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[Aldric]

3D Land and World are NOT a sidescrollers. What's more, there isn't a single 3D game like them. In 2016 they're way more unique than the "new types of platforming games," you speak of. I'd take another completely new form of Mario if they nailed their idea as well as they did the 3D World games.

That said, you know, I do think a new 64 type game is something that should be done at some point.

Obviously they're not literally sidescrollers, but they're clearly built to satisfy fans of this type of platformers at the expense of those who enjoy a more action-adventure style. And there's absolutely nothing unique about them because Wii U already has a plethora of quality 2D precision platformers in its library, without even mentioning other systems and indie games, while Yooka Laylee is the only surviving example of the 64 era platforming template.

 

[TheDinoman]

The 2D Marios, especially the first two NSMB games, have a history of dramatically outselling the 3D installments. The best selling 3D Mario games tend to sell at around 10 million, while the best selling 2D Mario games tend to sell like 20-30 million. The first SMB also sold 40 million although a lot of that was probably because it was a pack-in game with the NES.

I really do love 3D Land and World but they honestly do feel like Nintendo's desperate attempt to get people that primarily buy the 2D Mario games into buying the 3D games. Which I honestly don't think has worked out as well as they hoped, from a sales perspective that is.

 

[tomato shrub]

The 2D Marios, especially the first two NSMB games, have a history of dramatically outselling the 3D installments. The best selling 3D Mario games tend to sell at around 10 million, while the best selling 2D Mario games tend to sell like 20-30 million. The first SMB also sold 40 million although a lot of that was probably because it was pack-in game with the console.

NSMB1 was over a decade ago. The latest Mario games all failed to outsell Galaxy, even on successful hardware like 3DS. I don't understand why Nintendo doesn't want to let go of that formula and style. It's divisive among fans and doesn't seem to pull in people anymore. Thankfully the quote in the OP sounds like they might give the series a similar treatment like Zelda (new people killing tired aspects).

 

[TheDinoman]

NSMB1 was a decade ago. The latest Mario games all failed to outsell Galaxy, even on successful hardware like 3DS. I don't understand why Nintendo doesn't want to let go of that formula and style. It's divisive among fans and doesn't seem to pull in people anymore.

Well, NSMB Wii was about 7 years ago and it sold about 30 million.

I think the problem with the latest NSMB games is that they just don't feel special anymore. NSMB DS was a novelty because it was the first 2D Mario game in like 14 years. NSMBWii also felt special in its own way because it was the first 2D Mario game on a home console in 19 years since SMW and also had much more involved and advanced level design and generally introduced a lot of new crazy concepts not seen in the first game such as four player co-op. NSMB2 and NSMBU kinda just felt like NSMB games for the sake of having NSMB games so I always felt like people caught on to that and stopped caring.

I agree that Nintendo really needs to shake up 2D Mario. Keep some elements from the NSMB like the alformentioned co-op but just spice up the presentation and get rid of the "NEW" in the title.

 

[Acinixys]

Open world Mario?

I.. dont know how I would feel about that

 

[sammyCYBORG]

An open world Mario would basically be the evolution of Mario 64, which is what I've wanted for the last 20 years...

Sunshine kinda scratched the itch but not really.

I love all aspects of Mario, but this would excite me the most.

 

[kromeo]

Bob Hoskins platformer please

 

[TheDinoman]

Bob Hoskins platformer please

It'd be a bit odd to make a game based on somebody who died, but alright.

 

[Nosgotham]

It'd be a bit odd to make a game based on somebody who died, but alright.

did you not get the joke or are you being intentionally obtuse? anyways, ill take a New Super John Leguizamo U!

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Open world Mario?

I.. dont know how I would feel about that

Yeah I really hope this isn't what we get. I have this sneaking suspicion that Ninty might be doubling down on open world.

 

[cyberheater]

VR Mario. The next system has to VR. No way they are missing the boat on this. Except instead of getting an addon, NX will BE VR. I expect Nintendo to go all in with this in a way that will shock and awe.

Yeah. I'd love a SMVR but I can't see Nintendo doing it.
I recently played Luckys Tale in VR and it's astonishing.

 

[SirShandy]

I'm not sure how a 3D platformer like Mario would benefit from being completely open world, but i'm fine with however they structure the world as long as they can keep a high frame rate.

My hope is they borrow the physics playground feel that we got a taste of in Zelda, and go even further with that in cooperation with an extensive move set for Mario.

3D Mario is most memorable when it has that playground sense of experimentation with the environment. It would be great if the new Zelda was any indication of what they might bring to the next Mario in terms of its attention to emergent mechanics.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

They didn't "perfect" anything, they made a game for people who enjoy classic sidescrollers and more or less alienated players who grew up enjoying the new type of platforming games spearheaded by Mario 64. Because for about a decade platformers were synonymous with this sort of design, you can't just ignore this period of gaming history and treat it as some sort of mistake. Look at the success of the Yooka Laylee kickstarter, there's an audience for this type of experience, and it's obvious Nintendo could create something really special if they adopted this design again, let their creativity run free and tried to perfect it.

You mean the people that Nintendo crafted the two highest rated games of all time, back to back, for? Those people? They're 'alienated'?
How about the overwhelming number of people who prefer 2D Mario, or can't understand 3D Mario conventions?
Wouldn't it be sweet if Nintendo sort of just... designed a 3D game, with 2D conventions, to acclimate those people to 3D Mario... so that neither audience remains 'alienated', so that Nintendo could produce their future 3D Mario games for a wider audience?

Obviously they're not literally sidescrollers, but they're clearly built to satisfy fans of this type of platformers at the expense of those who enjoy a more action-adventure style. And there's absolutely nothing unique about them because Wii U already has a plethora of quality 2D precision platformers in its library, without even mentioning other systems and indie games, while Yooka Laylee is the only surviving example of the 64 era platforming template.

I can't think of anything unique about a multiplayer 3D platformer, no sir.

 

[Haines]

I wonder if Nintendo does another "One game only" E3 again next year. Would be interesting to see the feedback if they only brought a single game again after launching a new platform.

No.

In Nintendo's words they do something different each e3.

I expect next year be a different take again. That said e3 itself will be different next year as well.

 

[Ensirius]

Full open-world platform, thanks.

Please Nintendo, listen to this person. Thanks.

 

[BGBW]

Before you get all experimental. Can I have a true sequel to SM64/Galaxy for the NX.

You know. A proper free roaming 3D Mario.

Thanks Nintendo.

I wouldn't really call Galaxy free roaming. If anything Galaxy was the start of their current direction with 3D Mario games. Even more obvious with Galaxy 2.

 

[Hyperactivity]

After BotW at this E3.

My god, I'm going to be blown away. Just something like Galaxy was crazy enough for me

These "new" and "young" people are the best thing to happen to nintendo

Yup

 

[privitsan02]

I hope he has a hands-off approach. Star Fox suffered because of him and Zelda is definitely benefiting without him being around.

Best wishes.

 

[cartman414]

VR Mario. The next system has to VR. No way they are missing the boat on this. Except instead of getting an addon, NX will BE VR. I expect Nintendo to go all in with this in a way that will shock and awe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX2smM87r14

 

[Aldric]

You mean the people that Nintendo crafted the two highest rated games of all time, back to back, for? Those people? They're 'alienated'?
How about the overwhelming number of people who prefer 2D Mario, or can't understand 3D Mario conventions?
Wouldn't it be sweet if Nintendo sort of just... designed a 3D game, with 2D conventions, to acclimate those people to 3D Mario... so that neither audience remains 'alienated', so that Nintendo could produce their future 3D Mario games for a wider audience?

What the hell are you talking about? "Two highest rated games of all time" They're not even the two highest rated Nintendo games, or the two highest rated Marios. And even if they were, it doesn't change the fact they're very controversial among fans and that Nintendo failed in their stated goal of satisfying fans of both 2D and 3D games with them.

And no, it wouldn't be "sweet" if Nintendo cynically tried to appeal to the lowest common denominator because they're somehow not satisfied with 3D Mario games "only" selling twelve and a half million copies at most instead of 30 million. l'll always be amazed how so many people zealously defend that further homogenization of their library. lt doesn't even work as 3D Land didn't sell more than 64 or Galaxy and 3D World is the worst selling 3D entry and completely failed at being a system seller.

 

[Number_6]

Yeah that really needs to come back, so disappointed with how Nintendo has gone backwards in that regard with this series.

As far as changing it, I think going back to Mario 64 and trying to marry the big open hub and large worlds, with some of the detailed platforming of Galaxy and 3D World would be the way to go. Mario has really regressed in terms of presentation and scope since the original Galaxy, so this is a good opportunity to blow it out again.

Nah, man, they sidestepped. Just because they took a different approach from before isn't a regression. 3D world was great fun! Having open world is not necessary/sufficient/equivalent to progress.

The 2D Marios, especially the first two NSMB games, have a history of dramatically outselling the 3D installments. The best selling 3D Mario games tend to sell at around 10 million, while the best selling 2D Mario games tend to sell like 20-30 million. The first SMB also sold 40 million although a lot of that was probably because it was a pack-in game with the NES.

I really do love 3D Land and World but they honestly do feel like Nintendo's desperate attempt to get people that primarily buy the 2D Mario games into buying the 3D games. Which I honestly don't think has worked out as well as they hoped.

I don't know, I thought the idea of a series of tight, focused, and beautiful 3D platforming obstacle courses that you race through like a boss (and explore if you want) was well worth exploring and quite successful in 3D World. Is there another 3D platformer like it? The 2D rush but in 3D.

Larger 3D platform world with exploring are cool too, but they always get slowed down by you having to walk to the fun parts. Someone else compared the experience to walking into a theme park and getting this sense of wonder and excitement. Sure, but I don't like the part where I actually have to walk around in the theme park. Especially if I'm not actually walking but sitting on the damn couch.

 

[Blues1990]

Before you get all experimental. Can I have a true sequel to SM64/Galaxy for the NX.

You know. A proper free roaming 3D Mario.

Thanks Nintendo.

Lately, I'm dreading the idea of any Mario-related project that Miyamoto has a hand with. Especially with his hard-on for experimentation and innovation for the sake of it, which can hamper the overall experience. I hope he can take a more logical approach to implement innovative gameplay mechanics if it actually complements the overall design.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

What the hell are you talking about? "Two highest rated games of all time" They're not even the two highest rated Nintendo games, or the two highest rated Marios. And even if they were, it doesn't change the fact they're very controversial among fans and that Nintendo failed in their stated goal of satisfying fans of both 2D and 3D games with them.

And no, it wouldn't be "sweet" if Nintendo cynically tried to appeal to the lowest common denominator because they're somehow not satisfied with 3D Mario games "only" selling twelve and a half million copies at most instead of 30 million. l'll always be amazed how so many people zealously defend that further homogenization of their library. lt doesn't even work as 3D Land didn't sell more than 64 or Galaxy and 3D World is the worst selling 3D entry and completely failed at being a system seller.

I, uh, let's start over. Try re-reading my post. You should figure out which games I was obviously referring to when I mentioned the 'two highest rated games ever made developed back to back targeting the traditional 3D Mario audience', for one. I meant to imply that it comes off as just a tad bit entitled when you make the case that 3D Mario's fanbase ought to feel alienated by one deviation from the traditional 3D Mario formula (two if you reeeally want to count 3D Land, although I do believe that that game had a much tighter and more focused, platform-appropriate design than 3D World did)... when that same fanbase arguably had it better during the Wii's tenure than literally any other established Nintendo fanbase.

And while there's no way to make twelve million sales for Galaxy not look impressive, it dampens the party a bit when you recall just how many units the Wii sold, and the percentage of Wii owners who were legitimately interested in those two highest rated games of all time, versus the 2D Marios (which they understood) that followed. I'm not defending homogenization, I'm looking forward, because unlike some of you with your worst-case scenarios, I saw 3D Land and World as bridge titles that aren't meant to replace Nintendo's more apparently ambitious 3D Mario titles so much as just acclimate more of the audience to their 3D games, which they clearly prefer to put out (if two back to back 3D Mario platformers developed for the Wii despite that, combined, sold less than the much less expensive to produce NSMB Wii, are any indication). And I don't see the merit in pointing out that 3D Land just BARELY sold less than

- a revolution, the definitive 3D videogame at the time of its release (it's a shame that I have to clarify for you but I'm talking about Mario 64)
- an astoundingly critically accliamed game that debuted on a console that sold over a hundred million units (Galaxy)

(it's also worth noting that 3D World has the highest attach rate of any 3D Mario game. Nearly half of the people who own a Wii U, own 3D World. I associate its relative lack of success more with the fact that Wii U was a failed console than with any perceived lack of appeal.)

Framing that attempt to bridge audiences as 'cynical' as opposed to a measured and reasonable response to New Super Mario Bros' relative dominance is insanely myopic from my point of view.

 

[Claude Augario]

It's really amazing to me to think that 3D world could be "controversial" considering how good it is. Mario fanbase has the opposite problem of the Sonic fanbase - they've got it so good they can't help but shit where they eat because they don't know better and have been spoiled for too long.

 

[Oblivion]

Here's the real question: Why wasn't Mario shown already?

 

[javadoze]

Here's the real question: Why wasn't Mario shown already?

I mean...

...if E3 2016 was only Zelda, that means they gotta dedicate E3 2017 entirely to Mario NX.

Spoiler

I'm half-joking.

 

[TheRed]

That open world Mario, the amount of things to jump over is endless

 

[Menitta]

How do you increase the suffix after Galaxy...

Super Mario Reality.

 

[baxter2231]

Has anyone made a Mario 3rd party joke yet?

 

[WordAssassin]

How do you increase the suffix after Galaxy...

Super Mario Reality.

Given the name of the Wii U we all kind of expected the obvious Super Mario Universe. ):

 

[Chezzymann]

Really hope it's not open world. 64 was my least favorite Mario because of the exploration and collection aspects. I love straight platformers, which is why 3D world is my favorite 3D Mario game.

 

[Vena]

How do you increase the suffix after Galaxy...

Super Mario Reality.

Super Mario Twin-Slit Experiment.

Super Mario Wave-Particle Duality.

Super Mario Cluster.

Super Mario Black Hole.

Super Mario Event Horizon.

Super Mario Non-Euclidean Geometry.

Super Mario Multiverse (or Parallel Worlds Theorem).

Super Mario Universe.

Super Mario Dark Energy.

Super Mario Entropic Heat Death of the Univserse-wahoo!

 

[Icyflamez96]

Mega Mario

 

[Huge Succeeded]

That open world Mario, the amount of things to jump over is endless

See that mountain?

You can jump on it

Mega Mario

This is legitimately what I'd like the next 64-like Mario to be called. Mega Mario Bros. rolls right off the tongue. or just 'Mega Mario World'. although knowing Nintendo they probably wouldn't be able to internally justify that name without centering the game around Mega Mushroom mechanics :/

 

[Mutagenic]

Great. I'd love a completely new take on Mario. I'm guessing this won't release until 2018.

 

[Subpar Spatula]

I want a Mario game that incorporates most if not all different types of Mario games into one: racing, golf, 64, etc.. I think 64 model type game (different worlds with different rules) would be quite fun.

 

[Skux]

Finally, the gritty open world reboot we always wanted.

 

[Calm Mind]

Finally, the gritty open world reboot we always wanted.

Gonna unlock Wario and Waluigi with amiibo and do drive-bys on unsuspecting Toadstools.

 

[Sammy Samusu]

NewGAF best be prepared for the upcoming slayage that will ensue this September.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVNm03nTT30

It will be a mirror of Nintendo 3DS Fall Conference.

- Breath of the Wild, first NX footage
- NX montage revealing both first and third party games
- NX launch plans
- Reveal of Mario NX
- Reveal of Smash Bros 4 NX
- Reveal of Eternal Darkness NX, remaster and sequel
- Reveal of Animal Crossing NX
- Reveal of new Nintendo NX IP aimed at girls/casuals
- Level-5 plans for NX
- Reveal of Fire Emblem Musou NX
- Reveal of Final Fantasy V remake
- Reveal of Resident Evil Outbreak remaster
- Reveal of Monster Hunter 5

 

[SolVanderlyn]

"Yeah, we're doing something."

"What?"

"We'll tell you like next year lol"

 

[Hatty]

Can someone explain to me why people want open world Mario? The 3D games are at their best when the platforming challenges are tight and linear. 64 and Sunshine are the worst 3D Mario games why would going back to that formula be a good idea?

 

[Subpar Spatula]

Can someone explain to me why people want open world Mario? The 3D games are at their best when the platforming challenges are tight and linear. 64 and Sunshine are the worst 3D Mario games why would going back to that formula be a good idea?

MadMaxThisIsBait.gif

 

[SalvaPot]

NewGAF best be prepared for the upcoming slayage that will ensue this September.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVNm03nTT30

It will be a mirror of Nintendo 3DS Fall Conference.

- Breath of the Wild, first NX footage
- NX montage revealing both first and third party games
- NX launch plans
- Reveal of Mario NX
- Reveal of Smash Bros 4 NX
- Reveal of Eternal Darkness NX, remaster and sequel
- Reveal of Animal Crossing NX
- Reveal of new Nintendo NX IP aimed at girls/casuals
- Level-5 plans for NX
- Reveal of Fire Emblem Musou NX
- Reveal of Final Fantasy V remake
- Reveal of Resident Evil Outbreak remaster
- Reveal of Monster Hunter 5

I can't get excited about a Eternal Darkness, tbh. Unless is made by the Fatal Frame team.

 

[Sammy Samusu]

I can't get excited about a Eternal Darkness, tbh. Unless is made by the Fatal Frame team.

Retro Studios.

 

[Sober]

First person, let's do it.

 

[Godzilla's Left Toe]

I, uh, let's start over. Try re-reading my post. You should figure out which games I was obviously referring to when I mentioned the 'two highest rated games ever made developed back to back targeting the traditional 3D Mario audience', for one. I meant to imply that it comes off as just a tad bit entitled when you make the case that 3D Mario's fanbase ought to feel alienated by one deviation from the traditional 3D Mario formula (two if you reeeally want to count 3D Land, although I do believe that that game had a much tighter and more focused, platform-appropriate design than 3D World did)... when that same fanbase arguably had it better during the Wii's tenure than literally any other established Nintendo fanbase.

And while there's no way to make twelve million sales for Galaxy not look impressive, it dampens the party a bit when you recall just how many units the Wii sold, and the percentage of Wii owners who were legitimately interested in those two highest rated games of all time, versus the 2D Marios (which they understood) that followed. I'm not defending homogenization, I'm looking forward, because unlike some of you with your worst-case scenarios, I saw 3D Land and World as bridge titles that aren't meant to replace Nintendo's more apparently ambitious 3D Mario titles so much as just acclimate more of the audience to their 3D games, which they clearly prefer to put out (if two back to back 3D Mario platformers developed for the Wii despite that, combined, sold less than the much less expensive to produce NSMB Wii, are any indication). And I don't see the merit in pointing out that 3D Land just BARELY sold less than

- a revolution, the definitive 3D videogame at the time of its release (it's a shame that I have to clarify for you but I'm talking about Mario 64)
- an astoundingly critically accliamed game that debuted on a console that sold over a hundred million units (Galaxy)

(it's also worth noting that 3D World has the highest attach rate of any 3D Mario game. Nearly half of the people who own a Wii U, own 3D World. I associate its relative lack of success more with the fact that Wii U was a failed console than with any perceived lack of appeal.)

Framing that attempt to bridge audiences as 'cynical' as opposed to a measured and reasonable response to New Super Mario Bros' relative dominance is insanely myopic from my point of view.

The game was bundled with the console for a good year in NA.

 

[JavyOO7]

I thought 3D Land/World were excellent. I'd love a sequel.

 

[Huge Succeeded]

The game was bundled with the console for a good year in NA.

So were Sunshine and 64.

 

[EatinOlives]

Before you get all experimental. Can I have a true sequel to SM64/Galaxy for the NX.

You know. A proper free roaming 3D Mario.

Thanks Nintendo.

Wut.

Galaxy wasn't free-roam. In fact, Galaxy was used pretty plainly as the template for 3D Land/World.

 

[.JayZii]

Super Maria Sisters NX