Support NeoGAF

[Mit-]

Looks like Oculus definitely won't be leading the VR charge.

This is disappointing and not their fault.

Their vision has always been to do VR right. Even though most people's home computers weren't ready for it yet.

They're delivering on this vision finally, and all people can think about it how it's going to fail due to inferior-quality, cheaper competition.

Or, their competition just hasn't been as honest and upfront about system requirements as they have, and is letting Oculus suck up all the negative press.

In any case, I haven't seen anyone else with a vision as grand and focused as theirs. I believe they've been doing everything right so far. Unfortunately others want in on the potential for success and are coming out with more straight forward and less ambitious products ahead of them. I only hope they don't fuck the vision of VR too hard and that people are still excited about it when Oculus can truly deliver, which is whenever consumer PCs that can truly run good VR become more affordable and the content is there.

Good luck Oculus. Wii ruined motion gaming by being half assed at launch. Hopefully VR doesn't suffer the same fate.

 

[Nzyme32]

If Sony can get developers to make some solid games that people are excited for and a bundle out I don't see how they can't just dominate that market.

"Dominating the market" isn't necessarily the way to success. We have seen this time and again particularly with motion controls such as move, kinect and even the Wii. They can sell loads but it won't mean anything to their longevity if they are seen as a gimmick in the long term and result in reduced attach rates of compatible games and low quality gimmick games. It is yet to be seen just how things will work out on that front for all these platforms.

 

[jtar86]

The VR market? If Sony makes this a PlayStation peripheral, and HTC/Valve, Facebook, or Samsung go mobile/android, then Sony's market is a puddle. Sony could dominate the Consoles/PC space certainly, but we don't know what the space for VR is gonna be.

Yeah I was mainly speaking of the console/pc space. I think of mobile as a whole different thing.

 

[ShadyJ]

Not really interested to be honest.

I feel this will a gimmick.

 

[Yudoken]

My pc is ready!
I can't wait to play my favorite games on it.
But honestly I wait for the second/third version of it.

 

[jett]

Good luck with that, Facebook.

 

[Solid Samus]

This "recommendation" is going to quickly become a minimum. A single fully overclocked 4790k/GTX 980 combo is not even powerful enough to run Project CARS at a stable 75fps on the DK2 at medium settings. This is also largely true for Assetto Corsa. Even iRacing experiences framerate drops at max settings. Elite Dangerous is a little better, but still requires heavy a lot of GPU power.

If you have the desire or expectation to "stably max modern high fidelity games out" on a OR CV1... well... a Titan X or SLI 980s (once SLI is even supported in VR) is going to be required. The problem is there is no room for framerate drops in VR. Nothing hurts the experience more. I would expect in a years time, even that won't be enough and something like Pascal or a 400x will be needed. Again, this is max settings with a stable framerate.

The reason I bring this up is that people mostly game on 1080p monitors at 60-144hz and for that a 970 is perfect. That jump in resolution and refresh for VR is a bigger jump than it seems on paper.

Put all this together and the minimum price for a full experience is around $2,000-2,500

I don't see why the recommended specs would just become a minimum when those are the specs recommended to developers and when many in active VR development adhere to specs even less intensive than that. if you're playing the latest and greatest games at max settings \ you'd have to upgrade to enthusiast-level hardware but that's true regardless of your display medium. With VR you'll have to make compromises if you want to play really visually heavy games that aren't designed specifically with VR in mind - but those that are would be made by those who consider the impact VR rendering has on a computer's potential output, and occasionally by those wishing to push enthusiast-level hardware. And I think a 970 could produce visuals in VR competitive with what other 3D entertainment solutions display on traditional screens as long as the right considerations are made. But at any rate, it's not as though the 970/i7s or future analogues will retain their current price for much longer moving forward. I don't think making the claim that the minimum cost of entry will jump by a thousand soon is really all that sound.

 

[Dr.Acula]

2002: rip HDTV. I mean, $5000? HDTV is over before it could really even begin again.

And remember, HDTV adoption was slowed because of a dearth of HD media and the cable companies dragging their feet on delivering content. VR content is already here, and the hardware isn't even out.

 

[Stimpack]

Good luck with that, Facebook.

Please be joking.

 

[jaypah]

As it should be. On the PC it's going to be a high-end affair. For the people willing to pay the price they'll get a premium. I'm fine with that. GearVR and Morpheus will bring in a lot of folks and VR on my PC will be better off for it. I assume that devs who want to dabble in VR will want as many customers as possible so there will probably be a bit of overlap too. That works for me!

 

[Azure Dream]

When did spending $1,200 on a PC become "High End."

And that's based on now, non-sale prices.

And based on you literally not having a PC at all to start with. If you already have a computer, you probably have at least some of, if not all of the parts already necessary.

 

[totowhoa]

Look at this 10 page thread.

Why, as a public figure, would you ever spit out a cost that includes a monitor, keyboard, mouse, speaker, power supply, tower, all the guts, AND the headset, when people already have a lot of those costs covered? And that's including a lot of the broader, modern demo. "We expect the average person to spend 60k in total to enjoy the oculus rift in a comfortable white suburban neighborhood."

How about; "we think our average consumer will be spending about $700 to invest in VR." Speak to your damned demographic.

That should be how the whole leadership and marketing team sees it. Not as a crazy 1500 hardware investment, if it doesn't have an apple on it.

This cost is going to be lower in no time anyway. Can't believe they said that, heh. Maybe I'm grumpy because I work close to marketing

 

[border]

There a lot of unfortunate truths about VR that people are going to have to deal with. It's expensive to buy a headset and it's expensive to get hardware that runs VR simulations well.

Why does Oculus insist on taking the massive PR hit with all this information though? HTC/Valve are launching first, why not let them be the ones to break the bad news to everyone? Why did Oculus come out as the first one to talk about the steep system requirements and expensive rigs needed for VR? Especially when they have the chance to undercut HTC anyway.

 

[Furyous]

My retina Macbook can handle this with 8 GB of RAM. Can't wait to adventure in Oculus.

 

[Alebrije]

Well, it seems i will keep with my current VR set

 

[Glitchesarecool]

I have a feeling that most of this will be like computing when it was first coming around: Enthusiast used until it drops to a point that a typical consumer can pick it up.

 

[Compsiox]

I have a feeling that most of this will be like computing when it was first coming around: Enthusiast used until it drops to a point that a typical consumer can pick it up.

With the purchase of 2 Oculus Rifts you get one 1500 dollar compotter

 

[YuShtink]

Look at this 10 page thread.

Why, as a public figure, would you ever spit out a cost that includes a monitor, keyboard, mouse, speaker, power supply, tower, all the guts, AND the headset, when people already have a lot of those costs covered? And that's including a lot of the broader, modern demo. "We expect the average person to spend 60k in total to enjoy the oculus rift in a comfortable white suburban neighborhood."

How about; "we think our average consumer will be spending about $700 to invest in VR." Speak to your damned demographic.

That should be how the whole leadership and marketing team sees it. Not as a crazy 1500 hardware investment, if it doesn't have an apple on it.

This cost is going to be lower in no time anyway. Can't believe they said that, heh. Maybe I'm grumpy because I work close to marketing

Maybe they are actually being *GASP* honest about their product. Crazy, I know. Who in their right mind wouldn't try to mislead the consumer?

 

[Trojan X]

.... $1500..... Sorry Oculus. You screwed up. I won't be buying it for that price. I was expecting around the $500 range, $700-800 max. That would make it reasonable from a consumer perspective. Oh well, it's obvious that they are charging that pricing because they cannot recoup the money in other forms such as software.

The ONLY way I would buy it now is whether those specs are off the charts! If they aren't and I see major flaws still then they can take a running jump.

 

[Compsiox]

.... $1500..... Sorry Oculus. You screwed up. I won't be buying it for that price. I was expecting around the $500 range, $600 max. That would make it a steal. Oh well, it's obvious that they are charging that pricing because they cannot recoup the money in other forms such as software.

You won't but many enthusiasts including myself will.

 

[antonz]

.... $1500..... Sorry Oculus. You screwed up. I won't be buying it for that price. I was expecting around the $500 range, $700-800 max. That would make it reasonable from a consumer perspective. Oh well, it's obvious that they are charging that pricing because they cannot recoup the money in other forms such as software.

The ONLY way I would buy it now is whether those specs are off the charts! If they aren't and I see major flaws still then they can take a running jump.

Oculus is only going to charge you like 400-500 bucks. The max of 1500 is you buying a computer if you don't already have one

 

[Trojan X]

Well, it seems i will keep with my current VR set

loL! That's messed up, My eyes.

 

[Trojan X]

Oculus is only going to charge you like 400-500 bucks. The max of 1500 is you buying a computer if you don't already have one

I may have mis-read. I guess we have to wait for the official price. Thank you for pointing that out.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

.... $1500..... Sorry Oculus. You screwed up. I won't be buying it for that price. I was expecting around the $500 range, $700-800 max. That would make it reasonable from a consumer perspective. Oh well, it's obvious that they are charging that pricing because they cannot recoup the money in other forms such as software.

The ONLY way I would buy it now is whether those specs are off the charts! If they aren't and I see major flaws still then they can take a running jump.

Not sure if serious, or misreading the OP.

EDIT: Ah, misread

 

[Dreamwriter]

There a lot of unfortunate truths about VR that people are going to have to deal with. It's expensive to buy a headset and it's expensive to get hardware that runs VR simulations well.

Why does Oculus insist on taking the massive PR hit with all this information though? HTC/Valve are launching first, why not let them be the ones to break the bad news to everyone? Why did Oculus come out as the first one to talk about the steep system requirements and expensive rigs needed for VR? Especially when they have the chance to undercut HTC anyway.

Maybe they want to make sure HTC doesn't try to skimp on the system requirements, knowing that Oculus isn't. Because a mediocre VR experience at this point could totally kill VR, since mediocre means making people feel literally ill. So if HTC came out with requirements like an Intel i3 with a GeForce 550M, that could make people sick and kill the market before Oculus even had a chance.

 

[totowhoa]

Maybe they are actually being *GASP* honest about their product. Crazy, I know. Who in their right mind wouldn't try to mislead the consumer?

See Trojan X's post just above. It's causing confusion. 90% of the people following the Rift won't need to invest 1500. A clearer message would be "We expect most people to spend around $X given the specs we've announced." That data is possible to gather and I'm sure they have an idea of it, which is why I'm surprised this was ever said in this way.

 

[Skux]

For those about to drop the cash on a 980, we salute you.

Let us know how it goes.

 

[YuShtink]

.... $1500..... Sorry Oculus. You screwed up. I won't be buying it for that price. I was expecting around the $500 range, $700-800 max. That would make it a steal. Oh well, it's obvious that they are charging that pricing because they cannot recoup the money in other forms such as software.

They didn't screw up at all. From the very beginning it was understood that the Rift would run off of PC hardware. The Oculus Rift itself will be between $300-500. But you need a computer that isn't a complete piece of shit to run high end VR games. A computer that could cost anywhere from $1000-1200 at least. This has been the understanding all along. $1000-1200 is not that much for a PC. They are simply being forthcoming and honest. They don't want people with crappy laptops and integrated or 3+ year old graphics cards spending hundreds of extra dollars on a Rift for a sub-par experience. All that would do is leave a bad taste in peoples' mouths and undersell their own product simultaneously.

God, when I think about the experience people will be able to have for less than 2 grand in 2015-16. It's something that couldn't even be dreamed of 5 years ago. You people are crazy. When PC's hit the market they were 3-5k pre-inflation adjustments. A $1200 PC is NOTHING for the visual experience this shit will give you.

 

[totowhoa]

They didn't screw up at all. From the very beginning it was understood that the Rift would run off of PC hardware. The Oculus Rift itself will be between $300-500. But you need a computer that isn't a complete piece of shit to run high end VR games. A computer that could cost anywhere from $1000-1200 at least. This has been the understanding all along. $1000-1200 is not that much for a PC. They are simply being forthcoming and honest. They don't want people with crappy laptops and integrated or 3+ year old graphics cards spending hundreds of extra dollars on a Rift for a sub-par experience. All that would do is leave a bad taste in peoples' mouths and undersell their own product simultaneously.

God, when I think about the experience people will be able to have for less than 2 grand in 2015-16. It's something that couldn't even be dreamed of 5 years ago. You people are crazy. When PC's hit the market they were 3-5k pre-inflation adjustments. A $1200 PC is NOTHING for the visual experience this shit will give you.

And read his next post.

 

[Trojan X]

You won't but many enthusiasts including myself will.

Really? If it did cost $1500 you would buy it for that price? Honestly, those specs really do have to be off the charts if they ever charged at that price.

 

[Diddy Kong]

this won't take off

 

[GuitarAtomik]

There a lot of unfortunate truths about VR that people are going to have to deal with. It's expensive to buy a headset and it's expensive to get hardware that runs VR simulations well.

Why does Oculus insist on taking the massive PR hit with all this information though? HTC/Valve are launching first, why not let them be the ones to break the bad news to everyone? Why did Oculus come out as the first one to talk about the steep system requirements and expensive rigs needed for VR? Especially when they have the chance to undercut HTC anyway.

Agree with this to a point. I think getting the recommended specs out there soon was smart (though they probably should have included more context since everyone seems to misunderstand it as MINIMUM specs), but they should shut up about any price figures beyond the final cost of the Rift.

 

[Trojan X]

They didn't screw up at all. From the very beginning it was understood that the Rift would run off of PC hardware. The Oculus Rift itself will be between $300-500. But you need a computer that isn't a complete piece of shit to run high end VR games. A computer that could cost anywhere from $1000-1200 at least. This has been the understanding all along. $1000-1200 is not that much for a PC. They are simply being forthcoming and honest. They don't want people with crappy laptops and integrated or 3+ year old graphics cards spending hundreds of extra dollars on a Rift for a sub-par experience. All that would do is leave a bad taste in peoples' mouths and undersell their own product simultaneously.

God, when I think about the experience people will be able to have for less than 2 grand in 2015-16. It's something that couldn't even be dreamed of 5 years ago. You people are crazy. When PC's hit the market they were 3-5k pre-inflation adjustments. A $1200 PC is NOTHING for the visual experience this shit will give you.

I misread the OP. I was thinking Oculus itself would cost around $1500, not Oculus and a PC. Cool?

 

[Skyzard]

And once you spend $1,250 on a computer, you can clearly only use it for VR, and gain no other advantages from it.

My pc is already under the desk where am I supposed to find the space to put a vr station.

 

[Dreamwriter]

How about; "we think our average consumer will be spending about $700 to invest in VR." Speak to your damned demographic.

But, that would be BS, you can't get both a VR headset and a full computer for $700, the average consumer doesn't have a computer up to snuff, and doesn't upgrade only pieces of their computer, so will indeed have to buy a full computer.

 

[YuShtink]

I've misread the OP. I was thinking Oculus itself would cost around $1500, not Oculus and a PC. Cool?

Yep it's cool. Post wasn't only directed toward you, you just happened to be the one I quoted . Sorry if I came off harsh, it's just quite literally angering me how jaded people are anymore. This is a tech that's so cool and worthwhile but people are simply using it as another point of contention in system wars, or comparing it to half assed gimmicks of yester-year. This is bleeding edge tech. As bleeding edge as consumer tech has ever been. It will astound people. And here we are arguing over marketing ploys and bickering about console vs. PC mentalities that have been the same for decades. Shit is depressing.

 

[flyinpiranha]

W/e Oculus, just release the goddman CV1 already.

This is where I'm at. I've given up on GAF arguments about VR. I just want it for myself and to watch it grow. My DK2 is dusty as I just wait. I'll spend 2k .... Just release the fucking thing with some good input device and some kickass software.

I'll go back to waiting until 2015 or 2016 or whatever ....

 

[YuShtink]

This is where I'm at. I've given up on GAF arguments about VR. I just want it for myself and to watch it grow. My DK2 is dusty as I just wait. I'll spend 2k .... Just release the fucking thing with some good input device and some kickass software.

I'll go back to waiting until 2015 or 2016 or whatever ....

It's confirmed to be coming Q1 2016. There will be a Rift event on June 11 that will have some good info as well.

 

[flyinpiranha]

It's confirmed to be coming Q1 2016. There will be a Rift event on June 11 that will have some good info as well.

That's good news. I was so gung-ho about it for a while. Lots of kickstarters, HOTAS, greenlight games, but I got sick of trying to make stuff work all the time. Switching displays, having to disable them and physically unhook stuff. It was fun for a couple months but now I really need a consumer experience.

 

[mephixto]

Nothing new and with the probs of change the way we do something is cheap at the beggining. Home consoles weren't cheap back then, black and white TV's were a luxury, Flat panels also. It takes time.

 

[Dreamwriter]

By the way, this here is an average example of a computer someone would need to power the Oculus Rift, that is part of that $1500 total cost:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229626

Intel Core i5 4690K (3.50GHz)
16GB DDR3
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 4 GB
16GB Ram
2 usb 3.0 ports
$1150

 

[totowhoa]

But, that would be BS, you can't get both a VR headset and a full computer for $700, the average consumer doesn't have a computer up to snuff, and doesn't upgrade only pieces of their computer, so will indeed have to buy a full computer.

Eh, there's some presumption in "average customer" there (vs. average person or even average American). A lot of people do have monitors, keyboards, controllers, speakers, mice and other things. I'm not saying a lot of people could do this without dropping a solid grand, and I pulled the 700 number straight outta my ass.

This was just poor form, and this thread is longer than it needs to be due to a lot of confusion it's caused

 

[YuShtink]

That's good news. I was so gung-ho about it for a while. Lots of kickstarters, HOTAS, greenlight games, but I got sick of trying to make stuff work all the time. Switching displays, having to disable them and physically unhook stuff. It was fun for a couple months but now I really need a consumer experience.

Yea I hear you on that. Also less new demo software to be playing with lately as everyone seems to have chosen their projects and are working towards consumer launches at this point. With the latest SDK and Runtime updates I've had a lot better luck with programs "just working" in Direct to Rift mode. But it's still far from a 100% smooth experience.

 

[somesang]

Sounds like a lot of people only have one job.

A $1,000 pc could get you the Witcher 3 at 1080p/60 with mostly high settings. So, that's a bonus.

 

[Dreamwriter]

Eh, there's some presumption in "average customer" there (vs. average person or even average American). A lot of people do have monitors, keyboards, controllers, speakers, mice and other things. I'm not saying a lot of people could do this without dropping a solid grand, and I pulled the 700 number straight outta my ass.

This was just poor form, and this thread is longer than it needs to be due to a lot of confusion it's caused

Nowhere does anything say the $1500 includes monitors and speakers and stuff (in fact, speakers aren't needed at all). Look at the computer system I posted - that's what he's talking about. $1150 for a basic gaming system meeting (slightly exceeding) the specifications for the Rift.

 

[Razgreez]

Looking at the general performance of the 970 at 2560 x 1440 in newer games I'm scratching my head as to why it is deemed acceptable. I understand that VR games are not necessarily going to be graphically intensive but for those that are a 970, when attempting to hold 90fps, is definitely not going to cut it. To me this is a rather large elephant in the room

 

[totowhoa]

Nowhere does anything say the $1500 includes monitors and speakers and stuff (in fact, speakers aren't needed at all). Look at the computer system I posted - that's what he's talking about. $1150 for a basic gaming system meeting (slightly exceeding) the specifications for the Rift.

I knew it was a 1k investment since the specs were announced. He said a total of 1500, which lead me to believe he meant the the price of this hardware in 2016+Oculus+other necessities. maybe he meant current prices and I was just reading things into it (just re-read the quote). Still an awkward way to frame it without any qualifiers for reasons I noted above (confusion).

 

[border]

Nowhere does anything say the $1500 includes monitors and speakers and stuff (in fact, speakers aren't needed at all). Look at the computer system I posted - that's what he's talking about. $1150 for a basic gaming system meeting (slightly exceeding) the specifications for the Rift.

You can buy a relatively stock Dell machine for $600-$700 and drop a 970 into it for another $300. Probably less than that in 2016.

 

[Compsiox]

Really? If it did cost $1500 you would buy it for that price? Honestly, those specs really do have to be off the charts if they ever charged at that price.

Ummm. I basically bought my $2100 PC for VR just back in February.

 

[Derpcrawler]

So if Sony comes in with a reasonable price for the Morpheus and drops the PS4's price by $50-$100, then the consumer would potentially have to pay nearly double for a gaming PC and a Rift? Yikes. Oculus better deliver one helluva better experience for that kind of price disparity, but I suppose the devices are likely aimed at somewhat different market segments anyway.

It will never be even close to Oculus experience it terms of IQ, resolution and framerates.