight success" for VR anyway. What we are seeing for various reasons (price for Oculus and likely Vive, tech for Sony) are the very early stages of VR, where you are going to see fairly niche enthusiast adoption. We are probably 5-10 years from the "My grandma wants a VR headset" stage.
 

Nipo

Member
Console players are whining when they get 900p with graphics equivalent of low/medium from PC.

I'd wait to see what a VR PS4 game running 1080p @ 120fps looks like before already declaring winners lol. It likely wont be pretty, or very on-rail.

For most existing PC gamers it will not require an upgrade, or if so, very minor.

The vast majority of PC gamers will need significant upgrades.

Considering the most popular games are DOTA2, LoL, and TF2 that isn't too surprising. A lot of people are interested in VR but lets not pretend people with $1200+ gaming PCs isn't a niche market.
 
The Rift itself is definitely going to be cheap, Oculus has said so all along. They are planning to sell it at cost, with no profit whatsoever, so it can reach the largest audience. They originally said $300-350, though if it would mean a huge increase in quality they might go a bit higher. Of course that was before they got Facebooked, but even after the Facebooking they said it would still be sold at cost for no profit.
 
good luck with that.

basically giving sony a home run.

I wouldn't be so sure. VR is bleeding edge tech and it's not like we're talking about *just* VR here, as the mainstream gaming VR is unlikely to 'happen' over the next couple years. There's still plenty of trial and error to be done on the most fundamental levels for all VR applications, with gaming being just as experimental. By the time it's better understood for the mainstream gaming audience, the spec cost that Oculus is targeting as baseline now will be much more affordable and without nearly the level of compromise Sony would be making by starting with PS4.
 

Buggy Loop

Member
The vast majority of PC gamers will need significant upgrades.

Considering the most popular games are DOTA2, LoL, and TF2 that isn't too surprising. A lot of people are interested in VR but lets not pretend people with $1200+ gaming PCs isn't a niche market.

Check the cumulative % of all GPUs that are in the vincinity of a 970 (doesnt have to be better, thats the beauty of PCs, it scales). Then take that % out of 125M users. Its still a huge userbase. Of course i was not trying to say all DOTA2 peoples will switch to oculus, but its still millions of peoples with capable hardware a good 8 months or more before the thing even releases. A good percentage again will just make a minor upgrade if they are interested in VR for a cheaper price than a PS4 (GPU most likely as PC cpus have been frozen in time for years now..). So yea, i still keep saying its a huge possible userbase.
 

Ferrio

Banned
I wouldn't be so sure. VR is bleeding edge tech and it's not like we're talking about *just* VR here, as the mainstream gaming VR is unlikely to 'happen' over the next couple years. There's still plenty of trial and error to be done on the most fundamental levels for all VR applications, with gaming being just as experimental. By the time it's better understood for the mainstream gaming audience, the spec cost that Oculus is targeting as baseline now will be much more affordable and without nearly the level of compromise Sony would be making by starting with PS4.

To me all it's going to take is that one game that causes people to go "Holy Shit" when they experience it. I think the even with PS4 level tech that the possibility is there, whether they fulfill it is another thing.

Something like VR minecraft (which won't happen due to MS) could of easily been that game. Really sad that occulus might be the only way to VR minecraft, cause that could of been the trojan horse for lower end VR.
 
To me all it's going to take is that one game that causes people to go "Holy Shit" when they experience it. I think the even with PS4 level tech that the possibility is there, whether they fulfill it is another thing.

Something like VR minecraft (which won't happen due to MS) could of easily been that game.

I'm not sure it's possible or not given I don't know much about the performance of the game, but I would LOVE if tomorrow children released with Morpheus support. A game like that would be so breathtaking in VR it's not even funny.
 
To me all it's going to take is that one game that causes people to go "Holy Shit" when they experience it. I think the even with PS4 level tech that the possibility is there, whether they fulfill it is another thing.

Something like VR minecraft (which won't happen due to MS) could of easily been that game. Really sad that occulus might be the only way to VR minecraft, cause that could of been the trojan horse for lower end VR.

The hard part is going to be communicating that to people who have never used VR or might be skeptical of the tech. Word of mouth I always thought was going to be the biggest hurdle for VR which is why I think it's going to take years for it to really advance to that mainstream stage as a technology.
 
I still think it will be mobile solutions like Gear VR, along with businesses like Chuck E. Cheese investing in the headsets that will make VR take off in the beginning. It's still way too expensive otherwise for everyone else.

So, the $1500 price is fine to me, I think. They're clearly targeting the hardcore PC gamer crowd, who will pay anything. This is the crowd that will pay $100 for a fancy headset, or a keyboard, or even a mouse, even when a cheaper $10 alternative would get the job done just as well. Many PC gamers already have rigs that meet or surpass the ~$1500 price tag anyway.
 
To me all it's going to take is that one game that causes people to go "Holy Shit" when they experience it. I think the even with PS4 level tech that the possibility is there, whether they fulfill it is another thing.

Something like VR minecraft (which won't happen due to MS) could of easily been that game.
Any decent interactive demo can elicit the 'holy shit!' reaction in the masses, IMO, so I don't think a single killer app for gaming is possible for VR when there's so much learning still to be done about what the bounds are for comfort levels for players with different intensities of the more fully-fledged gaming experience and the amount of freedom that works well while sitting, standing, and *gasp* walking. Shit's too early for primetime with gaming, but media viewing could be the way.
 

Sulik2

Member
Anyone who thought it wouldn't cost this much needs to look at the amount of power needed to push an Oculus at full resolution. Sounds about like what I expected.
 

Ferrio

Banned
Any decent interactive demo can elicit the 'holy shit!' reaction in the masses, IMO, so I don't think a single killer app for gaming is possible for VR when there's so much learning still to be done about what the bounds are for comfort levels for players with different intensities of the more fully-fledged gaming experience and the amount of freedom that works well while sitting, standing, and *gasp* walking. Shit's too early for primetime with gaming, but media viewing and could be the way.

I don't understand why you think something like Morpheus would be daunting to normal gamers. I feel the transition from gaming from 2D->3D to be a good comparison. We suddenly got games we could control in many different ways, with arugably worse graphics and controls. Yet that shit thrived.
 

Foggy

Member
It's amazing to me that people thought the price point would be even remotely competitive with Sony or lead to mass early-adoption. It's not even like it's some closely guarded secret, all you had to do was ask someone using these headsets right now and I'd wager everyone would've said it'll require a PC north of $1000. The only people this is catching off guard are the people that weren't paying much attention in the first place.
 
I don't understand why you think something like Morpheus would be daunting to normal gamers. I feel the transition from gaming from 2D->3D to be a good comparison.

The cost is still a relatively high barrier and the software on a console just won't roll in as often, from as large a number of possible developers nor will those titles be as quickly updated as would be the case on an open PC platform. Morpheus will also be limited to gamepad and Move motion controllers to start, at least from the looks of things right now, while PC will have many more options available, including the rock-solid and stationary environment of a desktop PC with keyboard and mouse in addition to having those other control options.

With 2D to 3D gaming, it took twenty years of evolution and experimentation in the same space of time that the hardware capability and software knowhow was increasing from 1980 up through the late '90s...at the point where most playable gametypes were mainstream at about the sixteen-year mark. VR has nowhere near the same level of maturity since it's not just 3D gaming slapped on a visor if you want to actually do it right and not make many of your potential users sick and nauseated from an undercooked experience while you're still trying to make software that can feel satisfying beyond the demo level built for the short-burst duration.
 
Does anyone know what the current rates are on taking out a second mortgage on a house?

Seriously though I have a question. Did DK1 and 2 require really high end specs too? If not, what's changing with the consumer version?
 
Seriously though I have a question. Did DK1 and 2 require really high end specs too? If not, what's changing with the consumer version?

They all did. It's simply putting it into concrete numbers that's causing people to flip out and say silly things like "Sony wins lol."
 
Seriously though I have a question. Did DK1 and 2 require really high end specs too? If not, what's changing with the consumer version?
It really depends on the game. You could get by with a mid range PC for many of the basic looking Unity demos on DK2 but you need something more powerful for games like Elite or Project Cars. As for what's changing with the consumer version, the framerate is going up from 75 to 90 and the resolution is larger too. I'm sure there will still be some basic experiences that will run on more modest PC's but VR games are only going to get more ambitious so its natural that recommended requirements will be higher.
 
In the real world the more advanced technology doesn't rarely wins. This seems to be following that trend.

I am sure the mass market would be willing to spend 1500 vs 900-1000 bucks.
 
Does anyone know what the current rates are on taking out a second mortgage on a house?

Seriously though I have a question. Did DK1 and 2 require really high end specs too? If not, what's changing with the consumer version?

DK1 had a resolution of 1280x800, one single screen with lenses that can only see half of it, and not even all the pixels of each half. It also only needed updating at 60 frames per second. DK2 had a resolution of 1920x1080, one single screen as well, this time updating at 75 frames per second. It added motion sensing through a camera, so overall required a beefier computer but not that much worse.

The Consumer version has a resolution of 1080×1200 per eye, using most of the pixels of each screen, and updates at 90 frames per second. In addition, it has realistic 3D sound (that is somewhat CPU intensive) and more sensors. So definitely requires a more powerful computer.

Really, the thing is you need a SOLID framerate. It MUST not drop, ever - any framerate drops will leave people feeling sick. So that's part of the reason for the hefty specs. And the difference between 60 and 75fps makes a HUGE difference in how realistic it seems, how much "presence" you feel, and makes it less likely that you will feel sick. Supposedly, 90fps is where people truly feel "presence", and makes the resolution seem higher as well. So while you could use a weaker system to play at lower framerates, you really don't want to.
 
Getting mainstream consumers to put on head-gear is a non-starter no matter the price. This has niche/fail written all over it for a variety of reasons. Price is only one of them.

Edit: That said, I'm most definitely part of the small target market who will at some point buy one or more of the competing products. I'm really excited about VR in the long run & love the idea of being an early adopter to give it a good run. But I think anyone who believes this is going to take off for the average family is delusional.
 

J-Rzez

Member
Not worried about the computer

Give me the damn headset price

This.

It's falling into the year I do a complete overhaul of my current rig (2600k/780) anyways. But, I hope for the sake of them they stick to their word when they said it would cost $300. Any more than that will put it dangerously close to quality 1440/2160p decent sized monitors/TVs at that time which will probably sway a percentage of the potential VR userbase. Obviously it will have no impact on the people like myself and others here who really believe this is the next big thing, what we've been waiting a decade(s) for.

Shouldn't really be a VR-wars thing though peeps. I hope Rift, Vive, and Morpheous all do fantastic. It's needed to ensure that there's a reasonable enough uptake of the devices so that developers pay attention.

It's only going to take one big game to really blow it out though. Proper Minecraft support, a big time shooter, and if anything Sony has the talent to make something special for VR, so we should get said killer app in one form or another.
 

Despera

Banned
I'm willing to invest up to $3k in a VR setup.

I held off upgrading my old gaming rig for this particular reason. Once I decide on which VR headset I'm getting it's upgrading time!
 
Getting mainstream consumers to put on head-gear is a non-starter no matter the price. This has niche/fail written all over it for a variety of reasons. Price is only one of them.

seems like you lack perspective and won't consider VR viable unless it's an overnight success that sweeps the world. which it won't be. which is what 90% of people who have actually genuinely researched VR have been repeating for a long time now. alongside ballpark expectations for specs that near matched the real ones. but VR has a lot of big players in, and well outside of the gaming industry, excited and making moves... so I don't know where this notion comes from that it even could outright fail, especially when the justification is "it'll cost a lot day one". Man, tell that to HD Television, right? That never got off the ground! VR has plenty of time to mature and become more accessible through several alternate channels, and these seemingly high recommended specs for day 1 VR won't seem nearly as high 2 or 3 years from now (hey guys! VR isn't just going to disappear as technological advances make it more viable!) - when smartphones, consoles, and dedicated VR systems are all doing it, and when analogues to the recommended 970 will seem positively mid-to-low-end.
 
seems like you lack perspective and won't consider VR viable unless it's an overnight success. which it won't be. which is what 90% of people who have actually genuinely researched VR have been repeating for a long time now. alongside ballpark expectations for specs that near matched the real ones. VR has plenty of time to mature and become more accessible through several alternate channels, and these seemingly high recommended specs for day 1 VR won't seem nearly as high 2 or 3 years from now - when smartphones, consoles, and dedicated VR systems are all doing it, and when analogues to the recommended 970 will seem positively mid-to-low-end.

You didn't read the rest of my post, did you?

I dont lack perspective. And I have common sense & a fair grasp of the consumer market. Something it seems a lot of the pie-in-the-sky supporters definitely lack.
 

jtar86

Member
If Sony can get developers to make some solid games that people are excited for and a bundle out I don't see how they can't just dominate that market.
 
Getting mainstream consumers to put on head-gear is a non-starter no matter the price. This has niche/fail written all over it for a variety of reasons. Price is only one of them.
Anecdotally, the experience is strong and impressive enough that it overcomes any goofy feeling of wearing a headset. Everyone I've demoed VR to wants one and that's an incredibly common response from talking to other DK2 owners. But regardless, a bully headset is not an inherent problem. They'll be barely bigger than a pair of glasses within a decade according to Nate Mitchell. People will buy one just so they have a 4K Imax screen for a hundred bucks.
 

Dr.Acula

Banned
If Sony can get developers to make some solid games that people are excited for and a bundle out I don't see how they can't just dominate that market.

The VR market? If Sony makes this a PlayStation peripheral, and HTC/Valve, Facebook, or Samsung go mobile/android, then Sony's market is a puddle. Sony could dominate the Consoles/PC space certainly, but we don't know what the space for VR is gonna be.
 
You didn't read the rest of my post, did you?
well, no, it was an edit. but I see it now. And I shouldn't have come at you like that, this is my first response to this thread and that's more my sentiment toward the general tone in here and in other VR threads. A lot of people jump in to post their valuable opinions without really seeming like they know shit about VR, really.
I dont lack perspective. And I have common sense & a fair grasp of the consumer market. Something it seems a lot of the pie-in-the-sky supporters definitely lack.
I wouldn't consider myself a 'pie in the sky' supporter, I just don't think that VR's viability rests on Rift's day one or year one success, nor do I believe that its day 1 cost will be much of a stopping block, as that cost of entry will drop in reasonably short order, and as viable alternatives to PC-tethered VR are introduced.

Wow. RiP VR, over before it could really even begin again.

Maybe in a decade or two...

lol

2002: rip HDTV. I mean, $5000? HDTV is over before it could really even begin again.



Maybe in like 20 years... yeah, that's a reasonable amount of time to allot to newly viable and continuously moving tech before it becomes affordable and accessible.
 

paskowitz

Member
This "recommendation" is going to quickly become a minimum. A single fully overclocked 4790k/GTX 980 combo is not even powerful enough to run Project CARS at a stable 75fps on the DK2 at medium settings. This is also largely true for Assetto Corsa. Even iRacing experiences framerate drops at max settings. Elite Dangerous is a little better, but still requires heavy a lot of GPU power.

If you have the desire or expectation to "stably max modern high fidelity games out" on a OR CV1... well... a Titan X or SLI 980s (once SLI is even supported in VR) is going to be required. The problem is there is no room for framerate drops in VR. Nothing hurts the experience more. I would expect in a years time, even that won't be enough and something like Pascal or a 400x will be needed. Again, this is max settings with a stable framerate.

The reason I bring this up is that people mostly game on 1080p monitors at 60-144hz and for that a 970 is perfect. That jump in resolution and refresh for VR is a bigger jump than it seems on paper.

Put all this together and the minimum price for a full experience is around $2,000-2,500
 
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