I mean, teach people to be respectful instead of assholes, or at the very least teach people that acting out said asshole behaviour WILL have real consequences for them. The way it is now is that everyone is getting away with it. Well, seemingly everyone at least.
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Former Naughty Dog employee says he was sexually harassed by a lead in late 2015
- Thread starter chadskin
- Start date
I mean, teach people to be respectful instead of assholes, or at the very least teach people that acting out said asshole behaviour WILL have real consequences for them. The way it is now is that everyone is getting away with it. Well, seemingly everyone at least.
WhiteRabbitEXE
Member
I understand that HR exists to protect the company. I just don't understand how they come to the conclusion that stuffing skeletons in their closet is the best thing long term.
Obviously, every company should help the victims in these incidents, because it's the right thing to do. But it's also the thing that makes the most business sense.
At my company, one of the ethics concepts ingrained in us from day one, is the "news headline" test: pretend the decision you are about to make is going to end up on the front page of the news. Would you be ashamed? If so, it's probably wrong AND will harm the company in the long term.
Obviously, every company should help the victims in these incidents, because it's the right thing to do. But it's also the thing that makes the most business sense.
At my company, one of the ethics concepts ingrained in us from day one, is the "news headline" test: pretend the decision you are about to make is going to end up on the front page of the news. Would you be ashamed? If so, it's probably wrong AND will harm the company in the long term.
NipplesAndToes23
Member
I'm not sure what to say.
Compsiox
Banned
Definitely this. Would they be fired immediately following a thorough investigation (if guilty)? Or something of that sort?
How would we be sure that a thorough investigation takes place if so?
Onimusha78
Member
HR was one of the areas I was looking at getting into now I've graduated, but family members have repeatedly told me that "you'll just there to serve your line manager, you won't actually get to help people". Guess they were right
Son Of Sparda
Member
This is disgusting. Especially the bit about how Sony's HR fired and then tried to bribe him.
I'm so mad right now.
I'm so mad right now.
The problem isnt making a statement the problem is who knows what and when? Sony has switched so many people around at wws, anybody who was there that knew anything could be gone now? Or they never new, how much access to the lower employees have to executives?
Did yoshida know anything?
Did adam boyes know anything?
Did druckmann or staley know anything?
What about evan wells?
Did upper management have a clue about any of this or was this solely on sony HR. The issue is disgusting but also complicated?
Lightning_Roller
Banned
What the fuck....!? Fuck Naughty Dog!! And Sony for trying to sweep it under the rug.
digoutyoursoul
Member
All good questions but I think you can still maybe recognise the situation in a video and give s view on the info available. It would be best to wait and see how ND/Sony respond before making a vid.
The real problem will be cases where there are no witnesses/no evidence of any kind and it's just they said, they said. Best case scenario there will be if you can somehow reassign one or both of the people involved in a way that a) doesn't feel like a punishment/demotion or promotion to anyone and b) keeps them out of each other's way. But that's probably not going to be possible in all cases.
TLZ
Banned
They're naughty dogs alright.
Lys Skygge
Member
Yeah these things are very complicated when it comes to large corporations. People painting all of Sony/ND should probably wait until more info comes out? Otherwise, the people that should be called disgusting are HR and whoever the harasser was.
Mega Caprison
Member
Please don't be Nolan North
Don't let him be my milkshake duck
Don't let him be my milkshake duck
fluffydelusions
Member
Nolan North isn't a lead...he's a voice actor
Uh, Nolan North doesnt work at Naughty Dog.
That's quite the response.
his speech at the game awards last year was kind of fishy if you ask me
Yes, please. Ive been seeing this everywhere here and what the fuck does it mean?
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
How so? (I remember nothing about it)
"Y'know what Ellie? We really are the NaughtyDogs."
Its the term for a person you used to look up to revealing themselves to be vile/stupid.
Modern version of "Broken Pedestal" basically.
Compsiox
Banned
Yeah true. In a studio environment theyre only working on a few projects so it would possibly be difficult if not impossible to move people. In a large office it could be easier to move people around though.
Maybe we could have cameras that record audio throughout the workplace? Keep anywhere but the bathroom from being secluded.
And if they decide to harrass digitally there will be solid evidence. So it could work.
Based on what?
anti SAG-AFTRA strike iirc
Dirk Benedict
Member
I prefer broken pedestal. Milk Shake Duck sounds like some kind of modern day blowjob technique instead.
digoutyoursoul
Member
Prefer to use "Twat"
Well I feel bad for this guy. Seriously fucked situation. Also can't imagine the courage it takes to come forward with this experience. This culture needs to change.
My first thought was that he was harassed by a male, just because this is the kind of shit that men do. Doesn't matter the sex though, it really shouldn't distract from the clear abuse of power and failure of HR to make things right.
But really, men are terrible. Saying this as a man who has plenty of reasons to loathe himself. Still just as shocking and sickening to read some of the accounts of male victims from female perpetrators.
My first thought was that he was harassed by a male, just because this is the kind of shit that men do. Doesn't matter the sex though, it really shouldn't distract from the clear abuse of power and failure of HR to make things right.
But really, men are terrible. Saying this as a man who has plenty of reasons to loathe himself. Still just as shocking and sickening to read some of the accounts of male victims from female perpetrators.
People you look up to, quite like turn out to be scum of the earth with qualities such as racism, sexism etc.
It does let them off the hook somewhat so probably not a great term, call them what they are.
BanjoLayleeYookaKazooie
Banned
It's a hypothetical where a duck drinks milkshake and becomes an Internet sensation, as would obviously be the case given the nature of the Internet. Then that same duck after getting its fame and fortune has the skeletons in its closet exposed, usually racist/sexist awful stuff like the one here.
On topic, I'm not happy about this at all. As a PS4 owner I have absolutely no intention to invest in that ecosystem until this is further extrapolated and then the perpetrators get what's coming to them.
This is serious stuff.
entremet
Member
Yep. Milkshake duck is just a plain stupid descriptor.
I mean you can still go into HR and do the right thing. Someones gotta be the good one why not you?
Ascenion
Member
I doubt very seriously PlayStation as a division has its own HR, so its not too much of a reach to blame Sony, if it is a company wide HR dept. since that means this shit has happened else where in the company. If PlayStation has its own HR, they still likely look to Sony HR proper for guidance which again...leads to Sony corporate culture.
If youre curious as to how high it went in ND, just ask yourself how many employees ND has and how close knit the team is, youll find your answer there. My division in my company is only about 180 people. I cant name them all but I can definitely tell you whos been with who, whos got a record, who lost their kids etc. People gossip.
Again from experience the head of HR knew as well as every person in the chain of command that person reports to (depending how their leadership is organized)
This so much
bonesmccoy
Banned
Don't go to HR, go to your lawyer.
You are a lawyer and still so naive?
MrS
Banned
Just because you like the games they make? That's a bit naïve, isn't it?
Truth
funkystudent
Member
Their 2 decade long history of near constant crunch and poor work / life balance isnt enough for some people.
ND make amazing games but they are right up near the top as far as AAA "work em' till they burn out" mentality.
Not shocked if some other shit is going on too but I wouldn't be shocked if a lot of that goes on elsewhere. Like...you hear stories about some people at some other well known studios and I just wonder how the hell regular people can cope. AAA space is kinda still fucked. Even with the few studios that are still around today.
They made some good games for a console that poster likes.
igordennis
Member
As a brazilian would you kindly shut the fuck up and stop giving us a bad name. Thanks.
Missed the whole kesha story of last 2 years
SirMossyBloke
Member
OfTheOverflow
Member
Have spent two hours reading every response in this thread, and I'm really disappointed in Naughty Dog and particularly Sony. That said, this is undoubtedly the tip of the iceberg. The incident concerning UploadVR early this year disgusted me, but made me aware that this is probably happening (in less explicit terms) everywhere, in probably every industry.
Incredibly depressing. Respect to those in the thread that have had the courage and strength to speak up about their experiences, too. You folk are admirable and I wish nobody had to deal with the shit you have.
Incredibly depressing. Respect to those in the thread that have had the courage and strength to speak up about their experiences, too. You folk are admirable and I wish nobody had to deal with the shit you have.