Objection, Your Honor. Relevance?
They're not a hate group and that doesn't change what their action at Pride last year represents in of itself.
Also: Receipts for that last claim?
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Toronto Police Union Wants Pride Funding Pulled After Floats Banned
- Thread starter CazTGG
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Objection, Your Honor. Relevance?
Also: Receipts for that last claim?
http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/mobile/u-...tor-ex-officials-over-severance-pay-1.2582603
Sad the founder are clowns it just de-legitimizes the whole movment.
Also LOL at the PM being a "white supremacist terrorist"
Isnt one of the main things the gay community does is to make Black queer folk feel like outsiders?
M0nochromatic
Member
The Toronto BLM branch seems a tad unhinged, but the police should be accustomed to that by now. I hope they can sort their shit out and get along, especially for an event that's supposed to be positive like that.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
This really drives home the fact that cops here in Canada still have their fair share of problems. What a disgusting move.
That story you linked to doesn't say anything about stolen money going to fund BLM TO, mostly because it doesn't even mention BLM TO...or York for that matter (it was U of T where she claimed her overtime). Either way, it doesn't have any relevance to the group's protest at Pride.
You have no idea.
To me this should be good enough
"We are putting our voices forward and being called bullies and being called terrorist because of anti-blackness."
OG Shaka Zulu
Member
I don't know much Canadian history but Anti-Blackness is at least 4 centuries old. Propaganda about the inferiority/savagenesss of Blacks was spread wherever they were enslaved and throughout the countries which colonized Africa. Any countries the colonial powers were in contact with, propaganda against Blacks spread there as well. There is a reason why BLM resonated with Black communities throughout the world who live in White societies. Whether people want to admit it or not at minimum there is an underlying lack of respect for Black people that always rears its ugly head. Blacks have been enslaved since 1619 in North America... that hatred does not get undone just because Blacks became people, on paper, a generation ago.
As posted in this thread there is a racial disparity on how Canadian police treat people, though it's not as bad as the US. "Not as bad as the US" shouldn't be where the bar is though.
That's BLM Vancouver, not BLM Toronto. If you're going to justify your internal biases, at least make sure you don't get the facts incorrect. That quote you mentioned is from Cicely-Belle Blain, a BLM Vancouver member who feels their concerns are being brushed aside with the increasing support of a petition advocating for the police to stay in the Vancouver Pride parade.
Pretty much. As an aside, it's odd how slavery in Canada/New France is almost entirely unobserved when it comes to the history of black Canadians.
Oooh, I like that one.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
How does that back up your claim at all?
And that's not even BLM Toronto, that's BLM Vancouver.
If bringing up certain claims against the leaders of a BLM chapter are enough to delegitimize their message (well, a message over 400 years old as someone said). Then, police, in this case, have no defense. And people should have no problem coming at that institution with 10 times the fervor. But it doesn't happen.
And just as a note, I always hate the proposition of "we need to come together" and then the responsibility is laid equally on both parties, when it's quite obvious there's a difference in strength. It's comparable to Demetrious Johnson fighting a newborn infant. It's not a fair fight. So, when talking about "coming together" you must proportion 100% of the responsibility appropriately.
Making jokes about accepting checks while people are brutalized by police just shows a level of detachment which is one of many reasons things are difficult for minorities.
First, it's police, second, it's inaction and third, it's those who are putting the marginalized on the same level as police; i.e. making them responsible for their own oppression.
And just as a note, I always hate the proposition of "we need to come together" and then the responsibility is laid equally on both parties, when it's quite obvious there's a difference in strength. It's comparable to Demetrious Johnson fighting a newborn infant. It's not a fair fight. So, when talking about "coming together" you must proportion 100% of the responsibility appropriately.
Making jokes about accepting checks while people are brutalized by police just shows a level of detachment which is one of many reasons things are difficult for minorities.
First, it's police, second, it's inaction and third, it's those who are putting the marginalized on the same level as police; i.e. making them responsible for their own oppression.
If you don't want there to be a chance for your organization's message to be leveraged/compromised by government institutions, then you should probably not be funded by the government.
I feel condescending just saying that since it seems so captain obvious.
finally something the all lives matter crew can stand beside.
This is all a conservative's wet dream.
Since last year, everywhere there has been discussion about Pride Toronto and the TPS Pride float. Hopefully, this will be a teachable moment. Specifically about the history of Pride and why/how it originated, about those who are most vulnerable in our community (e.g. black transgender women, Aboriginal women, etc), and about the part played by law enforcement (then and now).
It would be akin to commemorating Residential Schools on National Aboriginal Day, with Lynn Beyak on a megaphone giving speeches on how awesome those schools were.
Since last year, everywhere there has been discussion about Pride Toronto and the TPS Pride float. Hopefully, this will be a teachable moment. Specifically about the history of Pride and why/how it originated, about those who are most vulnerable in our community (e.g. black transgender women, Aboriginal women, etc), and about the part played by law enforcement (then and now).
It's a classic case of suddenly pretending to care and being too stupid to know the difference. Time to scour the bowels of the internet for a new link.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I was talking in terms of relations with LGBTQ after Operation Soap. Race is an entirely different story. And you might want to calm down with the strawman, I never stated nor implied that they are untouchable and do-gooders. All I said is that it's unfair to simply use the past as a reason to create a divide when police have improved (and like I said, there's still a long way to go).
Is it not equally ignorant to say that police should not be featured in pride because of historical context between LGBTQ+ and police officers? That sounds like taking two steps backwards and doubling down on politics of division (not to mention, Pride representing inclusion, and yet being selective with that inclusion which helps no one) rather than working to eliminate discrimination. I'm not trying to say that the police is an absolute saint of an entity (especially as far as race relations are concerned), but what does closing the door on them solve? Toronto Police (and everywhere else) is a social institution that rely on the public just as much as we rely on them, and closing the door on them does nothing but makes it more difficult to work with them on social issues.
This is why I don't agree with your analogy about the Jim Clark float, because Jim Clark believed he did the absolute right thing and didn't once think about how he was dealing with human beings who were being segregated.
He was stubborn and refused to change his ideals. That is in no way comparable to the Toronto Police when they have expressed regrets in regards to Operation Soap and have improved their relationship with the LGBTQ+ community before the BLM event during Pride last year.
indigo lily
Member
It's easier to find links to push your narrative or for confirmation bias rather than taking time to understand how nuanced this issue is at the very least.
There are a lot of good and informative posts from queer POC here so I hope some are taking their perspectives and experiences into account.
I wish POC were being shown the same level of support and solidarity as police but that's too big of an ask I guess
Gotdatmoney
Member
Did you even read that article? How is it crying racism about opposite view point when in the same fucking article Price Vancouver states these BLM activist are receiving death threats? Of course it's anti-blackness and racism. And much of that racism is from with the LGBT community itself according to Pride Vancouver.
But it's crying racism? Go away.
Yeah, that's the issue, you can be LGBTQ and non white and your issues with the police because of racism don't disappear simply because your LGBTQ relations (with white people) have gotten better. The police need to be better now. They don't need a pat on the back for approaching decency.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
No, it's not. Stop treating officers like some marginalized group along the lines of Canada's LGBTQ+, indigenous or black community.
Putting aside the fact that you're ignoring non-white LGBTQ+ people who have been stigmatized by the police in Canada, as it has been mentioned countless times at this point, officers who want to attend Pride can do so as private citizens. They're not getting a float precisely because they . They don't get an award for being better than officers in the 80s, mostly because there's a whole lot else about police culture that needs to be resolved. You acknowledge that the police represent a social institution buy you don't recognize the institutional bias and discrimination that has caused direct harm to Toronto's various minority communities. It's not the public's fault, it's the result of their direct actions and lack of accountability that have contributed to the toxic image of the police, and no amount of photos with them waving around flags will change that. Or do I need to remind people about this? The police are not owed a float nor any space in Pride just because they don't arrest LGBTQ+ people en masse like before any more as if saying sorry somehow absolves them of their actions or will resolve decades of systemic discrimination they have caused.
And these officers or the councillors of Toronto who say that Pride should be defunded don't think they're in the right because...why, exactly?
SwipeLeftHoney
Banned
Very true. What's sad about it all too is because of how blacks are portrayed negatively in many instances in North America it actually trickles down to other places around the world whom view most black people the same way. It's going to take a long time for something like this to dissipate at all.
Lets be honest here, the world didn't need North America to 'trickle down' racism to them. It was always there.
So you have a link for the correct black people yet?
Scintillating argument.
SwipeLeftHoney
Banned
Ya but it is so much worse now in other countries. I've visited places like China, Argentina and Spain and experienced the most racism there. They think all black people are like from Boyz n the Hood or something or what is seen in gangsta rap videos. Its surreal how they think. Only place I felt truly welcome is in Japan.
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