digoutyoursoul
Member
Understood. Thanks mate.
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Albert Penello on Project Scorpio and the future of Xbox (Inner Circle Podcast)
- Thread starter SOR5
- Start date
Understood. Thanks mate.
For reference , Forza 6 does 1080p60 on a 1.3TF machine.
I can't see why a machine that is 4.6x more powerful can't run a game with 4x the pixels
Neuromancer
Member
I would have liked to have heard more about their VR plans. Its the only reason I'm interested in Scorpio.
statham
Member
Hugh Swank
Member
Scorpio gonna be a beast!
Halo needs to be a visual flagship again, did really like 5 but there was so many glaring graphical shortcuts they took to get that performance
Bitch Pudding
Member
See, here is the problem. I'll try to make this clear with a fictive talk between a dev and his/her publisher somewhen in 2018:
tl;dr: I think as much as devs would like to go "all in" in terms of graphics fidelity in 1080p, their limited resouces will make most (not all) opt for the 4k resolution option. With Scorpio being marketed as a 4k console, I think this applies for 1st to 3rd party support.
On the other hand, and that's quite funny actually, multi-platform games could profit from the existence of PS4 Neo (mode) games, as devs have to implement bells and whistels for that ones anyhow, as Neo won't be powerful enough to deliver PS4 games in native 4k resolution. Only Scorpio is powerful enough to pull that off.
Wouldn't it all just depend on dev tools, pipelines and market expectations? It seems to me that MS wants developers to take a more PC like approach to their pipeline.
It makes sense to assume that many devs would target OG Xbox, then simply upres the Scorpio version. But is also possible that devs might tweak how they approach Xbox altogether to be more like PC. they could ship ship the game with all the bells and whistles at 1080p (primed for Scorpio), but running it on an OG Xbox One / 1S would be akin to running on min settings- turning the bells and whistles off.
InquisitorAles
Member
Yeah, you saying that all developers creating games only for consoles and never have to dealt with thousands and thousands possible specifications on PC. Adding few more variations of consoles will completely destroy 3rd party devs because they obviously doesn't know how to add different graphic preferences for each console iteration.
justsomeguy
Member
So they'll target neo but not Scorpio because it's too much work, and none of these devs already have multi target for PCs already?
Ok.
i still dont know what he means by "limited resources"
its funny how sony slides suggest the same thing ms does for scorpio, not mandating 4k but he somehow thinks its gonna go worse for ms and sony will knock it outta the park
I thought Sony had a 1080p mandate on all games developed for Neo.
Guys, he was suggesting that multiplat games on Scorpio would benefit from the Neo version requiring enhanced graphics anyway. He wasn't suggesting they'd put out an enhanced Neo version, but only 4k the Scorpio one.
A minimum of 1080p. They can go as high as they like, but can't for example put out a 900p Neo Battlefield 1.
A minimum of 1080p. They can go as high as they like, but can't for example put out a 900p Neo Battlefield 1.
Bitch Pudding
Member
What's funny is that I said nothing of the things you put in my mouth. Like, at all.
What I say is that based on the issue of limited resources (someone else might explain that to bidguy) devs may (!) opt for the more efficient option, which for all I know is targeting native 4k res on Scorpio - using XBOX One assets. It's efficient because they don't have to deal with additional models, textures, KI, or whatever, they "just" have to boost the resolution. The thing is, and Panello kind of explained that, you wont get both native 4k res and bells and whistels. Devs will have to choose in most cases (unless the game is not graphically impressive in the first place).
Now, what the "MS slide" above me got completely wrong is my standing on this issue. I think that whatever devs opt for, the result on Scoprio will still outperform the PS4 Neo edition in most cases. Furthermore I think that those switching from either XBOX One or PS4 to Scorpio will get a better trade off then those switching to Neo. I still doubt we will see significant prettier Neo than vanilla PS4 games, just more stable ones with better framerates. As much as some fans want exactly that, a graphics bitch like me won't be satisfied by that. I prefer the Scorpio monster approach by far.
I'm not big on technology (graphics wise anyway), can anyone elaborate on why 4K60 isn't possible with Scorpios GPU? Also what are the ramifications for Neo in light of that? I mean an actual valid opinion, not just 'lol no happenin breh' .. I'd love to know the particulars.
There is no reason. People are just concern trolling.
If the Xbox one can handle some games at 1080p60, then the Scorpio would theoretically be able to handle those same games, with some juice leftover.
You can't really judge what it "most efficient" without understanding each developers pipeline. Most Xbox one (and PS4)games are ports of PC games.
So the devs already have the high-end assets. They've been down-resing them to support the Xbox one. What's to stop devs from shipping the game with high end assets , then down-resing them for people who are using the OG consoles- just like they do with PC games?
Gamezone
Gold Member
Worrying question as they already struggle with today's games on one disc. I've tried asking, but looks like this is something Microsoft employees, including Albert doesn't want to answer. Games probably won't find their way to big sized UHD discs for a while because of the Xbox One attachment.
To honest, having a 4.2TF GPU means there should be no excuses for developers to have their games rendered at a native 1080p.
LordRaptor
Member
Does it need to be, though? I'd only put 1, 2 and 4 in that category, to be honest.
martino
Member
if every cost scale were linear how some think here we would already be playing 8k or more...
Spencer briefly mention this issue shortly after Scorpio was announced. He said that they haven't finalized anything but were looking at multi-disc and additional downloads...
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
What game was it recently that offered high res textures as an additional and optional download? I assume it was on PC as well, but I might be wrong.
Bitch Pudding
Member
Is it too much to ask to just read my first post more carefully? I was very specific which kind of resources I meant.
Good point.
LukasTaves
Member
I think its a visual flagship if you consider the locked framerate. Games that surpass it visually either render at a lower res (on xbone at least) or doesn't have a locked framerate.
so many compromises to get there though. half framerate enemies look real bad especially
Leyasu
Banned
Yep. But 343 won't have to make anymore compromises. Halo 6 is going to look stunning.. Maybe Crysis level lol.
The xbone port will be handled externally I reckon.
halo 5 still looks bad is my point
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
"Bad" is a bit strong.
it's very smooth and that's great but it's IQ is bad
Halo MCC externally? Good luck Xbone owners.
Bad? I agree the enemies running at 30fps at distance looks silly but in no way does the game look bad.
That was true last gen...
agree to disagree
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
There were occasions where I though "yeah, that's pretty damned blocky" - most notably whilst running down the outside of the Guardian.
But I simply cannot call the entire game bad-looking. It's fucking gorgeous, most of the time.
Fair enough.
Anyways, I'm hoping with the Scoprio reveal (which I'm still hoping will be early 2017) that we get announcements for the next Halo title, which first party games are being updated/designed to support the additional power, and what games are taking full advantage of the Scorpio from the very beginning.
I really hope Scalebound uses a dynamic resolution solution so that it'll be bolstered by the Scorpio.
Also, I want confirmation if it is using Zen or not. It would be a disaster if they didn't so I do expect it to be a Zen based APU.
martino
Member
Man you forget the async compute secret sauce...and not only console gamer have high hope on it
Gamezone
Gold Member
Ok, I didn't know that. Do you have a source for this?
LordRaptor
Member
It's true this gen.
The PC is not the lead platform for current multi-platforms.
I'm not talking about current pipelines using cage files from high-poly sculpts to add normal and height map details to character models (which was also happening at the end of last gen)
Gamezone
Gold Member
The whole Xbox division did. No need to blame Penello.
Louis Cyphre
Banned
Why not? He was the one who came to the forums and started fooling people with resolutions and now here he is again promoting 4k and 60fps.
gaming_noob
Member
We need some cboat-type posters to ramp up the hype. Perhaps after the Sept 7 Neo reveal. I want to be blown away...just need one post, don't necessarily require any words. "7.8" ....BOOM.
It's because the best graphics cards in the PC market can't consistently do 4K at 60 FPS - hence the skepticism. But maybe developers can optimize the code for the Scorpio better than they can on PC... I don't know. But to me it's more likely that developers will have to downgrade the resolution to achieve 60 FPS.
Cynn
Member
If that's your point then you have no point my friend.