I think it's a similar case similar to Alien Isolation, where even lower-end console level PCs outperform the PS4 version. Though the console version are pretty poor so the bar is set low.
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Rumor: Grand Theft Auto V will use additional DRM on PC (Steam + Denuvo)
- Thread starter crimsonheadGCN
- Start date
I think it's a similar case similar to Alien Isolation, where even lower-end console level PCs outperform the PS4 version. Though the console version are pretty poor so the bar is set low.
From what I gather, the majority of people who pirate games wouldn't buy them regardless of access to pirated copies.
AHA-Lambda
Member
ok, do we know what this DRM does yet?
I hate when I'm playing a non-steam game and some dickbag on my friends list messages me about pirating it. No I don't buy all my games on steam guys! Stop assuming I'm a pirate you assholes lol.
And somewhere in my dream land, I want R* to support Steam Workshop in GTA V
CambriaRising
Member
I got a lot of these messages when I bought Tomb Raider 2013 on Origin because I had some credit. It was really annoying.
Performance is relative when it comes to PC gaming though. Whether it is causing performance issues or crashes I wouldn't know, but stating a game runs better on PC doesn't really mean much when PC hardware is not a fixed thing. Neither are people's expectations. Expecting a game to run at 60fps, but getting less than that would constitute a legitimate problem if it could be proven the DRM was the cause of that. If it ran at a steady 60fps without it.
It's okay, I've been hugely misled about the importance of the offline singleplayer modes in WoW, KOTOR, LoL, DOTA2, Hearthstone, and TF2 as a part of their respective packages as well.
Not really but there's this:
From Lords of the Fallen EULA.
Isn't that just key you register on Steam?
Wait your comparing a MMO to DRM? What? CS:GO is a MP only game always has been since the beginning stop saying false information if you dont know what your talking about. Simcity always been a singleplayer game and offline...see Simcity 2000 or Simcity 4 for that even since that game is still selling more then the one they brought out last year.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
Either GTA:O is compelling enough that it is a disincentive to pirate, or it isn't.
EDIT:
(sigh)
A game that needs to authenticate to play online is online only DRM.
A game designed around online multiplayer is not contrioversial to have such a system.
jellies_two
Member
Or maybe Rockstar will provide a mod API that opens it up, but not to the point where mods can stuff up the play experience of the online GTAV experience for others.
Facebook and twitter allows mods, but only if you get a key and operate within the API. Very reasonable. Does Facebook hate its users by not allowing any and all modifications to their platform?
Barack Lesnar
Banned
Whether it's Steam DRM, Origin DRM, Uplay, this Desuvo, in the end the pirates will always have the more appealing product for single-player games because they have no DRM at all. What do you do? Download a torrent, type in the crack and you're done. 100% DRM-free game at your fingertips.
The only roadblock for them is multi-player. I'm liking how integrated online aspects of next-gen games are because of this.
I'd like to think that Bioware has enough pull within EA that they wouldn't fuck people over like that.
CambriaRising
Member
It is, but you can still start it through Origin.
People need to calm down.
- FIFA 15 seems to be fine. Of course, every game has its "Crash solution thread"s around the internet. But I haven't found anything out of the ordinary with that game at the moment.
- Lords Of The Fallen seemingly crashes frequently. But so did/does Dead Rising 3.
As long as I haven't seen backed up proof that the DRM is the cause, I call the accusations utter bullshit.
Look, if this DRM was cracked in a few days, I would of course be against it. But if it succeeds to combat piracy in the first 6 months that's a tremendous achievement.
Remember, the first 6 months are crucial since any cracked game probably gets the most seeds & peers in those first 6 months.
Pirates will eventually give in and buy the game.
And don't tell me some pirates simply have no money and will still wait it out till the game's cracked: that is false. If you have the money to get a gaming PC that runs GTA V, you don't have to tell me you can't buy a AAA game.
If that's the case you should reevaluate your life asap. Get a job/get a better job/educate yourself/get rid of your overpriced Apple products/...
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This all on the condition modding is still possible.
I have a feeling Rockstar will support Steam Workshop and find a way to make it all work together.
- FIFA 15 seems to be fine. Of course, every game has its "Crash solution thread"s around the internet. But I haven't found anything out of the ordinary with that game at the moment.
- Lords Of The Fallen seemingly crashes frequently. But so did/does Dead Rising 3.
As long as I haven't seen backed up proof that the DRM is the cause, I call the accusations utter bullshit.
Look, if this DRM was cracked in a few days, I would of course be against it. But if it succeeds to combat piracy in the first 6 months that's a tremendous achievement.
Remember, the first 6 months are crucial since any cracked game probably gets the most seeds & peers in those first 6 months.
Pirates will eventually give in and buy the game.
And don't tell me some pirates simply have no money and will still wait it out till the game's cracked: that is false. If you have the money to get a gaming PC that runs GTA V, you don't have to tell me you can't buy a AAA game.
If that's the case you should reevaluate your life asap. Get a job/get a better job/educate yourself/get rid of your overpriced Apple products/...
--
This all on the condition modding is still possible.
I have a feeling Rockstar will support Steam Workshop and find a way to make it all work together.
Pathfinder
Member
Do we know for sure that this added DRM will affect modding, or are we jumping to conclusions with no factual evidence?
? I could swear that Tomb Raider 2013 is Steamworks everywhere, including Origin.
I don't think the DRM has much effect on modding(well, with the exception of mods that modify the exe of the game and so).
Do you know what will really affect modding though? Rockstar themselves. They will happily break mods with every update they do.
luca_29_bg
Member
In less than three months will be hacked, trust me!
Yes, I agree with this, but I'm taking the stance that it isn't disincentive enough on its own. Not because it's not well made or not fun, but that the entire game as a package isn't primarly designed around online multiplayer.
If you can clearly understand this yourself then I don't know why you listed LoL, DOTA2, Hearthstone, and TF2 in that first post.
It doesn't not support it either. Of course it runs better on PCs than the PS4. The question is would it run better on PCs without the DRM than the same PCs with the DRM.
Moral Panic
Member
Equivalent hardware runs the game better than PS4. Game runs 1080p30 with dips on PS4.
That might be true, but I will just point out that lack of evidence doesn't automatically prove the opposite.
Despite beign against it, I'm actually very interested to see how long this DRM lasts with GTA V. It will be true test, Lords of the Fallen and FIFA 15 is still small releases compared to it.
Steam DRM is usually instantly cracked, there seems to be some kind of modified client which removes checks, and I assume it works for every game. It only prevents early leaks, because files on disc are encrypted.
Not really. Updating and installing from Steam is far easier and safer than from some random shady site and without need to hunt for working non-malware infected download and possible same for patches.
Steam: Just click install & wait for download to be done.
Of course multiple DRM layers is mayor pita in many games.
Steam DRM is usually instantly cracked, there seems to be some kind of modified client which removes checks, and I assume it works for every game. It only prevents early leaks, because files on disc are encrypted.
Not really. Updating and installing from Steam is far easier and safer than from some random shady site and without need to hunt for working non-malware infected download and possible same for patches.
Steam: Just click install & wait for download to be done.
Of course multiple DRM layers is mayor pita in many games.
I'm sure there'll be an difference, but an insignificant one. The majority of game piracy happens in countries that have a low median income, these are countries where F2P games like World of Tanks and War Thunder are extremely popular. They'll just continue to happily play those. These countries are just incompatible with the AAA $60 model.
Sentenza
Member
But these are not on the same level at all.
I'm completely fine with Steam and in the end even with Origin (despise not being too fond of EA being in charge of it) when it doesn't come with SecuROM.
Uplay is a crappy client/account system, but that's pretty much the issue with it these days that constant online checks are gone.
Denuvo, SecuROM, TAGES and Starforce on the other hand are an entirely different story. They are rootkits installations which mess with your system, potentially even harming it, just to indulge on the "control freak" mindset of some publishers.
But I don't want to download a crack. I pay for legit products precisely because I don't want to deal with that garbage (and because I want to reward developers making things I like).
I'm not annoyed because they are preventing pirated copies from working, because I was going to buy the game anyway. What annoys me is precisely that they are making my (now eventual) original copy less appealing to me.
Right, so the best course of action is probably to wait until we have more information. It's too early to declare that the sky is falling or that everything is fine, we just don't know.
Like I said, PC gamers are rightfully nervous due to the precedent of previous DRM fuckups, so the negative reactions aren't unwarranted. The onus is on Rockstar and Denuvo to reassure people that they won't be getting a worse experience than the (eventual) pirates.
FunkyMunkey
Banned
"No more piracy on PC." Well that's a wrap everyone, PIRACY IS DEAD!
So what will happen when the game is still pirated?
So what will happen when the game is still pirated?
Moral Panic
Member
Where are all of you people whenever I criticise Steamworks DRM?
jellies_two
Member
I dunno man I agree with everything you say except this one bit. People who love to torrent tend not to love Apple for the reason that they don't like having to buy apps and songs or re-root their phone every month, and they think that Apple represents Satan and mind-controls its users and wouldn't give them a dime. Also they are cheap - except when it comes to their PC GPU upgrades - So my guess is they have an Android device or three.
Yeah, people are upset because they're pirates and not because SecuROM/Tages/whatever are known to cause issues.
Sentenza
Member
Do you realize the difference between the "Steamworks DRM" just having an encrypted executable unlocked on release date and a rootkit doing who-fuck-knows-what installed in your OS?
It's a false equivalency.
I wasn't planning to. But now I'm kind of wanting to.
That's an awful comparison. DRM has a long, rotten history of causing a lot more grief and harm to legit consumers than the ones doing the piracy - DRM tends to get hacked within weeks or months, whereas a game with DRM will forever be plagued by the inherent problems that DRM has, and thusly you're actively harming your consumers, the ones who paid you for your product, and you're in reality not doing much to stop piracy.
Reaching for bottom of the barrel material i see.
Moral Panic
Member
Is Denuvo a rootkit?
If it has remnants of SecuROM, then it may well be.
Sentenza
Member
Apparently.
It's said to have more than few roots in common with SecuROM, which is.
Gotta agree with this, I know each of those games has a big following, but GTA is GTA and sort of in another league.
There will be a LOT more eyes looking for a way to hack it.
I was actually waiting for this on PC but might just drop back to a console release, so little is known about this DRM I hate inviting it onto my computer without knowing what it does and what the long term effects are.
Well, that would mean more than simply runs better on PC anyway.
MrNyarlathotep
Banned
A program that disguises its processes while running with priveleged access on a computer.
Like SecuROM does.
Willy Wanka
my god this avatar owns
I can't say I've noticed any problems with it while playing Fifa 15. I'm in no huge rush to buy it though (already finished it on the 360) so I may hold off on a purchase until a few weeks after release, to make sure that there are no significant issues caused by Denuvo.