Support NeoGAF

[Bernardougf]

So you now agree that Starfield is shit then?

There is not higher profiler than Starfield... it already been discussed... IF Starfield goes multiplat anything can go (at some point). No matter what the green rats try to spin it even to the point of saying that Starfield is not high profile .... but lets wait and see what Phil is going to say....anybody expecting a promise from him that all high profiles games will remain exclusive are in for a rude awakening

 

[DaGwaphics]

That guy needs some therapy and pills. Fucking mental.

Guy should have done the right thing and just sent it to me. I could have steamrolled that thing down to flat paper.

 

[Topher]

Says it like it is....

He's talking about people like this.....

 

[dragonyeuw]

I'm starting to wonder if they're just going to spring it on us or if they are going to announce a date for this with a tweet or something.

It's crazy no one has any idea even when this is happening.

The leadership has fallen square on its face with the lack of communication. I have an increasing hunch that Phil Spencer may not be head honcho of Xbox this time next year.

 

[Hohenheim]

No worries, its just something I see a lot and at times on here. And I expect with all this Xbox talk its a narrative that starts getting pushed even more. My issue with it is how untrue it generally is. And you will always find that its never spoken about just on the merits of the pricing, because it is impossible to make a case for PC gaming if that is all you do, what tends to happen is that people start, as I said, trying to move the posts and throw in all these other considerations to justify the price discrepancy.

Those show me your setup things are mostly pandering to people that feel they have something to "show off". You should know that. A lot of people just have a decent $4-600 60-65" 4K TV and have one console plugged into it. And that is perfectly ok. And make no mistake about it, even within the PC space, you can see that budget is a thing. Just look at Steam, thankfully they do a great job at tracking these things.

You can see what percentage of PC gamers game at 1080p/1440p/4K, with a $400 GPU, $600 GPU, $1000+ GPU, 6, 8,12 core CPU.....etc. Its all right there.

The second you take a cursory glance at that data, two things will quickly become apparent to you, its either that PC gamers and/or the PC gaming media is full of blatant hypocrites, or its that nearly 95% of all the PC gaming advocates/media outlets we have or we come across, consists of the like 3-5% of the PC gamers that can actually afford those systems that can run games the way they seem to demand or expect games to run at those Ultra settings and high framerates. Which would make them the loudest minority in the history of loud minorities.

Its just not real. And the sooner people accept that there are a LOT of people that really take gaming as a hobby and see no reason why they spend more than $500 on a gaming device every 5-7 years, and or just do not like gaming on PC, and that this has been the case since gaming consoles existed... the better for everyone.

Yeah, I see your points here, and it makes totally sense. Up until recently I think the 2070 was the most used GPU on Steam?
My point was initially that many folks complain about performance in their consoles, while at the same time refusing to see beyond the console world.
And yeah, the "show mr your gear" thread is definitly for showing off, but it's nice to all the smooth setups folks here have.

I guess this got a bit hand in a thread about what poor ol' Phil Spencer is gonna say next week though

Or maybe he's gonna say that Xbox gamers should buy a 4090 and stfu. Who knows in these crazy times!

 

[Chuck Berry]

He's talking about people like this.....

What fucking losers. Seriously.

That sorta stuff is just surreal to me lol

 

[King Dazzar]

What if all this is simply Microsoft moving from "Xbox" gaming to "Microsoft" gaming? Everything else more or less stays the same outside of a few multiplayer focused games like Sea of Thieves coming to other consoles.

Dont know about that, I think there is big change coming, but that it will happen over time. The bit I'm less confident about is how Phil puts all this across and if after waiting a week, anyone is actually any clearer where we stand - hes not exactly the paragon of truth and honesty. We'll see. But dont be suprised, if following his chat, theres even more questions than answers...

I dont think the show is over as far as consoles go though. Not yet at least anyway.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Software licensing still applies on non-physical ecosystems. So no, they aren't losing anything unique.

You push a game to XBL/Game Pass you still need compliance to that back end. You can build for PC but if you want it on a MS controlled storefront you need to pass their cert/lot-checks specific to their ecosystem. You can't just hand them a raw binary or build pre-published on Steam or GoG and they'll simply say "have at it" even though there's nothing about that code that's alien to the hardware its intended to be run on.

So no. Licensing fees aren't going anywhere even if Xbox as a hardware offer is no more.

But why would publishers risk their NDA'ed publishing plans early with Microsoft and potentially getting usurped with competing games -such as a unique (of the time) stylisation , like Rayman - by publishing day and date with a "platform" that is now effectively a rival, rather than a shared stakeholder with successful hardware at risk that have a vested interest - above and beyond - in yours and other publishers success like PlayStation to not try and beat you to market after early disclosure?

For me, that's where the Series and next xbox hardware dies rapidly, publishers won't want to read Xbox in on their plans anymore, in the way they would PlayStation and Nintendo, resulting in better unique games skipping the platform as standard, all feeding into a rapid publisher withdrawal of all sequels of non-gaas games.

 

[aliadiere25]

Starfield cost 500m to produce. If that 500m game goes over to PlayStation, you best believe that all of them will follow down the road.

 

[reinking]

The leadership has fallen square on its face with the lack of communication. I have an increasing hunch that Phil Spencer may not be head honcho of Xbox this time next year.

He isn't now. He is head honcho of Microsoft Gaming.

 

[King Dazzar]

He's talking about people like this.....

Is it only me, who's wondering if it'll still work. I just want to press the start button lol

 

[Arsic]

My prediction:
-All gamepass game titles on all platforms they can put it on.
-New tier of sub if you want to keep playing day one exclusives as well. First to Xbox PC then later on gamepass to other platforms.
-New consoles in 2026 end of year
-Hellblade 2 reviews as a 6/10 along with stalker 2
-Xbox fans say next year is going to be the best year. Next game is best game.

 

[AtomicStarving]

Says it like it is....

MS is putting all xbox games on pc day one. There's not fucking reason to get a Xbox already. These F fanboys are like 5 years delayed lol WTF these people lol

 

[dragonyeuw]

He isn't now. He is head honcho of Microsoft Gaming.

Thanks for the correction, the same hunch applies subbing out 'Xbox' for 'Microsoft'.

 

[MisterXDTV]

How much did Blockbuster going exclusively BD have to do with the WB decision?

Edit: And how much did people having PS3 BD players in their home effect the Blockbuster decision?
Just a thought

A lot....

PS3 was by FAR the top selling next-gen disc player at the end of 2007 (after the PS3 european launch in March)

HD-DVD players were not selling even with crazy discounts at that point

Having one machine that could do HD gaming and HD movies at the same time was really big...

Just like it happened with DVDs and PS2

 

[PaintTinJr]

Starfield cost 500m to produce. If that 500m game goes over to PlayStation, you best believe that all of them will follow down the road.

If Starfield sells well on PlayStation compared to PlayStation games - ie not a Mass Effect situation - without being a significantly better offering than what is on Xbox/PC, then Microsoft might have some justification to stagger incoming games like Indiana Jones and keep day 1 gamepass. if it goes the other way and they are relatively managing the same(double sales) or less sales on PlayStation than Xbox, then for unified marketing expense and avoiding risk of damaging day one sales, I would expect all future releases to be day and date on PlayStation, and day 1 on gamepass to be gone.

 

[Topher]

MS is putting all xbox games on pc day one. There's not fucking reason to get a Xbox already. These F fanboys are like 5 years delayed lol WTF these people lol

Plenty of console gamers don't want to game on PC so plenty of reason to get an Xbox for them.

 

[DaGwaphics]

100% THIS!!!


I'm not sure why so many Xbox fans (not only the fanboys) thought that the following would be true......

1. Hardware sales don't matter anymore, Xbox is playing a different game. Their games are on PC too now.

2. Software sales don't matter anymore, Xbox is playing a different game. Gamepass is the future

3. Physical games don't matter anymore, Xbox is playing a different game. Video game streaming is the future anyway.

4. Exclusives don't matter anymore, Xbox is playing a different game. Gamepass makes it so gamers have access to all the games they need.

5. Remasters and remakes aren't needed anymore, Xbox is playing a different game. Their backwards compatibility services are second to none and is what everyone wants.

I guess obviously the numbers might not be what they want, but things can't be this dire. For one, every single third party that has released console sales splits (outside of genres that just don't sell to the player base) shows Xbox right where it would be or sometimes over performing based on the current split 2:1, most recently the figures from CDPR about the CP2077 DLC. Second if people aren't buying the consoles (okay, you've got this one a bit because the hardware sales are slowing down), never buy software and don't pay for GP, exactly where does MS's revenue come from? Especially once you figure in the fact that hardware is such a large chunk of the revenue thanks to the prices of the consoles, those lower sales would be putting a lot of downward pressure on the gross number. But, even without ABK factored in MS has been staying flat or having minor gains/losses because GP has been picking up the slack for them. Now, if they have a 40% further decline in hardware next quarter, that might finally be a bit too much for software and services/GP to cover, but still. The picture you paint and the math just don't square for me.

 

[Pancakes and Sausage]

Interrupting the regularly scheduled programs for an announcement.





Now back to your regularly scheduled programs.

Microsoft does not want to exit the console business but they will be forced to.

Xbox isn’t gaining console sales, they are losing them and if you can purchase the big Microsoft exclusives on PlayStation then people will buy even fewer Xboxes next generation.

 

[reinking]

Thanks for the correction, the same hunch applies subbing out 'Xbox' for 'Microsoft'.

I know a lot of people want him gone but him being promoted to CEO of Microsoft Gaming just before all of this hit the fan tells me he isn't going anywhere. At least not yet. MS appears to be moving away from the Xbox brand and using Microsoft Gaming for their multiplatform titles. Sarah will continue the console/XB division and Phil will push the overall Microsoft Gaming initiative into a more robust multiplatform era.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

If Starfield sells well on PlayStation compared to PlayStation games - ie not a Mass Effect situation - without being a significantly better offering than what is on Xbox/PC, then Microsoft might have some justification to stagger incoming games like Indiana Jones and keep day 1 gamepass. if it goes the other way and they are relatively managing the same(double sales) or less sales on PlayStation than Xbox, then for unified marketing expense and avoiding risk of damaging day one sales, I would expect all future releases to be day and date on PlayStation, and day 1 on gamepass to be gone.

Staggered release doesnt make sense in their case, they lose the hype cycle relevance big time that way

 

[AtomicStarving]

Plenty of console gamers don't want to game on PC so plenty of reason to get an Xbox for them.

Looks like they are not buying xbox consoles enough

 

[PaintTinJr]

Staggered release doesnt make sense in their case, they lose the hype cycle relevance big time that way

Completely agree. A large part of game sales in the first release result in buyer's remorse IMO, doing two launch cycles, with the biggest audience 2nd protects against buyer's remorse in the biggest audience, and based on the current situation, if Xbox console exclusive games weren't banger enough to move Xbox consoles, then it doesn't point towards the banger ratio changing that would be the loophole to skipping day and date releases on PlayStation.

 

[Topher]

Looks like they are not buying xbox consoles enough

Sure....but that's a different argument than saying there is no reason to buy an Xbox.

 

[Crayon]

I have never seen anyone mention another huge problem with game pass: The subscriber's digital library stops growing. Remember that thing that is supposed to anchor users? That sure would make it easier to jump ship to ps when the moment of truth comes.

 

[spons]

I can see some minor success in Microsoft dumping their console-exclusives like that rumored Gears of War collection (the one they were already playtesting or something a month ago) on PlayStation, but I don't particularly see a rich and famous future for Xbox as a hardware platform. The Xbox console business is most certainly a red box in every manager's spreadsheet in existence.

And as for cloud gaming, I have no fucking clue why that still exists. They have to have tons of Xbox-frankenservers at many regional data centers to make this work properly in the first place. Most of Europe is covered by a massive Azure data center in Amsterdam. Nobody is going to tell me that isn't hemorrhaging money. If any plug is pulled next week, Xcloud ain't surviving the storm.

 

[bitbydeath]

My prediction:

-Xbox is going away and being replaced with Microsoft Gaming Devices
-These devices aren’t made by Microsoft, support hybrid streaming, and are used to run GamePass only
-You can trade your Xbox Series in for one at no extra cost and your GamePass will carry over, but they won’t support any titles you had purchased on Xbox
-Series S is a straight swap while Series X gives a free year of GamePass on top
-All Microsoft games moving forward will become multi-platform, some older games will also switch
-GamePass will continue to not exist on Sony and Nintendo consoles
-Day 1 games will continue on GamePass but third parties will go

 

[havoc00]

Guys im a free agent now, any PS5 factions have some opens spots? I cant take being on the losing team anymore im wasting my prime here like Barry Sanders

 

[JohnnyFootball]

The leadership has fallen square on its face with the lack of communication. I have an increasing hunch that Phil Spencer may not be head honcho of Xbox this time next year.

I also wouldn't be surprised if he bends the knee to senior leadership. You don't get $10M a year jobs easily.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

I know a lot of people want him gone but him being promoted to CEO of Microsoft Gaming just before all of this hit the fan tells me he isn't going anywhere. At least not yet. MS appears to be moving away from the Xbox brand and using Microsoft Gaming for their multiplatform titles. Sarah will continue the console/XB division and Phil will push the overall Microsoft Gaming initiative into a more robust multiplatform era.

I don't really care what happens to Phil Spencer, but Matt Booty and Aaron Greenberg should be fired. Phil has done SOME good things, but I cannot see a single thing Matt Booty has accomplished.

 

[kruis]

Starfield cost 500m to produce. If that 500m game goes over to PlayStation, you best believe that all of them will follow down the road.

The bigger the game, the higher the budget, the more likely that game will come to other platforms. Let's not forget that Microsoft now has more studios than ever before yet their user base is also going to be smaller than ever before. MS sold 85 million Xbox 360s and 58 million Xbox Ones. The way this generation is going they'll sell less than 40 million Xbox Series S/X consoles. It's a dramatic fall in popularity. The console hardware is solid, 3rd party support is solid, they're giving their software away on Game Pass but sales are only going down. Something's gotta give.

Either Xbox fans will have to get used to low-mid budget AA games or they'll just have to accept the fact that Xbox' biggest games will go to PS/Switch as well.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

The bigger the game, the higher the budget, the more likely that game will come to other platforms. Let's not forget that Microsoft now has more studios than ever before yet their user base is also going to be smaller than ever before. MS sold 85 million Xbox 360s and 58 million Xbox Ones. The way this generation is going they'll sell less than 40 million Xbox Series S/X consoles. It's a dramatic fall in popularity. The console hardware is solid, 3rd party support is solid, they're giving their software away on Game Pass but sales are only going down. Something's gotta give.

Either Xbox fans will have to get used to low-mid budget AA games or they'll just have to accept the fact that Xbox' biggest games will go to PS/Switch as well.

Not to mention Xbox leadership conditioned them to NOT buy their games!

It amazes me how many fanboys continued to believe that Xbox would be allowed to operate with a blank check. Heck, I am shocked it was allowed as long as it was.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Charming sir. Go and ask Nintendo/Sony to release their titles other consoles, then we can talk about everybody. I said by Friday things like this would start.

 

[Montauk]

Charming sir. Go and ask Nintendo/Sony to release their titles other consoles, then we can talk about everybody. I said by Friday things like this would start.

Really sick of this bullshit lazy sentiment now.

This isn’t good for competition, so it isn’t good for everyone.

I’d be saying the same if Sony or (god forbid) Nintendo were in this position. I’ve always wanted three strong competitors creating this lively dynamic in the market.

This is not good! Stop trying to pretend it’s good because of this bullshit “plastic boxes” nonsense.

After Sega exited the market it was great that Microsoft entered it. We lost something with Sega but gained something with MS.

And it lead to great things. If we lose Xbox we lose something, however much temporary enjoyment some people get out of it.

 

[Shin-Ra]

This whole "only certain games" or "only bethesda/abk" doesnt even make sense.
The current rumours are HiFi Rush and Sea of Thieves, one of them is probably their most successful XGS game in recent times. So if the rumours are true, then there is no line between ABK + Bethesda and XGS.

If they port Sea of Thieves to Playstation, then Halo and Forza have the same probability, since they are also GaaS games.

Sounds like one of them “cut off your nose despite your face” moves.

 

[DJ12]

Guys im a free agent now, any PS5 factions have some opens spots? I cant take being on the losing team anymore im wasting my prime here like Barry Sanders

At least stick it out until after the event, you never know it might just be 3 games after all... when they don't sell on PS5 either Microsoft might rethink again.

Charming sir. Go and ask Nintendo/Sony to release their titles other consoles, then we can talk about everybody. I said by Friday things like this would start.

A new cope enters the chat.

'Phil said it all along'

 

[reinking]

Charming sir. Go and ask Nintendo/Sony to release their titles other consoles, then we can talk about everybody. I said by Friday things like this would start.

This is the "Phil has been saying it all along" acceptance stage.

Sony has a few games that are multi-console and they bring some games to PC. I do not expect that to change. Sony and Nintendo do not have to do this because they have built their fanbase over the long haul by building the library that caters to their core audience. They did this while maintaining a robust selection of third-party titles. MS has had a few successful franchises but chose to buy their way in. They are finding that playing keep away doesn't work and are now forced to reach the audience that did not follow those titles.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

There's so much more than this on top of it. PC gamers always make PC gaming sound like a paradise. I've been gaming on PC since the day you had to use cmd just to run the programs. I have a gaming PC right now that's been turned off since BG3 came out on PS5. PC gamimg has a lot of positives but PC gamers always leave out all the inconveniences involved in having a gaming PC. Inconveniences that seem small on the surface but quickly add up over time.

Exactly... I too have a gaming PC, a fairly decent one. Its at least got a 3080 in it and I have had it for almost two years now. And there are so many little inconveniences to gaming on PC that just don't get mentioned. And I don't know if this happens to anyone else, but every time i game on PC, and I mean every single time, I become apprehensive, almost like I am waiting for something to go wrong.

Anyway, there is a place for PC gaming, it's just not as straightforward as a lot of people would like to have you believe. Like the zealots that champion people use Linux. OMG.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

I tell ya I gamed with some folks last night who should know these things and they simply don't

MS is guarding this one tightly to this point

Then the rumors are mostly true. Otherwise there would be absolutely no reason whatsoever to let this shitstorm cause this much drama.

 

[foamdino]

Charming sir. Go and ask Nintendo/Sony to release their titles other consoles, then we can talk about everybody. I said by Friday things like this would start.

Preparing the ground. Game "journalists" are so transparently in MS back pocket it is truly amazing to see how much PR they do.

 

[bitbydeath]

Just realised that if MS are moving to those rumoured streaming devices then ABK can’t go on GamePass because Ubisoft hold the rights to it… Might explain why no ABK titles have landed on GamePass yet…

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Then the rumors are mostly true. Otherwise there would be absolutely no reason whatsoever to let this shitstorm cause this much drama.

It feels like a big moment and MS really needs to stick the landing here

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Really sick of this bullshit lazy sentiment now.

This isn’t good for competition, so it isn’t good for everyone.

I’d be saying the same if Sony or (god forbid) Nintendo were in this position. I’ve always wanted three strong competitors creating this lively dynamic in the market.

This is not good! Stop trying to pretend it’s good because of this bullshit “plastic boxes” nonsense.

After Sega exited the market it was great that Microsoft entered it. We lost something with Sega but gained something with MS.

And it lead to great things. If we lose Xbox we lose something, however much temporary enjoyment some people get out of it.

If that’s his opinion so be it , his attitude stinks tho, how many Xbox console players visit that site for news etc and he’s basically demeaning them by labelling them warriors. They couldn’t care less about the console.

 

[King Dazzar]

Guys im a free agent now, any PS5 factions have some opens spots? I cant take being on the losing team anymore im wasting my prime here like Barry Sanders

How's your kid smoove boi? Whilst I dont wish people harm, I was quietly hoping he'd suffered permanent loss of his voice in all this. He does need to pay penance for that tune. How'd it go again? "gamepaaaass, gamepaaaass, I might need to always pee, but I like to play for free, game paaass, game paaaass, phil gives it to me in the ass, but he's real top class, gamepaaas gamepaaaas"

 

[Astray]

MS is guarding this one tightly to this point

As they should, this is stock price shifting material.

What's your gut feeling on this, not asking for specific info, but interested to think what you think they should do here.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

It feels like a big moment and MS really needs to stick the landing here

Morale must be very low at Xbox.

I remember working for a company that was crashing and burning as well.
Lots of speculation, the parent company invested €8M in a last attempt to get things sorted, morale was extremely low, I left the company.
Two years later, the company was sold off.

Not saying this is the exact same situation, but it does remind me of that and it doesn't bode well at all.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

As they should, this is stock price shifting material.

What's your gut feeling on this, not asking for specific info, but interested to think what you think they should do here.

Glad you are not asking for specific info because I tried to get some and struck out

I THINK Phil says they are staying in the hardware business but talking about their handheld and saying something like they are deep into development of their next gen box

Some games will go multiplat but not all

Gamepass as we know could be in trouble

The only thing I feel confident about is the hardware but its entirely possible MS pulled the plug on it

I know the next console WAS further along than people think late last year

Its super interesting how quiet its been

 

[Alebrije]

Lots of theories here and there, my Bet is that Gamepass price Will increase no matter the model Microsoft takes.

 

[FIREKNIGHT2029]

This might be a preview to what we see next week. Xbox as a brand might be getting sent to the shadow realm

 

[reinking]

It feels like a big moment and MS really needs to stick the landing here

Come on Phil......