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[heidern]

I'd guess they'll go for Wii U level graphics(maybe a bit more) but in 3D at either 540p or 720p. So would that be around 200-400 GF?

 

[AzaK]

Alright, time, to step back. Emily clarified her position on Twitter that her "close to XB1 but that's a stretch" comment was saying that it's weaker than XB1 and that calling it close to XB1 is a stretch. Also, 4SMs would mean a chip nearly twice as large as the X1, which is way too big for a portable device. Let's just get back into reality, people.

Ahhh but what if there's 2 SMS in the handheld and 2 in the doc?

I agree though, this is getting out of hand. If NX hits >1TF I will change my name by deed poll to 'Nintendo is best' and wear nothing but Nintendo Cosplay for the rest of my life. I'll also play every JRPG on the thing.

 

[Eolz]

But it doesn't add up with Eurogamer's report about it having the Tegra X1 in the devkits. Then again we have no idea how long ago that was and things could have changed. Let's hope we hear it soon because I am pretty much done with these rumors.

They had overclocked X1 with active cooling (fans) in the devkit. It would never work in an handheld without some serious customization.

 

[Cerium]

But it doesn't add up with Eurogamer's report about it having the Tegra X1 in the devkits.

This has been covered many times even in the Eurogamer thread; the fact that the X1s in the devkit are active cooled and have loud fans implies that they're being overclocked, which in turn implies that they are placeholders for something more advanced.

 

[frankie_baby]

Another question I have: why do people just expect Nvidia to take a loss on these chips? Is that something they're known to do? Because that seems to be the only way people are reconciling this whole cheap AND
Uber powerful
Brand new architecture
Super efficient

Chipset thing.

They were basically out of the console market and out of it for a long time to come so its not inconceivable they'd take a "small" loss on this if it meant giving some volume to its tegra chip line

 

[maxcriden]

Streaming tech has been on the money and it points to how they see their platform.

Also the SOC makes it a hybrid when any leaker starts talking about any architecture designs that are more like a typical mobo give me a call and real details haven't seen it once.

Thanks for your insightful post as always. Can I humbly ask you to clarify these two statements? I'm a bit of a tech luddite so I wasn't sure I grasped their meaning in re: NX.

But it doesn't add up with Eurogamer's report about it having the Tegra X1 in the devkits. Then again we have no idea how long ago that was and things could have changed. Let's hope we hear it soon because I am pretty much done with these rumors.

I believe Eurogamer/DF said it had X1 tentatively in the devkits but indicated that it might be a placeholder, given overclocking happening in devkits.

Edit: sorry, I see this was covered above.

 

[MuchoMalo]

Ahhh but what if there's 2 SMS in the handheld and 2 in the doc?

I agree though, this is getting out of hand. If NX hits >1TF I will change my name by deed poll to 'Nintendo is best' and wear nothing but Nintendo Cosplay for the rest of my life. I'll also play every JRPG on the thing.

The funny thing is that Tegra-Next is capable of something like this. If Nintendo were truly committed to making a hybrid and not just a handheld that console players can still enjoy, they'd toss a 20-40W GPU into the dock. But no, they're just going to make a handheld with a TV dock and call it a hybrid.


By the way everyone, Charlie from SemiAccurate is an extreme Nvidia hater and the least professional tech writer you'll ever meet. I wouldn't put any stock into his reasoning for Nvidia making the deal.

 

[Übermatik]

Are you implying this leak was controlled? Cuz if so that blows my mind. Didn't think Nintendo did stuff like that.

I'm not sure 'controlled leak' would be the right term to use here... Nintendo have just likely been more flexible with sharing their information. The timing is right. Siggraph has been on this past week, Nvidia are due for a keynote in August, there's Hot Chips happening, and info has begun rolling out of major developers on support for NX. Maybe a more finalised dev kit just hit the floor, who knows.
What this DOES show, however, is that Nintendo have their finger on the industry pulse more than ever... And this is extremely promising. I think a partnership with Nvidia is exactly what they needed to kickstart the NX presence.

 

[Fat4all]

I'm wondering, it seems like the mobile games the system will play would be Nintendo games and select third-party games and apps, what are the odds they go for having a sort or shared catalogue, or small partnership with Apple to bring the iOS app store to the NX?

Or maybe they could work out a sort of curation system that would allow people who already own specific games on the iOS store to get their game profiles and progress for free on the NX.

My worry with the mobile side of the NX is a lack of software being supported. I'm not very familiar with how DeNA handles their mobile stuff over in Japan when it comes to a catalogue that would appeal to western mobile game users.

 

[weepy]

So potentially how much more powerful could the NX be than the WiiU with this custom chip set? Is it just going to be a portable WiiU/ a WiiU that could do 1080p? Or, could there be noticeable differences in performance between NX games and WiiU games? What I'm really asking is: should I keep my WiiU to play Zelda BotW?

 

[Daphnes Nohansen Hyrule]

I am super confident in this partnership between Nintendo and Nvidia, can´t wait for the reveal in September!!

 

[tronic307]

Just answer me this, more units=more expensive for Nintendo? If so, we have the answer right here

Now, would that be enough for Jen-Hsun Huang to brag about?

 

[Regginator]

So potentially how much more powerful could the NX be than the WiiU with this custom chip set? Is it just going to be a portable WiiU/ a WiiU that could do 1080p? Or, could there be noticeable differences in performance between NX games and WiiU games? What I'm really asking is: should I keep my WiiU to play Zelda BotW?

Way too soon to ask, since it's all speculations now and no confirmations whatsoever. Also, I doubt Nintendo is going to make the NX version of BotW significantly better. For their own PR I think they're probably opting for graphics parity for the most part (expect maybe resolution at 1080p instead of 720). I wouldn't expect a massive overhaul.

Nevertheless, if the NX turns out to have backwards compatibility with the Wii U (according to the latest rumours it won't have BC), I'll sell my Wii U as fast as you can sing happy birthday.

 

[MuchoMalo]

I'm wondering, it seems like the mobile games the system will play would be Nintendo games and select third-party games and apps, what are the odds they go for having a sort or shared catalogue, or small partnership with Apple to bring the iOS app store to the NX?

Or maybe they could work out a sort of curation system that would allow people who already own specific games on the iOS store to get their game profiles and progress for free on the NX.

My worry with the mobile side of the NX is a lack of software being supported. I'm not very familiar with how DeNA handles their mobile stuff over in Japan when it comes to a catalogue that would appeal to western mobile game users.

Not a chance. It wouldn't even work because the games would need to be ported.

 

[Fat4all]

Not a chance. It wouldn't even work because the games would need to be ported.

But apparently the system will be compatible with the iOS and Android Nintendo made games (like Pokemon GO), so perhaps it will be a simpler process to do.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

NX is getting more exciting by the day.

 

[LCGeek]

The thing is, if we're assuming Pascal that alone means that Nintendo's stepping out of their comfort zone tech-wise. All bets are off. Typical Nintendo would be using a K1-based SoC. Thus, I feel very safe in my estimations. I don't see the GPU being slower than 2 SMs @500MHz.

Also, if this really is a controlled leak I think that Nintendo might go public with specs this time.

Tech wise I never say that they were blending chips with the first NES and did better job than anyone besides sega until sony started entered the industry. Sony no longer does their own stuff they just blend what they feel is a good idea along with a solid api/os.

They maybe low spec but they get performance easily of any company when it comes to fps. This is no joke but they are the FPS masters. I cannot think of any company that spends the time on 60fps or consistently having good frame pacing. Sure they don't make lookers but plenty of titles on console or pc are proof that's not an easy feat even when a game is simplistic looking. Not only that they go through same effort with their own hardware being friendly towards that with very little effort placed on a developers in comparison to other consoles or the pc with windows. WiiU is less powerful than this thing which shows how quick mobiles have caught up in the last decade or generation alone. I don't see them going all out but at this point in gaming it's not a requirement for console or mobile devices. The people above engineers are why nintendo ended up where they did, even with iwata. Now that they have had enough or seemingly enough for now we get something that is potent.

 

[BY2K]

NX is getting more exciting by the day.

And then it's revealed and every rumor was wrong and it sucks and it's the Wii U all over again.

Fool me once...

 

[James Scott]

I'd guess they'll go for Wii U level graphics(maybe a bit more) but in 3D at either 540p or 720p. So would that be around 200-400 GF?

I highly doubt they'll go back to 3D

 

[Cerium]

So potentially how much more powerful could the NX be than the WiiU with this custom chip set? Is it just going to be a portable WiiU/ a WiiU that could do 1080p? Or, could there be noticeable differences in performance between NX games and WiiU games? What I'm really asking is: should I keep my WiiU to play Zelda BotW?

If the rumors are true and if the GPU performs equivalent to an X1 or better we're looking at maybe 2x to 3x the power of a WiiU in handheld form.

 

[Tatsumi Oga]

They had overclocked X1 with active cooling (fans) in the devkit. It would never work in an handheld without some serious customization.

This has been covered many times even in the Eurogamer thread; the fact that the X1s in the devkit are active cooled and have loud fans implies that they're being overclocked, which in turn implies that they are placeholders for something more advanced.

That's good news for sure then. I admit that I didn't read the full report of Eurogamer.

 

[jdstorm]

Thank you. I just didn't know if that meant it would be more comparable to an XB1 or something in power than a Wii U.

I really know/understand very little of the tech side, so I often ask for these sorts of things in layman's terms. Maybe I'm on the extreme luddite side of layman, but for me just knowing it's the newest architecture isn't dumbed down enough for me to really understand what this means on the consumer end.



Ahh, I see. Thank you.

I'm also a layman. Basically the talk of 16/14nm Finfet and Pascal is about advances in architecture. It doesn't tell you much about the specific chip.
For instance the Nvidia pascal Titan X is all of those things. It's pumping 11 Tflps at a factory clock speed (roughly 3x Microsofts Scorpio console) and will retail for around 1000USD.

Basically handhelds are limited by battery life and heat. The newer pascal architecture is more power efficient. So in practice it means you get more power for the same battery life as a chip built on an older architecture like maxwell.

Optimistically people are predicting the Pascal Tegra to be roughly 2/3rds of an Xbox one while running on battery. (With good battery life)
When Plugged into mains power/docked that is likely to improve. Perhaps even double which would put the NX handheld about halfway between an Xbox one and PS4

 

[Eolz]

But apparently the system will be compatible with the iOS and Android Nintendo made games (like Pokemon GO), so perhaps it will be a simpler process to do.

Pokemon Go isn't a Nintendo made game and wouldn't really work (need gps, AR, etc). So that would be Miitomo, Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem, etc (which shouldn't need gps for example).
If they are indeed playable there, it'll be because Nintendo would have ported them from the start, unlike developers that will have to port them again.

If games are ported anyway (easily or not), it'll be based on Android versions. Doing ports from/to ios is a nightmare compared to android, most devs will tell you that.

 

[Fat4all]

Pokemon Go isn't a Nintendo made game and wouldn't really work (need gps, AR, etc). So that would be Miitomo, Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem, etc (which shouldn't need gps for example).
If they are indeed playable there, it'll be because Nintendo would have ported them from the start, unlike developers that will have to port them again.

If games are ported anyway (easily or not), it'll be based on Android versions. Doing ports from/to ios is a nightmare compared to android, most devs will tell you that.

Fair enough.

 

[Schnozberry]

NX is getting more exciting by the day.

Especially when people take one tiny thread of information and build skyscraper worth of expectations on top of it.

Based on what LCGeek and NateDrake are saying, I think there's reason to be optimistic about NX being reasonably powerful for it's power envelope, which is great news. People throwing around ridiculous numbers and clock speeds in "tales from my ass" fasion will be disappointed, as always.

I'm most curious about Breath of the Wild. If it looks even better than the Wii U version in my pocket I will be on board for day one.

 

[James Scott]

But apparently the system will be compatible with the iOS and Android Nintendo made games (like Pokemon GO), so perhaps it will be a simpler process to do.

I don't think the WSJ means that. I'm pretty sure it means that you can use data from Nintendo mobile games on NX like Miitomo clothes passing over to MiiMaker

 

[The Last One]

Nintendo GAF is crazy af

People are already making assumptions on the dock and non-dock power difference.

We have nothing that suggest the dock thing will have its own "brain"; and to see people expecting a 1 TFLOP handheld device... FROM NINTENDO...

lmao

The hype is kicking, for sure

 

["D"]

Can someone basically summarize what's so great about Nintendo possibly using Nvidia's Pascal GPU?

 

[BorkBork]

Another question I have: why do people just expect Nvidia to take a loss on these chips? Is that something they're known to do? Because that seems to be the only way people are reconciling this whole cheap AND
Uber powerful
Brand new architecture
Super efficient

Chipset thing.

Theory from an older thread for why Nvidia is willing to take a loss.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Tegra X1 is already a 512 GFlops chip.

Yes I expect X2 to minimum double that with NX in docked mode.

BTW I'm talking about FP32 because Tegra X1 is 1 TFlops in FP16 if Nintendo wishes to programing using half-precision.

I love that we've basically already established that 'docked mode' is a thing when it's just as likely that the dock is just nothing more than a TV-out.

And it's only what, day two? Shit's going crazy.

 

[heidern]

I highly doubt they'll go back to 3D

Go back? They never left, their last hardware release was the New 3DS which offered improved 3D(or to be more accurate 3D that's not broken). It would help keep development costs and times down.

 

[MuchoMalo]

But apparently the system will be compatible with the iOS and Android Nintendo made games (like Pokemon GO), so perhaps it will be a simpler process to do.

Yes, because Nintendo will port them. They aren't going to port every iOS game ever made.

Tech wise I never say that they were blending chips with the first NES and did better job than anyone besides sega until sony started entered the industry. Sony no longer does their own stuff they just blend what they feel is a good idea along with a solid api/os.

They maybe low spec but they get performance easily of any company when it comes to fps. This is no joke but they are the FPS masters. I cannot think of any company that spends the time on 60fps or consistently having good frame pacing. Sure they don't make lookers but plenty of titles on console or pc are proof that's not an easy feat even when a game is simplistic looking. Not only that they go through same effort with their own hardware being friendly towards that with very little effort placed on a developers in comparison to other consoles or the pc with windows. WiiU is less powerful than this thing which shows how quick mobiles have caught up in the last decade or generation alone. I don't see them going all out but at this point in gaming it's not a requirement for console or mobile devices. The people above engineers are why nintendo ended up where they did, even with iwata. Now that they have had enough or seemingly enough for now we get something that is potent.

This is all true, but I'm still cautiously optimistic that this will be the machine I was hoping for in 2012.

I love that we've basically already established that 'docked mode' is a thing when it's just as likely that the dock is just nothing more than a TV-out.

And it's only what, day two? Shit's going crazy.

It's because there's apparently active cooling going on. I'm not expecting a fan in a handheld. I also feel like Nintendo isn't going to want to limit the thing to only being able to render at the screen's resolution.

 

[Cerium]

[QUOTE="D";211876824]Can someone basically summarize what's so great about Nintendo possibly using Nvidia's Pascal GPU?[/QUOTE]

It's unreleased "next generation" mobile GPU tech that is significantly more efficient than the existing Maxwell architecture. This opens the possibility of getting more performance from the same amount of power consumption.

That doesn't tell us how powerful it is, but either battery life or graphics are going to be significantly better.

 

[Eolz]

[QUOTE="D";211876824]Can someone basically summarize what's so great about Nintendo possibly using Nvidia's Pascal GPU?[/QUOTE]

It's a good architecture and means they won't have an outdated one.
Nothing else until we know more. Doesn't say anything about the power.

 

[James Scott]

Go back? They never left, their last hardware release was the New 3DS which offered improved 3D(or to be more accurate 3D that's not broken). It would help keep development costs and times down.

A higher res 3D screen is probably very expensive and consumes a lot of power (why many 3DS games ran at half the FPS in 3D mode)
it's not worth it.

 

[Ganondolf]

I love that we've basically already established that 'docked mode' is a thing when it's just as likely that the dock is just nothing more than a TV-out.

And it's only what, day two? Shit's going crazy.

When people are talking about docked mode they are assuming that battery constraints are removed and the chip can run at full speed which can be achieved with a basic tv out dock

 

[Calm Mind]

"A number of factors..." Like how much bullshit I can get away with posting on Twitter without having it blow up in my face.

You are why we can't have nice things.

 

[majik13]

Nintendo GAF is crazy af

People are already making assumptions on the dock and non-dock power difference.

We have nothing that suggest the dock thing will have its own "brain"; and to see people expecting a 1 TFLOP handheld device... FROM NINTENDO...

lmao

The hype is kicking, for sure

I dont think its a 'brain' or any extra horsepower in the dock. Its more that since while in the dock, and not restrained by a battery or no fan/heatsink, it might unlock the higher clockspeed of the chip already in the device. All theoretical though. And possible wishful thinking...

 

[Enduin]

Nintendo GAF is crazy af

People are already making assumptions on the dock and non-dock power difference.

We have nothing that suggest the dock thing will have its own "brain"; and to see people expecting a 1 TFLOP handheld device... FROM NINTENDO...

lmao

The hype is kicking, for sure

Pretty sure most people don't expect the dock to be anything, they're speculating whether the chipset will have different performance profiles for when it is on battery verse plugged into the wall.

When used as a handheld it can be downclocked and or have some cores turned off in order to conserve power. Then when plugged in those cores can run at full speed and on. Thus increasing the performance of the system as a console.

 

[mrklaw]

Still not sure about the idea of having the touch screen docked where you can't use it. Seems counter productive and means no games can really on touch controls

 

[jdstorm]

I love that we've basically already established that 'docked mode' is a thing when it's just as likely that the dock is just nothing more than a TV-out.

And it's only what, day two? Shit's going crazy.

To most reasonable people "docked mode" means increasing the clock speed of the NX's GPU in a turbo boost type mode. Since battery life isn't a concern when it's plugged into the mains. This is industry standard technology and exists practically everywhere.

 

[Hoo-doo]

When people are talking about docked mode they are assuming that battery constraints are removed and the chip can run at full speed which can be achieved with a basic tv out dock

Yes, I can see how it's possible.

But there are heat considerations, plus you're now basically having to create games for two separate specs. I don't see Nintendo going for that at all. They'd sooner go with complete parity.

To most reasonable people "docked mode" means increasing the clock speed of the NX's GPU in a turbo boost type mode. Since battery life isn't a concern when it's plugged into the mains. This is industry standard technology and exists practically everywhere.

Why don't current handhelds have this? Or phones? Or tablets?

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

And then it's revealed and every rumor was wrong and it sucks and it's the Wii U all over again.

Fool me once...

You put whoopee cushions on every chair at weddings.

 

[BDGAME]

I'd guess they'll go for Wii U level graphics(maybe a bit more) but in 3D at either 540p or 720p. So would that be around 200-400 GF?

They are using a chipset that can run Unreal Engine 4. Why be limited for Wii U if they can do more?

 

[The Boat]

Pokemon Go isn't a Nintendo made game and wouldn't really work (need gps, AR, etc). So that would be Miitomo, Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem, etc (which shouldn't need gps for example).
If they are indeed playable there, it'll be because Nintendo would have ported them from the start, unlike developers that will have to port them again.

If games are ported anyway (easily or not), it'll be based on Android versions. Doing ports from/to ios is a nightmare compared to android, most devs will tell you that.

If NX had 4G and GPS (don't think it will) it would be perfectly plausible for Pokemon Go to come out.

 

[Neoxon]

I love that we've basically already established that 'docked mode' is a thing when it's just as likely that the dock is just nothing more than a TV-out.

And it's only what, day two? Shit's going crazy.

Well battery life won't be an issue when docked, so it'll likely allow the NX to run at full speed.

 

[KingSnake]

I can already see Jen-Hsun Huang presenting the NX

"Nvidia worked hard to make this possible, and with Nintendo, we wanted to do something new and groundbreaking. Given the power envelope a lot of you will think 'it's impossible to make a chip capable of delivering next gen graphics with such power envelope'. Well, in Nvidia, we like to make impossible things happen, and, we proudly present you the new Tegra NX, based on our latest and revolutionary architecture, Pascal. Coupled with our latest Denver ARM cores. You won't believe what your eyes are seeing, and your mouth will hit the floor when I tell you we were capable of producing a handheld device with 1TF of power on the go. Yes, I'm not lying, 1TF of FP32 on the go. So, instead of more chit chat, I'll show you what the new Nintendo NX is capable of"

If they don't get Jen-Hsun Huang to speak at NX reveal they are crazy. That man can sell twice as much devices at launch with one speech.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

How is the battery life on the Shield?

 

[Eolz]

If NX had 4G and GPS (don't think it will) it would be perfectly plausible for Pokemon Go to come out.

I agree, but Nintendo isn't stupid on this side. They're not making the Vita's mistakes, better wifi and other improvements will be well enough for them.
edit: I'm sure it'll have some sort of camera/sensors though, whether it's facing the user or not. WiiU/3DS had those.

 

[Oregano]

Yes, I can see how it's possible.

But there are heat considerations, plus you're now basically having to create games for two separate specs. I don't see Nintendo going for that at all. They'd sooner go with complete parity.



Why don't current handhelds have this? Or phones? Or tablets?

Both of those things already happen to an extent. Some 3DS games run better on N3DS and the 3DS can be brighter when plugged in.

Also developers are going to be developing to two different specs for MS and Sony so it's not a stretch Nintendo will take a similar approach.