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[III-V]

Thanks DF for the write up. Looks great.

 

[Canis lupus]

Why isn't MK8 shitted on for having closed tracks? Don't say cuz it's a karting game, Diddy Kong Racing was open world almost 20 years ago.

Reviewing double standards still continue.

 

[c0de]

Why isn't MK8 shitted on for having closed tracks? Don't say cuz it's a karting game, Diddy Kong Racing was open world almost 20 years ago.

Reviewing double standards still continue.

But this is a digital foundry thread and not a review thread?!

 

[Raist]

Stolen from the OT:

Someone should take the time to get tons of footage and see to what extent the cloud patterns are repeated or instead completely "random". Although I guess the devs could answer that.

 

[crazyprac]

As far as my ability to analyse anything at length, well, lets just say that I'm perfectly capable of it, I just reserve it for more worthwhile endeavors than complaining about other people having different expectations or preferences than I do.

 

[Red Chocobo]

I feel sorry for the Project Cars devs.

The poor guys are going to have their great racing game marked down for not being open-world

 

[nkarafo]

Why isn't MK8 shitted on for having closed tracks? Don't say cuz it's a karting game, Diddy Kong Racing was open world almost 20 years ago

The main stages were not "open world", just standard racing circuits. Only the hub world was like what you describe.

 

[Maintenance]

Driveclub can be bad for a number of reasons (hint: I'm not saying that, but other people are), however say that the game looks bad, that's ridiculous.

 

[benny_a]

But this is a digital foundry thread and not a review thread?!

But Digital Foundry has opted to not only discuss the technical analysis of the game but also write about the lack of open world and soul and charisma.

For better or worse, that is the article this thread is based around so you can talk about that without being off-topic.

 

[Amir0x]

I've read a fair bit of what you've said on the matter. Just because you go to lengths to explain yourself doesn't make your 'analysis' any less reactionary or overly defensive.

Which is why instead of explaining how anybody is actually wrong, you just go around and say they're salty. Like I said: a perfect companion to the shitty games journalists that penned these embarrassing statements in many reviews/previews/etc.

As far as my ability to analyse anything at length, well, lets just say that I'm perfectly capable of it, I just reserve it for more worthwhile endeavors than complaining about other people having different expectations or preferences than I do.

Which is why, of course, you're wasting your time continually responding to the people actually putting time and effort to describe the problems with these articles at length with garbage-bin posts like people are "salty." Because you have more worthwhile endeavors.

You're comically transparent bro.

I bought a PS4 last year almost exclusively with the intent of playing Driveclub on it. You're goddamn right I'm going to at least "try" it, lol.

And I agree about not needing to break new ground. If anything I spend most of my time lamenting the death of arcades and old Sega racers. I'd kill for a next-gen Daytona USA or Ridge Racer (5 not Type-4 lol) equivalent.

Haha, well Ridge Racer this is not, gameplay focus aside. I could kill for some rad Ridge Racer drifting action though

 

[Breakfast at Noon]

This line here...



...is just total bullshit. This pervading mentality that open world automatically means better. No, it doesn't. Especially not in a racing game.

*claps*

Indeed.

 

[KidJr]

I think the graphics are generally great but you do get a lot of aliasing in certain circumstances, dashcam on the Evora shows awful aliasing across the front of the vehicle and this is also shown in the windscreen reflections. However the rest of the presentation seems really good to me and hopefully they can improve this edge aliasing with some slight tweaks to their engine.

I expect that as this is meant to be a game the evolves over time any engine improvements that get made will be patched in.

The other question to ask is how much GPU compute is this engine using, with the amount of simulation going on I would expect that there is quite a lot of GPU compute and for a first attempt it seems pretty solid and could be used as a basis for a lot of games to come.

May I ask why you think that it using a lot of GPU compute?

 

[c0de]

Driveclub can be bad for a number of reasons (hint: I'm not saying that, but other people are), however say that the game looks bad, that's ridiculous.

That's why DF didn't say this nor anybody here.

 

[gaming_noob]

Stolen from the OT:

Volumetric cloud effects are awesome.

 

[Jigolo]

Of this trend of lowering the score for a game continues (even though reviewers magically all started on DC for some reason) I won't be able to take any review serious anymore. Is asinine behavior.

 

[dracula_x]

I don't get why Driveclub gets pegged for not being Open-World but Mario Kart 8 doesn't...

Because Nintendo magic.

 

[derExperte]

With a car avatar you just drive. You are not supposed to stay still, you either drive against the clock or opponents. You can't climb mountains and you can't explore the woods. You are restricted on the road, despite having a huge world designed for you. Basically, you can do all these things on a linear/standard racing game. That's why its not worth the extra weight of a big open world.

I quite enjoyed exploring the world and finding ways to get to collectibles in for example Burnout Paradise. Doesn't mean I need it in all my racing games though so that's not meant as a complaint against DC.

 

[Maintenance]

That's why DF didn't say this nor anybody here.

Oh really? Then what's this?

It really isn't a great looking game. I think there is a placebo effect going on where people been thinking it was going to be great look for years that they can't think other wise.

The textures are bad, the lod is bad. No af is horrible.

I was against the game from the start, because I don't like 30fps racers, but even I can't say that this game looks bad, saying that is borderline fanboyish.

 

[mocoworm]

I think it's less of a problem that it's not open world and more of this. Reviewers need to take in to account it doesn't really matter what kind of game they want to play. They need to review the game that they have, and take the positives and negatives of the game. Not add on hypothetical aspects of a game just because you want to play a different game.
There were complaints about how Forza Horizon 2 was open world, and should be more like Forza Motorsport track wise. It's a universal problem with reviewing.

This, 100%.

It's ridiculous.

 

[Drifters]

I'm going to admit that I've yet to play Driveclub (stuck waiting until the 10th), but could you detail what you think makes this the case? Because I'm struggling to see it personally.

What is the point of a driving game of this type? Speed and Immersion. Tack on the fact that this game has the most polished weather and lighting component really seen anywhere I don't get how people are simply dismissing this game as a great user experience.

I don't see it.

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. Not everybody will agree, though.
.

Fair enough.

Stolen from the OT:

Yup... this right here folks.

 

[c0de]

Oh really? Then what's this?



I was against the game from the start, because I don't like 30fps racers, but even I can't say that this game looks bad, saying that is borderline fanboyish.

Oh damn, missed that post. But whatever, this is obviously to be ignored completely. Yes, the game isn't perfectly polished, visible LOD and pop-in but overall looks extraordinary great.

 

[Mr E.]

I feel sorry for the Project Cars devs.

The poor guys are going to have their great racing game marked down for not being open-world

How you know its great?

 

[Red Chocobo]

How you know its great?

Played it.

 

[Mr E.]

Played it.

Good to hear, PS4 version?

 

[thelastcrusader]

Damn no charisma and soul.

Pre-order cancelled.

This made my day. Not open world? No soul? No charisma? WTF do these have anything to do with a fucking racing game?!?

 

[Methamatics101]

the lack of open world exploration and use of fixed tracks may seem a little behind the times

This has to be the dumbest thing I've read in regard to Driveclub.

 

[Loudninja]

Combine finally

 

[Seanspeed]

Which is why instead of explaining how anybody is actually wrong, you just go around and say they're salty.

Yes, because that is the first and only thing I've ever said on the matter.

Which is why, of course, you're wasting your time continually responding to the people actually putting time and effort to describe the problems with these articles at length with garbage-bin posts like people are "salty." Because you have more worthwhile endeavors.

You're comically transparent bro.

I thought we were talking about analysing things *at length*? You're moving the goalposts here now.

Honestly, it doesn't really take any time at all to explain what's happening here, which I've explained already. I suppose if you think quantity of words strengthens an argument, then yes, my view on the subject is mathematically inferior than yours.

Whatever man. I don't want to continue the 'snide response-athon' this is becoming.

 

[mocoworm]

THREADS HAVE BEEN MERGED.

Thank you, ThoseDeafMutes

 

[Mr E.]

This made my day. Not open world? No soul? No charisma? WTF do these have anything to do with a fucking racing game?!?

Gran Turismo has it also apparently. Don't see it my self but it's a Poliphony digital thing.

Last game I played with soul was Sing Star.

 

[jaosobno]

So it's not open world and therefore, it's behind times? What a load of crap. Are all games required to be open world now? Is this some sort of new, bullshit standard?

Most open world games, outside of a few notable exceptions have been bland and boring. The world map is usually littered with meaningless side activities which have a singular role of providing meaningless filler due to developers lack of imagination and original ideas (Assassin's Creed games are probably the worst offenders).

I'd take great "linear racer" over some kind of boring open world mess (like The Crew) any time of day.

 

[Amir0x]

Whatever man. I don't want to continue the 'snide response-athon' this is becoming.

Haha, now you don't want to participate, when you're the one who started down this path with your nonsense salty comment. Hilarious. Thanks for the laughs this morning man, I didn't want it to all be so serious.

 

[Halph n Halph]

Can't wait for the lack of open world exploration criticized in future Fighting Game reviews.

It my biggest criticism of FIFA 15. It just too linear.
On topic .. imo they should have postponed this vs until the weather update rather than re-visit the article at a later date for more analysis.

 

[KingSnake]

What the hell is going on in this thread? The review thread was not enough? I entered here to read comments on the DF analysis and instead there are complains about MK8 not being scored lower because it's not open world? WTF? This is no longer Driveclub, it's Drivenuts. Lol.

 

[Red Chocobo]

Good to hear, PS4 version?

PC. But I hear the PS4 version is near identical. I can't imagine them being much different, apart from the obvious visual benefits for the PC version.

It will be interesting to see if the same reviewers mention lack of open-world in their Project Cars reviews.

 

[justsomeguy]

It my biggest criticism of FIFA 15. It just too linear.
On topic .. imo they should have postponed this vs until the weather update rather than re-visit the article at a later date for more analysis.

haha imagine if you could hoof the ball out the stadium and go play in the car park. That would be

Spoiler

FIFA Street

 

[Brad Grenz]

Remember when reviewers complained about open world racers because they thought it was such a chore to find or restart events? Remember when reviewers complained about racing games having tacky and pointless framing devices that attempt to tie your progress to a terrible story or dumb festival? Remember when hyper-realistic simulation and Burnout crash fest were not the only two acceptable types of racing game?

Pepperidge Farm remembers.

 

[pixlexic]

Oh really? Then what's this?



I was against the game from the start, because I don't like 30fps racers, but even I can't say that this game looks bad, saying that is borderline fanboyish.

I strongly think the opposite. It has a lot of issues people have laughed at other games for having. Bad aliasing, the worst no af I have seen in a long time. Lod that makes grassy hills look like green blobs until you are right on top of them.
The worst is the texture resolution is verybad.


now let's Remember this is suppose to be a technical discussion only not a ... I like it you suck fanboy! Or a ..well its fun.. discussion.

In those terms I think it has the best driving model of any racer in a long time.

There are just some severe graphical flaws that other games have been ripped apart for here.
Like the whole shadows of Mordor texture issue.

 

[ninjablade]

For those who were worried about the image quality when you actually play the game (NinjaBlade).

The low level of anisotropic filtering and FXAA is really killing the potential to show off the game's beauty in screen captures which is a shame for such a beautiful game.

 

[Maintenance]

Bad aliasing, the worst no af I have seen in a long time. Lod that makes grassy hills look like green blobs until you are right on top of them.
The worst is the texture resolution is verybad.


now let's Remember this is suppose to be a technical discussion only not a ... I like it you suck fanboy! Or a ..well its fun.. discussion.

In those terms I think it has the best driving model of any racer in a long time.

I'm guessing you haven't seen Strider or Thief, then. But that's understandable.

 

[Crackbone]

It's not breaking any new ground, but it IS reviving a type of racer that is all but dead in the industry. And it's not like that type of racer died because it was shit or something. These were amongst the best type of racers that ever came out, the pure skill-based no-frill arcade/simcade racers. The question I have is if it's actually good at accomplishing the goals within this barely alive subcategory of racers. For my money, it absolutely does. But, crucially, you don't have to think it does, because it's a legitimate opinion to think it's not that great. It's perfectly appropriate to believe it failed at its goals, which are strictly defined and therefore easy to criticize if there are legitimate issues.

What is not OK is to bring in all sorts of random bullshit, talking about how racers should be, because as a reviewer you're incapable of remembering games that released longer than a month ago, because you have expectations you're inappropriately foisting on a game that has completely different goals, or because you have some daft ideas about open world or upgrades somehow being equivalent of "next gen" or "quality."

Each approach has strengths and weaknesses, and each approach can be done well or poorly. DID DriveClub handle its specific approach to racing poorly? If so, how? When you come from that perspective, criticism can begin to be on the right foot. It does me absolutely no good to read about how much you wish it was open world, because if I wanted a fucking open world racer, I'd play a fucking open world racer. I love Forza Horizon 2, it just came out. Play that shit. This is a different type of racer with different goals. Does it accomplish them well? That is what I want to read.

I am king of negativity. I love hearing people criticize shit, because it means they're wielding a highly effective tool as a consumer. But this shit we've had in like a zillion reviews/previews/articles at this point? It has got to stop. It's embarrassing.

Preach it.

The fact of matter is I haven't played DRIVECLUB yet. However, for whatever reason, many of the reviews in reading stink of not being reviews at all.

This industry, more specifically, the gaming press has become so self important that everything reads like some foolish collection of malcontent every single time.

Quite frankly I'm sick of it. Is the game fun? Does it accomplish what it set out to do? Review a fucking game on the merits.

It's like negatively reviewing poker because it's not a game of blackjack. It's fucked.

 

[MrCookiepants]

This open world criteria in racing games is fucking retarded

Right. Since when was a random bunch of roads better than a tightly designed race track?

Casual racing fans really need to get over their fear of braking.

 

[CyclopsRock]

You guys are flying off the handle about that open-world line and I don't understand why. It came right at the end, after all the actual graphical analysis. It's not like they were saying "Yeah, it looks pretty good for a shitty old school, non-open world antique" or something.

 

[barit]

This has to be the dumbest thing I've read in regard to Driveclub.

It's true. Watch_Dogs is the better driving game because open world /s

 

[T.O.P]

Right. Since when was a random bunch of roads better than a tightly designed race track?

Casual racing fans really need to get over their fear of braking.

Open World = Casual


Got it

 

[Maintenance]

Open World = Casual


Got it

Until they make a Dakar or another open rally simulator, I think so too. It doesn't help that most of the open world games haven't got sim physics, too.

PS: This doesn't mean that I think Driveclub is a sim, it is not.

 

[Steroyd]

I hate the new trend. Why would everything has to be open-world?

Haha yeah, I thought we were over this phase after GTA III came out.

 

[ninjablade]

I strongly think the opposite. It has a lot of issues people have laughed at other games for having. Bad aliasing, the worst no af I have seen in a long time. Lod that makes grassy hills look like green blobs until you are right on top of them.
The worst is the texture resolution is verybad.


now let's Remember this is suppose to be a technical discussion only not a ... I like it you suck fanboy! Or a ..well its fun.. discussion.

In those terms I think it has the best driving model of any racer in a long time.

There are just some severe graphical flaws that other games have been ripped apart for here.
Like the whole shadows of Mordor texture issue.

While i disagree with you about the game looking bad, i think it looks great cause of the amazing lighting. if you post direct feed screens the problems you mention will show up, and that's why if you wanna have a graphical show case for a console, it need's to look amazing in screen captures.

 

[stryke]

What the hell is going on in this thread? The review thread was not enough? I entered here to read comments on the DF analysis and instead there are complains about MK8 not being scored lower because it's not open world? WTF? This is no longer Driveclub, it's Drivenuts. Lol.

And in that DF analysis, it brought up open-world. It's relevant.

 

[Amir0x]

You guys are flying off the handle about that open-world line and I don't understand why. It came right at the end, after all the actual graphical analysis. It's not like they were saying "Yeah, it looks pretty good for a shitty old school, non-open world antique" or something.

People have explained at length what the problem is. The reason people are especially flippant about this specific issue in this topic is because yesterday about a billion articles stated some variation of this same complete fucking bullshit "criticism."

So yea, naturally people are starting to become very sensitive indeed to how much of a problem this is in the field of games "journalism."