• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Twitch.tv update imposes delay up to 60s in streams, viewer interaction impacted

F

FallingEdge

Member
In another startlingly anti-consumer decision Twitch.tv has implemented staggering delays in all of its streams as it pushed out what it called a, "Major Video System Update." The update, which Twitch says improves the video system's stability and scalability, adds a delay that can stretch up to 60 seconds. That's a minute between what's broadcast and said by the streamer is received and shown to a viewer -- severely impacting stream interaction.

Let's start at the beginning. Twitch states that they are experiencing explosive growth which has been compounded by the service's release on Xbox 360 and Xbox One, as well as its impending release on PlayStation 4. In order to provide the "best quality video to as many users on as many platforms as possible" this new system has been implemented. Twitch says that the new system allows them to serve 15% more traffic than the old system with the same hardware.

This new system has been at work on mobile platforms and consoles since May earlier this year. They then stepped up and used the system for all viewers for the DreamHack Winter 2013 event to what they call "great success." Earlier this week the system went live full-time for all viewers.

Now for the effects. For large, commentary-based streams like eSports and large sponsored show there will be no immediate effect. Since there's no direct interaction between the broadcaster and the Twitch chat there's no need to worry about delay. However, for streams where gamers are directly interacting with their audience, the new system nigh on ruins communication. Imagine having a conversation where 10-60 seconds fell between each message, on top of dozens if not hundreds of other messages were also intermingled between. Consider streamer to viewer conversation absolutely destroyed.

That's not the only effect, however. Despite Twitch's insistence that the changes have had a positive effect on video quality, many gamers (myself included) believe the opposite is true. Not only does quality fluctuate often and for what seems to be no reason at all, but many viewers claim there are glitches that can make viewing streams a frustrating and low-quality experience.

The simple fact is that Twitch has implemented a system that allows them to buffer streams, catch brief quality fluctuations and alter the overall stream quality (ie lower the quality) to account for said fluctuations, and save bandwidth in the process. As such, Twitch itself is likely saving huge amounts of money on bandwidth at the expense of overall viewer experience. This is, of course, just an educated assumption based on the details provided by Twitch. However, it accounts for Twitch's inability to simply turn off the delay.

Perhaps Twitch couldn't sustain itself with the previous service, but as of right now it seems like Twitch has just exploited its audience's investment in the service for profit. Where else are streamers and viewers supposed to go?

My two cents? This is absolutely nonsense. I'm a frequent viewer on both console and and PC and can vouch for how much worse of an experience console streams have been comparatively. Guess what? Streams on PC are just as bad now. That's not even taking into consideration the stream buffer delay, which is by far the greater insult to viewers.

Twitch folded when it tried to get rid of 480p in one of its last brilliant viewer-exploiting decisions. I don't think they're going to fold this time. Like said above, the new system hinges on the buffer delay and considering how much money likely went into its development I doubt it's something they could, or would, disable. Again, it's nonsense, and if there was another viable service for streamers to go to I'd say saddle up.
Click to expand...

http://www.neoseeker.com/news/24328...streams-viewer-interaction-severely-affected/

Pretty damn terrible.
 
Z

Zombie James

Banned
Despite Twitch's insistence that the changes have had a positive effect on video quality, many gamers (myself included) believe the opposite is true. Not only does quality fluctuate often and for what seems to be no reason at all, but many viewers claim there are glitches that can make viewing streams a frustrating and low-quality experience.
Click to expand...

So, nothing's changed.
 
E

EightBitNate

Member
Can I ask how Twitch makes money on PS4? Sounds like a shitload of bandwidth gets used, and not a single ad. Does Sony just pay them handsomely?
 
S

StalkerUKCG

Banned
I have never had a good experience with twitch. Despite have 100mb connection the streams are still horribly inconsistent.

Service is garbage.
 
V

vazel

Banned
Yup, this has been annoying. Not just the delay but now I'm getting buffering pauses where before I had no problems with viewing streams.

Seeing how twitch staff behave and now this makes me really want an alternative to twitch. I would like a site that is run more professionally.
 
S

StanleyStutters

Member
The quality has been much better for me. I often had video's stutter and had to lower the quality or close one of the other Twitch tabs I had open, and even that wouldn't always work. Now I can have multiple tabs open without any issues with the video quality. The delay is a little disappointing, but in the streams I watch, it hasn't had a major impact on their interactions with chat. I'm sure they'll get it to the point where they can improve the video quality issues without causing a delay.
 
D

Dreams-Visions

Member
"Now for the effects. For large, commentary-based streams like eSports and large sponsored show there will be no immediate effect. Since there's no direct interaction between the broadcaster and the Twitch chat there's no need to worry about delay."

Anyone who's watched competitive gaming on a stream knows that this is about as far from true as it can be. It's like a crowd not being able to cheer for a minute after the a touchdown is scored.
 
S

Soulflarz

Banned
Soo

we need a new site or something (to those who it is a big deal? Im fine w/ this personally...kinda)

Youtube and Twitch have fucked them over and i can only hope you dont touch ustream

So....
Dammit
 
B

Bsigg12

Member
I watch a Minecraft stream from time to time and today was really awkward with the delay. The streamer is usually always watching chat and answering questions and talking with us, but the delay made it so weird.
 
C

CreepingFear

Member
I can see this being a huge problem on channels like Towelliee, Dexter and Victoria or anyone that makes it a point to interact with the chat. For people that don't talk or have cams, they won't be impacted that much.

Edit: I suppose streamers could get around this by using a more private IRC chat room, but that's an extra annoying step that you shouldn't have to go through.
 
J

jabuseika

Member
This pretty much ruins the service for me.

A big part of streaming is chat interaction, and it's hard to keep up with what everyone is chatting about when people are at different intervals of delay. It spoils what's happening on stream for those that are very delayed, when chat reacts to something and then it happens for you a minute later. When the streamer asks questions to the chat, it feels like an eternity to get answers.


I understand where they're going with the new system, and that they want to deliver interruption free broadcasts. But honestly, the way it was before, you could just set your quality to a lower setting and be on a 10-15 second delay maximum. Now, even source quality sets you back at least 30 seconds. That is too much of a delay in my opinion.

I guess it's fine for the few streams that only deliver content, like Esports events streams, or announcements streams, where stream interruption could cause you to miss something. But the majority of streamers on twitch interact with chat, and don't care if there's a hitch, or a few frames dropped, as long as the delay of their stream is as little as it can be.

Just imagine VGCW, and everyone in chat is on different delays.

Or a speedrunner like Siglemic, and viewers react to something he did 30 seconds ago, and others are even farther behind.
 
B

Busaiku

Member
Dang, I didn't even know this was going on, since I've been watching fewer streams lately.
But this is definitely gonna hurt AGDQ.
 
S

soundscream

Member
Dreams-Visions said:
"Now for the effects. For large, commentary-based streams like eSports and large sponsored show there will be no immediate effect. Since there's no direct interaction between the broadcaster and the Twitch chat there's no need to worry about delay."

Anyone who's watched competitive gaming on a stream knows that this is about as far from true as it can be. It's like a crowd not being able to cheer for a minute after the a touchdown is scored.
Click to expand...

Live sports has a delay. As long as it's the same for everyone what's the big deal if it's a min or 10 seconds like a live sporting event.
 
W

WillyFive

Member
jabuseika said:
This pretty much ruins the service for me.

A big part of streaming is chat interaction, and it's hard to keep up with what everyone is chatting about when people are at different intervals of delay. It spoils what's happening on stream for those that are very delayed, when chat reacts to something and then it happens for you a minute later. When the streamer asks questions to the chat, it feels like an eternity to get answers.


I understand where they're going with the new system, and that they want to deliver interruption free broadcasts. But honestly, the way it was before, you could just set your quality to a lower setting and be on a 10-15 second delay maximum. Now, even source quality sets you back at least 30 seconds. That is too much of a delay in my opinion.

I guess it's fine for the few streams that only deliver content, like Esports events streams, or announcements streams, where stream interruption could cause you to miss something. But the majority of streamers on twitch interact with chat, and don't care if there's a hitch, or a few frames dropped, as long as the delay of their stream is as little as it can be.

Just imagine VGCW, and everyone in chat is on different delays.
Click to expand...

Yep.

They obviously were thinking more about the eSports channels, which are the most watched, than the much smaller and personal channels with tighter communities. It may save resources on the back end, but really kills everything else.
 
O

Odrion

Banned
Man, websites are really driving the stake through the heart of Let's Players.

Can we just hurry things up and end Net Neutrality?
 
S

Salex_

Member
KTallguy said:
Why isn't USTREAM more popular?
Click to expand...

This is why I never use the website:
qNf6zNX.jpg
Click to expand...
hQitweh.jpg
Click to expand...

The layout is terrible if you just want to watch the video and chat. You have to pop out both of them for every single video if you want the fullscreen experience. Outside of that, I think the service is fine from the small number of times I used the site.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Twitch will now allow "Artistic Nudity" following the viral topless meta (Update: they walked it back)
Drama 3 4 5 6 7
332
50K
Fart Knight replied
Activision Wants To Suggest You Games Based On The Live Streams You Watch
Business Game Dev
19
969
winjer replied
Twitch to shut down in Korea over ‘prohibitively expensive’ network fees
News Business 2
70
5K
Ansphn replied
Crash Team Rumble dead on arrival as Twitch numbers hit less than 30 viewers
News 2
65
6K
DaGwaphics replied
PS5 beta firmware adds DualSense controller sound enhancements and Share Screen interactions
Platform 2
89
6K
WitchHunter replied
Top Bottom