Fair enough.
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Microsoft Studios (& Partners) Current and Future Landscape
- Thread starter Banjo-Kazooie
- Start date
Fair enough.
Poodlestrike
Banned
I mean, this is definitely MS' take on it internally. Betting that being the best place to play third party games on a technical and service level is worth more than a strong exclusive lineup this late in the game isn't without sense, but between PS' mindshare advantage and the 499 price point I'm skeptical how well it'll pay off for them.
Nightengale
Member
edit
Nah. The dwarve game is press plays project dwarka. I knew it looked familiar
Vire
Member
They clearly attacked it from the angle that 3rd party games will all look and run better on our system. But I don't think they demonstrated how much the difference will be. The Assassin's Creed demo didn't look demonstrably better than what we have seen before from the series so I am kind of left just shrugging my shoulders.
Incredibly disappointed in the first party offerings. Hoping for new IPs from the first party crew but it seems we will need to wait a while since most of the new ideas got scrapped and put in the trashcan.
Incredibly disappointed in the first party offerings. Hoping for new IPs from the first party crew but it seems we will need to wait a while since most of the new ideas got scrapped and put in the trashcan.
Bits N Pieces
Member
No offence to the game or the developer but this is not what I expect to see on stage at the Xbox E3 press conference, unless its part of an indie montage or sizzle reel.
I really really hope some journalists actually earn their living and question Phil on the goals, roadmap and investment for first party. Cause as an outsider looking in it looks to me that they are coasting to a sell off of the division.
That's not hyperbolic that's just what it looks like. The fall from grace from the 360 to where we are now us heart-breaking.
I'm pretty much a one person console guy, due to time commitments rather than money or anything else and Xbox has me hooked because of Halo and Forza. Never considered jumping ship until now.....
Poodlestrike
Banned
You're a little late to this, but it looks like all three options are getting made. There's gotta be a weird story behind that studio closure lol.
Yeah. I thought, man, we're gonna see them address their first party situation head on this E3. And in a way, they did: they showed that they are wholly uninterested in expanding their first party catalog.
Next year, we will get a big Halo 6 blowout, a new Gears teaser, another Forza game, and that right there already consumes half of the conference. "Xbox is Better than Ever." "Wow there was a much bigger presence of first party this year!" and so on.
They are playing the services game. Games as a service, Xbox as a platform service. Hey, remember 360 games? Here's a backwards compatibility program, a Games Pass program that lets you play as many as you want, and a Games with Gold program that gives you free 360 games every month. And not only that, it's expanding to the original Xbox! Think about that- three different services for one kind of platform, on one console.
If I had to guess, MS blew most of their budget on Xbox One X instead of first party. If they had to make a choice, I suppose they made the right decision, since it is vital they hold on to their market for as long as they can. In the meantime, they can build PR wins with BC compatibility, new dashboard features, doing things Sony isn't really wanting to at the moment (cross console play), etc. Phil can always blast on Twitter with a "hey we hear you guys, we listened to your feedback, and we're definitely going to be sharing this with the Xbox team to bring you exciting announcements for next year!"
They are uninterested in first party development. The times they've had partnerships with studios either ends with those studios going multiplatform (Remedy, Insomniac jumping with Sony on Spider-Man, Playground, Respawn with Titanfall 2), cancellations (Scalebound, Phantom Dust) or something out of their control (Crytek closing or on the verge of closing), or even just poor performance (think we'll ever see Halo Wars 3 after those sales?). Sony has their share of duds too, but they keep pushing forward. We're even getting a Knack 2 for crying out loud. Why doesn't MS want to take the risk with a Sunset Overdrive 2? Oh, because they don't own the IP. Guess they'll let that partnership dry up then! (We didn't even get any "exclusive partnerships" this year, aside from indie and lower budget titles.)
Xbox is not what they once were, but that's entirely the plan. They are moving into the services industry. First party is not a priority aside from their three tentpole franchises, and they're ok with that. I wonder if gamers will be too.
Banjo-Kazooie
Member
Yep, but they are still spending money on publishing duties. Probably paying for the porting costs, cert costs, and obviously marketing support. I know I'm kinda just repeating what you are saying, but just typing it out there for everyone
I actually like that they are helping smaller devs again. Brings me back to the XBLA days of them publishing small games. The situation was different then where studios "needed" them but still
MosquitoSmasher
Member
The picture showing all the Xbox One E3's is really not a good look and if we go by that it's not exactly promising for the future, only seems to get worse now. Which i really hope not. It's really time they put the money where their mouth is, because improving first party has been promising too many times now. I didn't expect much this year, but jesus hopefully next year because when else?
I know establising studios or making deals with third party studios for a new game isn't something that happens overnight. I mean i am not gonna claim i have any insight of that, but surely things need to change for damn sure. I'm sure we'll see plenty of tweets from Phil Spencer this year where he acknowledges the importance of first party. But that's not cutting it anymore.
Yesterday he clearly was very proud of thediverse lineup, all cool and well but most of that were not their own games.
I know establising studios or making deals with third party studios for a new game isn't something that happens overnight. I mean i am not gonna claim i have any insight of that, but surely things need to change for damn sure. I'm sure we'll see plenty of tweets from Phil Spencer this year where he acknowledges the importance of first party. But that's not cutting it anymore.
Yesterday he clearly was very proud of thediverse lineup, all cool and well but most of that were not their own games.
The hell? Sony has 10 or 11 first party studios all working on games for the ps4. Like proper non vr games. Then they have Manchester that is doing vr games
30yearsofhurt
Member
???
Seriously this was the best xbox conference I've seen in terms of games.
I'm a Gran Turismo fanboy so I gravitate towards Playstation but the one thing I really disliked about xbox was that is was too much a 'dudebro' console that catered for CoD, Halo, Gears and Forza. It's always had less variety than Playstation in my eyes.
This conference however had so much more interesting and different stuff this year.
Yes there was too much talking, too much cringey BS and one too many Porsche 911s but I was generally regretful of my impulse XBO S purchase this morning and now I'm actually not. I genuinely don't care for 90% of xbox's first party trash but I'm genuinely eager to see a lot of what was shown today.
Vire
Member
But if you have an Xbox S and Playstation 4, what is the reason to be excited for this conference? Almost every game you saw can be played on a different platform.
Bits N Pieces
Member
This is the intro to the last game shown at the MS conference yesterday, I actually chuckled to myself as Patrick Söderlund was introducing Anthem. Was Phil listening on the sidelines questioning his own decisions and company goals or was he just thinking I hope enough people buy that $499 box?
Im not saying its doomsday for Xbox or the end of the line for the division but if it continues down this path, it 100% will be and I dont think any of us want that.
Where abouts is Creating new studios on the User Voice thing?
digoutyoursoul
Member
I'd be gutted if it did happen but being a fan only goes so far. We don't owe them anything. I'm seeing stuff on my FB with comments such as "we need to keep giving feedback", are the people at Xbox really that ignorant ? Fans have given feedback for years dude, I ask myself is it worth it anymore.
Not telling anyone what to do or what to spend their dollar on, always felt the very best way of showing approval or disproval is voting with the wallet.
30yearsofhurt
Member
Well that's the $64 question. What the fuck does "console launch exclusive" entail?
Otherwise the following are what I'm genuinely interested in:
Player Unknowns Battlegrounds
Deep Rock Galactic (CLE)
The Last Night (CLE)
The Artful Escape (CLE)
Code Vein (CLE)
Sea of Thieves
Super Luckys Tale (CLE)
Ashen (CLE)
Ori and the Will of the Wisp
That's 9 games which is more than double what I currently own on my xbo s.
Incidentally, oh wow, I started listing games that were exclusives but not on your list and wow, you weren't kidding and I can see why you made the choices you did, it's just absurd how many there are, it's well over a hundred, maybe even 200.
Nightengale
Member
timed exclusive.
You do realise creating new studios is not an overnight process look at The Coalition from starting life as Zipline games to releasing their first game 5 years.
Maybe MS Studios is using Global Publishing team to find the right studios which fit in how MS works and build them up from that point.
When Sony has multiple Studios working on multiple IPs at each Studio that is what MS should be striving for. When you watch hardcore Xbox complain that MS are investing in Sea of Thieves and Super Luckys Tale and Ori 2. That is where the issue lies.
Nightengale
Member
The primary reason for my chart in the first place is to identify 2 key things:
1. what are the first-party investments made and outlook in short-long term
2. what are the specific third-party deals done by platform owner
A lot of PlayStation exclusives are there by default because Japanese devs don't believe in Xbox. I don't want to include those games because it's effectively "given for free" to Sony by the virtue of their dominance.
I want the focus to be first-party, with the occasional insight into games that Sony/MS are making clear strategic partnerships with third-party ( like Crash or Tomb Raider )
30yearsofhurt
Member
But for how long???
Excuse me, sir, let's look at something from the list that's on the very same page as your post
Most of what you see on Sony's list is first party...
DriftingSpirit
Member
It varies, but smaller titles don't usually have big stretches of exclusivity.
Nightengale
Member
We don't know.
Some games are one month, some are 3 months, some are 6 months, some are a whole year.
Code Vein's not exclusive at all.
digoutyoursoul
Member
Yes
This is not an overnight problem. This isn't a problem they only recently came across. Why are you giving them the benefit of the doubt when they very clearly expressed where their stance on first party is at the conference?
My annual Xbox first-party (+ lifetime/major 3rd-party timed exclusive) chart that looks specifically at the announcement line-ups, updated with the latest E3 announcements.
Xbox FP 2017 in summary? The emperor has no clothes.
The One was off to such a promising start, and Microsoft finally talked me into buying one of their consoles for the first time. I picked up the Sunset Overdrive bundle under the guise that they were starting to focus more on a wider variety of first party games, new IPs, and exclusives with great games like it, Recore, Quantum Break, Ori, and Cuphead.
But this is looking pretty dire. I really expected them to come out swinging with new games to back up the X, but it seems foolish to me to buy a $500 half-iteration to a console I already own, especially when the only games I have to look forward to are two 2D indie games: Cuphead and Ori 2. (It also doesn't help that I'm not a fan of Gears or Halo, so next year's presumed "big" announcements will fall flat in my eyes.)
The average game company ideally wants to put out 1 piece of hardware, then sell you on various games. That business model makes the most sense.
Microsoft on the other hand wants to put out 1 game, and sell you 3 different pieces of hardware.
Jokingly, yes, that's a bit of an exaggeration, but it's not far from the truth. They basically have what they see as 3 sustainable franchises with Forza, Halo, and Gears. Yet they've released 4 versions of the One: the original, the Elite, the S, and now the X. That logic is so backwards it's insane.
Sony is in the excellent position they are in despite early missteps with the PS3 because they actively pursued developers and acquired talent, even long before that. They lost their early IP, like Crash and Spyro, from the PS1 days, but after that they began to build a solid portfolio. They scooped up quality studios like Naughty Dog, Guerilla, Sucker Punch, and Media Molecule, and have strong bonds with independent developers like Insomniac and Ninja Theory. They constantly look to create new IP. And that's why they are where they are today.
Microsoft really needs to adopt some of that way of thinking.
This makes sense.
Because I have worked for a large multinational company - not in games industry, however, trying to get money from higher ups to fund projects that would lead growth in said company as nigh on impossible.
I appreciate the struggle that Phil and Co. is in. They have a budget to work in set by the CFO of MS.
If they have just been given access to more money for investment of Studios last year, lets say, that increases headcount which costs more longer term costs. If the began the process last year with key individuals - what did you expect them to say a nothing announcement of :
Phil: Hey we have started 2 new studios!
Everyone: What are they working on?
Phil: I don't know.
Being a head in a large company doesn't mean he can spend whatever his division wants. Hence the multiple nostalgia plays of MCC, Rare Replay, BC and this year of OG BC.
Kaji AF16
Member
As weak as Microsoft´s conference was IMHO, and even if the difference in the output of exclusives is almost inarguable at this point, looking at those lists I realized that ultimately I wouldn´t be able to switch to Playstation. Forza alone is more valuable to me than all of Sony´s exclusives.
Of course, there´s also the Xbox ecosystem and my list of friends as strong factors for me to continue playing primarily on my old, fat, launch One.
That said, I still believe that during 2018 this first party barren landscape situation has to be reverted with much more than Halo 6 and Forza Horizon 4 alone.
Of course, there´s also the Xbox ecosystem and my list of friends as strong factors for me to continue playing primarily on my old, fat, launch One.
That said, I still believe that during 2018 this first party barren landscape situation has to be reverted with much more than Halo 6 and Forza Horizon 4 alone.
Yearsoflurking
Member
closing Kinect studios, dismantling Kinect lowerinf expextations of hardware pprbably impacted microsoft for a looong time. they need one of their services to become the next big thing
OrbitalBeard
Member
My annual Xbox first-party (+ lifetime/major 3rd-party timed exclusive) chart that looks specifically at the announcement line-ups, updated with the latest E3 announcements.
Xbox FP 2017 in summary? The emperor has no clothes.
This image is downright sad.
I will give credit where it's due though. The announcement of original Xbox BC and Ori 2 ensures I won't be selling my XB1.
But if I didn't already own one, there is absolutely no way in hell I'd be purchasing an Xbox console anytime soon.
Zvonimir Boban
Banned
Excuse me, sir, let's look at something from the list that's on the very same page as your post
Most of what you see on Sony's list is first party...
Man, 2017 is looking rough for Sony.
I felt it was the weakest one they've had in the Xbone era but it's nice that some people got hyped by it. I'm one of those weirdos who thought MS put on great shows in the first couple of years of this gen so what do I know?
notnow0182
Member
We don't know, but generally timed exclusives are around three months for the most part, especially for indies. If it was a first party AAA sure, but I can wait three months to play an indie game on my PS4.
SEGAvangelist
Member
LOL. He's gonna troll the hell out of this thread once he's back.
MisterR
Member
It's amazing the fall from grace. I've still got my 360 hooked up to the TV and I sold my Xbox One to get a Switch when I realized I was mostly playing 360 games on it.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Doesn't mean he's not a fake insider imo.
We knew they were going to focus on games coming out within the next year. We knew they had too many outstanding projects anyone could of predicted that.
Chobel
Member
Did we? Then why Sneakers got so much shit for saying what he said?
Because, again, that poster was constantly negative and never showed up to participate in conversations where there wasn't an opportunity to express that negativity.
I said it then and ill say it now (and I personally thought MS's E3 was terrible).
Doesn't matter if they are an insider or not.
There is a difference between MS has no games in development apart from the known ones and they aren't going to concentrate on games coming out within the next year.
Doug Heffernan
Member
Idk, I'm kinda convinced Xbox has 0 new IPs in the pipeline and they think they can coast with Halo, Gears, Forza for all eternity.
If ever there was a time to reveal cool new IP, this was the time to do it. I mean Phil had over 3 years to plan for this!
If ever there was a time to reveal cool new IP, this was the time to do it. I mean Phil had over 3 years to plan for this!
More to do with the way he came across than him saying they don't have any games to show.
It was pretty obvious this E3 was going to be light, if I'm honest I didn't expect it to be that light, but I don't think many were expecting MS to go up and announce like 40 AAA's or something.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Because when questioned he either vanished into the aether or berated those who dared doubt his universal but unspecified connections. Which is... Like, not SUPER trustworthy behavior?
He may have been right, but that doesn't make him legit.