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[blue_phazon]

I'm sorry, but this is utter nonsense. The idea that halo had reached its potential is just a defeatist argument. There are always ways to improve.

Ofcourse Halo could have done things to maintain its popularity- but the changes made for Reach and Halo 4 were not it.

Sure, ADS, loadouts and sprint are 'modern'- but that's because games with other mechanics failed to deliver desirable systems around their own mechanics- not because those mechanics are inferior or out of style. You are making the mistake of assuming correlation equals causation.

COD 2 had sprint and ADS and Loadouts. The 'improvements' between then and Blops2 were in the overall package, not the mechanics themselves.

It's absolutely ridiculous to suggest that halo couldn't include compelling innovations without straying from its core formula. H2s matchmaking was such an innovation. Forge was such an innovation. Firefight was such an innovation.

From Reach onward, halo developers stopped innovating and started following. Meanwhile halo's competitors made their existing formulas more palletable.

In 2010-2012 A destiny-styled co-op RPG mode to accompany the standard Halo campaign and pvp suite would have been a massive success w/o requiring the dev to sacrifice the core gameplay. It would have been an innovation. Instead they released games that simple changed to less desirable formulas for Halo.

Yup. Halo could have innovated in creative game modes, or even changing the structure of the campaign.

What if the campaign had interconnected online elements? What if it was a metroid-esque game where you gradually gain the Spartan abilities to explore areas you couldn't get to yet, and there was an emphasis on huge boss battles with actual mechanics instead of "shoot the thing in the back until it dies"

Spoiler

Okay truth be told I just want a new metroid prime game, but STILL.

I think the biggest innovation Halo 5 made was warzone, since I haven't seen a gamemode that combined pve with pvp which was cool. The issue is that Halo 5 had a million other problems and bad press, that people didn't really notice or care.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Makes sense. hopefully this means 343 doubles down on the MT and makes them better. REQ packs became a hassle in regards to managing your collection and slowing down the game with the server calls.

Hopefully this also means we get a longer full support cycle and more rapid integration of user content.

 

[Orochinagis]

Do halo 5 get new maps in response then?

 

[Andodalf]

Do halo 5 get new maps in response then?

Yeah, several maps, modes, weapons, enemies, game types, huge forge updates, and a PC forge.

 

[RichiRamjag]

Do halo 5 get new maps in response then?

You'll get forge and you'll like it. What a racket.

Yeah, the BTB neglect really soured me. It came late and they couldn't even release one dev map for it. Furthermore, when they released some more maps months later. They had frame rate issues that took them months to fix. Also BR starts is just shit, it should be pistol starts. However, 343i doesn't even want to test it. When the community map makers made the maps they said they were designed for pistol starts. However, 343i is like fuck that we know better than the community, BR starts!

343i didn't give a shit about BTB in H5. I mean why should they? They are making money from WZ.

That's what I'm saying. Drop BRs for a week and at least see how it plays out. A lot of these maps actually seem designed for pistol starts.

(Also put a damn cool down on banshee flips already and take wasps out)

 

[Complicated]

Every game you listed was around back then. Halo just became less competitive against those franchises. They improved while halo regressed.

People used to play halo AND those games. Now many of those people skip halo.

CoD and GTA have definitely gotten worse as far as multiplayer goes. The discussion was never really about quality though. Every other game got more accessible while Halo stayed the same skill-based shooter it has been. Everything else has killstreaks, tons of auto-aim, low TTK, and support characters/classes for low-skill players to latch onto and feel like they can contribute. If Halo tried any of that it wouldn't be Halo anymore and everyone would lose their minds. Halo 5 is just what a successful Halo game looks like in 2015-2017. A lot of people just have a hard time accepting that, or are railing against 343/MS for other dumber reasons.

 

[VincentMatts]

CoD and GTA have definitely gotten worse as far as multiplayer goes. The discussion was never really about quality though. Every other game got more accessible while Halo stayed the same skill-based shooter it has been. Everything else has killstreaks, tons of auto-aim, low TTK, and support characters/classes for low-skill players to latch onto and feel like they can contribute. If Halo tried any of that it wouldn't be Halo anymore and everyone would lose their minds. Halo 5 is just what a successful Halo game looks like in 2015-2017. A lot of people just have a hard time accepting that, or are railing against 343/MS for other dumber reasons.

Exactly. Totally agree with you. And halo did try that with 4, and everyone did lose their minds.

 

[ethomaz]

There is any * in Patcher words? Because it feels like bullshit.

i read this often, but what are the numbers?
what leaderboards?
what are those numbers for Halo 5 in comparison


i do believe people vastly overestimate player retention for those old games.

this does not look like a good and growing player retention rate

Using Halo 4 graphs to prove somebody wrong about Halo 2 and Halo 3.

You will be surprised when you see a Halo 3 graph

 

[Theorry]

Nice. Support has been great because of it and free.

 

[legacyzero]

I've given them so much money for this. It all feels really meta, which feels fun, and the base isn't split.

Wish they'd gimme my GODDAMN HALO 2 BR though

 

[ethomaz]

The numbers are in peoples imagination and nostalgia lenses.

Halo 3 tanked soon after COD4 came out (understandably). It wasn't long after H3 came out.

What? Halo 3 was the most played game in Live years after release... ahead CoD... it sold more than CoD4 even after it release.

Most people didn't know I guess but...

Halo 3 > Any CoD on 360

No CoD on 360 sold more than Halo 3.

 

[Trup1aya]

Yup. Halo could have innovated in creative game modes, or even changing the structure of the campaign.

What if the campaign had interconnected online elements? What if it was a metroid-esque game where you gradually gain the Spartan abilities to explore areas you couldn't get to yet, and there was an emphasis on huge boss battles with actual mechanics instead of "shoot the thing in the back until it dies"

Spoiler

Okay truth be told I just want a new metroid prime game, but STILL.

I think the biggest innovation Halo 5 made was warzone, since I haven't seen a gamemode that combined pve with pvp which was cool. The issue is that Halo 5 had a million other problems and bad press, that people didn't really notice or care.

This.

I find it eternally annoying that halo was simply the victim of its mechanics getting old or too much competion.

Every single popular Franchise was subject to the same rising competition, and many of them have mechanics that pre-date Halo's classic formula. The only difference is that these other franchises and Halo is wrapped compelling games around their mechanics, while halo simply changed their mechanics.

You see the same things happening with COD. Rather than innovating, they'd begun to simply change their mechanics, and the market as been increasingly down on them. Excitement is building around WWII because it appears to be a fresh take on the classic formula.

Battlefield as learned similar lessons. Battlefield 3 was previously the series peak. Battlefield 4, had launch issues, but was roughly flat sales wise. Battlefield hardline just changed the formula, and the market responded extremely negatively. They response was BF1 (a Fresh take on the classic formula) and it's been a tremendous success.

 

[Synth]

Apologies for cutting down the replies a bit... I don't want to spend forever replying to each part of each post in detail when multiple people are responding back. It just begins to get too long eventually.

I'm sorry, but this is utter nonsense. The idea that halo had reached its potential is just a defeatist argument. There are always ways to improve.

Ofcourse Halo could have done things to maintain its popularity- but the changes made for Reach and Halo 4 were not it.

I keep saying that I'm not claiming Halo couldn't do anything to maintain its popularity... I'm saying that those things may well have been what the other games actually did (just before they did them obviously). As for the line you bolded...that wasn't to say Halo could be no better, simply that an amazing game has less ability to rapidly improve than a decent game. Mario 64 had less room for improvement than Sonic Adventure, regardless of how much actual improvement each made. If the next 3D Sonic had been on par with Mario Galaxy, pointing to where Sonic Adventure was compared to Mario 64 was is meaningless.

In 2010-2012 A destiny-styled co-op mode to accompany the standard Halo campaign and pvp suite would have been a massive success w/o requiring the dev to sacrifice the core gameplay. It would have been an innovation. Instead they released games that simple changed to less desirable formulas for Halo.

But Destiny doesn't split its single and multiplayer aspects, and that's core to its success, in comparison to something like Warzone being completely separate to Halos campaign or its standard arena combat. People play Destiny's MP to get shit to use in its campaign and vice-versa.

Edit: it takes some serious leaps of logic to conclude that halo players prefer H4 thanks to MCC. First of all, in 2012, 343 had to change H4s MP to more resemble H3 in order to stop the bleeding. secondly many of the players who would prefer a classic formula, probably quit the game, and many don't even own xboxes do to Halos regression. It should be no surprise that many people who still play Halo are the ones who don't mind the changes- But these people are comparatively few in number. Lastly, H3 gets plenty of votes in mcc (which is a shame because I prefer h2).

The bolded is almost certainly true... but do they prefer classic Halo to whatever they're playing right now? I'm not at all convinced that's the case. For all the complaints modern Halo sees, its more Halo than everything that drained Halo of its playerbase... so why would I assume classic Halo players would rather play classic Halo than all the non-Halo games?

Im sorry, but your argument is terrible. Overwatch doesn't have half of the mechanics you listed and it's highly successful. A good game is a good game. Some games with rpg elements are successful, many aren't. This doesn't indicate any sort of trend other than people like well made products.

Overwatch has nearly every mechanic I listed, besides RPG progression... they're just split amongst the cast. Ultimates take the place of killstreaks, and everything else is clearly accounted for.

 

[RichiRamjag]

What? Halo 3 was the most played game in Live years after release... ahead CoD... it sold more than CoD4 even after it release.

Most people didn't know I guess but...

Halo 3 > Any CoD on 360

No CoD on 360 sold more than Halo 3.

Yeah, it's crazy how people are trying to downplay halo 3 all of a sudden.

Apologies for cutting down the replies a bit... I don't want to spend forever replying to each part of each post in detail when multiple people are responding back. It just begins to get too long eventually.



I keep saying that I'm not claiming Halo couldn't do anything to maintain its popularity... I'm saying that those things may well have been what the other games actually did (just before they did them obviously). As for the line you bolded...that wasn't to say Halo could be no better, simply that an amazing game has less ability to rapidly improve than a decent game. Mario 64 had less room for improvement than Sonic Adventure, regardless of how much actual improvement each made. If the next 3D Sonic had been on par with Mario Galaxy, pointing to where Sonic Adventure was compared to Mario 64 was is meaningless.



But Destiny doesn't split its single and multiplayer aspects, and that's core to its success, in comparison to something like Warzone being completely separate to Halos campaign or its standard arena combat. People play Destiny's MP to get shit to use in its campaign and vice-versa.



The bolded is almost certainly true... but do they prefer classic Halo to whatever they're playing right now? I'm not at all convinced that's the case. For all the complaints modern Halo sees, its more Halo than everything that drained Halo of its playerbase... so why would I assume classic Halo players would rather play classic Halo than all the non-Halo games?



Overwatch has nearly every mechanic I listed, besides RPG progression... they're just split amongst the cast. Ultimates take the place of killstreaks, and everything else is clearly accounted for.

Ok, but as a whole it doesn't. It's hard to make an argument for sprint, ads, etc as being necessary nowadays when only one or two characters in that game use those mechanics. Overwatch overall is a good game, sprint and ads isn't the basis of that. No one is saying overwatch is better than halo because you can sprint with soldier.

In either case, this is a debate that can't really be proven either way. Had MCC not been a pile of garbage at launch, then maybe we'd have a better guage of how bad the thirst for classic halo is. In any case, we may be seeing a classic playlist soon I believe. I'll be spending most of my time in that.

Also, I'd like to better articulate my point, but I'm sneaking gaf in at work, so I apologize if I'm not coming across properly.

Well, we had an 343 employee saying that halo 5 did 5.5 million in 3 months, but no one believed and said he was talking shipped, despite his post being clearly a response for someone saying it didn't had a good sales number sold through.

Unless he's gonna return and clarify, it doesn't matter much. Sales discussions without solid info are really the worst imo. Just a bunch of assumptions.

 

[LukasTaves]

Do you have a official source, numbers, that actually prove that H5 sold more in that stretch than H1,2,3,4 or that it had more active players besides Pachter apparently having been told so ?

Silly how defensive people can get. I usually prefer to believe what I see. And unless they release official numbers than excuse me for not believing what someone like Pachter says.

Well, we had an 343 employee saying that halo 5 did 5.5 million in 3 months, but no one believed and said he was talking shipped, despite his post being clearly a response for someone saying it didn't had a good sales number sold through.

 

[BleedOrange]

No, not really. Overwatch has a better system. OW allows players to purchase specific items when you save enough. H5 is all random.

I'd agree this is one thing I'd love to see in Halo 6.

 

[Trup1aya]

CoD and GTA have definitely gotten worse as far as multiplayer goes. The discussion was never really about quality though. Every other game got more accessible while Halo stayed the same skill-based shooter it has been. Everything else has killstreaks, tons of auto-aim, low TTK, and support characters/classes for low-skill players to latch onto and feel like they can contribute. If Halo tried any of that it wouldn't be Halo anymore and everyone would lose their minds. Halo 5 is just what a successful Halo game looks like in 2015-2017. A lot of people just have a hard time accepting that, or are railing against 343/MS for other dumber reasons.

Again, BS.

Battlefield and COD had all that shit since H2, and H2 and 3 still trounced the competition. Halo 3 still held its own against COD:MW despite being 2 years older at the time of its release

There's literally no evidence that a H3 styled shooter with industry leading innovations (like MM, Forge, and Firefight ) would not have been successful back in 2010- because no such game has been released since 2007.

What are you comparing it too?

Edit: I will say this: Halo is now much LESS accessible than it ever has been. It takes several button presses to simply make a jump now... you also have two manage your move speed vs your shield health vs ability too shoot. it's come a long way being all about simply running&gunning while jumping and throwing grenades.

Halo was just as accessible as any of its competitors prior to reach ( if not moreso) when they started adding bullshit.

 

[Septic360]

I spent £200 on packs like a cunt

 

[RichiRamjag]

I'd agree this is one thing I'd love to see in Halo 6.

Same here, doesn't have to be everything, but it'd be nice for specific stuff.

 

[psyfi]

I'm responsible for some of this. I've dropped a couple hundred on req packs. Love that damn game. Still my favorite current gen MP.

I 100% agree, best Halo MP ever.

Spoiler

I only bought one REQ pack tho lol.

 

[Caayn]

He is not wrong:

- No Forge at launch.

Spoiler

(but I can forgive that since the Forge Team was and is the best thing at 343i)

- No dev made BTB maps at all. There are only Forge BTB maps.
- 3 competetive Gametypes since launch.
- Despite Oddball and KotH Gametypes being patched in months later, they are not supported, because they don't have Voice Overs. Couldn't even been bothered to at least use old files for example. Instead we get a pack of paid Voice Over DLC from 3 Voice Actors.
- Releasing several Arena Maps that were not worth anyone's time. Maps that were even taken out completely out of competetive playlists.
- Post Game Carnage Reports missing info like Medals. Not patched in after several months have passed.
- Still no Campaign Theater.

So yes, it shipped with less features and the DLC was pretty much content that should have been in the game.

Thank you for this.

 

[jelly]

COD2 didn't have sprint.

 

[Welfare]

343 posted that 7 months in (end of May) Halo 5 had better player retention than any Halo game since Halo 3. May was also the first content drop that only had REQs and no new maps, so in April (month 6) I could see Halo 5 being above Halo 3 because of April having a bigger content update.

On sales, about on par probably means it didn't flop in the first 6 months. Remember that Microsoft only gave out sell in figures for Halo before, so it is possible that sell through is closer than the shipped figures. If I had to guess the first 6 month shipped sales, the sales rankings would probably

Halo 3: ~9M shipped
Halo 4: ~7M shipped
Halo 5: ~6M shipped
Halo 2: ~5M shipped
Halo CE: ~1.5M (Because it was a launch title)

 

[NullPointer]

Req nonsense is where I jumped out of Halo and makes me likely to jump out of the Xbox in general since I'd expect this idea will only continue in Halo and other first party games.

Good for MS and those who love to manage inventory in their Halo and/or drop a ton of cash on card packs, bad for me.

 

[Cranster]

Req nonsense is where I jumped out of Halo and makes me likely to jump out of the Xbox in general since I'd expect this idea will only continue in Halo and other first party games.

Good for MS and those who love to manage inventory in their Halo and/or drop a ton of cash on card packs, bad for me.

Yet it only affects warzone. Everything else is simply cosmetic in Arena so I don't know why your so salty.

 

[Shil Pencer]

Req nonsense is where I jumped out of Halo and makes me likely to jump out of the Xbox in general since I'd expect this idea will only continue in Halo and other first party games.

Good for MS and those who love to manage inventory in their Halo and/or drop a ton of cash on card packs, bad for me.

All this quote to me says that you are only here to complain and you might never have even played Halo 5 or even have an understanding of the Req system. The cards gave you no advantage and was pretty much the same as a loot box in Overwatch....which also is great. Its amazing to me that a game like Halo 5 and Overwatch retailed for 40-60 dollars and have been able to provide such fantastic value and replay ability if you are either buying or not buying the packs. I have never spent a single cent on reqs or loot boxes but i LOVE obtaining them through gameplay and i love the fact big fish who are lazy or just love the game are willing to help keep the costs of the game low

 

[NullPointer]

Yet it only affects warzone. Everything else is simply cosmetic in Arena so I don't know why your so salty.

I don't play Arena. Warzone and firefight were the big stars for me.

And I put plenty of time into them and the REQ system to be disappointed.

 

[Welfare]

Req nonsense is where I jumped out of Halo and makes me likely to jump out of the Xbox in general since I'd expect this idea will only continue in Halo and other first party games.

Good for MS and those who love to manage inventory in their Halo and/or drop a ton of cash on card packs, bad for me.

Should have played more Arena than Warzone then. REQ's aren't in Arena.

 

[Fahzgoolin]

I'd rather pay for high quality DLC maps instead. Seems like the MT model is pumping out poopy content.

Halo 2 did it right. Those maps were legit great.

 

[highrider]

Req nonsense is where I jumped out of Halo and makes me likely to jump out of the Xbox in general since I'd expect this idea will only continue in Halo and other first party games.

Good for MS and those who love to manage inventory in their Halo and/or drop a ton of cash on card packs, bad for me.

Edit: point moot after seeing other post

 

[highrider]

I don't play Arena. Warzone and firefight were the big stars for me.

And I put plenty of time into them and the REQ system to be disappointed.

That's cool, I mean warzone is kind of a screw around mode to me, but I mostly play team slayer. If I actually cared about warzone it probably would annoy me with req stuff lol.

 

[Exploratory]

Cause H5 is the best example of how you do MT's.

Disagree. Overwatch is the best example of MTs.

 

[Jaguar Victory]

Disagree. Overwatch is the best example of MTs.

They're very similar really.

 

[Trup1aya]

[1]I keep saying that I'm not claiming Halo couldn't do anything to maintain its popularity... I'm saying that those things may well have been what the other games actually did (just before they did them obviously). As for the line you bolded...that wasn't to say Halo could be no better, simply that an amazing game has less ability to rapidly improve than a decent game. Mario 64 had less room for improvement than Sonic Adventure, regardless of how much actual improvement each made. If the next 3D Sonic had been on par with Mario Galaxy, pointing to where Sonic Adventure was compared to Mario 64 was is meaningless.

[2] But Destiny doesn't split its single and multiplayer aspects, and that's core to its success, in comparison to something like Warzone being completely separate to Halos campaign or its standard arena combat. People play Destiny's MP to get shit to use in its campaign and vice-versa.

[3]The bolded is almost certainly true... but do they prefer classic Halo to whatever they're playing right now? I'm not at all convinced that's the case. For all the complaints modern Halo sees, its more Halo than everything that drained Halo of its playerbase... so why would I assume classic Halo players would rather play classic Halo than all the non-Halo games?

[4]Overwatch has nearly every mechanic I listed, besides RPG progression... they're just split amongst the cast. Ultimates take the place of killstreaks, and everything else is clearly accounted for.

[1] I'm saying that's just not true. CE was an amazing game. H2 set new standards as to what is amazing. H3 again set new standards. It not an excuse to say "raising the bar is hard because our last game was great". It's sink or swim. Reach sank in that regard, and the rest is history.

[2] what realities are core to Destiny's success would not neccisarily be core to Halo's success. If Halo Reach had shared world co-op experience IN ADDITION to traditional MP without the bullshit, I'm almost certain it would have been a massive success and players wouldn't have any more issue going back and forth than they did going from PvP to Firefight to random custom games in H3. The variety of the experience is core to halo's success.

[3] there's literally no way to tell because there hasn't been a classic halo game released since 2007 except for MCC, which was an utter disaster. What I can say is that, since 2010 halo games haven't been good at retaining fans or attracting new ones- and that can't be blamed on the core formula, because the core formula had been abandoned.

I stopped playing Halo when Reach Launched, in favor of BF and COD. Not because I preferred the style of play those games offered. I actually liked all three franchises for different reasons- but I liked and played halo the most. When Reach launched, it no longer had the gameplay that I liked, while COD and BF expanded upon the things I like about those games.

If I had a new classic-style halo game to play, I would play it. But I can't because no one has made one within the last decade. Many people felt this way with through Reach, H4 and 5.

You have NO EVIDENCE that people who left for other games wouldn't have stayed for more traditional halo titles- Because since H3 there have been no titles to compare.

[4] surely you aren't trying to argue that Overwatch is successful because some Overwatch characters have what you consider modern mechanics . It's successful because it's a good game- and would have been just as successful if it instead had other good characters with different mechanics.

 

[Akai__]

The cards gave you no advantage and was pretty much the same as a loot box in Overwatch....which also is great.

Except that they did. Or is spawning with a power weapon or heavy vehicle in every game not an advantage to you?

That was the whole point of REQ weapons and vehicles to begin with. Spawning with better equipment to destroy bosses and your enemy. Buying these cards, instead of grinding them gives you a shortcut.

 

[Kill3r7]

What's up with all the bullshit about Halo 3 player retention and performance? Have folks forgotten this quickly or are they just making shit up? Here are the most popular games of 2009 on XBL as posted by Major Nelson. That is in fact 2009, not a typo. Halo 3 was in the top 3 most played XBL games for nearly 3 years running.

https://majornelson.com/2010/01/11/the-top-20-live-games-of-2009/

 

[blue_phazon]

Disagree. Overwatch is the best example of MTs.

Halo 5's biggest advantage is that you don't get duplicate unlocks, but Overwatch's biggest advantage is that you can buy specific items with in-game currency.

I think Halo 5 is better simply because with the amount of time I spend in both those games, I'd unlock everything with Halo 5's system. Whereas in Overwatch there are people with 5 star silver nameplates that don't have everything

 

[Shil Pencer]

Except that they did. Or is spawning with a power weapon or heavy vehicle in every game not an advantage to you?

That was the whole point of REQ weapons and vehicles to begin with. Spawning with better equipment to destroy bosses and your enemy. Buying these cards, instead of grinding them gives you a shortcut.

You are trying so hard that its just making me sad for you

 

[JigglesBunny]

It's nice that the free maps/MT model works, just don't make your added maps complete shit or poor reworkings of existing maps.

Hated Halo 5's remix stuff. If you're not going to make new maps, at least do some full remakes of maps from previous games in the series like Titanfall does.

 

[Falchion]

I'm fine with this, charge for cards or customizations and use the free maps to keep players engaged.

 

[blakep267]

Except that they did. Or is spawning with a power weapon or heavy vehicle in every game not an advantage to you?

That was the whole point of REQ weapons and vehicles to begin with. Spawning with better equipment to destroy bosses and your enemy. Buying these cards, instead of grinding them gives you a shortcut.

Well no becaue it's still dependent on your energy level. You actually have to be playing well if you want to have a God like weapon towards the end of the match. Often times I'll just spam lvl3 random weapons and vehicles and hope for the best.

Having reqs doesn't mean your going to get to use them

 

[Akai__]

You are trying so hard that its just making me sad for you

I'm so tired of responses like these. If you can't be bothered to give a real answer then don't bother responding with a garbage response.

 

[Madness]

I believe it. I spent more money on Halo 5 than all other halo games combined. But it gets to a point where you won't spend another cent no matter what. So I imagine there is a massive cliff level drop. But they did get their money's worth from me. Frankie been eating good the last 1.5 years.

 

[Fahzgoolin]

What's up with all the bullshit about Halo 3 player retention and performance? Have folks forgotten this quickly or are they just making shit up? Here are the most popular games of 2009 on XBL as posted by Major Nelson. That is in fact 2009, not a typo. Halo 3 was in the top 3 most played XBL games for nearly 3 years running.

https://majornelson.com/2010/01/11/the-top-20-live-games-of-2009/

Correct. It's an important fact.

 

[Fata1moose]

I bought a REQ pack with each DLC released because I like the model.

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

I hated how they implemented this in halo 5 but I pretty much hated everything about that game.

 

[shoreu]

Why does this seem to be getting a free pass yet every other thread for a game that has MTs it's the second coming of the devil? Curious.

Lmao where have you been people raised hell about this. 343 just implemented it so well there's really no room for complaints.

 

[Trup1aya]

What's up with all the bullshit about Halo 3 player retention and performance? Have folks forgotten this quickly or are they just making shit up? Here are the most popular games of 2009 on XBL as posted by Major Nelson. That is in fact 2009, not a typo. Halo 3 was in the top 3 most played XBL games for nearly 3 years running.

https://majornelson.com/2010/01/11/the-top-20-live-games-of-2009/

It's just crazy that everyone wants to blame everything except halo-

but here we have a H3 being the most played Xbl game for 2007, 2008, and 2009. In 2009 it lead despite COD WaW, COD MW1-2, GTAIV, And Gears.

Yet somehow people argue that people simply preferred modern mechanics... when Halo was shitting on modern mechanics... year after year... and the moment Halo adopted modern mechanics people stopped playing it.

 

[RichiRamjag]

[1] I'm saying that's just not true. CE was an amazing game. H2 set new standards as to what is amazing. H3 again set new standards. It not an excuse to say "raising the bar is hard because our last game was great". It's sink or swim. Reach sank in that regard, and the rest is history.

[2] what realities are core to Destiny's success would not neccisarily be core to Halo's success. If Halo Reach had shared world co-op experience IN ADDITION to traditional MP without the bullshit, I'm almost certain it would have been a massive success and players wouldn't have any more issue going back and forth than they did going from PvP to Firefight to random custom games in H3. The variety of the experience is core to halo's success.

[3] there's literally no way to tell because there hasn't been a classic halo game released since 2007 except for MCC, which was an utter disaster. What I can say is that, since 2010 halo games haven't been good at retaining fans or attracting new ones- and that can't be blamed on the core formula, because the core formula had been abandoned.

I stopped playing Halo when Reach Launched, in favor of BF and COD. Not because I preferred the style of play those games offered. I actually liked all three franchises for different reasons- but I liked and played halo the most. When Reach launched, it no longer had the gameplay that I liked, while COD and BF expanded upon the things I like about those games.

If I had a new classic-style halo game to play, I would play it. But I can't because no one has made one within the last decade. Many people felt this way with through Reach, H4 and 5.

You have NO EVIDENCE that people who left for other games wouldn't have stayed for more traditional halo titles- Because since H3 there have been no titles to compare.

[4] surely you aren't trying to argue that Overwatch is successful because some Overwatch characters have what you consider modern mechanics . It's successful because it's a good game- and would have been just as successful if it instead had other good characters with different mechanics.

Perfectly stated.

It's nice that the free maps/MT model works, just don't make your added maps complete shit or poor reworkings of existing maps.

Hated Halo 5's remix stuff. If you're not going to make new maps, at least do some full remakes of maps from previous games in the series like Titanfall does.

How I feel. I like that it's been supported this long, but the quality of (some)content provided isn't winning me over. Last map I've liked was attack on sanctum and I've only gotten it once.

 

[Ryde3]

I sure ass hell bought a ton of Gold packs.