computers putin'
Member
Glad this is happening, I'm just hoping the specs are beefy enough, and devs are willing to patch older games so I can finally play them in 60fps
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Sony confirms PS4 Neo, [Cites smartphone cycle, waiting until enough games post E3]
- Thread starter Thomper
- Start date
Duxxy3
Member
It will really depend on the developers. It won't be able to do 4k, but there are some games that will be able to go 60fps instead of 30. 1080p should be guaranteed no matter what. You'll see better AA implemented as well. Better lighting.
Basically, it's what the PS4 and XB1 should have been capable of 3 years ago.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Cars and console generations are like apples and oranges, but phones and consoles in terms of hardware and multiple sometimes widely different hardware specifications existing in the same ecosystem is what you get when you release products more frequently and you support more than one generation at a time... similar problems for developers as you have when you target a wide variety of iPhone and iPad devices and OS's (even if you were lucky to only support iOS 8 and iOS 9 it adds up, many secs still have to support iOS 7 and some iOS 6).
I do not see any real consumer benefit beside PC specs envy in killing traditional console generations.
On one hand tons of people shout about diminishing returns and silicon manufacturing progress and processors performance growth slowing down... and the answer being more frequent console releases seems counterintuitive and illogical.
I see the big benefits for MS and Sony, I can understand their fear of losing consumers every time a new generation starts, I can understand hag they want to lock users to their ecosystem and hopefully train as many of them to update consoles more often generating more money for them, but I am not seeing why consumers should embrace it.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Keep iterating on the design at the same node like everyone will do on 14 nm tech for quite a bit, see the death of Tick - Tock, and then release a PS5 in 2018.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
I wonder if I actually know the guy lol, do not think so. I have not talked about console hardware with my father lately and from what I know of him I am not sure he would go on GAF to make his point lol.
Bitch Pudding
Member
Please stop insulting the asses of other people.
KinofChaos
Banned
MR ARCADE FOREVER
Member
What kind of improvements are guys expecting from games on ps 4 Neo? For example Uncharted 4 at the same 1080 p resolution @60fps??? Games running @4k resolutions is a bit unrealistic isn't it?
Some games will get jump to 60fps, but I expect most will just take advantage to show better effects on screen [better AA, longer LOD distances, etc]. Essentially, Neo games will look like current nextgen ports look on maxed out PC visual settings [while consoles are stuck at medium/high slider positions].
Indie games will probably run at 4K, some very easily.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Sorry man, I have a fine ass though if I do say so.
Pics though a PS4 disc.
You can't scare Neo. He is The true One. He has a pal named Morpheus, and he knows Kung Fu.
BenjaminArrola
Banned
Scorpio scared the shit out of Sony.
PdotMichael
Banned
Namco sure getting desperate in finding names for the Tales series.
The 14nm development roadmap is very fluid right now. Both AMD and Nvidia are starting out with very conservative, small chips (yes 1080 is a small chip - only half the size of a 980ti and even the PS4/XB1 APUs are a lot bigger)
So it would make sense not to have a concrete locked in spec just at the moment. Literally 3 months movement on ship date could provide a significant increase in power, or reduction in cost as yields improve. Sony and MS are both likely to be playing this carefully - wanting the best they can get for their budget and also enough to last them another 3-4 years until the next iteration. If they go too powerful it'll be an expensive machine which might upset the current positive momentum of console sales. If they go too conservative they'll benefit from lower costs but risk having their silicon outdated rapidly as 14nm evolves quickly over the next two years.
So it would make sense not to have a concrete locked in spec just at the moment. Literally 3 months movement on ship date could provide a significant increase in power, or reduction in cost as yields improve. Sony and MS are both likely to be playing this carefully - wanting the best they can get for their budget and also enough to last them another 3-4 years until the next iteration. If they go too powerful it'll be an expensive machine which might upset the current positive momentum of console sales. If they go too conservative they'll benefit from lower costs but risk having their silicon outdated rapidly as 14nm evolves quickly over the next two years.
Risk Breaker
Member
womfalcs3
Banned
It's already slimmer than the PS3 slim.
HughJanuss
Banned
These kind of posts always make me laugh, keep em coming.
boclfon479
Member
The fact that according to this not all ps4 games will work on the neo worries me a lot....
jeff_rigby
Banned
In the voluntary paper issued by Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo to the EU power board the next power reduction tier is scheduled for 2019, a year after AMD's Navi and I think 10nm. The paper is dated April 2015 and had no information on the power drop expected.
AuthenticM
Member
There could very well be a slim announced, yes. I hope so.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Surely he means a large portion of games will get Neo enhancements?
It could theoretically happen but there is 0 reason to presume it will happen.
If Microsoft shrunk theirs, don't see why Sony wouldn't. I actually think the reason Neo isn't showing at E3 is because announcing two new consoles would be confusing.
dead monkey uk
Member
All PS4 games will work on the Neo, what he means is not all games will be improved for Neo. It's made very clear in the leaked documents, Eurogamer has a good article about it.
That would likely mean EOL would happen very shortly after releasing new iteration - as the old iteration would quickly become more expensive than the new one to produce. That may "work" if the new strategy is to never sell consoles below 300$, but I'm not sure if that's where they're going.mrklaw said:
Maybe if the "disabling parts of chip" thing still works for yield recycling, Base models would just be produced from chips that have half of units disabled and downclock a bit.
The Mad Draklor
Member
"Support" as in taking advantage of the Neo's extra power
Are we talking prettier graphics and higher framerate as it pertains to games, or will there be other benefits too? Such as faster loading between levels/faster loading before starting a game, a faster user interface menu/faster when jumping in and out of share button screen?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I'll be in Battlefield pitching my flags while your loading
Hahaha!
I am just hopeful for Battlefield/Battlefront in 1080p/60 so it scales nicer on 4K.
One far fetched theory to another, lol.
Bravo, sir!
BenjaminArrola
Banned
LMAO guys, u really think that Sony excuse is "no gaems" for PS4 Neo? They are probably upgrading that hardware to match' Scorpio. They did this with PS4...
CosmicQueso
Member
So, how much does the plane ticket cost to fly to your fantasy world? Can anyone go there or does one require a special permit or visa of some sort?
We meet again. Like moths to the flame, we are drawn to the madness.
To be realistic, RX480 is in ~980 range, and with lowered clocks from 12xx mhz to 911mhz [which could change] it will be somewhere around gtx970. That is nothing to be sneezed at, it can run currentgen games flawlessly, but it is not card for 4K gaming.
I expect excellent PC-like visuals with some games jumping at 60fps, but nothing that will dramatically change current games [or that will push devs to ignore optimizing games for PS4].
An example, Alien Isolation is very CPU light on PC, and even modest GPUs can push it into 100fps range. Game is clearly GPU bound all the time. If there is justice Sega will allow Creative Assembly to push that game to 60fps rendering since I don't believe Jaguar [with added 30% overclock over PS4 version] will be bottleneck there.
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph9217/74233.png
http://cdn.overclock.net/1/15/15268e03_HxaUtMW.jpeg
Other games that are more CPU bound will probably remain at their framerates, except if they were hard locked at 30 by devs because game was constantly in 40-45 tear-like-mad range. We cannot know what locked 30fps games are in that range though.
BTW, anyone has some fresh CPU tests for Arkham Knight? GTX970 can deliver over 100fps on that game now.
http://img.clubic.com/08454590-photo-geforce-gtx-1070-batman-arkham-knight.jpg
Not at $399. Even the PS4, arguably better designed in terms of ratio power/ cost, only was in the black (barely) 3 months after launch.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
It truly is a disease or a drug, or both.
BenjaminArrola
Banned
GHG
Member
All games will work on both.
It's just a question of whether the game takes advantage of the extra power or not.
Underrated post
MR ARCADE FOREVER
Member
That's what I figured thanks!
THE:MILKMAN
Member
No. You think Sony will recall and throw away all the dev kits they sent out? Tell devs they have to scrap whatever they have already and start again at a later date?
This is getting really silly now.
From what I remember, PS4 never changed anything from the earliest leaks. The only thing that happened was they were able to get 8GB RAM in 16 chips because 4Gbit chips came at the right time.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Doesn't really seem likely given both Sony and MS are getting their APU's from the same partner, and a partner that has its feet firmly planted in the PC market at that.
Seems less about surprise factors than product cycles being aligned most favourably. A situation that I think really favours whoever's in the better position presently market-wise.
Whatever happens Xbox has a lot of ground to make up, which is a very difficult ask given how that platform's success has always been geographically isolated to a few significant markets. Pulling back the ~20m unit defecit they are looking at right now is going to take a few years unless Sony's PS4 business collapses globally.
Which in turn gives Sony plenty of opportunity to adapt and counter to whatever Scorpio has to offer by moving to AMD's next node first.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
There are always diamonds in the rough, this post is one of them.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
They are not saying this, they are talking about games having a Neo mode IMHO.
Lol you are on a roll. Keep it coming!
The Artisan
Member
I thought maybe at first that I misunderstood what you meant when you said hard reset. You meant a successor console, as tradition goes, right?
But anyways, even going with more traditional architecture, I still would've preferred they stick to the cyclical tradition. In that, even if the architecture is the same, the Ps5 would just have much, much greater specs. Same architecture could've just made BC easier.
The benefits, I guess seem mostly to come on the producer's side but the consumer's still seem relatively mixed about the idea. I wish one of these threads had a poll because even though the majority of GAF seems to like the notion of Ps4K and xbone scorpio, there is a sizable minority that doesn't. As for the producer, getting used to new hardware is what it has always been and if it wasn't working then the market would've collapsed; it's been this way and every generation there are hundreds of millions of consoles sold and games that sell tens of millions of units.
Yeah but the platform holders always do get a hold of those companies. That's how this market is. And it works because all their products sell millions of units.
I suppose this is true, so then the producers benefit, but like I was telling the other guy, the consumers don't necessarily benefit, depending on each of their perspectives. The majority seems like they will appreciate it though, but there's a sizable minority that won't, so either way, whatever happens it's going to be a dramatic change in the market. It's gonna change everything.
But even if that is true, how does newer hardware within the same generation fix that problem? It adds to the problem by that logic because it's another product that has to go through this process of selling and either a loss or a time frame of eventually breaking even.
why does that matter? what's clear cut is that there is a profit to be had, something that the Ps3 for a very long time wasn't having and that wasn't blatantly obvious. but that's different here.
Are we talking this generation? Because for the past 7 generations there have been no "starting over from scratch" because it's been the same hardware throughout. This is the first time that within the same generation there's a conversation of change. And going from Ps1 to 2 shows that with making the right moves, hard resets can still be in your favor. it's not about new architecture it's about the right marketing and pricing, that's what Sony did and would need to if the generations continued traditionally.
As for keeping your base locked in your ecosystem, like I was telling the other guys, even though the majority of people seem locked in, there's a sizable minority that doesn't appreciate the direction the generation is going - and that's the reason they won't be locked in not only the playstation ecosystem but maybe even the console market.
Yeah man it's really depressing. To be fair though, we don't know if devs are gonna use the original consoles as the primary development platforms and have upgrade options, or if they will use the better consoles as primaries and have downgrade options in their games. But I agree with you.
As for the NX...if this is iterative shit really is the reality, how do we know in 2 years Nintendo won't come out with an NX+?
I thought at first you were arguing pro-iterative consoles, but your final statement makes it sound like you think it is a bad idea?
This would not be the first time dev kits have been upgraded. If the original leak was accurate then a second option has been on the table for quite a while, and there's no telling when a final decision would have been made. I don't see enough evidence one way or another to guess what the final specs will be, but Sony does have a history of trying not to underpower their offerings.
I love happy endings.
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