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[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

The better question is why does a class called TOMAHAWK have a damn bow? They should be throwing tomahawks .

Or throw pies.

They shouldn't have been called Tomahawks at all, it sounds like the bare minimum of research went into the design of this class.

 

[Chev]

Some of the jobs costumes in the first Bravely Default were pretty dumb, especially the one's for from the 2 female party members, like the Spell Fencer job.

Spell fencers have been arabian nights-themed since FF5.

 

[The Technomancer]

They shouldn't have been called Tomahawks at all, it sounds like the bare minimum of research went into the design of this class.

Is Tomahawk something Japan specifically has familiarity with some reason? Like I mentioned earlier Tomahawk Man has also been in the Mega Man games

 

[Johndoey]

Leave in a stereotypical native american outfit done 'sexy' like' and it's clearly an insult to them... Remove it and it's clearly an insult to them and white washing gaming further.

Now I think we can all agree the tomahawk outfit is inappropriate... but who gets to decide what would be? I mean, even if you got a native american tribe on board, there would likely be many other tribes that would disapprove.

Explain how its white washing?

I am a quarter Native American, I find the costume to be very cool.

My wife (a woman) finds the sexy aspect of the costume to be cute.

And yet here you are speaking for us.

It doesn't matter in the least that you are a quarter Native American. Why do people keep trotting this shit out?

It's a video game, not a history book.

And this is just a lazy dismissal.

 

[PixyJunket]

They shouldn't have been called Tomahawks at all, it sounds like the bare minimum of research went into the design of this class.

It's a video game, not a history book.

 

[Warxard]

You are only upset because I don't share your viewpoint.

If I had said "I am part Native American and this grossly offends me," I suspect that my "anecdotal example" would not have been so summarily disregarded.

I couldn't care less at what you are or not offended by. Seriously. I don't even know you.

I'm not even remotely bothered by the design either. But you know,

Well let me play devil's advocate here:

WHAT IF, hypothetically speaking, what if people had this ability they used to 'emphatize' with people who maybe are not for a certain thing? Maybe, just maybe there are other people with differing thought processes that don't follow yours and mine. Wouldn't that be outrageous? And what if it was possible to respect those ideals and thought processes instead of doubling down on ridiculous "oh im fine, it doesn't effect me it shouldn't effect you" comments?

I mean that'd be fucking crazy if people could do that. Someday.

--

But then again, you seem admant on stating your point at least once per thread. Do you, homie.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

Im surprised they are spending money on something like this.

 

[PdotMichael]

Is Tomahawk something Japan specifically has familiarity with some reason? Like I mentioned earlier Tomahawk Man has also been in the Mega Man games

Looking at the Abilities I think the name Tomahawk itself and all the abilities refer to missiles.

http://finalfantasy.neoseeker.com/wiki/Tomahawk_(Bravely_Second)

Is some meta stuff.

 

[sensui-tomo]

It's a video game, not a history book.

You'd think common sense would have the weapon that the class is named after, but eh. ... I'd like pies to be thrown though.. Life always needs a little running gag.

 

[Chastten]

It's exhausting having to keep up with what exactly insults an individual or group or race or whatever. Seems like every Nintendo game that doesn't have Mario in the title gets censored one way or another. I'm beginning to understand why so many games don't get localized anymore. >_>

 

[Alucrid]

It's exhausting having to keep up with what exactly insults an individual or group or race or whatever. Seems like every Nintendo game that doesn't have Mario in the title gets censored one way or another. I'm beginning to understand why so many games don't get localized anymore. >_>

it's really not that hard

things like this aren't the reason why games don't get localized.

 

[Doukou]

Looking at the Abilities I think the name Tomahawk itself and all the abilities refer to missiles.

http://finalfantasy.neoseeker.com/wiki/Tomahawk_(Bravely_Second)

Is some meta stuff.

A reference to the Tomahawk missile?

 

[PdotMichael]

A reference to the Tomahawk missile?

Yes. The abbilities are also clearly named after missiles or are missile related terms.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I am a quarter Native American, I find the costume to be very cool.

My wife (a woman) finds the sexy aspect of the costume to be cute.

And yet here you are speaking for us.

The logic behind this is a bit backwards, he shouldn't speak for you since you're quarter native american, which makes you speak for the others?

 

[Psxphile]

Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

 

[Henkka]

Spell fencers have been arabian nights-themed since FF5.

Is that considered exploitative, too?

 

[Professor Beef]

It's exhausting having to keep up with what exactly insults an individual or group or race or whatever. Seems like every Nintendo game that doesn't have Mario in the title gets censored one way or another. I'm beginning to understand why so many games don't get localized anymore. >_>

yeah it's so difficult to not be a jackass in today's modern world, omg

Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

Not really.

 

[Johndoey]

Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

If they did their shit properly from the get go this thread wouldn't have to exist.

 

[The Technomancer]

Is that considered exploitative, too?

As someone else pointed out its resemblance to actual belly dancing costumes helps it a fair bit. There's still a conversation to have there, but its not nearly as black or white as this instance

 

[Warxard]

It's exhausting having to keep up with what exactly insults an individual or group or race or whatever. Seems like every Nintendo game that doesn't have Mario in the title gets censored one way or another. I'm beginning to understand why so many games don't get localized anymore. >_>

Yeah it's really hard not respecting another person's space and piece of mind and apologizing if you make an accident.

Games don't get localized because they don't sell, not because you're not seeing titty in your game.

Damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

I don't expect japanese developers to do research to make inclusive, faithful recreations of certain culture qualities. Because these are the same people who think big lips are a common way to visualize black men.

 

[Ridley327]

Yes. The abbilities are also clearly named after missiles or are missile related terms.

So really, they should have turned the job into Top Gun cosplay.

imokwiththis.jpg

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

It's a video game, not a history book.

I know that, but I own the game and it just feels out of place since none of the other classes are named directly after weapons, so it seems like they were stumped as to what they should call it and just "eh, fuck it, let's go with Tomahawk" It comes off as lazy and it doesn't even make sense since their specialty is gunplay.

EDIT: Seeing the missile explanation it makes more sense.

 

[Doukou]

Yes. The abbilities are also clearly named after missiles or are missile related terms.

Yah seems like its a weird joke then. Tomahawk to convey missiles and Native American.

 

[Dark Ninja]

I know that, but I own the game and it just feels out of place since none of the other classes are named directly after weapons, so it seems like they were stumped as to what they should call it and just "eh, fuck it, let's go with Tomahawk" It comes off as lazy and it doesn't even make sense since their specialty is gunplay.

After learning that its named after the missile, that's pretty clever.

 

[Warxard]

So really, they should have turned the job into Top Gun cosplay.

imokwiththis.jpg

Flight jackets, aviators and scarfs. Hell yeah

 

[Goldrusher]

Meanwhile at Wal-Mart...

(and that's just 2 pages of 20+)

 

[Chastten]

it's really not that hard

things like this aren't the reason why games don't get localized.

It is hard, really. Call me insenstive and what not, but I really don't see what's so offensive about these costumes, nor do I understand all the outcry about the new Fire Emblem, Xenoblade etc. Now I don't really care about the changes either as they don't affect the game (besides releasedates probably) but yeah, reading these topics make me cringe.

Nope, not directly, but if you suddenly face a lot of outcry over a little detail in a game thats bound to not sell a lot anyways, and you have to change that, it suddenly becomes a lot less financially viable to localize it at all.

 

[Alucrid]

Meanwhile at Wal-Mart...

http://i.imgur.com/RjTpfmQ.jpg[/MG]

(and that's just 2 pages of 20+)[/QUOTE]

walmart, the bastion of morals and values

well, okay, maybe values i guess

 

[Warxard]

Meanwhile at Wal-Mart...

I thought American Indian was an acceptable alternative to Native American?

 

[redcrayon]

You'd think common sense would have the weapon that the class is named after, but eh. ... I'd like pies to be thrown though.. Life always needs a little running gag.

To be fair, it's not like FF dragoons represent either the 17th/18th century European cavalry formations or the French 'dragon' cavalry firearm that the term comes from either, it's been used in FF terms to mean 'leaping dragon-themed knight with spear' for twenty-odd years instead.

Maybe they just thought it sounded cool. Same goes for general fantasy usage of 'Paladin' too, both terms have a specific historical meaning, but sometimes games designers just choose it because it sounds evocative. 'Paladin' for 'knightly', 'Dragoon' for 'draconic knight', 'Tomahawk' for 'tribal warrior'. I can see how they get there.

 

[sensui-tomo]

I thought American Indian was an acceptable alternative to Native American?

What do you call a person of Indian heritage who also happens to be born in America?

 

[Frumix]

 

[Warxard]

What do you call a person of Indian heritage who also happens to be born in America?

The reason I asked that (I say Native American regardless) is that supposedly it's still registered on a lot of sites alongside the Native American terminology.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

What do you call a person of Indian heritage who also happens to be born in America?

Isn't that Indian-American?

 

[Crossing Eden]

There's a difference between the original creators changing something and it being their decision to change something. I feel as if that's important to note. Also, how do we know this was their decision? And why would that be the case, if its only being changed for the Western market? Does it not at all seem suspicious that this change isn't being made for Japan as well? I mean if the original creator felt that this is a better outfit, wouldn't an update be made on the Japanese release as well?

It could've been a decision by the creators to change something for a different market. Considering that the people who oppose these sort of outfits most likely wouldn't reach them. It can be inferred that they decided to do this themselves.

I am a quarter Native American, I find the costume to be very cool.

My wife (a woman) finds the sexy aspect of the costume to be cute.

And yet here you are speaking for us.

You being a quarter Native American doesn't make you the final authority on the matter. Neither does the terribly overused "My wife, girlfriend, f-e-m-a-l-e friend doesn't find this sexist" excuse that ALWAYS comes up either.

 

[sensui-tomo]

Isn't that Indian-American?

If it is then i have made a mistake :/

 

[kamineko]

Seems like game will be fine without it.

 

[Trojita]

That cowboy outfit looks terrible.

 

[Tesseract]

My elders are not a costume for you to wear

my elders too

my mom's side is native american, m8

the costumes are fun, not everyone has a tomahawk up their bum

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Isn't that Indian-American?

If that's indian-american than what is indian-american, hindu-american? But that'd be religious.

 

[TatteredHat]

It's another 8-4 localization, can't say I'm surprised at this point. Original costume looks a lot better than the new one, maybe the EU version will keep the original but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Alucrid]

That cowboy outfit looks terrible.

it literally looks the same minus the paint and feathers, plus a cowboy hat. maybe pants, but that might be shadows

 

[Professor Beef]

Isn't that Indian-American?

Reverse it.

 

[sensui-tomo]

It could've been a decision by the creators to change something for a different market. Considering that the people who oppose these sort of outfits most likely wouldn't reach them. It can be inferred that they decided to do this themselves.

You being a quarter Native American doesn't make you the final authority on the matter. Neither does the terribly overused "My wife, girlfriend, f-e-m-a-l-e friend doesn't find this sexist" excuse that ALWAYS comes up either.

not targeting you, but is the "My wife (a female)" the new "my friend whom is black" ?
Shit is bad to read. I like the lewd outfits... but damn if i see some dumb comments made for it.

 

[Oregano]

It's another 8-4 localization, can't say I'm surprised at this point. Original costume looks a lot better than the new one, maybe the EU version will keep the original but I'm not holding my breath.

Is It?

I would have assumed Binari Sonari would be handling it again. They did a pretty good job with the first game.

 

[autoduelist]

Many character designs are based on 'other' cultures. This makes perfect sense, since we have a world of cultures to sample from.

Many character designs are sexy. This makes perfect sense, since we, in general, are horny beings.

I have no issue with the original designs, or the remade designs. Whatever. All cultures, races, ethnicities, and religions get stereotyped to some degree because stereotyping is part of how we make sense of the infinite variety of human beings.

You put a suit on someone, or a baseball cap, or a cowboy hat, or camouflage, or whatever and it all has meaning. So does a Native American costume. Give a character a boomerang and an Australian accent, or make a character look like a snake-charming middle eastern shaman, or a white American alpha-frat boy, or a blond cheerleader.... it's all stereotyping, and ultimately it's all okay, because it's how -we- work. Glasses imply smart and nerdy, etc, etc. If it wasn't how we worked, we wouldn't instantly identify and assign meaning to those images in the first place. Can it be offensive? Sure. Most things can. But merely making a stereotype 'sexy' is stretching it, imo. Sanitizing everything is even more offensive in my opinion.

 

[Aeana]

Reverse it.

Assuming he was talking about Indian as in of the country India, then Indian American is correct. Like anything else: Italian American, French American, Chinese American, etc. American Indian is used as an alternative for Native American.

 

[SpacePirate Ridley]

This seems silly.

So Americans (or any countries population for that matter) couldn't wear traditional foreign wear then such as kimonos (Japan) or sombreros (Spain/Mexico)?

Seems silly to me given the fact that a good majority of the world adapted to wearing the Western/European style of clothing line. Should we call out those people as well since they aren't English/American?

Shit this video calls it like it is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwoSYWIgV9Y

Im with you here, but we dont wear sombreros in Spain
Change that for sevillana dresses, and your point still stands.

 

[TatteredHat]

Is It?

I would have assumed Binari Sonari would be handling it again. They did a pretty good job with the first game.

That's what I read, atleast.

 

[Professor Beef]

Assuming he was talking about Indian as in of the country India, then Indian American is correct. Like anything else: Italian American, French American, Chinese American, etc. American Indian is used as an alternative for Native American.

Ah, you're right. I got the post mixed up, my mistake.