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SPOILER ALERT: Halo 5 (Spoiler) Spoiler Thread of Spoilers Spoiler

jackdoe

Member
Yes. Instead we make it to Cortana as Blue team, and before we get to see them talk to her, it fades to Osiris. When they finally meet up MC admits he knows Cortana is dangerous. HOW did they not let us see the interactions that led to this?
I think that the in game chatter from Cortana for the second Blue Team mission slightly addresses this. The real problem is that they, both Blue Team and Cortana, waste hours before they do anything else, waiting until Osiris shows up so that they could progress the main plot thread forward.
 

Solidsoul

Banned
Here is where I am having trouble with Halo 5's story:

Halo 4 took the series in a different direction than I would have taken but I felt it still did the job very well. I was invested in Halo 4 and I loved all the extended media surrounding it. I could really get behind where they were taking the series, even if it wasn't where I would have taken it specifically.

Then Halo 5 comes along, and not only does the marketing campaign, as well as the podcast for hunt the truth lead us to believing a lot of things are going to be going on in Halo 5's story that in fact aren't at all. But then to top it off all of the extended media 343 has been releasing leads us in a completely different direction, with all of the background on the forerunners and their conflict with the humans. Leaving them to obtain the mantle and such, the lifetime of planning for the Chief and the strong hints that he may of had some geas or imprint of the Iso-didact himself. There was a lot going on and you could see they were headed towards something very interesting.

But then Halo 5 story happens, and it ruins everything that has been established within 343's own extended universe. They talked about how this game would change everything you thought you knew about Halo, and while it does they didn't do it in a clever way. This isn't one of those situations where there is a big reveal and you realize everything they had been telling you all along was kind of pointing to this and you didn't realize it. No, it was more of "Hey cortanas bad and shes leading AI's to take over the galaxy" Nothing pointed to that, it didn't seem interesting or clever.

I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, I'm just stating how I am feeling right now, and that is that I don't think I can follow the Halo universe anymore. It's convoluted and makes no sense. What's really sad is that it would be easy to say 343 is the only reason why Halo went downhill (story-wise) but I can't even say that, because I liked Halo 4 and several of the extended universe stories. I don't see anyway this story can turn around. It literally seems impossible after what happened in Halo 5. Like, I can't conjure up one scenario that would fix where the universe is headed.

So disappointed by the story. Though I want to clarify I have a lot of respect for 343 and their team. I'm sure they worked their asses off, and it's evident by how great the gameplay and multiplayer is. It just completely went off the rails for me as far as the story goes.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
Watching IGN's reactions panel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86IqMUtWWfE

At about 1hr mark they make a good point... At end of Spartan Ops (which I just watched online today) Halsey "wants revenge" for losing her arm and the UNSC trying to kill her... Then when they get her in Halo 5 she's just like "Oh Hi guyz"

Ehh, she worked to advance humanity her whole life, I always thought she was just playing Jul so that she could get to the Record and get back to humanity with her findings. A little bit of Pallmer shooting off her arm isn't going to turn her off from her lifes work. So none of that was inconsistent to me.


The only weird part on that front was going back into ONIs arms, and Pallmers, sending them her coordinates...Something needs to fill the gaps there. Escalation maybe.
 

Flipyap

Member
One small thing that irked me in this game is how Blue Team kept calling John "Chief".

This is a family, they're on a first name basis. Come on.
I was more bothered by them verbalizing their every move instead of communicating mainly through HUD lights and cutesy gestures.
I get why 343 did this, but they play such a small role in the campaign, I doubt it would confuse the average player that much if they had to endure limited team chatter for three missions.

Because Halo 4 ruined him. He even looks stupid (in my opinion). I don't mind the armor, but that face... The Warden is so much more imposing.
The Didact's armor looks even dumber than his dumb face. He's supposed to be a respectable military leader, but he wears a skull mask and the skull isn't even modeled after his own species.
I think that dude suffers from severe nasal cavity envy. No wonder he hates us so much.

I thought it was pretty clear that she was playin Jul all along.
It makes sense, but the way that scene is directed and acted just makes her look evil. They've made no effort to explain Halsey's MO to people who haven't read the books, instead showing her in the worst light throughout the game. When I watched it, I did not expect her to suddenly start acting like Nylund's Halsey at the very end.
 
After beating the game, some thoughts. Obviously there are spoilers in my end-game thoughts in the spoiler thread.
The short version is that this is a definite and clear improvement over Halo 4 in almost every way resulting in what could finally be considered a solid Halo game liked by most fans, but there are still a few choices that I find completely questionable that I just cannot understand 343 justifying.

Good:
-General gameplay has gotten way better. The guns are weapon balance have improved. The new movement options are fun, especially after they fixed ground pound. Multiplayer instantly took a huge leap forward. However they did sort of mess up the aiming since the beta, confirmed changed by Josh Holmes.
-Forerunner enemies are way more fun to fight now than they used to be. They're not all just bullet sponges. Knights are actually scary now. The solider's erratic personality, strange voices and teleporting are fun, too. Overall good work with them, I actually like them now.
-I liked the Warden Eternal boss fights, even if they repeat. Though I do wish there were other bosses and not just him repeated every time.
-On that note, the god damn Hunters. Really fucking awesome. Should have had more scripted moments with them like their introduction.
-Near the end it has some really beautiful Halo environments. The kind of stuff I expect from a Halo game. Enough human colonies, I want some alien shit. Wall really feeling good on Genesis while surrounded by Guardians. That was a damn cool environment. And running down the side of one? Holy shit.
-Loved a few of the little jokes they scattered around, like the multiple strange Grunts. Bungie had a little fun with hidden easter eggs and 343 should continue to embrace the same tradition.
-By the end, the plot felt grander and larger than Halo 4 which is good. Halo is about danger on a galactic scale and I was glad that I felt it this time. Guardians are about to fuck shit up and a god damn Death Star Halo is waking up. All hail Emperor Palpatine Cortana.
-Buck is an awesome inclusion and is awesome himself.
-Music has improved. Get more of it going during gameplay.

Bad:
-Another cliffhanger ending. Halo 2 ended on an unsatisfying cliffhanger because Bungie was forced to cut a significant amount of content and cut the ending altogether. I didnt like it then, and I dont like it now. I don't understand what about this unfortunate situation 343 saw fit to emulate. Did they actually choose to do this on purpose or did they get stuck in a similar situation? I've been watching people play the ending on Twitch and they are almost consistently disappointed. People should be saying "Halo 5 was good" but instead I hear them all saying "Halo 6 is going to be good."
-Where the fuck are the terminals? No, not audio logs, I mean proper terminals.
-I still want more mystery like in the OT, and not the "lol we left this out, read the book" kind of mystery 343 seems to like. I mean a genuine sense of discovery and intrigue. Of not knowing what I'm getting myself into. The underground lava area with the surprise Guardian is like what I want, but more please. Take me on a roller coaster like Halos 1-3 did.
-Hated that the game skipped over the transition between gameplay and cutscene. For example, in previous games IIRC it would show your character hop up into the pelican either before the cutscene, or just as it began. The fade to black feels awkward.
-Cortana's face. Please no. Her newfound clothes are fine, but give her back her H4 face. I can't stop staring at this new one and not for good reasons.
-Where the hell was the Chief? There were what, three whole levels with him? Come on now. If H5 was 80/20 in favor of Locke, please make H6 80/20 in favor of Chief.
-Locke looks cool and there was nothing I really disliked about him, but I didnt feel like I had any reason to like him either. He's cardboard. Give him more of a personality, even Chief manages to have one. I heard some stuff about him in Oni, how about making him really clever?
-The Covenant seemed like an afterthought at times during the plot. They were included but sometimes felt like they were thrown into certain sections just so we didnt forget they exist. More integral Covenant involvement in the primary plot thread next time, please.
-The multiplayer menus look pretty but have less actual functionality than any previous halo ever. Come on.
-The multiplayer maps are low in variation. Get us some natural environments set on Genesis and Sanghellios. It's been a whole two days and I'm already sick of 'Metal Corners and Tubes #6'.
-And oh my fuck get Orion out of matchmaking. In fact, get Forge out of regular playlists and make a dedicated playlist for rotating forge maps. You should be embarrassed to consider Forge maps as actual launch maps.
-Playlists need major work. Separate Slayer and Objective at least. And please introduce more gametypes, so many are missing completely. This is probably the saddest launch playlist lineup in halo history.
 

ryan299

Member
Osiris really doesn't add anything to this universe or the story. Chief going awol is the macguffin that sets them in motion. without him doing that, Osiris wouldn't be involved at all. Everything they do can be done by Blue team.

In order to make Cortana's turn into a villain, Chief needed to be the main character. His emotional journey would be from hope to broken. Hope bc Cortana is alive and slowly he is broken as he cannot do anything to stop her and he must make the decision to destroy her for good.

Halsey involvement would be greater as she could provide valuable exposition as both Cortana and Chief are 'born' to her. She hints in the beginning that Chief isn't emotionally equipped to deal with Cortana becoming the villain. Showing emotion on Chief is hard, bc we don't see his face and he doesn't talk much, so Halsey could help in that regard. Chiefs relationship with Blue team would also help in that regard.

I don't have a great idea for the Didact yet, but he needed to be involved. Cortana's is trying to inherit the mantle, which is one of the reasons the Didact is fighting humanity. Perhaps he is fighting Cortana, as she tries to gain control of the domain and all the promethean forces/Guardians.

The Arbiter is also pretty pointless in this game. He's only there for Osiris to get the 'key' to access the Guardian.

Storylines from Halo 4 are completely abandoned here. Besides the Didact, The Librarians involvement as well as Chief's 'evolution' are gone. There's more of course, but the Librarian and the Didact's war on humanity are the top two.
 

Trup1aya

Member
It makes sense, but the way that scene is directed and acted just makes her look evil. They've made no effort to explain Halsey's MO to people who haven't read the books, instead showing her in the worst light throughout the game. When I watched it, I did not expect her to suddenly start acting like Nylund's Halsey at the very end.

Evil? She just had her arm amputated after a failed assassination attempt. It's no surprise she was angry, but evil? Nah..
 
After beating the game, some thoughts. Obviously there are spoilers in my end-game thoughts in the spoiler thread.
The short version is that this is a definite and clear improvement over Halo 4 in almost every way resulting in what could finally be considered a solid Halo game liked by most fans, but there are still a few choices that I find completely questionable that I just cannot understand 343 justifying.

Good post. Think I agree with everything you said.
 
For the love of all that's holy, it's not a cliffhanger.

It's... it's just not.

If you seriously think this then I don't think you know what the term means. Literally it's referencing something (like a tv episode) ending with the main character hanging off of a cliff, in certain danger, with no resolution until the next episode.

Halo 5 ends with
the antagonist of the game becoming queen of the galaxy, dispatching giant death warriors to every major location, completely shutting down the UNSC defenses along with all the electricity on earth, and making a statement to every living thing in the universe that if they don't obey her she will kill them and turn them into murder-robots. Then the game ends without resolution until Halo 6.
How in the fuck is that not a cliffhanger? The term shouldn't even be called a 'cliffhanger' anymore, it should be called a '
cortana
' because holy shit.

As TVtropes describes it, "A Cliffhanger ends an Act Break, episode, or even a whole season (or a film or novel in a series) with some or all of the main characters in peril of some kind and the audience is made to wait for the outcome."
 

Toa TAK

Banned
After beating the game, some thoughts. Obviously there are spoilers in my end-game thoughts in the spoiler thread.
The short version is that this is a definite and clear improvement over Halo 4 in almost every way resulting in what could finally be considered a solid Halo game liked by most fans, but there are still a few choices that I find completely questionable that I just cannot understand 343 justifying.

Awesome post.
 

blamite

Member
If you seriously think this then I don't think you know what the term means. Literally it's referencing something (like a tv episode) ending with the main character hanging off of a cliff, in certain danger, with no resolution until the next episode.

Halo 5 ends with
the antagonist of the game becoming queen of the galaxy, dispatching giant death warriors to every major location, completely shutting down the UNSC defenses along with all the electricity on earth, and making a statement to every living thing in the universe that if they don't obey her she will kill them and turn them into murder-robots. Then the game ends without resolution until Halo 6.
How in the fuck is that not a cliffhanger? The term shouldn't even be called a 'cliffhanger' anymore, it should be called a 'cortana' because holy shit.

As TVtropes describes it, "A Cliffhanger ends an Act Break, episode, or even a whole season (or a film or novel in a series) with some or all of the main characters in peril of some kind and the audience is made to wait for the outcome."

Did Empire Strikes Back end on a cliffhanger?
 
Seems to be bang on the definition, why do you think its not?

If you seriously think this then I don't think you know what the term means. Literally it's referencing something (like a tv episode) ending with the main character hanging off of a cliff, in certain danger, with no resolution until the next episode.

Halo 5 ends with
the antagonist of the game becoming queen of the galaxy, dispatching giant death warriors to every major location, completely shutting down the UNSC defenses along with all the electricity on earth, and making a statement to every living thing in the universe that if they don't obey her she will kill them and turn them into murder-robots. Then the game ends without resolution until Halo 6.
How in the fuck is that not a cliffhanger? The term shouldn't even be called a 'cliffhanger' anymore, it should be called a '
cortana
' because holy shit.

As TVtropes describes it, "A Cliffhanger ends an Act Break, episode, or even a whole season (or a film or novel in a series) with some or all of the main characters in peril of some kind and the audience is made to wait for the outcome."

Do you know the definition? For that matter, did you read the tvtropes quote you posted?

Because none of the characters are in peril or immediate danger when the credits roll. Cortana's actions represent a seismic shift in status quo, not a present danger. Everybody we know is safe, it's galactic sovereignty that's fucked.
 

Trup1aya

Member
Did Empire Strikes Back end on a cliffhanger?

I was just going to post the same thing!!!

This isn't a cliffhanger simply because there is remaining conflict. Such is the case with any trilogy or saga.

If the game ended with the Infinity about to explode then it would be a cliff hanger.
 
Good post. Think I agree with everything you said.

Awesome post.

Thanks buddies, good to know I'm not alone with these thoughts.

Do you know the definition? For that matter, did you read the tvtropes quote you posted?

Because none of the characters are in peril or immediate danger when the credits roll. Cortana's actions represent a seismic shift in status quo, not a present danger. Everybody we know is safe, it's galactic sovereignty that's fucked.

I would definitely consider Cortana's hostile actions at the end to be a present danger and I certainly don't feel like the primary plot thread of the game ever reached a resolution. For these reasons I confidently call it a cliffhanger.

If you don't that is fine, it's not like its really important to settle this, and it's not worth the effort going back and forth about semantics when we both already know what the other means.

Is there some other word for an ending like this that you think I should be using instead?
 

Trup1aya

Member
Thanks buddies, good to know I'm not alone with these thoughts.



I would definitely consider Cortana's hostile actions at the end to be a present danger and I certainly don't feel like the primary plot thread of the game ever reached a resolution. For these reasons I confidently call it a cliffhanger.

If you don't that is fine, it's not like its really important to settle this, and it's not worth the effort going back and forth about semantics when we both already know what the other means.

Is there some other word for an ending like this that you think I should be using instead?

A bad ending maybe?

It's not a cliffhanger though... Just because the main antagonist is still hostile, doesn't make it a cliff hanger. See Halo CE, Star Wars, lord of the rings etc.
 

Van Owen

Banned
Could part of the reason Cortana is so fucked up is because of her time with the Gravemind? I think it was hinted at that she was pretty damaged from it in Halo 3.
 
Are people really trying to use technicality to claim the ending wasn't a cliffhanger?

It was a goddamned cliffhanger.

But it's not!

Thanks buddies, good to know I'm not alone with these thoughts.



I would definitely consider Cortana's hostile actions at the end to be a present danger and I certainly don't feel like the primary plot thread of the game ever reached a resolution. For these reasons I confidently call it a cliffhanger.

If you don't that is fine, it's not like its really important to settle this, and it's not worth the effort going back and forth about semantics when we both already know what the other means.

Is there some other word for an ending like this that you think I should be using instead?

IDK, sequel hook? The primary conflict isn't wrapped up, and everybody is in some sort of danger, but that alone does not a cliffhanger make. If the game ended with Cortana whisking away the Chief, Osiris tagging along (somehow) and being all "let's finish this!" And then the credits roll, that'd be a cliffhanger. 2 is a cliffhanger. This is a sequel hook crossed with a little bit of The Bad Guy Wins. It's definitely intended to put you on the edge of your seat, but it's nowhere near the worst in that regard I've seen.

As for why we're still talking about it, it's just one of my pet peeves :p Cliffhanger is a kind of loaded term.

Could part of the reason Cortana is so fucked up is because of her time with the Gravemind? I think it was hinted at that she was pretty damaged from it in Halo 3.

Could be. There's certain similarities between what happened to her and what happened to Mendicant Bias. It's possible she got hit with a little bit of that Logic Plague.

I really do think it's just her, though. She's nigh-omniscient and wields physical power unheard of since the Forerunners fell. She attained ultimate power, and with it, ultimate responsibility. As far as she's concerned, the best way to discharge that responsibility is to conquer the galaxy and enforce peace.

She's not entirely wrong either, which is what makes it interesting.
 
So, the leaks were true.

Anyhoo, can someone please bring me up to speed? I just got to Chapter 8 or 9 (on my way to meet Arbiter) and am just confused.

1) Why was Jul with Hensley in Chapter 1? Were they looking for forerunner tech?

2) What is a Guardian? Thing came alive but I must have missed what they were other than a giant transformer

3) Locke is chasing Chief because Chief disobeyed orders to go on a solo mission to find Cortana, correct?

4) The main storyline, thus far, is that the Forerunners, using Prometheans, want to tap into the power of A.I immortality to take the mantle of running the galaxy while suppressing the humans against the precursors wishes, correct?

Thanks in advance.

1) Halsey joined up with Jul following the events of Spartan Ops. They're there because she was leading him around by the nose; he thought she was bringing him to hidden Forerunner weapons, she was trying to figure out what Cortana was doing.

2) Giant Forerunner peacekeeping weapon designed to bitchslap the whole star systems.

3) Precisely.

4) No. Cortana has elected to usurp the Mantle of Responsibility using Foreruner tech. She's also become effectively immortal, omniscient, and hyperintelligent in the process.
 

Plywood

NeoGAF's smiling token!
rlzX55b.jpg


I'm going to leave this here along with this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASsNtti1XZs
 
Could part of the reason Cortana is so fucked up is because of her time with the Gravemind? I think it was hinted at that she was pretty damaged from it in Halo 3.

I kind of assumed something like that. What happens when you take a crazy, fragmented, rampant AI who has spent quality time with the Gravemind and plug it into the Forerunner domain? Shit gets wild.

The truth is probably that the Cortana we know really did die in 4 and that what we have now is all the crazy fragments shoved back together with a strong dose of unlimited powah for good measure.

Her claims are suspicious, too. Cortana claims that becoming forerunner cured her rampancy, but forerunner AIs are still known to go rampant themselves. Perhaps she is actually still just as rampant as ever, she just doesn't realize it because the domain helped her keep her shit all in one place. Crazy people never think that theyre crazy.
 

Magwik

Banned
I don't mind the Cortana stuff at all, not even anything regarding the mantle. It's the only way they could fix the whole "chosen one space Jesus" that the librarian was spewing in Halo 4.
 
So, the leaks were true.

Anyhoo, can someone please bring me up to speed? I just got to Chapter 8 or 9 (on my way to meet Arbiter) and am just confused.

1) Why was Jul with Hensley in Chapter 1? Were they looking for forerunner tech?

2) What is a Guardian? Thing came alive but I must have missed what they were other than a giant transformer

3) Locke is chasing Chief because Chief disobeyed orders to go on a solo mission to find Cortana, correct?

4) The main storyline, thus far, is that the Forerunners, using Prometheans, want to tap into the power of A.I immortality to take the mantle of running the galaxy while suppressing the humans against the precursors wishes, correct?

Thanks in advance.

1) Halsey says something about tapping into some forerunner network and that it takes
time, she uses this to stall jul so UNSC can retrieve her. Its in the final cutscene of the 1st mission.

2) They are forerunner's version of a nuke, step out of line and get your planet destroyed
Cortana explains this shortly before the end i believe

3) Yes guess

4) Not really, Cortana somehow convinced The warden Eternal that she(AI in general) can take over mantle of responsibility, given that in the domain AIs can live up to
thousands of years to uphold the mantle.
That is my take on it, the forerunners are not present in the milky way except for
maybe the Didact
 

TheOddOne

Member
A) Osiris rescues Blue Team and offer their assistance to stop Cortana.
B) Cortana tries to take over Infinity. Infinity escapes and Lasky assures that they will return when they know how to fight Cortana.
C) Blue Team and Osiris get back to Sanghelios and reunite with Halsey and Arbiter. Halsey says "Took you long enough." Fade to black.
D) Credits at the end says:
...see you on Sanghelios.

-343 Industries
It’s not really a cliffhanger, but more a setup.

They stumbled setting it up though, that I will give you.
 

Prologue

Member
Something about Cortana turning evil, rubs me the wrong way after 4 halo games of her being your partner. After all she stood for and did to protect humanity and John?


Were there no other better story avenues? Don't make our Cortana like this :(
 
Something about Cortana turning evil, rubs me the wrong way after 4 halo games of her being your partner. After all she stood for and did to protect humanity and John?


Were there no other better story avenues? Don't make our Cortana :(

I don't even know if I'd call her evil, at first blush. It's kind of complex.
 

Van Owen

Banned
Something about Cortana turning evil, rubs me the wrong way after 4 halo games of her being your partner. After all she stood for and did to protect humanity and John?


Were there no other better story avenues? Don't make our Cortana like this :(

Well, all human AIs go rampant.

Plus she was isolated for years while Chief was in cryo, which is bad for AIs as well.
 
Alright, just finished it. Enjoyed all the Halo games until now and Halo 4 grew on me a lot. But this one... I don't know. Maybe it will change later if I replay it a bit, but for now it doesn't look good.

- The story with the Forerunners and their stuff doesn't interest me at all. I like the Halo universe with the humans and Covenant, but this whole stuff about the mantle, guardians, whatever. Seems like 343 wants to make things complicated and epic, but kind of fails at it. What's wrong with an easy: this Covenant faction returned, go kick their ass.

- The constant team around you and chatter that comes with it just feels strange. I rather have the Master Chief alone on his mission. I also didn't care at all about any of the characters and they all come across as trying too hard.

- The dialog. Can you say 'spartan' a couple of hundred times more? We get it, you're a super soldier, now shut up.

- The environments are more open now. While that should be nice, I actually like the corridor layouts of the previous games better. It felt more thought was put into the encounters, while now it is just a lot of enemies randomly put there. Maybe this will change when I get to know the levels more if I decide to replay it later.

- Cortana's reasons make no sense at the moment. She wants to be some kind of god and force people to live peacefully or kill them? Why exactly? Maybe there is going to be some plot twist here that will redeem her, but for now she's just plain evil for no good reason.

For mainline Halo games - I really didn't care that much for Reach and ODST also - this one ranks at the bottom for now.
 

Toa TAK

Banned
I don't know if killing potentially millions of people, plunging the Earth and outer colonies in darkness and threatening your wrath on those who refuse to cooperate with you count as "complex".

Don't forget hostages. Maybe not all of Blue Team, but she sure as shit wants the Master Chief on her side.
 

Monocle

Member
I don't know if killing potentially millions of people, plunging the Earth and outer colonies in darkness and threatening your wrath on those who refuse to cooperate with you count as "complex".
It's her reasoning (her actions could be justified with a utilitarian argument), the unknown details of her transcendence, her prior relationship with the Chief, the history of the mantle, etc. that make her actions complex. You're purposely framing it in a way that makes her seem like some generically evil person.
 
It's her reasoning (her actions could be justified with a utilitarian argument), the unknown details of her transcendence, her prior relationship with the Chief, the history of the mantle, etc. that make her actions complex. You're purposely framing it in a way that makes her seem like some generically evil person.

Hey, Cortana!

43130.jpg
 

DecepticonCora

Neo Member
It's her reasoning (her actions could be justified with a utilitarian argument), the unknown details of her transcendence, her prior relationship with the Chief, the history of the mantle, etc. that make her actions complex. You're purposely framing it in a way that makes her seem like some generically evil person.

I would say that threatening death from giant Forerunner police machines for not obeying her decrees a fairly evil thing. Even from a utilitarian perspective I think it falls flat since she is co-opting the same ideals as the imperialistic Forerunners who used the Guardians for the same reason she is using them now. That kind of rule led to the galaxy falling as easy prey to the Flood. She might say the Created will care for humanity, and other organic life too, but that was the same logic as the Forerunners. They cared for the galaxy and guided them, it just so happened none of the other species with the exception of humanity and San 'Shyuum, were powerful enough to oppose their rule.
 
I don't even know if I'd call her evil, at first blush. It's kind of complex.
Maybe mankind requires a deep-seated fear of their naked blue betters to keep them from engaging in endless war.

Maybe Cortana is tired of humanity. Those people. Maybe she's tired of being caught in the tangle of their lives.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
I don't know if killing potentially millions of people, plunging the Earth and outer colonies in darkness and threatening your wrath on those who refuse to cooperate with you count as "complex".

As a human AI suddenly given near infinite processing power, I think she just doesn't know how to deal with it. Here's this god like character who can see that, if she sacrifices a few hundred million lives now, she could create a peaceful society some time in 10,000 years, and over the lifespan of the galaxy, the small sacrifice would be worth it in the long run.

Basically how every dictatorship tends to go, actually. Not saying it's right, but from her perspective with all the processing power in the world it may seem like the only choice.
 

Monocle

Member
I would say that threatening death from giant Forerunner police machines for not obeying her decrees a fairly evil thing. Even from a utilitarian perspective I think it falls flat since she is co-opting the same ideals as the imperialistic Forerunners who used the Guardians for the same reason she is using them now. That kind of rule led to the galaxy falling as easy prey to the Flood. She might say the Created will care for humanity, and other organic life too, but that was the same logic as the Forerunners. They cared for the galaxy and guided them, it just so happened none of the other species with the exception of humanity and San 'Shyuum, were powerful enough to oppose their rule.
The Forerunners were proud and arrogant. AIs can be immortal now, and much smarter than biological beings. Who's to say Cortana's empire will suffer the same implementation problems as the Forerunners'? We just don't know how it's going to play out yet.

I think a utilitarian argument works fine, and it might even be her own justification for the whole thing. Sacrifice a few million to secure peace for billions or trillions. From a utilitarian perspective, it's worse to allow chaos and tribalism and infighting to carry on unchecked and ruin even more lives eventually.
 

RoKKeR

Member
Here's one thing I'm stuck on... doesn't Cortana essentially offer everyone safety if they get with the program and allow AI's to run the show? Obviously she threatens to fuck shit up if you resist, but that's kind of what she offers... right?

In that case, why does she Guardian blast that planet the Infinity is above after it jumps to slipspace? The ships above the planet would all crash and it looks like it wiped everything out on the planet? Trying to understand the rationale behind that.

Also, even though it put a smile on my face I'm not sure what she wants with a Halo ring...
 
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