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[cyberheater]

Sorry, but I'll have to disagree. People using Cemu, which is being developed purely by reverse engineering the Wii U, are getting almost full speed emulation on some games (Mario Maker) with low-specced PCs. With all the documentation available, i'm quite sure Nintendo devs are able to code a competent enough emulator.

PPC is a well understood architecture and not that dificult to emulate (see Xbox One BC, or Dolphin. Heck, PearPC will turn 12 yrs old next month). And the Wii U GPU is not some unknown part using bizarre instructions.

Also, for the people concerned that by going the x86 route for the console and ARM for the handheld, the whole unified architecture idea goes to toilet, that is not the case. Almost nobody (except Middleware developers) code to the metal anymore. Just look at the Android, iOS / OS X or Windows ecosystems for good examples on how to handle multiple architectures without much trouble. For a pratical example, most of the apps on the Play Store (coded to the SDK) can run on ARM and x86 phones.

I think you are right that a software emulation might be possible and would definitely point to a performance envelope for the new console which is encouraging.

 

[maxcriden]

Ok, I just noticed that nofusion (the guy with the second set of rumours, the pessimistic ones), said that WSJ , when they did that report back in October 2015, was "mistaken", and that he covered this multiple times.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaah.

What does the 'yeeah' mean here? You're skeptical of nofusion's statements?

 

[Tom Nook Sawyer]

He's saying the Wall Street Journal report is wrong: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX..._need_to_be_stated_re_leaks/d1pkp51?context=3

Ehhhh I think I know which side I'm picking here.

Particularly as his account was created 3 days ago...

What does the 'yeeah' mean here? You're skeptical of nofusion's statements?

That's definitely a skeptical "yeah" and not an excited "yeah!"

 

[GaussTek]

Not quite sure I believe the x86 Architecture when Iwata said they wanted to be on the same architecture to make porting and sharing between their systems much easier. I still believe it will be ARM and not x86 and ARM will be in all of their systems to share libraries, and much more because Apple.

Nowadays systems don't have to share the same architecture in order for devs to easy port their games, a lot of engines already have options/tools to do that, and I'm sure Nintendo would develop a framework/SDK to simplify the process, just like Microsoft is doing with their Universal apps.

So, I don't see why they should stick to ARM, when an x86 processor would probably be cheaper (to an equivalent ARM one with the same power) and more suited to a home console.

 

[diaspora]

I don't know what's driving this current "console upgrade cycle", but if they all aren't mandating 4K resolutions and at least 75FPS framerates AT that resolution for their hardware specs, along with some form of VR support, then they've already failed.

If this current gen has taught us anything, it's that resolution and framerate are pretty much make or break for gaming.

x86 or not. The last thing you want to be is on the visibly low-end of the graphical comparisons again.

Hopefully Nintendo has done their homework this time around. Forget the gimmicky nonsense and put some raw horsepower into that NX.

Assuming you're not joking, I hope you're ready to be disappointed unless console vendors start shipping systems with tri-SLI GTX 980 Ti.

 

[Malus]

But it couldn't be, because Iwata said it wouldn't be a hybrid. Unless you are suggesting that Iwata was lying...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXvMTNAbXn8

Ok, I just noticed that nofusion (the guy with the second set of rumours, the pessimistic ones), said that WSJ , when they did that report back in October 2015, was "mistaken", and that he covered this multiple times.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaah.

Reposting for new page: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX..._need_to_be_stated_re_leaks/d1pkp51?context=3

 

[On Demand]

praise the sun if true

I don't like if all consoles use the same architecture. It will lead to commodity which Iwata warned against. I like generations before when each console had it's own design.

Everything being the same seems cheap, safe, and easy to me.

 

[maxcriden]

But it couldn't be, because Iwata said it wouldn't be a hybrid. Unless you are suggesting that Iwata was lying...

Or, alternately, Nintendo changed their mind. It's not impossible.

 

[Peterc]

Looks like reddit mod wants to work together with neogaf mods:

FlapSnapple • 53m
I have actually only lurked on NeoGAF before and never posted, so I didn't even have an account! I just registered one though and will reach out to them.

(As soon as I'm able to at least: "Your account has been activated but you are currently in the moderation queue to be added to the forum.")

 

[rokkerkory]

Sounds encouraging, can't wait for e3

 

[Spyder_Monkey]

Who is more trustworthy; the Wallstreet Journal or a no name guy on reddit?

 

[Anth0ny]

I don't like if all consoles use the same architecture. It will lead to commodity which Iwata warned against. I like generations before when each console had it's own design.

Everything being the same seems cheap, safe, and easy to me.

this is EXACTLY what nintendo needs right now, what the third party devs want, and what most consumers want as the sales of PS4/Xbone show.

 

[Candescence]

A lot of this is par for the course for NX rumors, but the x86 part is something of a red flag for me due to what we've figured out what the NX probably is (a pair of systems, one handheld, one console). Unless Nintendo can actually make x86 on console and ARM on handheld cross-compatible, I'm sceptical that Nintendo wouldn't use ARM for both.

 

[Pokemaniac]

I'm not a hardware CS, far from it (or software one ). From my understanding, the Risc-Cisc separation is very blurred on modern x86 chips and practically invisible to the coders.

RISC vs CISC would matter if you're writing code in assembly, since, at its core, it has a lot to do with what kinds of instructions are present in the ISA.

On the other hand, I'm pretty sure there's been work to make CISC CPUs operate much closer to RISC CPUs internally, so, take that as you will.

Ok, I just noticed that nofusion (the guy with the second set of rumours, the pessimistic ones), said that WSJ , when they did that report back in October 2015, was "mistaken", and that he covered this multiple times.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaah.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeah, that's not a good look for them (the reddit guy, not the WSJ).

 

[Nanashrew]

Current ARM processor is as strong as the processor in the current PS4 and Xbox One, the newer one coming out this year is even stronger than those. I could easily see them sticking with ARM just for coherence.

 

[Peltz]

Someone else posted this 1hour ago on reddit :

Definitely bullshit.

 

[cyberheater]

If the performance estimates are right about this platform then VR is a possibility.

 

[Neoxon]

I really, really do not think so. That is an extra layer of complexity that seems wholy unworth it. What would ARM bring to a console exactly the x86 could not do?

Unification with the next handheld. ARM isn't anywhere near as complicated as you're making it out to be.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Looks like reddit mod wants to work together with neogaf mods:

We are in for another ride guys, all we need are Andy McNuggets and the other insiders to say, "Oh yeah this lines up with what I heard too"

 

[Dark Cloud]

Who is more trustworthy; the Wallstreet Journal or a no name guy on reddit?

I think we all know the answer.

 

[blu]

Unlimited Poweeeer! Blu, plz correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't the Wii U CPU tiny!?

It's so tiny that if it was any tinier it would've collapsed into a singularity.

Joking aside, the Espresso die is full of dark silicon, just so they could gather up enough area to provide for the pins.

 

[Mysterious]

Unification with the next handheld. ARM isn't anywhere near as complicated as you're making it out to be.

What do you know about ARM, Neoxon?

 

[XenodudeX]

I think we all know the answer.

#teamrerdditguy

 

[outunderthestars]

Support for a second screen....couldn't that just means it uses the Wii U gamepad..or even a handheld device like the 3DS?

I mean, I really can't see them getting rid of the gamepad and making it not work, so that'd be cool to use it on NX

I would think that Nintendo would want to move away from the Wii U gamepad as quickly as possible to eliminate marketplace confusion. Nevermind the fact that the gamepad is clunky, expensive, and a throwback to a system that sold worse than any of their home consoles (VB excluded) in company history.

 

[ReyVGM]

Because they aren't assured enough that they will sell you two pricey items. unless they are packaged together I don't see people jumping on both.

But that's the same situation (worse, actually) if they used smartglass or whatever.

Besides, the rumor said "support", not "mandatory".

 

[Neoxon]

What do you know about ARM, Neoxon?

Based on my Computer Science programming experience, the amount of effort needed to port code between x86 & ARM is minimal at best.

 

[bomblord1]

Assuming you're not joking, I hope you're ready to be disappointed unless console vendors start shipping systems with tri-SLI GTX 980 Ti.

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that tri-SLI GTX 980's would not be able to handle that.

 

[Lonely1]

It's so tiny that if it was any tinier it would've collapsed into a singularity.

Joking aside, the Espresso die is full of dark silicon, just so they could gather up enough area to provide for the pins.

And yet is smaller than many Phone's CPUs. And that's on 45nm...

 

[Lilalaunebaer]

Most of that leak is stuff we already know about from patents or different leaks. So really nothing new.

Except for the x86 part.

Now correct me if i´m wrong, but from what i read, the console being x86 and the handheld being ARM wouldn´t make it not possible to have cross-sku games. Since nowadays you don´t write to the hardware itself anyway but the software environment they run. As long as the handheld has enough horsepower, games running on both would be no problem right?

Also i don´t expect them to just run the exact same code on both, just with different settings like on pc. Just making porting easier, so instead having to invest a lot of time and money into porting, say Smash4Wiiu to 3DS, it would take let´s say a month instead of 6 months. Numbers out of my ass.

Second screen stuff could mean a gamepad situation again (hope not, as that just increases the console price) but i think it´s more that you can use the NX handheld as a second screen, so you could play your NX console games on your Handheld while at home. Don´t think it will have anything to do with using a tablet with the NX.

2 months till E3.

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

So that X86 is good news? Being able to run ports or current gen games sounds good, however things are changing fast and if the PS4K stories are true, won't Ninty more or less be missing the boat again, so to speak?

 

[Mysterious]

Based on my Computer Science programming experience, the amount of effort needed to port code between x86 & ARM is minimal at best.

What Computer Science programming experience do you have?

 

[outunderthestars]

So that X86 is good news? Being able to run ports or current gen games sounds good, however things are changing fast and if the PS4K stories are true, won't Ninty more or less be missing the boat again, so to speak?

I can't imagine a world where a developer won't create games that can run on the PS4/XB1/NX install base in order to have a game that runs on a machine that will have a tiny fraction of the install base of those three systems.

 

[Malus]

Looks like reddit mod wants to work together with neogaf mods:

 

[Peterc]

We are in for another ride guys, all we need are Andy McNuggets and the other insiders to say, "Oh yeah this lines up with what I heard too"

I think it could be a good thing to verify reddit sources in the future.

 

[Pokemaniac]

Also, for the people concerned that by going the x86 route for the console and ARM for the handheld, the whole unified architecture idea goes to toilet, that is not the case. Almost nobody (except Middleware developers) code to the metal anymore. Just look at the Android, iOS / OS X or Windows ecosystems for good examples on how to handle multiple architectures without much trouble. For a pratical example, most of the apps on the Play Store (coded to the SDK) can run on ARM and x86 phones.

As something of an addendum to this, if Nintendo goes this route, it would behoove them to hide hardware details from the devs to an even greater degree then Android. If Nintendo goes this route, the best case scenario would be that they have devs submit all software as bytecode.

 

[-Horizon-]

Looks like reddit mod wants to work together with neogaf mods:

Oh snap.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

I think it could be a good thing to verify reddit sources in the future.

I agree

 

[Plinko]

I'm not buying anything until official release of information. Not after the last couple weeks.

 

[Neoxon]

Most of that leak is stuff we already know about from patents or different leaks. So really nothing new.

Except for the x86 part.

Now correct me if i´m wrong, but from what i read, the console being x86 and the handheld being ARM wouldn´t make it not possible to have cross-sku games. Since nowadays you don´t write to the hardware itself anyway but the software environment they run. As long as the handheld has enough horsepower, games running on both would be no problem right?

Also i don´t expect them to just run the exact same code on both, just with different settings like on pc. Just making porting easier, so instead having to invest a lot of time and money into porting, say Smash4Wiiu to 3DS, it would take let´s say a month instead of 6 months. Numbers out of my ass.

Second screen stuff could mean a gamepad situation again (hope not, as that just increases the console price) but i think it´s more that you can use the NX handheld as a second screen, so you could play your NX console games on your Handheld while at home. Don´t think it will have anything to do with using a tablet with the NX.

2 months till E3.

It wouldn't be impossible, but it'd be a bit harder to pull off. And at least based on the coding experience that I have (sophomore in college for a Computer Engineering Software degree; experience with Unreal Engine 4 & Unity; have coded in Java, C++, C#, etc.), having the console be ARM would be more of a benefit to Nintendo than it would be a detriment for third parties. I may change my tune if things get dicey as my programs grow more & more complicated, but I'm just going off of my current experiences with programming.

What Computer Science programming experience do you have?

See above. I'm not an expert just yet, but I'm on my way there.

 

[diaspora]

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that tri-SLI GTX 980's would not be able to handle that.

No kidding. Even 4k 30fps is laughable for what the PS4k is rumoured to be. Frostbite titles are barely hitting 900p-1080p on current gen systems, let alone pushing 4x more pixels.

 

[On Demand]

this is EXACTLY what nintendo needs right now, what the third party devs want, and what most consumers want as the sales of PS4/Xbone show.

They can achieve that without using x86 can they not?

 

[spekkeh]

Yeah I call bullshit. If the big developers didn't have dev kits, we'd hear more leaks that they didn't have dev kits. There would be no NDA holding them back. There's a small possibility that genuinely every major developer thinks 'maybe the other guys got it instead of us', but more likely, if this guy is legit, then he only deals with smaller third parties or the ones that aren't targeting Nintendo consoles anyway.

 

[Neoxon]

They can achieve that without using x86 can they not?

With ARM, sure. But PowerPC isn't really supported, anymore.

 

[Joelstinton14]

So that X86 is good news? Being able to run ports or current gen games sounds good, however things are changing fast and if the PS4K stories are true, won't Ninty more or less be missing the boat again, so to speak?

I'm out of my depth in this thread as i know nothing about hardware or how it works.

But, i would say No. Not really. If true, The X1 and PS4 will still have the same games as the "4K"machines. They will not simply abandon an install bases of , last time i read, 55m users. I think people are reading too much into these .5 rumours.

 

[Candescence]

I would think that Nintendo would want to move away from the Wii U gamepad as quickly as possible to eliminate marketplace confusion. Nevermind the fact that the gamepad is clunky, expensive, and a throwback to a system that sold worse than any of their home consoles (VB excluded) in company history.

Well, not necessarily. Nintendo's patents are pointing to a free-form screen format with a handheld device size, if the console controller is anything sorta like the fakes, then it'd look sufficiently different and novel enough to be distinct from previous controllers and other screen-based devices, while also potentially looking much sleeker and more portable than the Wii U gamepad.

 

[Regiruler]

Based on my Computer Science programming experience, the amount of effort needed to port code between x86 & ARM is minimal at best.

Really? I heard Arm was closer to PowerPC than it was to x86 given that both are RISC.

 

[bomblord1]

Really? I heard Arm was closer to PowerPC than it was to x86 given that both are RISC.

Well if you're using middleware like UE4 the difference in effort is which "compile for" button to hit

 

[Grief.exe]

I'm out of my depth in this thread as i know nothing about hardware or how it works.

But, i would say No. Not really. If true, The X1 and PS4 will still have the same games as the "4K"machines. They will not simply abandon an install bases of , last time i read, 55m users. I think people are reading too much into these .5 rumours.

What's common on GAF is a quick kneejerk reaction without considering the larger context. That's what you're seeing.

 

[SneakyStephan]

Second screen ,does that mean like the wii u gamepad?

Because the wii u gamepad is the only thing I like about the wii U hardware (<10 ms input lag streaming)

It fills exactly the use that I normally buy handhelds for (like my psp and vita), to play in my home in my bed or in a lounge chair being very lazy.

 

[Afro Thunder]

Reddit's got you covered. It's organized by date, and has links to the original post and the name of the poster.

NX Rumor Spreadsheet

Wow!