OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Really? I hadn't heard!
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Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
Im glad you know now.
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
I did hear starfield is going to be the best thing ever. So at least I'm up to date on that!
Lognor
Banned
Too early to call. Who will be publisher of the year in 2022? Nintendo? They got more games coming out than Sony and Microsoft combined. Pokemon, Kirby, Bayonetta, Splatoon, Switch Sports, Triangle Strategy, etc. They seem like a favorite to get publisher of the year 2022. 2023 probably belongs to Nintendo too. Botw2, Metroid Prime, etc. No one else can compete. Microsoft got lucky last year.
R3claimer117
Member
His spin what about all the spinning being done for negative Xbox news? That’s not spin? Where’s proof that this game is a bad game? Where’s proof that this game is in bad shape? Where’s proof that crystal dynamics is now all of a sudden a garbage developer? None of this is factual just speculation because no one knows or has presented evidence of the game in any capacity outside of whats shown. Gallagher already proved he can deliver with the tomb raider reboot so if his vision is what’s being executed then until there’s proof of this being bad or the games bad everyone’s talking out their bums.
Dr Bass
Member
It is not "spin" to surmise mass exodus of talented employees indicates some kind of internal problem. That's all that people are saying, and it seems to be backed up by further news stories and former employees reaching out to people who write on video games.
The game could up being fine. That doesn't mean what is currently happening ... isn't happening. Does that make sense? It's extremely simple.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I think we've been reading different threads if that's all people are saying in this thread lol
Topher
Gold Member
You are being incredibly literal there. You know that.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I think what I'm saying should be easily digestible and I shouldn't have to scan this 15 page thread for each individual posts to point out what I'm saying.
There's been a LOOOOT of bad faith posting here which has veered waaaaaay off the point of Perfect Dark or The Initiative.
Dr Bass
Member
Well, that's all I have been saying in my few contributions. I bowed out of this thread for awhile after it was seriously implied by some of the loyal that the exodus could indicate great news for the game.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
We'll probably never know the full extent of what's going on with the game outside of a Schrier expose.
I'm still maintaining SOME hope that we may see surprise content for it at E3. We don't know how long Crystal Dynamics have been working on the game (before the first time it was announced in September). So let's see.
I'm still maintaining SOME hope that we may see surprise content for it at E3. We don't know how long Crystal Dynamics have been working on the game (before the first time it was announced in September). So let's see.
Topher
Gold Member
There is just as much "bad faith" from those pretending this all fine and good. You can add as many vowels to your sentences as you want, but none of this is good news. In an industry where talent is at a premium, this is just not good.
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adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
I don't think anyone in their right mind would say staff leaving is "good news", but we simply don't know if their role was done, whether development has primarily shifted to CD or what the actual circumstances behind them leaving were.
We now from other recent news that MS has been waaaay too lenient on developers and studios, you wouldn't just leave a cushy job like that.
Papacheeks
Banned
No.
it's been literally documented the only reason for the Re-investment to XBox is because Phil and couple others in his court who work in Enterprise came up with a solution to bring to Nadella. Like XBox being sold off was on the table at these meetings. Like you can literally look it up.
Thats how bad things were in terms of how investors and key company people viewed the gaming division. Xbox grows Azure, it grows data centers specifically in other regions/Countries as they get streaming setup to be accessed via a Xbox streaming stick.
Phil has been on record in about how he pitched XBox being a pillar next to things like Office 365, Microsoft 365 to Nadella and the board. Reason for getting this giant influx of what seems like unlimited money, is the end goal. Growth market sector. Which is what Netflix, Disney, Amazon, Google, Facebook are all chasing.
Gamepass gets them there and if its intertwined with backend Enterprise that helps run facilitate that growth sector they become even bigger in their market cap, and in their reach around the world. Someone in brazil gets an xbox, they get gamepass, if they stream like one game thats an metric that is tracked that they are using said data center where ever it is to access said game they are streaming. If the game in question is using azure hosting servers, thats another metric thats tracked.
The more a company is seen with all of its assets being utilized by multiple facets makes its market cap grow and more people from outside buy in as investors to be part of that growth stock wise. Enterprise runs Xbox so to speak, not physically in terms of actual people behind the day to day.
But all the metrics in place or coming into place all go to Microsoft's HQ where they look at how many people are logged in, downloading games that come off of server blades they make, and use data centers they house.
How can you not see that?
Microsoft Xbox Vs. Enterprise Software: Same Platform, Same Rules, Different Game
The worlds of games and enterprise software are both inextricably linked through the tools, platforms and methodologies used to create them… and through their shared focus on three core tenets of computing: content, customers and cloud.
www.forbes.com
Here's a snippet:
Choudhry insists that, “Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella has a clear view on gaming. He wants to now be able to combine the work that Microsoft does in gaming and the software assets and capabilities that we have across the rest of the company. Microsoft Xbox lead Phil Spencer was promoted to now report directly into Satya late last year and our focus in this division centers on those three core aspects already noted: content, customers and cloud. There will soon be two billion gamers on the planet and it is our goal to reach all of them.”
Yea, again Enterprise is still in control of XBox just now xbox has access to a larger capital spending because the back end alligns with Enterprise.
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Topher
Gold Member
We know the game director's job is not done as the game is no where near completion. This is getting silly.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
It really is ,we're speculating about a game that didn't even have a release date or anything. It may as well be vaporware now.
digoutyoursoul
Member
I watched David Jaffe’s video on this earlier, I like him to be honest. His views on production management in particular are interesting, particularly how it was at Sony compared to what could potentially be happening at Microsoft.
Topher
Gold Member
Yeah....I'll go with you on that. But damn......massive black eye for The Initiative and Darrell Gallagher if they fail. I hope not. I want to see this game.
Kokoloko85
Member
I think around something like 34 members of the team have left ( according twitter ), but tbh crystal dynamics is a great to help any team. I just doubt it will be AAAA like they mentioned
3liteDragon
Member
Way too many people involved with the game which according to VGC, became ANOTHER soft-reboot after Crystal Dynamics apparently joined in. But the first question I had since the CD involvement news broke was why does a studio that's fully owned & funded by MS that call themselves a "AAAA" studio need help from an outside publisher-owned studio to make their game? People think I'm talking about outsourcing, every studio does that. This is a first-party studio that's CO-DEVELOPING a game with an outside studio owned by Square Enix, meaning they had as much say as The Initiative in the game's overall direction. I was expecting this to be a Fall 2024 release before the news broke & now I'm not even sure if it'll come out in 2026, and MS buying ABK & all their IPs for nearly $70 billion is somehow supposed to give me hope regarding their future.
R3claimer117
Member
So now it’s going to take crystal dynamics 5 years to make a game because they just forgot how to make games? What’s with people and this game that no ones even seen running. Do we even know what engine this game is using? Didn’t naughty dog used some 2000 people outsides studios and contractors for the last of us? Or we just ignore that and make it seem like Microsoft is the only one that does this?
Papacheeks
Banned
Yea, and that game is fucking huge with some of the most advanced animations/mo-cap, physics for NPC's ever seen. Also Naughty Dog literally put out games from 2013,2016,2017 and in 2020. All complete all polished. This new studio has been trying to nail a game that already has a blue print somewhat for 5 years?
I would expect to see something by now and this news says its been soft rebooted under Crystal. Which means they are keeping a lot of what Initiative built, but probably have a ton to do in terms of full on Production.
Yes Last of us part 2 was not all sunshine and rainbows, a good amount of people left. But a lot of people were contracted, they were no permanent staff. The people noted that left were literally the founding devs of the studio.
HieroglyphicMonk
Banned
Why would you be a fan of a company that is doing terrible??? Why would you support that you're going to keep getting garbage if you keep supporting it.... You should be worried about what GamePass means for Microsofts future.
And how do you think Enterprise approved? Because they would get Azure marketing and sales (Sarah Bond), they sell their own product, then Xbox gets what they wanted with no restriction. But it is true that Devices division was always being a bottleneck, there are reports from Jez and also even videos from those who researched that the people involved on Xbox One had little to zero interest in gaming, Microsoft most likely bought Mojang at the time because it was once in a decade opportunity, Satya for what I recall was always seen as a very straightfoward and cost cutting person, which is why it was even speculated that Xbox days were counted even if was selling reasonably. Just like it took a convicing argument to Bill, Phil made his own to Satya and he agreed on it, in the end everybody won.No.
it's been literally documented the only reason for the Re-investment to XBox is because Phil and couple others in his court who work in Enterprise came up with a solution to bring to Nadella. Like XBox being sold off was on the table at these meetings. Like you can literally look it up.
Thats how bad things were in terms of how investors and key company people viewed the gaming division. Xbox grows Azure, it grows data centers specifically in other regions/Countries as they get streaming setup to be accessed via a Xbox streaming stick.
Phil has been on record in about how he pitched XBox being a pillar next to things like Office 365, Microsoft 365 to Nadella and the board. Reason for getting this giant influx of what seems like unlimited money, is the end goal. Growth market sector. Which is what Netflix, Disney, Amazon, Google, Facebook are all chasing.
Gamepass gets them there and if its intertwined with backend Enterprise that helps run facilitate that growth sector they become even bigger in their market cap, and in their reach around the world. Someone in brazil gets an xbox, they get gamepass, if they stream like one game thats an metric that is tracked that they are using said data center where ever it is to access said game they are streaming. If the game in question is using azure hosting servers, thats another metric thats tracked.
The more a company is seen with all of its assets being utilized by multiple facets makes its market cap grow and more people from outside buy in as investors to be part of that growth stock wise. Enterprise runs Xbox so to speak, not physically in terms of actual people behind the day to day.
But all the metrics in place or coming into place all go to Microsoft's HQ where they look at how many people are logged in, downloading games that come off of server blades they make, and use data centers they house.
How can you not see that?
Microsoft Xbox Vs. Enterprise Software: Same Platform, Same Rules, Different Game
The worlds of games and enterprise software are both inextricably linked through the tools, platforms and methodologies used to create them… and through their shared focus on three core tenets of computing: content, customers and cloud.
Here's a snippet:
Choudhry insists that, “Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella has a clear view on gaming. He wants to now be able to combine the work that Microsoft does in gaming and the software assets and capabilities that we have across the rest of the company. Microsoft Xbox lead Phil Spencer was promoted to now report directly into Satya late last year and our focus in this division centers on those three core aspects already noted: content, customers and cloud. There will soon be two billion gamers on the planet and it is our goal to reach all of them.”
Yea, again Enterprise is still in control of XBox just now xbox has access to a larger capital spending because the back end alligns with Enterprise.
These metrics are stuff that most studios and companies use nowadays, how do you think that developers publish breakdowns of how many shots and stuff were done if they weren't even on achievements or trophies? They really do use that in order to make plans and with internal and/or public surveys to see what they could do else.
R3claimer117
Member
Lmao
you’re really a Sony Stan so logic fails you. No one knows when the initiative decided perfect dark was going to be their game first cg trailer was announced in 2020 they were announced as a studio in 2018. Who knows how long they prototyped that game or what other ideas they did before that. Naughty dog had help on all those games. It doesn’t take away from the accolades or awards those games won. Or that there aren’t talented people at naughty dog. Soft reboot? How can there be a reboot of something no ones seen outside of cg trailer ? Also that was speculation it was not a fact that there was a reboot of any kind. All of this is speculation including our opinions. The idea that only Sony studios know how to make games is clearly a dumb narrative as elden ring is proving releasing side by side with horizon.
3liteDragon
Member
Read my post again.
Papacheeks
Banned
I'll tell ya the good news about this, my Ignore list grew by two today.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
From what I've read up on them, it comes down to choosing the right enclosure and sticking with a GPU that's within the performance range of your laptop's CPU so that you aren't wasting money on power you can't tap. The laptop I've got can probably handle up around a 3070 and tap most of that power outside of a bit of loss (some say it's best to shave off 15% of the card's top performance for a theoretical top using it in an eGPU).
Other things to keep in mind is to make sure you've got Thunderbolt 4, because that one integrates the bus into the CPU itself instead of a bridge IC like Thunderbolt 3 does. You can probably use Thunderbolt 3 eGPU docks with a Thunderbolt 4 port but it'll operate as Thunderbolt 3 in performance, which doesn't have the lower latency of Thunderbolt 4. Also most places say to use an external display with eGPUs instead of the laptop's screen so that the laptop isn't using power on the built-in screen, meaning the eGPU can get more out of it (helps the CPU as well).
I just hope GPU prices for new upcoming cards don't go 2x - 3x over MSRP due to low supply and crummy scalpers. But it seems like a pretty doable set-up especially if you're maybe also gonna have a desktop you'd like to swap the eGPU's card into when needed.
The average AAA game takes about five years to make, and they were just brought onboard in September 2021. The Initiative didn't have much tangible work in terms of actual game engine and systems, assets etc. made because otherwise the December 2020 reveal wouldn't of been a CGI trailer. And the nine months between that and the CD announcement was apparently very slow, so there's likely not a lot they got done in those nine months.
Assuming they did though, that's still 4 years and 3 months to go, so June 2026 I'd say is the earliest this game is coming out, if it's in fact going to be a more traditional AAA game. If they decide to make it a live-service GaaS title, it can come sooner, but then you might get a lot of people who won't care for it. If they make it episodic, they could potentially strike a balance and we get the first installment in 2024, but there's no telling how big that episode would be and the second episode would probably not come for another two years anyway.
I guess we'll see in the future what is really shaping up for this game.
You can't? You sure? I thought they had a thread over there, was reading it earlier today. Got the page open right now.
Of course you have a bunch of people holding their tongues but that's par for the course with that place.
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Umbasaborne
Banned
I never said they are doing terrible, Forza horizon 5 and flight simulator were two of my top 5 games of the year last year. And their backward compatibility offerings are unmatched in the console space. But they clearly need to improve their consistency of game output, and they’ve had multiple games at this point that have been mismanaged to the point of launching unfinished, or in the worst case, gotten cancelled
Is The Initiative about to get Scaleboun'd?
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Papacheeks
Banned
God is the studio closing? And Crystal Dynamics is just going to do everything in-house? Or did the media manager leave as well that could explain it?
WTF is happening over at Redmond?
Riky
$MSFT
Hobbygaming
has been asked to post in 'Grounded' mode.
The crazy thing is that this game probably looked mindblowing with the Naughty Dog, Insomniac Games and Santa Monica devs having worked on it but they probably saw that it wasn't all coming together like they hoped
Now we might not ever see the Perfect Dark game those former devs started
kanjobazooie
Mouse Ball Fetishist
Yep. Didn't take long to find an old snapshot at Wayback Machine. This one is from Feb 2021, they didn't follow anyone.
https://web.archive.org/web/20210209041654/https://twitter.com/TheInitiative
And this one is from Oct 2021, after they announced the partnership with CD.
https://web.archive.org/web/20211027194125/https://twitter.com/TheInitiative
CD was the first and last account they ever followed.
Edit: posted the correct October url
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Riky
$MSFT
It's pretty sad how desperate these fanboys have got, this sums it all up. It's the usual suspects as well.
Thanks for clarifying. I rescind my earlier statement. But will leave it up for historical purposes.
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Papacheeks
Banned
So is CRYSTAL Dynamics basically taking over the studio now? Or is the studio being shutdown and MS is buying Crystal Dynamics to replace them? Seems more is happening than just a change in project hands.
mejin
Member
Papacheeks
Banned
I have Riky and a bunch of dumb fucks blocked so didn't see the responses that Initiative twitter only had like 1 follower or whatever. I see now its a nothing burger. But can You blame me? Sorry I don't follow AAAA studios. I also dont have twitter or any kind of social media outside an old ass Facebook account thats gets use every 6-12 months for marketplace.
What? Valkyrie Entertainment has been a support studio for big ass games like GOD OF WAR, Valorant ect?
What? Valkyrie Entertainment has been a support studio for big ass games like GOD OF WAR, Valorant ect?
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kanjobazooie
Mouse Ball Fetishist
Yeah, but we can only speculate now. I hope we get an official statement or something soon. (E3 at the latest?)
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OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
You'll recover someday. I'm sure you'll have nothing to say when something similar happens next time to a sony studio. I mean if it does. Typically Sony studios don't lose half their staff before even a snippet of gameplay exists.
Bernd Lauert
Banned
At least he's not posting disinformation from random console warriors on Twitter
Riky
$MSFT
You can check when people have had threads about similar losses at Sony, I don't participate in them, I'm only interested really in the end product, don't feel the need to just constantly downplay and troll like you lot. That's why I don't go into many Sony threads even though I've got a big collection of PlayStation games.
It doesn't surprise me to see these people doing this and getting embarrassed though.
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