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Rumor: Grand Theft Auto V will use additional DRM on PC (Steam + Denuvo)

Sentenza

Member
I know I'm not a sample of the average consumer, but I can't help but notice the irony of how their attempt to "protect their product" turned my stance from
"I'm going to buy this shit as soon as it's available on PC"
to
"Man, I'm really conflicted about this. I'll take my time to think if I really want to buy this game".
 

Orayn

Member
Sounds like a convinient narrative posted on reddit by pirates.

They claim a 5X CPU hit. Give me a break. The game wouldn't run if that was the case.

I'll give Bamco and Deck13 the benefit of the doubt and assume this is a case of garden variety bugs and performance problems that people incorrectly blamed on DRM because of an oddly named task.

That said, I still think people are right to worry. We're just now seeing a strong trend toward reasonable DRM methods and the abandonment of bad ones, so it's understandable that folks are skittish about this.
 

MUnited83

For you.
Of course DRM exists for pirates. When a pirate sees all his friends are playing the newest hit game and he can't because it's not been cracked yet, and could take any number of weeks to be cracked, then i'd guess he's more likely to just buy the game to join in with everyone else.

People are complaining about this DRM even though there is no evidence that it is harmful or obtrusive to their playing of the game. GTAV is not online only on any other platform but you believe that people will not complain if it was for PC?

Hmm:

-made by the SecuRom guys
-still has actual SecuRom code
-both Lords of the Fallen and Fifa 15 have reported performance issues.


Yeah, I will assume the absolute fucking worst until proof of contrary comes.
 
Steam sale time.

Fuck off Rockstar. I am a paying customer. I should have my fucking experience hampered with, because off people who weren't going to buy the damn game in the first place.
 

UrbanRats

Member
I know I'm not a sample of the average consumer, but I can't help but notice the irony of how their attempt to "protect their product" turned my stance from
"I'm going to buy this shit as soon as it's available on PC"
to
"Man, I'm really conflicted about this. I'll take my time to think if I really want to buy this game".

Indeed, if this shit seriously hinders modding and eats performance, i know i'll be considering it on very strong sale.

And i'm pretty rabid about GTAV.

Doesn't help them that the very next month i'll be playing Bloodborne AND Witcher 3.
 

LilJoka

Member
Hmm:

-made by the SecuRom guys
-still has actual SecuRom code

-both Lords of the Fallen and Fifa 15 have reported performance issues.


Yeah, I will assume the absolute fucking worst until proof of contrary comes.

No way! SecuRom broke my installation of Windows a fair few times, still want to install GT Legends but scared of SecuRom.
 

jshackles

Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
this has been covered in the thread multiple times

Sorry, I did a search for the owner's name but nothing came up. I thought it was relevant to point out the link between the two companies rather than what people have said that it's "just like SecuROM".
 

dhlt25

Member
it's not like Rock Stars gave a shit about PC gamers ever since GTA got big anyway. I don't pay more than $5 for any of their games and this won't change thing
 

Saganator

Member
Hasn't piracy gone down in the past 5 years or so? I don't miss the DRM days of PC gaming. Please don't let this be a new trend. I thought about triple dipping, but never mind.
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
*sigh*

I'm still going to try to get this, but if my budget forces me to choose between this and Witcher 3, it won't be a hard decision to make. When I finally decide to pre-order these games, I'm definitely setting the money aside for Witcher 3 first.

I've cracked plenty of games I own. Before Steam I used to do it habitually just so I didn't need to have the disk in to play something.

So people actually do this? I was wondering about it. If you're just talking about cracked exes I used to do it just to avoid the disc check on some games. I have no idea if people actually do it to avoid today's bullshit DRM though.
 
Guess I won't be in a rush to pick this up.

Oh, this is the magical double-stacked DRM that makes the game somehow run better, is it?

Lords of the Fallen runs better on PC than PS4. Take that however you want.

Steamworks was more obtrusive to my playing the game than Denuvo. I bought the game on Amazon and it came on the day of release but Steam wouldn't even let me install it because it wasn't 5pm yet. So if anything maybe we should get rid of that?

Note: Steamworks is not Steam, DRM free games can be sold on Steam
 

d00d3n

Member
Not knowing anything how this particular DRM works, I wonder how futureproof it is. Does it work on Windows 2025 without updates from Rockstar/Denuvo (because we know those updates won't be coming at that point)? Basically I'm wondering if this will set an expiry date on GTA 5 on PC like Starforce (which was a terrible DRM, but in the form of a driver to be fair) did to so many games a decade or so ago.

Of course. Imagine a customer who has bought these versions of GTAV:
PS3 digital (broken release) -> PS3 disc -> PS4 (better graphics) -> PC (better graphics)

Is it really fair that this customer gets to continue to play the PC version forever? I don't know about you, but this sounds an awful lot like slavery to me. How are the families of the people working at Rockstar supposed to survive? It is just immoral that the software continues to work forever without any additional payment.
 

Nzyme32

Member
Because they fucking hate PC gamers, as it can be seen by:

-Delayed PC version of GTA V
-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas)
-Shitloads of DRM (Securom+Social Club+GFWL on GTA IV. ALL OF THEM. AT THE SAME TIME)
-They added a warning on GTA IV store page basically saying that thay aren't patching GFWL out.


And now this shit. Rockstar can put the PC port back where the sun doesn't shine, because holy fuck, if you hate platform that much, you might as well stay the fuck away from it.


GTA IV has no Steam DRM(CEG). You can play your Steam copy without starting steam, afaik.

-Delayed PC version of GTA V - Makes sense if they want to maximise revenue and prevent it eating into sales of the console versions.

-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas) - Purposely?? When and what mods?

-Shitloads of DRM (Securom+Social Club+GFWL on GTA IV. ALL OF THEM. AT THE SAME TIME) - definitely stupid, no argument there

-They added a warning on GTA IV store page basically saying that thay aren't patching GFWL out. - Where is this, it's not there
 

Addnan

Member
Guess it has become a wait and see how it turns out game. I suppose it will have mandatory social club log in on top of the other two layers of DRM.
 
yes but what i mean is that you're saying nobody complains about league, hearthstone, dota and tf2 all being online only and nobody complains because they're free in the first place, whereas everyone complained about sim city being online only because it was a $60 title that was a step back in every way from previous games and had severe server issues for the first few weeks of its launch preventing people from playing the game that they paid $60 for

People complained about Sim City because it added an always online check to what should have been a singleplayer offline game. If it had literally had a "Go online" button that then activated a check nobody would have cared.

WoW, SC2, CS:GO all have 'always online DRM checks' that nobody complains about.
People complain about things that put them out.

A full retail product that has an online component where that online is authenticated and prevents pirate copies from playing is not only perfectly acceptable, its expected.
 
I know I'm not a sample of the average consumer, but I can't help but notice the irony of how their attempt to "protect their product" turned my stance from
"I'm going to buy this shit as soon as it's available on PC"
to
"Man, I'm really conflicted about this. I'll take my time to think if I really want to buy this game".
It's GTA5. You're gonna have to have some godly willpower to wait a year to get it for 10 bucks or something, assuming you haven't played it on consoles yet. I don't even care, I'm getting it. The "principle" doesn't matter to me; it's GTA5. #partoftheproblem
 

perorist

Unconfirmed Member
I'll bow to both of your obviously well researched and not knee jerk reactionary social studies into software piracy, its causes and effects.
Or you could use common sense.

People don't complain about WoW or KOTOR being online only because they're MMOs and social games by nature. No one wants to play by themselves in an empty offline world.

LoL, DOTA2, Hearthstone, and TF2 are competitive multiplayer games. No one wants to play by themselves offline in an empty game with bots.

People don't complain about the always online requirement for those games because without online and other humans they're absolutely pointless to play. It's pointless to compare those to GTAV or other games with huge singleplayer components. Take Sim City for example, people complained the shit out of that game's always online requirement because it added absolutely nothing to the game, which was always an offline, single player experience.
 

Squishy3

Member
"Denuvo is the new company formed from a management buyout of the Sony DADC DigitalWorks team, the team that developed best-of-breed copy protection systems like SecuROM for games and Screen Pass for movies"

No fucking thanks

Sorry, I did a search for the owner's name but nothing came up. I thought it was relevant to point out the link between the two companies rather than what people have said that it's "just like SecuROM".
I pointed it out on page 2, so yeah. No beef, just saying. Straight from the company's website.

Because FIFA's more popular so EA probably cares more about people pirating it.
ea is the company that said dragon age 2 wasn't using securom everytime they were asked before the game came out and then they clarified and said it was using a release control program made by the same team that made securom

flash forward 3 years and now companies are using a drm method made yet again by some of the staff from that same company
 

spwolf

Member
consider how long FIFA 2015 was out and that it has not been broken, i expect this one to be used soon by almost everyone in PC world.
 

DeaviL

Banned
This BS with DRM on PC has got to stop.
Lot's of piracy comes from poorer countries who can't afford these games anyway, so that's no money lost.
Secondly, the PC market has no second hand market whatsoever, we have to buy new.
 

Easy_D

never left the stone age
*sigh*

I'm still going to try to get this, but if my budget forces me to choose between this and Witcher 3, it won't be a hard decision to make. When I finally decide to pre-order these games, I'm definitely setting the money aside for Witcher 3 first.



So people actually do this? I was wondering about it. If you're just talking about cracked exes I used to do it just to avoid the disc check on some games. I have no idea if people actually do it to avoid today's bullshit DRM though.

I did for Witcher 2 until CDProjekt patched the DRM out of all copies, later they allowed you to register the game on GoG itself. Such nice guys.

This BS with DRM on PC has got to stop.
Lot's of piracy comes from poorer countries who can't afford these games anyway, so that's no money lost.
Secondly, the PC market has no second hand market whatsoever, we have to buy new.

It really is silly to equate numbers of pirated copies with numbers of lost sales.
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
-Delayed PC version of GTA V - Makes sense if they want to maximise revenue and prevent it eating into sales of the console versions.

Rockstar shouldn't care if you buy it on PC instead of console. It's still a sale for them.

-Purposely breaking mods for their games(happened with GTA IV/Saint Andreas) - Purposely?? When and what mods?

I can tell you this has happened on multiple occasions. Rockstar deliberately introduced patches to GTA IV to disable the graphics mods.
 
Or you could use common sense.

People don't complain about WoW or KOTOR being online only because they're MMOs and social games by nature. No one wants to play by themselves in an empty offline world.

LoL, DOTA2, Hearthstone, and TF2 are competitive multiplayer games. No one wants to play by themselves offline in an empty game with bots.

People don't complain about the always online requirement for those games because without online and other humans they're absolutely pointless to play. It's pointless to compare those to GTAV or other games with huge singleplayer components. Take Sim City for example, people complained the shit out of that game's always online requirement because it added absolutely nothing to the game, which was always an offline, single player experience.

So you're either pretending there's no singleplayer component to WoW or KOTOR, or you've never played them.
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
Once again, legitimate customers will have to deal with some extra that pirates will just easily remove.

Is it illegal to buy the game but then use the crack to get rid of the DRM?
 

jshackles

Gentlemen, we can rebuild it. We have the capability to make the world's first enhanced store. Steam will be that store. Better than it was before.
I pointed it out on page 2, so yeah. No beef, just saying. Straight from the company's website.

Gotcha, thanks just saw the post. I just wanted to make sure everyone was aware, because that's shady as fuck.
 

SexyFish

Banned
So...has this actually been confirmed other than their logo on their website?

Also, the post on the forum says that Rockstar was added today to their list of partners, but Wayback Machine shows them there as recent as May 2014.

dZmP7y2.jpg
 

Sentenza

Member
It's GTA5. You're gonna have to have some godly willpower to wait
I like GTA. I don't like it THAT much.
But that's not even the point.
The point isn't if I'm going to buy it or not in the end. The point is that they just made the product LESS appealing to me as a paying customer.
 

Squishy3

Member
So...has this actually been confirmed other than their logo on their website?

Also, the post on the forum says that Rockstar was added today to their list of partners, but Wayback Machine shows them there as recent as May 2014.
It has to be for GTA V, since Rockstar has no other PC releases coming anytime soon (wtb red dead) let alone have they announced any other games in development.
 

kick51

Banned
Some of these PC releases are like an episode of the Twilight Zone.

Final Fantasy XIII at 60fps!!! ...but it has no resolution options and stutters like crazy muahahaha

GTAV coming to PC with major enhancements!!! ...but crippling DRM muahahahah
 

Sentenza

Member
100% unobtrusive.
"Rootkits" DRMs are never unobtrusive. In fact they are typically the worst case of "intrusive".
Maybe not in the sense that you can obviously notice their presence when unaware of them, but they have the bad tendency to mess with your OS.
 
Why do you keep saying this when it hasn't been proven either way?

Sorry, what I meant was when you are playing the game you will never notice the DRM exists. It doesn't get in your way or make you jump through any extra hoops. What it is doing in the background of course, I don't know.
 
Don't forget Rockstar Social Club Login (which was 100% required for Max Payne 3, and has limited activations as far as I know).

So it will be Steam + Denuvo + Rockstar Social Club.
 
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