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We Are Subsidizing Rich Suburbanites to Clog Cities With Their Cars
- Thread starter entremet
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Mammoth Jones
Member
I concede trains are more efficient. But after using the MTA to get to and from work for 10 years I hate trains and would rather drive. But my two hour train commute one way would be 3+ hours if I drove during NYC rush hour so fuck that.
Must be great living in a place where if your car breaks down your life comes to a literal standstill.
entremet
Member
Driving into NYC during rush hour is pure madness. You'll also shave a few years off your life on pure stress alone lol
smokeandmirrors
Banned
The day my commute no longer required driving is the day my life got immeasurably better.
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
I cannot understand the mindset of someone who would prefer to drive over taking public transportation: the latter is substantially safer and isn't a total waste of time. I fucking wish I could take a train everywhere I wanted to go.
eBay Huckster
Member
no one's forcing you to live in a city, the solutions to the OP problem are just making it so we aren't literally paying for you to waste resources
There was an interesting story on Portland radio several months ago about how the history of cars has shaped the American city and how the adoption of driverless cars could lead to the radical redevelopment of land use and urban design.
http://www.opb.org/radio/programs/thinkoutloud/segment/5-things-cars-change-future-cities/
http://www.opb.org/radio/programs/thinkoutloud/segment/5-things-cars-change-future-cities/
Andrew Korenchkin
Member
It's amazing how many mass transit projects get stalled due to wealthy politicians, neighborhood groups, and citizens STALLING the process.
smokeandmirrors
Banned
Not gonna lie it's pretty great.
therealist
Member
gee it's almost like it's a personal preference, no right or wrong answer
As a Dutch guy, I can say that being able to get pretty much everywhere interesting with a combination of train and bike is great. Bikes really are the best way to get around towns and with the advent of e-bikes also quite feasible for a lot of places with the proper infrastructure in place.
In Toronto we had plans for a great LRT network to serve every area of the city, and the province had already promised to pay for it, but then that gigantic oaf Rob Ford campaigned on "SUBWAYS, SUBWAYS, SUBWAYS!", and that vast LRT network was mostly canceled, and instead we're getting a 6 km, one-stop extension of a subway line to replace an existing surface rapid transit line.
Politicians should never be allowed to be involved in transit planning.
Davey Cakes
Member
My drive to work would take 45-50 min with reasonable traffic. However, every day it pretty much takes 1 hour to 1.5 hours each way and is annoyingly inconsistent. When there are four lanes PLUS the breakdown lane open and the roads still get jammed up, that's a fucking problem.
I really hate having to sit at a desk for 8 hours and then in a car for 2.5-3. My ass can't stand it.
If only we'd designed roads for streetcars instead of automobiles. Things would be a million times better. Fuck the auto industry. Our infrastructure can't support this many people on the roads, especially at these pitiful speed limits.
I really hate having to sit at a desk for 8 hours and then in a car for 2.5-3. My ass can't stand it.
If only we'd designed roads for streetcars instead of automobiles. Things would be a million times better. Fuck the auto industry. Our infrastructure can't support this many people on the roads, especially at these pitiful speed limits.
Andrew Korenchkin
Member
I'm crushed Jennier Keesmaat stepped down. She's my favorite planner.
She's really good at what she does, but she's been hamstrung by an incompetent city council and the spectre of Ford Nation.
It's like how Adam Giambrone was run out of town.
And this is why congestion happens.
I use to commute almost two hours each way to work via bus/train/shuttle bus. Probably saved an hour each day if I drove but I'd rather watch TV and play games than drive in rush hour traffic
My commute is around half an hour in my car. No buses run by my office, so I don't have much of a choice. The idea of taking a bus it still anathema to me.
Andrew Korenchkin
Member
She should run for mayor.
I started a temp job recently where i have to drive in heavy DC-area traffic for about an hour a day, and yeah. At first i was feeling fine, but over the last week and a half i've been bloody miserable every day. And yet public transit would take 2 hours and cost me $16 a day or something.
It's not just parking space, when the car is being used it's mostly a waste since they are most of the time used by only one person. Even if the concept of the individual car survives its size and number of seats will absolutely decrease, current cars are absurdly inefficient in terms of mobility.
Ok, that's fine.
But there are a lot of people who would like that possibility. Now the thing is, if the option for easy commute by public transit was available, more people would take it and in turn would make your commute easier with less traffic around.
theepicoftyler
Member
Yeah, it's only good if your destination is downtown Chicago. I live out near Downer's Grove, but I work in Schaumburg. There is zero public transportation options that move north south, look at my post on the first page. Chicago might be fine in some areas, but the greater Chicagoland is just as bad as everywhere else in the country.
FrankCanada97
Roughly the size of a baaaaaarge
I like Giambrone, he's a good man. Too bad there were so many prudes living here.
I remember reading this headline:
Scarborough RT riders unaware it will disappear, survey shows
I mean, what? Where were these people for the past 5 years? "Upgrade it (the SRT)". What did you think the LRT was supposed to do? I am still very salty about what happened to Transit City. Miller was the best mayor out of all the post-amalgamation ones.
I could see public transit commute also being stressful. I've been in Tokyo during rush hour (usually missed the worst of it, but one time i had a final exam scheduled at an odd time and had to get right in the thick of it). Nobody's really relaxing there.
But my old bus ride, i would get on before it became standing-only, so i could nap on the way to and from work. It was a beautiful thing.
andythinkpad
Member
Yeah this is a car culture problem not a class struggle problem.
I live in NY. People who live in Long Islands takes much longer time to get to the city.
At least I can bike to work. And there are reasonable amount of separated bike lanes.
I live in NY. People who live in Long Islands takes much longer time to get to the city.
At least I can bike to work. And there are reasonable amount of separated bike lanes.
YourMaster
Member
I think people who prefer cars over public transport for work mostly experience bad public transport,...
I worked in Amsterdam, lived in a mid-sized city 40km (25 miles) from work. The car would be possible and on days when traffic worked out fine perhaps even a few minutes quicker. However, I never drove.
In the morning I woke up just 15 minutes before my train would leave. This gave me just enough time for personal hygiene and getting dressed ánd walking to the train before it would leave. (When I was tardy and still using the bathroom when I could see the train driving into the station, I could still hurry, put my shoes on and run towards the train and make it.)
In the train I continued to wake up, ate my breakfast and read the news. From the train station it was an 8 minute walk from exiting the train towards sitting behind my desk. These 8 minutes were the only 'wasted' minutes spend traveling, but a short walk in the morning is not the worst thing in the world.
On the way back it was again the same 8 minutes to the train station 'wasted time', and again a short walk after a day in the office isn't the worst thing in the world. Most of the time I would meet my wife in the train and we would spend the ride home together, conversing, if not I would play on my DS. This meant that 'getting home' was an interruption of the game and often I had to hurry out of the train.
For me, a big contrast with driving a car, where I would to wake up considerably earlier to be woken up and fed enough to safely drive in rush hour.
I worked in Amsterdam, lived in a mid-sized city 40km (25 miles) from work. The car would be possible and on days when traffic worked out fine perhaps even a few minutes quicker. However, I never drove.
In the morning I woke up just 15 minutes before my train would leave. This gave me just enough time for personal hygiene and getting dressed ánd walking to the train before it would leave. (When I was tardy and still using the bathroom when I could see the train driving into the station, I could still hurry, put my shoes on and run towards the train and make it.)
In the train I continued to wake up, ate my breakfast and read the news. From the train station it was an 8 minute walk from exiting the train towards sitting behind my desk. These 8 minutes were the only 'wasted' minutes spend traveling, but a short walk in the morning is not the worst thing in the world.
On the way back it was again the same 8 minutes to the train station 'wasted time', and again a short walk after a day in the office isn't the worst thing in the world. Most of the time I would meet my wife in the train and we would spend the ride home together, conversing, if not I would play on my DS. This meant that 'getting home' was an interruption of the game and often I had to hurry out of the train.
For me, a big contrast with driving a car, where I would to wake up considerably earlier to be woken up and fed enough to safely drive in rush hour.
titiklabingapat
Member
It's not just public transit. It's also the choices we make in where we live and the subsidies that come with it. The federal government literally had an urban design brochure that literally said suburbs=good, cities=bad.
Any amount of public transit improvements ain't gonna do much in an area designed for the automobile.
Oh and autonomous cars won't be the solution if we all just end up using them more because of induced demand. You can't change physics and the geographical reality of more things occupying the same exact space at any given time, especially during rush hour.
Any amount of public transit improvements ain't gonna do much in an area designed for the automobile.
Oh and autonomous cars won't be the solution if we all just end up using them more because of induced demand. You can't change physics and the geographical reality of more things occupying the same exact space at any given time, especially during rush hour.
Sunster
Member
Ha! I cannot imagine a politician in my city even talking about public transit let alone campaigning on it.
Improve public transit a littlethen maybe.a lot
Until then, no way in hell.
My actual commute (after having moved to be closer to my office):
vs
Fuck MARTA (Atlanta)
MARTA sucks so hard but it isn't MARTAs fault.
It was originally due to Cobb completely opting out and Clayton and Gwinnett not having the balls to funding the system.
MARTA has been woefully underfunded until quite recently, with Clayton county finally deciding to give financial support.
Read this for more info. The situation was a shitshow from the beginning and MARTA is only just starting to recover.
dr3upmushroom
Banned
Commuting is a serious problem of society, not only does it increase pollution but it allows cities to become the land of the rich while everyone else has to dedicate over an hour just to work there and then leave.
It depends. Getting to work for me is between a 12-25 minute drive or a 45-hours and ten minute bus commute in the city. I just drive because it's not worth the long commute. My commute home is about 10 minutes driving in the afternoon and at least 45 on the bus. I really do wish my office was closer to a public transit option.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I feel like this is heavily city dependant honestly. I remember Minneapolis being pretty dense with lower and middle income folks around the urban core and the long distance buses were largely to help them reach jobs out in the suburban strip malls
Toronto is still built around accommodating cars, but there are improvements every year. And frankly, the neighbours in the city are still very walk-able. TTC can be a shit show and is slow to adapt to modern times, but it could be way worse looking at other North American cities.
They thought the LRT was supposed to drive in traffic like a streetcar and get in front of their car, because Captain Crackhead told them it would.
Yes, we let an actual crackhead dictate our transit expansion policy.
I wonder if they gave thr LRT money to hamilton.
Were supposed to be getting one. The traffics not baf here yet but so many people from toronto are buying our "cheap" 500k houses
For the first time EVER, my city finally has a public transportation option that can get me to work. 10 min walk to the train station, 25 min train ride, 10 min walk from the train station to work.
I FUCKING LOVE IT! Traffic around here is horrendous and I dreaded it every fucking time it hit 5pm. Now, I get a nice walk in, listen to some tunes, jump on a train and look at some beautiful scenery while the sad saps on the highway stand still in misery.
I can firmly say that my quality of life has drastically improved in the last 2 weeks.
I FUCKING LOVE IT! Traffic around here is horrendous and I dreaded it every fucking time it hit 5pm. Now, I get a nice walk in, listen to some tunes, jump on a train and look at some beautiful scenery while the sad saps on the highway stand still in misery.
I can firmly say that my quality of life has drastically improved in the last 2 weeks.
titiklabingapat
Member
The funny thing is that we already know the solution to to this: Live where you work. Dense Humanscale cities with midrises everywhere is what it looks like. Basically the blueprint for most of the older Asian, European and African cities.
Funding for Hamilton's LRT was assigned before Toronto lost its mind. The idea was to get the whole GTHA moving. Mississauga is getting one too, up Hurontario, and it was supposed to go all the way up into Brampton, but Brampton couldn't agree on the alignment so they chose to get nothing instead.
It's funny how Mississauga and Hamilton were tripping over themselves with excitement to get an LRT, but Scarborough, with similar or lower density, demanded a subway instead.
diunxx
Member
Lol I'm gonna call bullshit on that, mass transit in the morning is one of the circles of hell.
Also I doubt free parking would stop anyone from working at home given the choice.
From what I understand Brampton has the most dysfunctional city council in the GTA.
It does not seem well planned. I had to work in some of the newer suburbs and it was crazy. So im not too surprised
Enter The 36 Chambers
Member
I live in a big city. My commute is 45 minutes on the bus or by driving.
I take my car everyday. I'm done with packed busses full of smelly students and awful school kids.
I take my car everyday. I'm done with packed busses full of smelly students and awful school kids.
I hate commuting in traffic so much that I chose a job outside the city so I can just drive on an empty highway. My commute is about 25 minutes, and low stress to the max. Unfortunately around here many jobs are downtown, and unless are you right by the c-train (calgary), driving is just better (but still awful).
As someone now living outside of metro Boston
I would happily take public transit into Boston if it were not so unreliable.
I would happily move into Boston if the city were at all affordable.
I would happily move into Boston if the public schools were not terrible.
I would happily move into one of Boston's many suburbs if they were not outrageously overpriced.
That being said I now work 100% remote so I don't really drive.
The commuter rail is absolute horseshit. Sympathies.
We lucked out and bought a house at the bottom of the bubble that's a little over a mile away from the Orange Line. Good shit. It's worth $200k more now than when we bought it 6 years ago. The housing market here is bullshit and anyone who is buying now is getting ripped off.
shinra-bansho
Member
Ban cars.