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[pokeystaples]

I borrowed this from my brother when it released, but never finished it because I was swamped with other stuff. 1080/60 frames will definitely convince me to pick it up. The twitch video looks DRASTICALLY different than last gen. When I saw the IGN comparison video it didn't look all that different, but the twitch video....holy hell.

Still wish it were cheaper, but...eh...

 

[TechOne]

OHHHHH SNAP!

Dis gonna be good. GG MS

 

[IvorB]

Going to be wild? Did you not notice that the thread is already in the 60 page range? Shit got real in this thread 59 pages ago.

Yeah this thread has been going a while. I thought I was hallucinating when I saw the title change. Man, half the frame rate is really a very big difference. Even in the worst of the PS3 vs 360 face offs was there ever a such a huge performance discrepancy?

You'd have to be really crazy to pay almost a 100 quid extra for that much real world disparity in performance. Or really like Kinect...

Edit: Oh sh*t this is not the OG Tomb Raider DE thread but a brand new one. Already 60 pages...

 

[Dictator93]

30FPS will Always Deliver Better Story-Telling than 60FPS in Games – Heres Why


All the peeps of the Gaming World have been going crazy over 30 FPS and 60 FPS standards this last year. From 60fps/1080p being thought the new Next Gen standard to Ryse downgrades. But there a point many people are missing, one which i hope to shed some light on today, the point that why 30 FPS cant and shouldn’t ever be replaced with 60fps.

30fps vs 60fps – The Magic of Story Telling Lies in Lower FPS, 30 FPS will always deliver a more “Cinematic” Experience than 60FPS.

I am of course making quite a bold claim and the burden of proof lies with me. One which i am more than willing to shoulder. Let me begin by saying that the minimum limit that our brain needs to perceive moving frames as a seamless entity ( a video) is 24 Frames Per Second. This is one of the reason 99% of Movies are shot at 24 FPS. Though this was originally due to Sound Hardware limitation of Old Cinema, it has now become the Cinematic Standard. The 24 fps of the Cinema Industry is roughly equivalent to the 30 fps standard of the Gaming Industry. When you see a video shot at 24 fps / 30 fps there are holes to fill and your brain automatically does this by literally creating stuff out of your imagination : also known as movie magic. The More frames you increase, the less you brain fills in, the less the “magic”.


Proof of Concept: Hobbit 24 FPS vs 48 FPS analogy to the 30FPS vs 60FPS Gaming Standard

So, Notice how the 48FPS video looks, Sped Up, Weird and almost too Real (in a Bad Way) ? That is called the Soap Opera Effect. Because we grew up in a world where reality tv and soap operas were shot at a higher FPS our brains are now hard wired to associate mundane reality with Higher FPS. And i think you can see now what i meant by our brain filling in the gaps at lower FPS. The Original trailer looks magical and truly “Cinematic”. Of course you might be one of the minority who actually like the sped up, but in my opinion that is probably because of the Novelty Value.

30fps vs 60fps

The more Frames Per Second we increase in our Gaming Standards the less “Magical” they will feel.
I remember when playing Alan Wake (at 30fps) that it felt unbelievably like a movie to me, the sudden attacks of darkness and the way everything was moving about, i wonder if the magic would have been there with 60FPS. If i could clearly see how everything moved – probably not. Likewise in Cinema the Smokes and Mirrors fall away with increased fps – and story telling is all about the illusion. Of course some games would actually benefit from higher frames per second like Racing Games and Fighting Games (Tekken) but Games in which story telling is a main part would do better with the 30FPS Standard.

http://wccftech.com/30fps-vs-60fps-30fps-better-story-telling-games/​

can you people finally drop this "60fps is better" nonsense

Wow. THis is the first time I saw this argument and I am really surprised anyone made the mental hurdles to get to that conclusion. That is extremely disconnected rom the reality of what a framerate means in context of Human computer interfacing.

This is about as round about as intelligent design.

This thread has a lot of grey names.

 

[benny_a]

I'll never understand the people who say they would take better graphics over fps.

FPS is inherent to better graphics, imo.

And for a lot of games, third person adventure games for example, I think the trade off of lower fps for higher everything else is better.

 

[pixlexic]

Hopefully this is not out of context then as it illustrates what my disagreement is with you - the quoted is not an objectively true statement as some people value higher framerate over more graphical shinies. Framerate is a component of how a game's graphics are perceived. Now I know you can choose a narrower definition that separates graphics and performance, but I think that is disingenuous in this discussion.

Yeah but don't you think the devs would have went for better graphics at 30 fps if they had the choice? You see what I am saying? There was a conscious decision to make them both look the same.

There has not been many times when a developer opted for better frame rate over graphics. I think parity was still a choice but since the ps4 is more powerful it just leads to better performance. Which I would be thrilled with if that is how every multiplatform game turns out. I'd rather have the frame rate than more bells and whistles.

 

[johnny956]

Hi.

You may notice a lot of gray names in this thread. They were largely people who thought this was a good place to fight about PC/PS4, rather than discuss the topic of the thread. They also include the people who brought up the PC in the first place.

So, some advice for the continuing thread:

1) Stay on subject.
2) Control your impulse to engage in console warrior silliness.
3) Quit discussing moderation, meta discussions, PC vs. PS4, etc.

This is the second time you've been warned. We have more gray pixels, if that's what it takes.

Thanks for the effort.

So do we have any confirmation that the effects/graphics are identical just a different frame rate?

 

[GribbleGrunger]

That's great to hear, a couple of friends who have played it also have said great things as well.

Plus you get the more sexualised version of Lara with better breast physics. What more can you ask for?

 

[PhatSaqs]

You'd have to be really crazy to pay almost a 100 quid extra for that much real world disparity in performance. Or really like Kinect...

If all you play are multiplatz you might have a point.

 

[newsguy]

It's the PC version since it's heavily modded.

Lmao.

 

[jmdajr]

Oh look..

 

[kasane]

Still doesnt change its definitive $60 price tag and now with the price hike on canadian games. Ughh

 

[Interfectum]

On topic, I imagine this has to leave quite a few Xbox One-only owners pretty disillusioned with the console. A lot of early adopters buy these consoles for the graphical leap from the previous machines. If I had just plucked down $500 on a machine and am constantly reading how this $400 machine continues to get significantly better ports I'd be getting pretty agitated at this point.

So I guess the question is, are the exclusives and the perks brought by the OS/Kinect worth the inferior 3rd party ports?

 

[i-Lo]

Calling 30fps+ a last gen framerate is going off the deep end at this point. Good lord. 60fps was a thing on the PS2 even.

Concur completely. Selective memory is a truly special thing.

Most reasonable console gamers have no issues withe a 30fps games as evidenced by the sales of Uncharted, Gears of War franchise, TLoU, Halo franchise, GTA franchise, etc etc etc.

We will always have 30fps games.

If all you play are multiplatz you might have a point.

This is the line of reasoning that was heard ubiquitously from PS3 owners.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

It's the PC version since it's heavily modded.

11/10. Would laugh again.

OT, Is there any Xbone owner that is not satisfied with a 30+ fps? I mean, pretty much all console games were this as standard last gen, and no one really had a complaint, other than those used to 60 from other platforms. The graphical quality is still much increased, the framerate will presumably always be above 30. That is totally fine in my view.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Some of these replies make less sense than Jacqueline Bisset's golden globe speech. 30 fps is better for storytelling? Lol.

What other replies in this thread bothered you? I don't really see anyone here agreeing with the 30fps is better argument (assuming both versions are identical in every other way).

 

[RoboPlato]

Wow. THis is the first time I saw this argument and I am really surprised anyone made the mental hurdles to get to that conclusion. That is extremely disconnected rom the reality of what a framerate means in context of Human computer interfacing.

This is about as round about as intelligent design.

This thread has a lot of grey names.

Oh my god I remember this. Holy shit it's insane. Less magical is the worst argument I've ever heard.

 

[Finaika]

Plus you get the more sexualised version of Lara with better breast physics. What more can you ask for?

She's more sexualized here?

 

[qa_engineer]

Is this game even worth picking up? I would imagine its a very linear experience and a lot of rinse and repeat type of game play.

 

[newsguy]

I bet you been sat there all night waiting for the opportunity to write that.

Actually no, since I have my pages set to 100 posts so it's the xbone version for me. I own both so I don't have a dog in this fight. I only care about the exclusives on the xbox.

 

[Interfectum]

Is this game even worth picking up? I would imagine its a very linear experience and a lot of rinse and repeat type of game play.

If you like games similar to Uncharted you should like this.


v Same.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Is this game even worth picking up? I would imagine its a very linear experience and a lot of rinse and repeat type of game play.

If you like Uncharted, it's good. I enjoyed it more than Uncharted 3, actually.

 

[benny_a]

Actually no, since I have my pages set to 100 posts so it's the xbine version for me. I own both so I don't have a dog in this fight. I only care about the exclusives on the xbox.

I have a basic understanding of computers so I don't have a dog in this fight.

There, I saved myself 500 bones. ;-P

 

[Pain]

At yet most people won't know or notice. Just like they have that "gaming mode" turned on their TV, or worse don't know what mode or anything is on their TV.

Not saying people should not be informed and support what you want with your wallet.

Most people don't visit forums to argue about games. We're Gaf. We're not most people. Why do you guys always bring that up?

 

[GribbleGrunger]

She's more sexualized here?

Haven't you noticed the warmer colours of her skin, the sensual eyes with eye-shadow and the redder, bigger lips? From the girl next door to the diva you meet in a night club.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Is this game even worth picking up? I would imagine its a very linear experience and a lot of rinse and repeat type of game play.

Edit: My knowledge is a sham based on lies, apparently.

 

[w00zey]

Is this game even worth picking up? I would imagine its a very linear experience and a lot of rinse and repeat type of game play.

I really enjoyed it but going by what you are saying you probably won't like it. There are somewhat open areas but they are not large. Also yes kill kill kill.

 

[Ysiadmihi]

I've not gone through the game yet, but my understanding was the opposite, that you have a kind of freedom to tackle different places in a different order of your choosing. This may not be accurate though.

Not accurate at all. The game is about as linear as you can get, although there is a small amount of exploration to be done in some areas of the game.

 

[RealityPales]

has Tim Dawg said anything yet?

He and I have back and forth "debates" just about every night now. Essentially, his argument for everything is "BUT TITANFALL!"

We made great strides last night though, as he admitted power advantage was with PS4:

I'm in it with this kid for the long game. I want to break him down over time until there's nothing left.

 

[Interfectum]

I've not gone through the game yet, but my understanding was the opposite, that you have a kind of freedom to tackle different places in a different order of your choosing. This may not be accurate though.

Not really... it was pretty linear. You might be able to deviate a little bit but I don't remember having much freedom in the game. Still a fun ride, though.

 

[IvorB]

If all you play are multiplatz you might have a point.

Yeah I guess. MS better come through with some killer exclusives to cover this.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Not really... it was pretty linear. You might be able to deviate a little bit but I don't remember having much freedom in the game. Still a fun ride, though.

Not accurate at all. The game is about as linear as you can get, although there is a small amount of exploration to be done in some areas of the game.

That sucks, I was told you could travel to different islands and choose which you took on. Clearly they lied to me. Now I own the game :/

 

[BBboy20]

So, when CBOAT said be prepared, did he hint that what would happen after launch or within 12 months?

 

[Pain]

Actually no, since I have my pages set to 100 posts so it's the xbone version for me. I own both so I don't have a dog in this fight. I only care about the exclusives on the xbox.

If you only care about Xbox exclusives the why not get the superior multiplats on PS4? If you own both why not take advantage of that fact?

Why are you getting the Xbone version? Humor me.

 

[Thrakier]

Some of these replies make less sense than Jacqueline Bisset's golden globe speech. 30 fps is better for storytelling? Lol.

There is something that needs to happen.

"30FPS is more cinematic"-guy

vs.

"30 or 60FPS...there is no difference anway and as kids we didn't even know what framerate is"-guy

I know there are plenty of these guys here on GAF. Let them clash, please. I want to read it.

 

[DemonNite]

"Both platforms offer the same outstanding Tomb Raider experience," a Square Enix spokesperson told Eurogamer.

"Delivering the core Tomb Raider gameplay at native 1080p and running at 30fps was always our primary goal given the type of experience Tomb Raider is and the exploration we want players to do. Anything beyond 30fps for this version is gravy."

Keep your Special Sauce... WE'RE GETTING GRAVY MAN!

 

[Interfectum]

That sucks, I was told you could travel to different islands and choose which you took on. Clearly they lied to me. Now I own the game :/

Yeah it's seriously Uncharted starring Lara Croft.

 

[Ding-Ding]

Some of these replies make less sense than Jacqueline Bisset's golden globe speech. 30 fps is better for storytelling? Lol.

It kinda is. Thats why I have sent Eidos a request to lower it on both platforms to 24fps for the real cinematic feel...

Spoiler

If you believe that load of shit, you'll believe anything

 

[molnizzle]

This makes me really happy. Why? Because it seems the Xbox One is there to help enable the multiplat games to have a higher framerate on the PS4.

I sincerely hope that this happens. Even if devs "lock" their frame-rates to 30fps on both consoles, if the PS4 version runs at a sustained 30 while the Xbone version has the frequent dips to the low 20's that we're used to from last gen, that's progress. I really, really hope that devs aim for resolution parity between the two consoles for this reason.

Frame-rate > resolution. Always.

As for Tomb Raider specifically, man. Cannot wait for the DF analysis.

 

[Nymphae]

Hmm, so PS4 is the Definitive Definitive version? (someone must have said that by now, sorry).

Good news for PS4 owners I guess, I missed the non-definitive version so I might check this out.

 

[Ocaso]

It's the PC version since it's heavily modded.

I wish I had a Banderas gif to reply with. You deserve it, my good man.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

Not accurate at all. The game is about as linear as you can get, although there is a small amount of exploration to be done in some areas of the game.

It's less linear than games like CoD, Uncharted and Gears of War, though. There are parts that have a bit more exploration than I expected and the game does a good job at making even the extremely linear parts feel expansive. I'd like to see more games like this as I get bored with too much open world crap. I'm excited to replay this game at 60fps now.

 

[benny_a]

So, when CBOAT said be prepared, did he hint that what would happen after launch or within 12 months?

I think it doesn't matter. Anything he hinted at in that vein wasn't specific and therefor is open to lots of interpretation. He has given us plenty of inside stuff but just something bad is happening in the future is not worth anything and might as well have been stated by one of those phony ghost whisperers on TV.

I sincerely hope that this happens. Even if devs "lock" their frame-rates to 30fps on both consoles, if the PS4 version runs at a sustained 30 while the Xbone version has the frequent dips to the low 20's that we're used to from last gen, that's progress. I really, really hope that devs aim for resolution parity between the two consoles for this reason.

I very much hope you are completely wrong about the resolution parity, because of the implication due to the shitty amount of eSRAM.

 

[newsguy]

If you only care about Xbox exclusives the why not get the superior multiplats on PS4? If you own both why not take advantage of that fact?

Why are you getting the Xbone version? Humor me.

The Xbone version comment was a reply to how many pages this thread was. If you are doing 50 posts per page you have the ps4 version cause it's at 60 pages. As far as the actual game, yes all my multiplats as of now are on PS4.

 

[snack]

Damn.

 

[i-Lo]

I sincerely hope that this happens. Even if devs "lock" their frame-rates to 30fps on both consoles, if the PS4 version runs at a sustained 30 while the Xbone version has the frequent dips to the low 20's that we're used to from last gen, that's progress. I really, really hope that devs aim for resolution parity between the two consoles for this reason.

Frame-rate > resolution. Always.

As for Tomb Raider specifically, man. Cannot wait for the DF analysis.

Sir Leadbetter will ensure that he remains neutral and point out the positives of running the game around 30fps.

 

[TyrantII]

Not accurate at all. The game is about as linear as you can get, although there is a small amount of exploration to be done in some areas of the game.

Note true either.

Its open linear with the ability to go back to areas for collection and tomb exploration.

The "arenas" are much larger than say a game like BioShock. Great use of virticality as well. This ain't open world like GTA though.

 

[Dabanton]

On topic, I imagine this has to leave a lot of Xbox One owners pretty disillusioned with the console. A lot of early adopters buy these consoles for the graphical leap from the previous machines. If I had just plucked down $500 on a machine and am constantly reading how this $400 machine continues to get significantly better ports I'd be getting pretty agitated at this point.

So I guess the question is, are the exclusives and the perks brought by the OS/Kinect worth the inferior 3rd party ports?

Did the same thing affect PS3 owners when the shoe was on the other foot or did they suck it up and get on with it?

But it is embarrassing that this is becoming a 'thing' now. If some devs are having this much trouble keeping parity with such early games it doesn't bode well unless MS gets it's ass in gear. Time and money will probably ease these issues somewhat but it's still a damm shame as the actual exclusives for the X1 are pretty good.

 

[RoboPlato]

Keep your Special Sauce... WE'RE GETTING GRAVY MAN!

LOL I hope more games have plenty of gravy in the future.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

When you see a video shot at 24 fps / 30 fps there are holes to fill and your brain automatically does this by literally creating stuff out of your imagination : also known as movie magic

What the wat!