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[NCR Redslayer]

It's a fair point. On wakeup I tend to pressure with s.mp, then do a shimmy, but sometimes the only option is throw... which has the exact same problem as eagle spike, both forward and back throw sends them flying across the screen resets the neutral.

His spinning mixer is an invincible reversal on wake up.

 

[Secret Character]

The other issue with Vega is that you need to spend meter if you're going to try and do any kind of meaningful damage in a combo. The issue with that is his V-trigger gives him the option to score a free super, which you might not ever have if you're burning meter constantly in order to maximize your hits.

I personally think that Vega is in the bottom third of the roster.

 

[LakeEarth]

His spinning mixer is an invincible reversal on wake up.

We're discussing Rashid's offense, not defense.

 

[Deps]

Vega has issues, but hes still very strong. I don't know about top 3, but hes up there. Also, his anti airs aren't amazing but they're decent, vs most character if you use the right one they won't lose/trade, if they are its a player issue, not a character issue.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

The other issue with Vega is that you need to spend meter if you're going to try and do any kind of meaningful damage in a combo. The issue with that is his V-trigger gives him the option to score a free super, which you might not ever have if you're burning meter constantly in order to maximize your hits.

I personally think that Vega is in the bottom third of the roster.

Vega is an uphill battle for sure, he's only been really good in ST. But I love the character so I always main him.

 

[cHaotix8]

From what I've seen the majority of Vega's anti-air buttons have a tendency to get stuffed so you're almost always better off attempting to get out of the way or going for an air throw. Then most of Vega's normals are weak in regards to hitboxes (his claw stance normals have far worse range than the model suggests), recovery and confirmability next to the other characters with strong pokes. However I'm not going to get into lengthy theorycraft debate when I haven't played a character for over a month. I think you just have to look at how he's currently doing in the competitive scene to see where he's ranked right now. You can claim he's just being slept on, but I don't think he's complex enough of a character for that to be the case.

Though I can't see how you can argue Vega's ranked above Necali who has reversals, command grabs, a 3 frame jab, easy safe confirms, an easy to confirm v-trigger to critical, decent buttons, great anti-air, great damage, a useful v-skill, one of the strongest v-triggers in the game, stupid damage off of crush counters and pressure that leads to a great stun game. To be honest I don't think Vega clearly beats Necali in any area whilst Necali's much better than him in multiple ones.

In the South, Vega has been consistently placing top 3 or winning most of our locals/regionals, so my opinion of him may certainly be biased. However, I think there’s something to be said about the ease of use of a character in terms of how they place nationally. You don’t see him placing highly because there are no strong players that are using him that travel outside of Flash Metroid, who places pretty well with him all things said. I never see Flash or any of our local players struggle with anti air.

You bring up some good points about Necali, and to be honest, I feel that the bottom two of the top 5 are interchangeable. That’s more a testament to how good Capcom has been regarding balance in this game. Necali has good damage and pressure but struggles to get in and relies on V-Trigger to become consistently scary. Vega’s pressure up close is very strong without the claw, since he’s one of the few characters that can safely confirm off a low + that walkspeed. His footsie game is strong enough to allow him to get in and keep up pressure against characters without strong normals, while at the same time, lame out rush down characters that want to get in.

 

[ShogunDarius]

I think the fight stick is starting to click with me somewhat


am i imagining things or does a fightstick have faster input reads compared to a controller?

 

[sixteen-bit]

I think the fight stick is starting to click with me somewhat


am i imagining things or does a fightstick have faster input reads compared to a controller?

might be placebo effect but wired vs wireless ftw

 

[HardRojo]

My ISP restarted my router yesterday and now I can't access PSN on any device Error WS 37 something. Been reading some stuff and apparently PSN has banned my IP thinking it was an attack? Fuck this Gonna have to call my ISP and complain.

 

[stn]

Hori Fight Commander 4 or Hori Fight Commander?

Is one better than the other? Anyone who has used both? Thanks.

Sorry to quote myself but I'd greatly value any insight you guys have. I'm on the fence. Leaning towards HFC4 just because its slightly cheaper. Good move?

 

[Wallach]

Sorry to quote myself but I'd greatly value any insight you guys have. I'm on the fence. Leaning towards HFC4 just because its slightly cheaper. Good move?

I wrote a comparison between the two in the old MadCatz FightPad Pro thread:

I have both of these, got the newer one a couple days ago.

Build quality wise they seem identical. Same plastics used, and the d-pad and buttons are essentially the same. There is a little bit more tactility in the new FC (particularly in the X/Sq/Tr/Ci buttons, the R1/R2 face buttons feel pretty similar to the FC4) but otherwise they are hard to distinguish.

The FC4 has a lock that you can disengage that will allow you to rotate the d-pad up to 20 degrees. I don't know who would use this but it is not present on the newer FC. There is also no diagonal sensitivity adjustment on the newer FC; it seems to be using the default setting compared to the FC4, but the differences weren't huge on any of the three settings of the FC4 and it is quite responsive. Molding and plastic on the d-pad is otherwise identical.

The shape is the primary difference between the two. The FC4 is molded differently on the left side compared to the right; the left side of the pad has a longer handle so that you have a better grip support if you want to use the pad with the claw hand position for the button side. Personally I think this is not ideal as it'll deprive you of access to the trigger buttons (which are highly usable compared to most pad triggers for fighting games), but it is a noticeable difference to the newer FC which is not usable with the claw position unless you place the pad in your lap.

The newer FC's shape is sort of like if the Genesis and Saturn pads had a fat baby. It's quite comfortable, though personally the grip is not quite as good as the FC4s regardless of the grip used. In particular the top R1 button is more of a reach if you are trying to use only your index finger to activate both triggers. The index finger sits more naturally square on the R2 trigger and requires a bit of hand shifting to hit R1; on the FC4, the index finger naturally lands between R1 and R2, and requires no hand shifting to hit either trigger comfortably.

Where the newer FC has an advantage though is that it has not just a PS3/PS4 toggle but a third PC toggle option, which switches the pad to XInput. This will allow it to work natively on any PC game as it can output in DirectInput (PS4 setting) or XInput (PC setting), whereas the FC4 will only output in DirectInput (requires an XInput wrapper to work on a game like SFV on PC).

Overall, I would probably recommend the FC4 over the newer FC unless you want the native XInput mode support.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Mahvel lives.

I'm having trouble replicating this combo, though. If I try to do it as shown, it drops during the gap between the Nadeshiko hit and the jumping roundhouse.

If I stay on the same side and do jumping fierce instead of roundhouse, it's fine though.

Any Mika players have tips on getting this consistently? I figure that I'm not timing the s.MP after the first air reset quickly enough, but it's such a small gap to work with that I'm not sure how to do it any faster.

Hori Fight Commander 4 or Hori Fight Commander?

Is one better than the other? Anyone who has used both? Thanks.

I own both. I like both, and they both feel about the same. I've heard, however, that the FC4 isn't as durable due to the adjustable d-pad mechanism wearing out more quickly over time compared to other controllers that aren't as mechanically complex. That might be why they removed it from the newer model in the second link.

 

[Shadow_Lord]

Mahvel lives.

Oh... My... God.

 

[mattp]

what are they doing in the menu?

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Mahvel lives.

This is ridiculous, nobody should be able to do 900 damage with only 1 reset...

 

[SMK]

what are they doing in the menu?

Turning off counter hit

 

[Onemic]

Fuck. Mika.

 

[Sigmaah]

There's a Discord chat?

U be posting in fgw right? They got the info there lol

 

[Sixfortyfive]

This is ridiculous, nobody should be able to do 900 damage with only 1 reset...

It's not quite 900. Karin starts with less than 100%.

Totally fair.

 

[xCobalt]

Mahvel lives.

I'm having trouble replicating this combo, though. If I try to do it as shown, it drops during the gap between the Nadeshiko hit and the jumping roundhouse.

If I stay on the same side and do jumping fierce instead of roundhouse, it's fine though.

Any Mika players have tips on getting this consistently? I figure that I'm not timing the s.MP after the first air reset quickly enough, but it's such a small gap to work with that I'm not sure how to do it any faster.

I haven't tried it but do you have Karin crouching for the combo?

 

[Sixfortyfive]

I haven't tried it but do you have Karin crouching for the combo?

Yeah, this actually seems to help a bit since the hurtbox gets extended. Otherwise I think Mika has to skip one of the s.MPs and no longer gets the stun without spending meter early.

EDIT: Still doesn't help on the one part I'm having trouble linking, though. It's like you have to walk under and stick out the s.MP as quickly as possible so that it hits in the later frames, or else you can jump and follow-up in time.

 

[Sgtpepper89]

https://www.twitch.tv/gaminglive_tv1

Seems like infil/poonko etc is playing in some kind of pre tournament event.

Who is worst on english, Infiltration or the french guys

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Mahvel lives.

queen

 

[MegamanXZero]

https://www.twitch.tv/gaminglive_tv1

Seems like infil/poonko etc is playing in some kind of pre tournament event.

Who is worst on english, Infiltration or the french guys

I'd have to say you

 

[FluxWaveZ]

U be posting in fgw right? They got the info there lol

I don't post in FGW, no.

Mahvel lives.

I'm having trouble replicating this combo, though. If I try to do it as shown, it drops during the gap between the Nadeshiko hit and the jumping roundhouse.

If I stay on the same side and do jumping fierce instead of roundhouse, it's fine though.

Any Mika players have tips on getting this consistently? I figure that I'm not timing the s.MP after the first air reset quickly enough, but it's such a small gap to work with that I'm not sure how to do it any faster.

Learnt.

Are you sure that the dummy CPU you're trying it on is crouching? The part after Nadeshiko hits might only work if the opponent is crouching, or else it'll drop for me against Ryu here: Nadeshiko hits > j.HK hits > st.MP hits > f/b.MP DROPS.

Edit: Wait, never mind, I've got it going a few times. Hm, must be the timing of the jump.

I think I'll just go with an immediate passion press most of the times in actual matches; the combo stuns anyways, so that little bit of damage isn't too big a deal.

Edit 2: Ugh, pain, my guard state was on No Guard, so I don't think going for the immediate passion press even works. Guess I'll need to learn the jump timing.

 

[SephLuis]

Anyone wants to play ?

 

[Hellshingu]

Mahvel lives.

lel.

So moral of the story is don't crouch when fighting Mika?

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Learnt.

Are you sure that the dummy CPU you're trying it on is crouching? The part after Nadeshiko hits might only work if the opponent is crouching, or else it'll drop for me against Ryu here: Nadeshiko hits > j.HK hits > st.MP hits > f/b.MP DROPS.

Edit: Wait, never mind, I've got it going a few times. Hm, must be the timing of the jump.

I think I'll just go with an immediate passion press most of the times in actual matches; the combo stuns anyways, so that little bit of damage isn't too big a deal.

Edit 2: Ugh, pain, my guard state was on No Guard, so I don't think going for the immediate passion press even works. Guess I'll need to learn the jump timing.

Tested it again. The crouch is irrelevant. You just have to time the s.MP after the walk-under as early as possible. This forces the opponent into a crouch state for whatever reason anyway.

I'm skipping the opening counter-hit jab and just starting from an s.MP. In this case, you *need* the rest of the hits to stun. Haven't tried it off the jab yet.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

lel.

So moral of the story is don't crouch when fighting Mika?

Not sure crouching has anything to do with it; that was just a counter hit cr.LP.

Tested it again. The crouch is irrelevant. You just have to time the s.MP after the walk-under as early as possible. This forces the opponent into a crouch state for whatever reason anyway.

I'm skipping the opening counter-hit jab and just starting from an s.MP. In this case, you *need* the rest of the hits to stun. Haven't tried it off the jab yet.

Yeah, I was actually messing it up because of the finicky dummy guard states; Ryu won't get stunned from this because he has 1k stun.

Thanks for the info, I guess I'm going to have to actually test something out extensively here. Seems pretty cool.

 

[Sgtpepper89]

I'd have to say you

Yea the worst is I even double checked my post and didnt see any faults lol. I must be ready to become a Korean top player!

 

[Baleoce]

Just fought someone called SatsuiYesHado xD

 

[Hellshingu]

Serious question to you Mika players. When you guys see stuff like this do you feel that it is fair/balanced to be able to do this when in the corner/off a reset? I know it is pretty situational but I am just interested in your honest opinions.

Not trying to start an argument or shitting on your character because she is fun to play around with personally.

Not sure crouching has anything to do with it; that was just a counter hit cr.LP.



Yeah, I was actually messing it up because of the finicky dummy guard states; Ryu won't get stunned from this because he has 1k stun.

Thanks for the info, I guess I'm going to have to actually test something out extensively here. Seems pretty cool.

Well six confirmed he crouch is irrelevant so I guess it doesn't matter either way. Just don't get hit I guess.

 

[Sgtpepper89]

Snake eyez playing Alex vs Luffy. Wonder if he has given up on Zanglief.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Snake eyez playing Alex vs Luffy. Wonder if he has given up on Zanglief.

He'll never give up on gief, but his alex is on point

 

[Shouta]

Snake eyez playing Alex vs Luffy. Wonder if he has given up on Zanglief.

RainbowImpact actually likes playing Alex vs Mika more than Mika vs Mika, heh.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Serious question to you Mika players. When you guys see stuff like this do you feel that it is fair/balanced to be able to do this when in the corner/off a reset? I know it is pretty situational but I am just interested in your honest opinions.

Not trying to start an argument or shitting on your character because she is fun to play around with personally.

The theory behind the character is that she's designed to be polarized: she has to put in a relatively higher effort to get a clean hit compared to most of the cast who have better range or frame data on their normal attacks, but the payoff from that hit is also greater. Despite being more mix-up based than strictly throw-based, she follows the "grappler gameplan" of just spending her life bar to close the distance so that she can get in range for the payoff. I wrote a pretty long post on this earlier.

That's the theory, anyway. Whether the risk/reward is properly balanced is anybody's opinion, and we'll have a better idea of that as the months go on. A lot of people would do themselves a favor by taking a more thorough look at the bigger picture and realize how easy it is to keep Mika from getting anything started in a lot of cases. Just standing in whiff-punish range or not letting her get away with negative-on-block moves goes a long way.

You also have to think about the resources spent. That combo used a full V-Trigger and CA bar.

RainbowImpact actually likes playing Alex vs Mika more than Mika vs Mika, heh.

Nobody likes that mirror match. It is a nightmare.

 

[Alucrid]

Serious question to you Mika players. When you guys see stuff like this do you feel that it is fair/balanced to be able to do this when in the corner/off a reset? I know it is pretty situational but I am just interested in your honest opinions.

Not trying to start an argument or shitting on your character because she is fun to play around with personally.



Well six confirmed he crouch is irrelevant so I guess it doesn't matter either way. Just don't get hit I guess.

it doesn't seem that crazy. i mean, look at the damage karin does with this reset

https://www.twitch.tv/crash_en/v/59680366?t=01h44m20s

take in to account that ryu has 100 more health, karin starts down some life at the start of the mika clip, and the fact that the CA probably does more damage than what ryu has left...i'd wager it's fairly comparable.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

RainbowImpact actually likes playing Alex vs Mika more than Mika vs Mika, heh.

Is Rainbow Impact this Snake Eyez person? I've encountered them a fair bit online.

And Mika vs Mika is absolute hell, probably more than Mika is to most other characters in the game. She is her own worst enemy. So it's understandable.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

Is Rainbow Impact this Snake Eyez person? I've encountered them a fair bit online.

And Mika vs Mika is absolute hell, probably more than Mika is to most other characters in the game. She is her own worst enemy. So it's understandable.

No that's native impact

 

[Wallach]

Snake eyez playing Alex vs Luffy. Wonder if he has given up on Zanglief.

I'd love to see a player as good as him pick up Alex. In my short time with him, he seems quite good and I was surprised to see people rate him so low. Doesn't surprise me that Snake Eyez would take to him.

 

[MegamanXZero]

Yea the worst is I even double checked my post and didnt see any faults lol. I must be ready to become a Korean top player!

If you suddenly become as good as Infiltration, don't mind the mistakes!

 

[Baleoce]

played 45 matches today. gg's if any of those were gaffers.

 

[FluxWaveZ]

I'm skipping the opening counter-hit jab and just starting from an s.MP. In this case, you *need* the rest of the hits to stun. Haven't tried it off the jab yet.

Man, the timing for the stuff in that video is actually surprisingly tight. So it's st.MP asap right after the cr.MP in the corner, huh. I can't even get it 20% of the time successfully right now.

 

[KhalilSyncere]

Mahvel lives.

I'm having trouble replicating this combo, though. If I try to do it as shown, it drops during the gap between the Nadeshiko hit and the jumping roundhouse.

If I stay on the same side and do jumping fierce instead of roundhouse, it's fine though.

Any Mika players have tips on getting this consistently? I figure that I'm not timing the s.MP after the first air reset quickly enough, but it's such a small gap to work with that I'm not sure how to do it any faster.



I own both. I like both, and they both feel about the same. I've heard, however, that the FC4 isn't as durable due to the adjustable d-pad mechanism wearing out more quickly over time compared to other controllers that aren't as mechanically complex. That might be why they removed it from the newer model in the second link.

I wonder why for Mika's super, they changed it from Mika & homegirl grabbing the opponents legs to make them do a split when coming down as well. Seems like that'd make even more sense for her super to doing damage.

 

[Kikirin]

Question on reading frame data for multi-hit moves.

Given the following frame data for FANG's st.mp, what is its total duration?

Startup: 7 (14)
Active: 2 (5) 2
Recovery: 15

These may be similar questions, but:

• Are first active frames only included in the initial startup, so only 1 is subtracted from the overall total? If so, the total duration comes out to 7 + 2 + 5 + 2 + 15 - 1 = 30.
• Does the intermediate startup (5) include the first active frame for the second hit? If so, the total duration would need another frame subtracted for a total of 29.
• Or perhaps startups in these cases don't include active frames at all? That might be the case since the 14 in the startup (7 + 2 + 5?) might be to indicate when the 2nd hit goes active. The total would then be 31?

Something doesn't seem to be consistent here.

 

[HardRojo]

Mahvel lives.

This is why I hate 50/50s that can lead into some serious damage

 

[Sgtpepper89]

I'd love to see a player as good as him pick up Alex. In my short time with him, he seems quite good and I was surprised to see people rate him so low. Doesn't surprise me that Snake Eyez would take to him.

Myea Im new to the fgc but he seems to be a very solid player. Heard him complain alot that he feels that the other characters are better than Zanglief and yet he still performs very well in tournaments, so would be interesting to see how he performs with a character he accually holds high tierwise.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

I wonder why for Mika's super, they changed it from Mika & homegirl grabbing the opponents legs to make them do a split when coming down as well. Seems like that'd make even more sense for her super to doing damage.

I dunno. Maybe the old animation caused some graphical weirdness with newer characters.

Question on reading frame data for multi-hit moves.

Given the following frame data for FANG's st.mp, what is its total duration?


These may be similar questions, but:

• Are first active frames only included in the initial startup, so only 1 is subtracted from the overall total? If so, the total duration comes out to 7 + 2 + 5 + 2 + 15 - 1 = 30.
• Does the intermediate startup (5) include the first active frame for the second hit? If so, the total duration would need another frame subtracted for a total of 29.
• Or perhaps startups in these cases don't include active frames at all? That might be the case since the 14 in the startup (7 + 2 + 5?) might be to indicate when the 2nd hit goes active. The total would then be 31?

Something doesn't seem to be consistent here.

"Active: 2 (5) 2" means that each individual hit has 2 active frames, with 5 empty frames between.

"Startup: 7 (14)" means that the first hit starts on frame 7, and the 2nd hit starts on frame 14.

If both hits connect:
7 start-up (minus 1, because the last start-up frame and first active frame are the same)
2 active
5 empty (or start-up for the 2nd hit, if you prefer)
2 active
15 recovery
= 30 total

If only the 2nd hit connects:
14 start-up (minus 1)
2 active
15 recovery
= 30 total

 

[Skilletor]

What is Luffy without an invincible backdash.

An at ease, losah.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH

I know it wasn't funny.

 

[Kikirin]

"Active: 2 (5) 2" means that each individual hit has 2 active frames, with 5 empty frames between.

"Startup: 7 (14)" means that the first hit starts on frame 7, and the 2nd hit starts on frame 14.

If both hits connect:
7 start-up (minus 1, because the last start-up frame and first active frame are the same)
2 active
5 empty (or start-up for the 2nd hit, if you prefer)
2 active
15 recovery
= 30 total

If only the 2nd hit connects:
14 start-up (minus 1)
2 active
15 recovery
= 30 total

Absolutely magic. Thanks a lot!