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Osaka Mayor, says forced prostitution was ok during World War II

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So in another and rather disgusting example of nationalism Osaka Mayor, Toru Hashimoto shares some opinions....
Toru Hashimoto, the young, brash mayor of Osaka who is also co-leader of an emerging conservative political party, told reporters that there wasn't clear evidence that the Japanese military coerced women to become what are euphemistically called "comfort women."

"To maintain discipline in the military, it must have been necessary at that time," Hashimoto said. "For soldiers who risked their lives in circumstances where bullets are flying around like rain and wind, if you want them to get some rest, a comfort women system was necessary. That's clear to anyone."


Historians say up to 200,000 women, mainly from the Korean Peninsula and China, were forced to provide sex for Japanese soldiers in military brothels.

Education Minister Hakubun Shimomura said Hashimoto's remark was unhelpful given the criticism Japan faces from neighboring countries and the U.S. over its interpretation of history.

"A series of remarks related to our interpretation of (wartime) history have been already misunderstood. In that sense, Mr. Hashimoto's remark came at a bad time," Shimomura told reporters. "I wonder if there is any positive meaning to intentionally make such remarks at this particular moment."

Hashimoto, 43, is co-head of the newly formed Japan Restoration Party with former Tokyo Gov. Shintaro Ishihara, who is a strident nationalist.

source & full article

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/14/toru-hashimoto-osaka-mayor-japan-sex-slaves_n_3270698.html?ncid=edlinkusaolp00000003
 

Jarmel

Banned
"To maintain discipline in the military, it must have been necessary at that time," Hashimoto said. "For soldiers who risked their lives in circumstances where bullets are flying around like rain and wind, if you want them to get some rest, a comfort women system was necessary. That's clear to anyone."

That's fine that some form of prostitution was necessary. The problem though is the forced component to it. It almost seems like he's using the comfort women terminology different from how it's generally used.
 

Sage00

Once And Future Member
Hashimoto is more than a bit of a nationalist dunce, but his remarks are being interpreted in quite an unfortunate manner here I think (especially given the timing after Abe's idiotic outbursts). He was just making the general argument that terrible things become acceptable when winning a war.

But he then went on to say "It is a result of the tragedy of the war that they became comfort women against their will. The responsibility for the war also lies with Japan. We have to politely offer kind words to [former] comfort women."

He also supports the 1995 statements that Japan's aggression was the cause of the war, and therefore that Japan bears full responsibility as the cause of the tragedies that occurred.
 

Dead Man

Member
That's fine that some form of prostitution was necessary. The problem though is the forced component to it. It almost seems like he's using the comfort women terminology different from how it's generally used.

Indeed. The point is being missed rather substantially. Regulated prostitution = ok. Sexual slavery = not ok.
 

phaze

Member
Guy is a dick but to be fair, nowhere in the article did he say that it was "ok". He stated that it was "necessary".
 

linsivvi

Member
LOL @ "It is a result of the tragedy of the war that they became comfort women against their will."

Yes, it's a result of war and not horrible human beings that women were kidnapped, enslaved and raped.
 
Hashimoto is basically your typical far right twat. These statements get people worked up because of past events but it doesn't particularly surprise me. It almost seems like a diversion because that sort of sentiment isn't anything new.

To be honest, his attitude towards the Japanese can't be considered much better. His attitude towards Japanese women would make most people's head spin because its unashamedly misogynistic.
 

linsivvi

Member
Both opinions are equally reprehensible

Pretty much. His statements boiled down to this:

1. The responsibility for the war lies with Japan.
2. A comfort women system is necessary.
3. It is a result of the tragedy of the war that they became comfort women.
4. We have to politely offer kind words.

He's whitewashing history and basically saying that while Japan was responsible for the war, the slavery and rapes were necessary because of the war.
 

Forkball

Member
Japan right wingers are even scarier than American right wingers in some ways. Anti-gay marriage signs vs. attempted assassination via katana (which isn't as cool as it sounds).
 

FyreWulff

Member
repostcrossposting from other thread:

They've got a loooooong way to go for gender equality when someone even considers saying something like that in public acceptable, even if it's condemned later.
 
Saying it was necessary just insults men along with the women it has harmed. The act alone is terrible, forcing women to be raped. To defend it as a necessity insults men as if they aren't able to function without regular sex.
 

Anustart

Member
Totally read thread title as Oscar Meyer says forced prostitution was ok during World War II, thought to myself that that was an edgy view to take for the processed meat company.
 
repostcrossposting from other thread:

They've got a loooooong way to go for gender equality when someone even considers saying something like that in public acceptable, even if it's condemned later.

Well, maybe, but as if you could find a culture on earth where some dumb politician isn't saying things like this. The US still has guys talking about how women need to just get over rape or let their bodies reject evil sperm. It does count for something that the prime minister jumped all over him and told him to STFU as soon as it happened.
 

Ratrat

Member
He also suggested brothels be set around the us military base didn't he? He's getting some flack for that at least.
 

linsivvi

Member
US troops abused Japanese women, charges Osaka Mayor

The Mayor of Osaka, who outraged many with remarks about Japan’s wartime and modern sexual services, has struck back after the United States condemned his comments as “outrageous and offensive”, accusing American soldiers of using Japanese women for sex during the US occupation of Japan.
“During the period of the US occupation of Japan (after the end of the war), the United States also utilised Japanese women. It is outrageous to use women to deal with the sexual (desires of soldiers) in combat areas,” he wrote in a series of comments posted on his Twitter account.

“It is intolerable to justify Japan’s utilisation of comfort women. But it is unfair to criticise only Japan.”

He was responding to State Department spokeswoman Jen Psaki, who on Thursday condemned his comments, calling them “outrageous and offensive”.

“What happened in that era to these women who were trafficked for sexual purposes is deplorable and clearly a grave human rights violation of enormous proportions,” she said.

http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/us-troops-abused-japanese-women-charges-osaka-mayor

Well that escalated quickly.
 

Piecake

Member
US troops abused Japanese women, charges Osaka Mayor




http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/us-troops-abused-japanese-women-charges-osaka-mayor

Well that escalated quickly.

I think the big difference is that in Japan's case, the use of comfort women was approved by the higher ups and was systematically set up, while the US soldiers committed crimes on their own. I would imagine it would be a lot more widespread in Japan's case as well. No idea on the actual numbers on the US side
 

linsivvi

Member
I think the big difference is that in Japan's case, the use of comfort women was approved by the higher ups and was systematically set up, while the US soldiers committed crimes on their own. I would imagine it would be a lot more widespread in Japan's case as well. No idea on the actual numbers on the US side

I think anyone with common sense understand this. It's just funny that this guy is leashing out to everybody and using children tactics of "but but but they did it too".
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
He didn't say it was OK. He said it must have been necessary at the time, but that kind of stuff is unacceptable today.

All we was doing is pointing out that Japan wasn't unique in its usage of prostitutes for soldiers.

Someone would defend the indefensible.

So if you disagree with someone it's OK to twist their words to make more sensationalist title?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
oh that's not so bad, everybody else was raping women so it must've been necessary for no reason what in the actual fuck

What he's saying is that organized prostitution was necessary to prevent such rampant raping and keep order among the troops. He's saying that similar systems were used by pretty much any country in war at the time, and while Japan has to take responsibility for their actions in the war, it's unfair that they are being propped up as if they are uniquely a "country of rapists."
 
It seems like he's deploring both forms of abuse.

His first quote read to me like how nuking a large amount of civilians was considered acceptable back then but I imagine there wouldn't be much support for such a thing now.

Well I'm sure there are people who would still support that but I'd like to think there are a significantly less number of them than in the past.
 
He didn't say it was OK. He said it must have been necessary at the time, but that kind of stuff is unacceptable today.

All we was doing is pointing out that Japan wasn't unique in its usage of prostitutes for soldiers.



So if you disagree with someone it's OK to twist their words to make more sensationalist title?

Are you saying it's necessary to rape?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Are you saying it's necessary to rape?

He's saying it must have been necessary for the armed forces (of more countries than just Japan) to utilize prostitution in times of war in order to keep order and prevent rape of the general population.
 
US troops abused Japanese women, charges Osaka Mayor

http://www.todayonline.com/world/asia/us-troops-abused-japanese-women-charges-osaka-mayor

Well that escalated quickly.

http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/politics/news/20130518-OYT1T00856.htm?from=main1



「慰安婦を正当化するつもりはない。しかし、欧米諸国が自らを棚上げして日本だけに責任を負わせ、臭い物にふたをするのは絶対ダメだ」「アメリカだって沖縄の女性に何をしていたのか。ベトナム戦争でも朝鮮戦争でも、慰安所、慰安婦を世界の軍が使っていた」

If the above article is in response to this comment, I think they misunderstood it a bit. He isn't trying to paint American actions in East Asia in regards to having sex with local women in a negative light, even if he is saying it (comfort women/forced prostitution) is not necessarily justified, but rather to show that even the USA did it, so it must have been necessary. Like, to say that Japan was bad, but not much worse than anybody else during the period.

Basically, the reasoning is 'the USA also had troops that went to brothels during occupation' as if that equates to the government establishing brothels with their own citizens. Of course, I think his point is not that the US did what Japan did, but rather that troops need sex when they are away from home, and every country uses brothels/prostitutes to get it. So the countries of Europe and the USA have no moral authority on the matter.

Kinda true, kinda not.
 
What he's saying is that organized prostitution was necessary to prevent such rampant raping and keep order among the troops. He's saying that similar systems were used by pretty much any country in war at the time, and while Japan has to take responsibility for their actions in the war, it's unfair that they are being propped up as if they are uniquely a "country of rapists."

He said exactly none of those things. He said because war is hard, it's necessary for soldiers to rape women.
 

hey_it's_that_dog

benevolent sexism
He's saying it must have been necessary for the armed forces (of more countries than just Japan) to utilize prostitution in times of war in order to keep order and prevent rape of the general population.

Isn't the objection that the women were forced to be prostitutes? i.e. raped and paid for it?

Also, if it's a patriotic need for Japanese soldiers to have fuck toys (and I say this crudely to illustrate how absurd the assertion is to begin with), why weren't Japanese women conscripted for the purpose?

I only read the OP, so maybe I'm missing some key information, but it sounds like we're talking about mostly Korean and Chinese women, yes?
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Isn't the objection that the women were forced to be prostitutes? i.e. raped and paid for it?

Also, if it's a patriotic need for Japanese soldiers to have fuck toys (and I say this crudely to illustrate how absurd the assertion is to begin with), why weren't Japanese women conscripted for the purpose?

I only read the OP, so maybe I'm missing some key information, but it sounds like we're talking about mostly Korean and Chinese women, yes?

Why is it being called 'forced prostitution' instead of 'rape and slavery'?

His position, and that of many others, is that, as of yet, there is no proof that there was a system of "forced prostitution" by the military of Japan.
 

linsivvi

Member
He's saying it must have been necessary for the armed forces (of more countries than just Japan) to utilize prostitution in times of war in order to keep order and prevent rape of the general population.

Those hundreds of thousands of women raped are general population. Also didn't stop them from murdering and raping the general population anyway.

He's saying while Japan is responsible for the war, those atrocities are just part of the war and therefore necessary. He's justifying war crimes.

Stop being such an apologist to everything regarding Japan.

His position, and that of many others, is that, as of yet, there is no proof that there was a system of "forced prostitution" by the military of Japan.

Which is bullshit and anyone who agree with them are deplorable.
 

hey_it's_that_dog

benevolent sexism
His position, and that of many others, is that, as of yet, there is no proof that there was a system of "forced prostitution" by the military of Japan.

Why do historians say otherwise? If anyone has reason to spin, delude themselves, or lie, it's this guy, not historians as a group.
 
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