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[Monty Mole]

It seems obvious to me that ND has ported their PS3 engine over and upgraded it from there. Whereas the J&D and Uncharted: DF engines were purposefully built from the absolute ground up for their respective platforms. I think that's why we're seeing Uncharted: Evolved, rather than Uncharted: The Revolution.

Personally, I wished ND had passed the Uncharted franchise on to another team and instead built something completely new from the ground up.

Of course, U4 still looks amazing, but it's the art direction and animation that impressed me the most, not the technology.

 

[dr guildo]

I don't think anyone familiar with the tech could say the gameplay demo was in line with the E3 teaser. I agree with Digital Foundry. It looks amazing, but it doesn't represent the massive generational leap we saw in the teaser.

...The almost flawless anti-aliasing and hair rendering is completely missing in the latest build

Read more at http://gamingbolt.com/uncharted-4-a...rom-e3s-teaser-is-missing#mhs3XqIQkGG9f7B9.99

how can someone take this analysis seriously after reading that comment ?!

 

[Dictator93]

This. Im sorry but I find it odd they dont even mention the game being in a pr-alpha state or alpha state when they talk about downgrades.

However, the game has plenty of time left in development,

DF wrote that, in the article.

With the arrival of gameplay footage, the teaser can now be seen in context - we hope that the final game surprises us with a fidelity matching the teaser, but we suspect that the original footage may indeed have been rendered offline within the engine. That's a shame in some respects because, for some, the discussion now isn't about how great the game looks - and let's be clear here, Uncharted 4 is often stunning - but rather about how it falls short compared to its initial reveal. On a general level - and not singling out Naughty Dog in particular - perhaps it's time for an end to 'in-engine' trailers? Show us the visuals running as we'll actually see them in-game - it's what we really want to see.

I like this quote the most. It is pretty much what everyone is clamoring for regarding downgradeathon stuff.

 

[DJ Lushious]

While I was watching the keynote live, I was thinking to myself how amazing the game looked, how Naughty Dog always thought of things before other developers.

I thought about how excited everyone on Neogaf was going to be...
Baffled at the reactions.

Agreed. As I sat there, in the keynote, I was completely blown away by the graphics, the gameplay, and the sound. It was all "did you see that?!" to my friend sitting next to me.

 

[MaulerX]

The PS3 was a pain to develop for. Naughty Dog (being first party and all) was able to dig deep into the PS3 hardware and deliver some amazing visuals compared to other games. On the other hand the PS4 is real easy to develop for so Naughty Dogs visuals aren't going to stand out as much this time. Other devs have already showed us what the PS4 is capable of so this looks just pretty ok in comparison.

 

[Figboy79]

It looked amazing in both graphics and gameplay. You CAN have both, you know.

The Order looks amazing, but is also out in 2.5 months. Uncharted looks amazing, but is out in 10-12 months.

Naughty Dog's signature attention to detail is in full display in that vertical slice, and the gameplay looks fantastic as well. Then again, I'm one of the people that has always thought that the UC series had great gameplay.

 

[truth411]

To those that are not impressed by Uncharted 4 visuals. Keep in mind 60fps is not free, if they hit the I.Q. of the demo at 60fps then everyone should be amazed. If you want better I.Q. that's what 30fps is for. I'm already seeing the Narrative of the I.Q. is good but could be better and not taking into consideration of the 60fps target, this mindset is exactly why many devs don't bother making 60fps games. Naughty Dawg should be applauded for possibly makeing the best looking 60fps on the market when it comes out. Will there be a better looking 30fps game out, possibly, but that's missing the point for those who like games @60fps. Just my 2¢..

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Agreed. As I sat there, in the keynote, I was completely blown away by the graphics, the gameplay, and the sound. It was all "did you see that?!" to my friend sitting next to me.

Yeah was watching with my GF and we were both completely blown away by the gameplay demo. Hell she's never even seen an Uncharted game before but got so excited for it to come out so she can watch. People keep saying The Order looks better, but it's completely by the books TPS gameplay, doesn't look anything above Gears of War last gen in terms of playability. And the character animation during gameplay in The Order looks kinda jank compared to what ND has been doing for the last 5+ years.

Uncharted 4 represents a clear jump in visual fidelity along with the huge improvements to gameplay that The Last of Us introduced, and the traversal mechanics of Uncharted. It's a perfect culmination of the excellent 4 games ND made last gen and it's a new-gen powerhouse for sure. Uncharted games have always been pretty fun to play but just service the narrative and setpieces, UC4 looks like a fucking BLAST to play though and there's a bit more strategy involved with what they've done to the stealth mechanic.

At this point I'm done trying to make sense of the shit some people here are spewing. "No Man's Sky looks boring" and "Uncharted 4 doesn't look much better than Uncharted 3." Fuckin' REALLY?

 

[Shadow_FFVI]

Haha, yeah. Thinking about quitting Neogaf because of all that negativity though. It just isn't fun anymore

Maybe because I was in the actual keynote, it had a bigger impact on me, but watching again on my computer it still looks greatlyimproved from the previous games, especially in the gameplay department.

 

[Game4life]

Okay why are people giving DF shit. The bigger leap that has people excited about just like DF mentioned is in the gameplay which is looking so freaking awesome.

 

[Always-honest]

The first teaser had 0 aliasing at all (as in it was 100% supersampled among other things).

I get the feeling it was unfair and or questionable to put out that Teaser at all. It represents unrealistic graphical quality on even the highest end components.

Yeah i agree. Though it was inengine and maybe the inengine cutscenes will be that level.
Maybe they'll even reach that level in gameplay at 30fps. But it's only needed for closeups..

We'll see.

I think the AA in the gamedemo was some of the best i've seen in games on consoles.. so whatever ;P

 

[Game4life]

Kudos to DF for pointing out how exciting the gameplay looks.

ND could have easily gone for a spectaculair set-piece, but instead they showed incredibly dynamic moment-to-moment gameplay. If that's the meat of the game with a few set-pieces thrown in for good measure, it's gonna be a very exciting game to play indeed.

Exactly. I agree with what DF has said. Easily my most aniticipated game so far along with Bloodborne just for the gameplay alone!

 

[VFX_Veteran]

This was exactly what I was trying to say in the other thread before getting hammered by the ND zealots. It's good to see some professional sites agreeing with my analysis as well.

 

[truth411]

It looked amazing in both graphics and gameplay. You CAN have both, you know.

The Order looks amazing, but is also out in 2.5 months. Uncharted looks amazing, but is out in 10-12 months.

Naughty Dog's signature attention to detail is in full display in that vertical slice, and the gameplay looks fantastic as well. Then again, I'm one of the people that has always thought that the UC series had great gameplay.

The Order is only 30fps, half of what Uncharted is aiming for and only 1920x800 of its 1920x1080 buffer is actively creating what we see on screen.

Edit: that's usually forgotten in the the U4 vs The Order comparison.

 

[valkyre]

This was exactly what I was trying to say in the other thread before getting hammered by the ND zealots. It's good to see some professional sites agreeing with my analysis as well.

Its really funny having you call other people "zealots"... the irony is exceptional.

 

[TheExecutive]

Should have an answer a year from now...

 

[LiquidMetal14]

If it already looks this good in this form then it should look mind blowing next year.

 

[Dictator93]

I think the AA in the gamedemo was some of the best i've seen in games on consoles.. so whatever ;P

That it was!

 

[t0rment]

devs should really stop putting unrealistic announcements trailers, it's becoming an annoying trend and it just detracts from the game.

this demo looks great and the final game will be even better, but i cant stop comparing to the e3 teaser, that's just above anything else i've seen. and they come out and say it's gonna be 60 fps, really nd? you're just creating disappointment.

 

[GYNGA]

By the way, if anyone wants to see a truly amazing dissection of the demo in both gameplay and tech watch this video.

He catches all sorts of shit I missed the first time, really gives you an appreciation of what Naughty Dog is already accomplishing. It's infinitely more useful than this Digital Foundry article, but your mileage may vary.

And he brings up some great points about the framerate as well.

Wow, really good video

 

[marc^o^]

There's some disparity already between the tech Naughty Dog was pimping in their "Bringing Nathan Drake to PS4" panel and what was shown. So I'm betting the game is going to look a lot different as it comes toward release.

Not that anyone should stop complaining about it now. It's a far ways off from the teaser, just as I always said it would be. But I also don't think we're close to indicative of where we'll be. Interview said the game looked extremely differently only 2 or 3 weeks ago, and they probably tried to get this demo running at as solid a framerate as possible, prioritizing that over putting all the effects they're going to have in place up.

I believe so. Same thing as the Zelda demo. I need to rewatch it as DF did, to see all the gameplay changes that didn't strike me at first.

 

[dark10x]

The Order is only 30fps, half of what Uncharted is aiming for and only 1920x800 of its 1920x1080 buffer is actively creating what we see on screen.

Edit: that's usually forgotten in the the U4 vs The Order comparison.

Also, early footage of The Order was running well below 30 fps (though they seem to be there now) while UC4 is delivering a stable 30 a year from release.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Graphically it looks wholly similar to other nextgen games in terms of techniques used and overall quality. I am not sure why it is a generational leap that is hoped for, you can already see the graphically generational leap in other games.

I really dislike the inordinate level of hyping that comes to some games and not others that use similar graphical tech...

This 100%. People really take away from the other developers that have push the boundaries either because it's not made by a popular company or it didn't get reviewed well.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Its really funny having you call other people "zealots"... the irony is exceptional.

I'm not a zealot of any franchise or company. I'm a zealot of beauty and pushing the hardware.

 

[Gurish]

It's no teaser levels but suggesting it's not a generational leap? are you kidding!? People including DF suffers from short term memory, it's a huge leap compared to PS3 Uncharteds, and it can easily be considered as a generational one, and still one of the best looking games I've ever seen.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

It didn't look like prerendered CGI (because that is an entirely other level of stuff), but the fact that it was running @ 60fps and had a number of things which are even missing from the 30fps cutscenes in the recent trailer... makes you wonder how they got it running on a PS4 at all

Wild guess: More time spent optimizing.

 

[alexandros]

It's no teaser levels but suggesting it's not a generational leap? are you kidding!? People including DF suffers from short term memory, it's a huge leap compared to PS3 Uncharteds, and it can easily be considered as a generational one, and still one of the best looking games I've ever seen.

Did you actually read the article?

 

[Dictator93]

Wild guess: More time spent optimizing.

As in, it ran at 60 and looked better because of optimization?

and then later on ran @ 30 and looked worse, because?

Not sure what you mean.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

I'm not a zealot of any franchise or company. I'm a zealot of beauty and pushing the hardware.

That is from from the truth .

 

[DubiousMaximus]

I don't think they'll have trouble hitting 60 FPS. Considering that they're using the same engine as TLOU or other Uncharted games for that matter, they know how to optimise this engine.

Just sit back and watch ND do their thang. We'll get a game that looks and plays brilliantly either way.

 

[valkyre]

I'm not a zealot of any franchise or company. I'm a zealot of beauty and pushing the hardware.

I guess beauty for you is constant pop in and LOD / framerate issues...

Face it, anything that comes out of a console for you, is already considered not in line with your "beauty standards" even before the video starts playing...

You yourself admitted to that.

 

[blitzcloud]

I also think he's wrong on the neck moving anatomically correct, I think its good deformation, but I don't think its actually moving the way muscles would under skin, but I need to get a copy I can frame by frame through.

it does, believe me. it's one of the first things I spotted, because it doesn't simply warp polygons to twist the head to the right like what we're used to. another thing would be that it might not be final and more changes will be done, but it really moves the way it should based on the pose.

As in, it ran at 60 and looked better because of optimization?

and then later on ran @ 30 and looked worse, because?

Not sure what you mean.

cutscene: controlled environment that only shows exactly what you want. that's what he meant.

 

[Lion Heart]

He's wrong about a lot of details, though. He's just throwing around features that aren't actually being used. Still enjoyable to watch, though.

Funny considering DF's own mishaps over the years. We desperately need a second source for these things, at least he knew that Far Cry 4 had Godrays on the PS4 version, I guess you guys missed that somehow. His framerate analysis also favored the PS4 while you guys gave the slight nod to the Xbone.

 

[Spinluck]

Nintendo was right. Consoles will hit their ceiling pretty soon. Not to say it's ok to gimp specs, but I don't see a huge leap. It's certainly an upgrade, but not much there blew me away like Uncharted 2 did on consoles the first time I ever saw it.

You know that game wasn't possible on PS2. Scale this down some and you can get it on PS3 without sacrificing too much.

 

[Windom Earle]

Funny considering DF's own mishaps over the years. We desperately need a second source for these things, at least he knew that Far Cry 4 had Godrays on the PS4 version, I guess you guys missed that somehow. His framerate analysis also favored the PS4 while you guys gave the slight nod to the Xbone.

Agreed, DF is seen as an instituation simply because they don't have any real competition. The mess up a lot.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

It looks very good, but I am more impressed by the interactive features of this game (interactions with environments, animations, gameplay) than it's purely visual aspects at the moment. Purely visually speaking, The Order looks better as of now.

ND seems to make a big step in terms of a.i. and interactivity with this one, however.

Agreed. The nice subtle touches to gameplay is a big step up from other games. It makes the game more immersive than before.

 

[Solid Samus]

It seems obvious to me that ND has ported their PS3 engine over and upgraded it from there. Whereas the J&D and Uncharted: DF engines were purposefully built from the absolute ground up for their respective platforms.

I don't understand this one little bit. I understand being underwhelmed, even though I'm not, but I'm not convinced at all that these visuals are identifiably the same engine as they've been using on PS3. In fact there's a lot of things about how this game is rendered, especially in motion, that looks distinctly different from the Uncharted games on PS3.

 

[Dictator93]

cutscene: controlled environment that only shows exactly what you want. that's what he meant.

That would be a good argument if this trailer didnt have the exact same sitauations in it (cutscene controlled environments).

For example, if that were true the cutscene at the end would run @ 60 whilst having individual hair modelling and etc...

But it didn't.

I do get the feeling that it was a pre-rendered in engine sequence in that original video.

Funny considering DF's own mishaps over the years. We desperately need a second source for these things, at least he knew that Far Cry 4 had Godrays on the PS4 version, I guess you guys missed that somehow. His framerate analysis also favored the PS4 while you guys gave the slight nod to the Xbone.

He is basically wrong with almost every single technical phrase he makes. Either that or it is baseless conjecture.

I like the way the video is slowed down and nice little detail is pointed out, but anything technical related to that detail is pretty much poor.

 

[Spinluck]

There is no "generational leap". The PS4 is old year old midrange PC hardware.

Pretty much. Great piece of hardware though.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

As in, it ran at 60 and looked better because of optimization?

and then later on ran @ 30 and looked worse, because?

Not sure what you mean.

Because the part they showed wasn't as well optimized.
And a few weeks earlier is was even worse according to Sony.

 

[pixlexic]

It's a video? . Not sure how they can comment in the aa.

 

[Bluenoser]

Wondering if anyone stopped to consider that Uncharted 1, 2, 3 were very advanced for their time, and it may be hard to achieve a huge graphical leap on games that were already so impressive. I've seen a lot of complaints here, but pretty much all are "it didn't wow me" or "not the leap I was expecting". Put it all in context? We all know what the PS4 has been capable of so far. Name me a game that looks even close to UC4 (even a year away from release) that runs at 60fps. I think expectations among the gaming community are getting way too high.

ND didn't bring this on themselves. At E3 they showed a 30 second teaser to announce they were working on UC4. Why they hell are people comparing ACTUAL GAMEPLAY to that? Boggles my mind.

Poor ND can't do anything right. SMH

 

[Dictator93]

It's a video? . Not sure how they can comment in the aa.

Things like pixel crawling / pop / specular AA are extremely evident in video... and even evident through things like depth of field.

Because the part they showed wasn't as well optimized.
And a few weeks earlier is was even worse according to Sony.

That commentary says nothing as to why a cutscene moment looked worse and used worse models and techniques than something from 6 months ago.

 

[Lord Error]

Good to see DF shout-out on the image quality in the demo, which was nothing short of spectacular considering what was being rendered.

For instance, the global illumination he keeps harking about, its not there. There's no real time GI.

To me it looks pretty clear that it's there - from his flashlight only - and it's the enhanced version of the flashlight GI bounce effect they already had in TLOU on PS3. Why would they retread from that?

I also think he's wrong on the neck moving anatomically correct, I think its good deformation, but I don't think its actually moving the way muscles would under skin, but I need to get a copy I can frame by frame through.

The effect pretty clearly is there, even if it's not 100% anatomically correct. The adam's apple movement is also there as they talk to each other.

 

[GifGafIsTheBestGaf]

Oh yes, absolutely. It's running well for being a year out but what's not clear is if they're still sticking with their statements about aiming for 60 fps or if they've decided to give that up.

yup, i believe in the prowess of ND and that the game is gonna look jaw dropping when its done but the 60fps thing i have to see it to believe it. i really want to be blown away by wizardry

 

[Solid Samus]

Things like pixel crawling / pop / specular AA are extremely evident in video... and even evident through things like depth of field.

wait, what? are there screengrabs of this, or can you give me times in the video where they're the most noticable? I've got the gamersyde video and frankly I've noticed very little of this. I wouldn't call it 'extremely evident' but maybe I'm missing something/

 

[Dictator93]

wait, what? are there screengrabs of this, or can you give me times in the video where they're the most noticable? I've got the gamersyde video and frankly I've noticed very little of this. I wouldn't call it 'extremely evident' but maybe I'm missing something/

He was commenting on how anyone can make statements concerning that stuff, I was pointing out that it is evident in videos in general.

I was not talking about the uncharted footage.

yup, i believe in the prowess of ND and that the game is gonna look jaw dropping when its done but the 60fps thing i have to see it to believe it. i really want to be blown away by wizardry

sigh...

 

[OsirisBlack]

I think Naughty Dog and Ready ad Dawn will be in constant competition with themselves and other Sony 1st party studios this gen. As of now the Order 1886 is the best looking game I have ever played as stated in the Orders thread I have never seen that type of attention to detail in a game ever. Also the animation in the Order is of the same caliber as Naughty Dogs works the entire package is quite impressive.

Not sure Uncharted 4 will surpass it visually as they are targeting 60fps but saying U4 isn't visually impressive is just silly.

 

[Lion Heart]

He is basically wrong with almost every single technical phrase he makes. Either that or it is baseless conjecture.

I like the way the video is slowed down and nice little detail is pointed out, but anything technical related to that detail is pretty much poor.

Well that's unfortunate but my point still stands. Even if he is wrong on tech nomenclature and the like, he was able to point out features that DF missed and his performance analysis revealed a different outcome then DF so its great to have a second source for tech articles. Hopefully he improves but I would never rely on DF solely after their history.

 

[Solid Samus]

He was commenting on how anyone can make statements concerning that stuff, I was pointing out that it is evident in videos in general.

I was not talking about the uncharted footage.

Oh. I missed that somehow.