davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
so, like 5% of 10 million is...500,000?
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Peter Moore on 360 failure rates: "ya know, things break"
- Thread starter Zombie James
- Start date
fly high ~ayunite~
Member
The saddest thing I think is that consumers are prepared to tolerate such unexcusable failure rates.
pr0cs
Member
what does that have to do with this thread topic?nubbe said:
Anyway, Microsoft needs to continue to revise the hardware manufacturing and improve the QC because right now the machine itself is the weakest link in the chain. The software library for 2007 is stellar, too bad the quality of the box assembled is not.
Spider_Jerusalem
Member
If so, Italy must be amongst the unlucky ones, as almost everyone the uses it frequently experienced the rings of death at least once. Luckily we have two years warranty, so till next december everyone is covered. I'm planning to sell my console and buy a new one by then, so I'll have two more years of warranty. Maybe an Elite.theBishop said:
Valkyr Junkie
Member
scissorfight said:
And sadly my 360 is the only one of the current-gen consoles I didn't buy at Costco.
EphemeralDream
Member
Despite doing a near 180 in image and mindshare since the original Xbox, MS really foiled greater success with the failure rate of the 360. Sony has managed to end the negative image in hardware quality with the PS3, but so many people were skeptical of the quality at launch. This issue will be in the shadow of MS for years to come, especially with their seemingly apathetic stance towards fixing the hardware.
When consumers are skeptical to jump in based on hardware quality, that is a major problem that needs to be faced. Why such a long wait?
When consumers are skeptical to jump in based on hardware quality, that is a major problem that needs to be faced. Why such a long wait?
Mefisutoferesu
Member
Microsoft does what Nintendon't...nubbe said:
Mojovonio said:
There is no way it's 40%, that's totally absurd.
What kinda surprises me about the whole faulty 360s discussion is this: regardless of whether the actual failure rate is 5% or 25%, MS doesn't seem to be appreciating (much less responding) to the perception that the 360 has a higher than normal failure rate. Any videogame message board you go to, you can find people talking about 360 failure rates, rings of death, repairs and - most importantly - prospective 360 owners expressing concern about those things. How many sales have MS been denied because someone is worried the console's aren't reliable? Who knows, but definitely more than a few - and that's a problem, even if their failure rate is only 3-5%.
So what surprises me is MS apparently ignoring this, either by dismissing or insisting the failure rates are "normal". Their brand is being harmed by these persistent stories, and they're more or less saying "it's really not that big a deal." I would expect them to go on the offensive: don't say your failure rate is an acceptable 3-5%, say you've decided to be the most reliable hardware manufacturer of the three. Set a (public) goal of a 2% failure rate, or less. Make press releases about how you've overhauled the QA process, and have the one of the greatest in the world.
And for ****'s sake: if someone sends you a faulty 360, fix it correctly the first time. The stories form people who have sent their 360 back more than once are poison for their brand.
MS is in a war with two highly skilled competitors... IMO, the perception that the 360 could crap out on you is a handicap they don't need.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
EphemeralDream said:
Didn't the PS2, pre-PS3's rescuing of Sony's rep in this matter, sell 100,000,000 units?
Tieno said:
The ultimatum for the XBox division to be profitable probably put a lot of pressure to cut corners - manufacturing was one of them. After getting all kinds of shit for the PS2, Sony didn't want to deal with that issue (hence their $40 mfg cost) and Nintendo's always built solid hardware (hence their $20 mfg) but after all the losses MS took on the first XBox - which was built like a tank - they want to be profitable this gen. Cutting corners is something they figured would help them get there, much to the chagrin of the consumer. $6 is downright pathetic, as it seems these boxes are put together by monkeys rather than people. Instead of addressing their issues with the Elite, they are still mostly cutting corners. At this point, I'm wondering if the 65nm box will fix anything, or whether MS will go this whole generation without fixing their design flaws and cheap manufacturing.
chibcicylist
Banned
What BS. Admit you have hardware defects rather than spouting lame bullshit like that when your competition is shipping more to more countries than you and thier hardware is built like a tank. For christ sake, you can't even include wireless wifi when a $250 POS has one built in.
I dunno why but these statements hit a nerve. I hope both Sony and them crush each other to a pulp.
I dunno why but these statements hit a nerve. I hope both Sony and them crush each other to a pulp.
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
Easy replacement of a console via a store bought warranty or via a refurb does not excuse the fact that there is a need to replace the console. Considering how many broken consoles have been sent out as refurbs, the only analogy I can think of to describe the X360 manufacturing problems is a very expensive version of a street shell game.
I cannot wait for Halo 3. I cannot wait for Forza 2. I love Xbox Live. But damnit Microsoft. Get your shit together and fix the solder and/or the disc drives and stop screwing those of us who love your console.
I cannot wait for Halo 3. I cannot wait for Forza 2. I love Xbox Live. But damnit Microsoft. Get your shit together and fix the solder and/or the disc drives and stop screwing those of us who love your console.
Speevy said:
Took me 8 weeks and 7 attempts for them to send out a BOX so I could send in my console.
Spoke to 3 managers, 7 customers service reps, assured each time it was on it's way, only to have to rinse and repeat a week later when nothing showed up.
By far the worst experience I've ever had with inept customer service. It doesn't help that each call takes 30-40 minutes because of the idiotic and slow phone system, and half the time their english is so horrible I have to repeat myself 6 times.
MS Canada sucks, I know that much.
Once they finally recieved my box they overnighted the replacement, which was not a refurb, so that's a small saving grace.
VibratingDonkey
Member
Though I know that this often isn't the case, Microsoft's support has treated me fairly well. Got my first 360 replaced within a week. When my second started acting up I circumvented the standard support and got in contact with the special pissed off-consumer support person via the retailer and got a bunch of free stuff along with a brand new Premium. So knowing this, for me it's actually a good thing if it breaks.
With that said, "things break" isn't a particularly confidence inspiring answer... I would like to hear that they're aware of the problem and are fixing it. But that would be a lie then wouldn't it?
Get your shit together indeed.
With that said, "things break" isn't a particularly confidence inspiring answer... I would like to hear that they're aware of the problem and are fixing it. But that would be a lie then wouldn't it?
Get your shit together indeed.
I'd guess the failure rate is somewhere between 15% and 30%, with obvious blowouts for certain batches.
I've had an AU$1800 Olympus digital camera and an AU$300 Sony PDA fail on me shortly after the warranty period, which sucked big time. My 360 died within one year and I still another 20 months warranty on it so at least I'm assured until then.
I've had an AU$1800 Olympus digital camera and an AU$300 Sony PDA fail on me shortly after the warranty period, which sucked big time. My 360 died within one year and I still another 20 months warranty on it so at least I'm assured until then.
Also these!
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/7033/backplatesqx7.jpg
X-Clamps X_X
http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/2269/mbkz5.jpg
CPU + GPU together = RING OF TEH FIRE!
Admit it. It's a design flaw.
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/7033/backplatesqx7.jpg
X-Clamps X_X
http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/2269/mbkz5.jpg
CPU + GPU together = RING OF TEH FIRE!
Admit it. It's a design flaw.
tracky_dacks
Member
Well I had to get my 360 repaired for the second time (got it back yesterday actually) only a few months after the first incident and a couple of months after my warranty expired. MS fixed it no problems, at no cost, and even threw in a months subscription to Xbox Live Gold which actually came in handy 'cause my 1 year subscription expired days before I sent my system.
Nice of them to do all that and I was pretty happy with their service, but having said that, I shouldn't have had to ship my system for repairs twice, let alone once, only 14 months since I've had it, especially for a device I spent AU$700+ of my hard earned on. And the thing is, it's gotten me paranoid as I've got this feeling it'll only be another few months before my 360 dies on me again and I'm sure they won't be so accomodating to fix it free of charge next time around.
I'm spewin' I didn't opt for the extended warranty.
Nice of them to do all that and I was pretty happy with their service, but having said that, I shouldn't have had to ship my system for repairs twice, let alone once, only 14 months since I've had it, especially for a device I spent AU$700+ of my hard earned on. And the thing is, it's gotten me paranoid as I've got this feeling it'll only be another few months before my 360 dies on me again and I'm sure they won't be so accomodating to fix it free of charge next time around.
I'm spewin' I didn't opt for the extended warranty.
PepsimanVsJoe
Member
Not liking this at all but eh I'm covered until 2010 I think.
EphemeralDream
Member
I bought a PS2 in late 2002 so I'm not sure how bad the failure rate was on early units but I don't think it was this high. More importantly the circumstances are a bit different this time around. PS2 was $200 or less by this point in the lifecycle, no DRM issues to worry about, and many of the issues didn't render the console completely useless. DREs on a few games could be worked around (I won't play those games mentality), but RRoD is completely unavoidable.BenjaminBirdie said:
As time progresses and with consoles getting more expensive, there should be progression in quality, not the other way around.
Spider_Jerusalem
Member
Based on my experience, this could easily be true. But maybe they're really having different rates in different countries. I run an xbox fansite in italy, and pretty every regular user in our forum had its console replaced by microsoft, some even two or three times.Vrolokus said:
Mefisutoferesu
Member
YYZ, you really should change your avi, you know that?
Anyway, to be fair, I really don't think there's much MS can do about the defect rate anyway, so they're kinda forced into the round robin of spin. They're subject to the whim of their manufacturers, if they cut edges here and there, what can MS do? Well, OK, there's a number of potential options, but they may not be feasible economically speaking - switching manufacturers is a major undertaking, for instance.
Anyway, to be fair, I really don't think there's much MS can do about the defect rate anyway, so they're kinda forced into the round robin of spin. They're subject to the whim of their manufacturers, if they cut edges here and there, what can MS do? Well, OK, there's a number of potential options, but they may not be feasible economically speaking - switching manufacturers is a major undertaking, for instance.
mentalfloss
Banned
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Spider_Jerusalem
Member
Yes, they did the same with me last month when I sent them my second broken console.tracky_dacks said:
Pristine_Condition
Member
Is this the first time Pee-tah has answered any question RE: failures with anything other than the old "well within the standard range for consumer electronics" line that he used to use?
...he must be getting rattled, because that was always the old standard for denial.
Mine is still going strong. Loud, but strong. I'm the only one of all my circle of friends to not have to have a replacement though, so our failure rate is over 80%.
...he must be getting rattled, because that was always the old standard for denial.
Mine is still going strong. Loud, but strong. I'm the only one of all my circle of friends to not have to have a replacement though, so our failure rate is over 80%.
All I know is, once my Xbox unit dies (and it's slowly getting there with the amount of times this thing locks up on games. Any games.) I will call whatever customer service line it is to call up and talk it over with them for a replacement. If I can't manage to get a free replacement, I'll just be without a 360 for the rest of the gen.
When my launch PS2 continues to work like a charm without a problem, and my year old 360 is dying, that doesn't cut it.
When my launch PS2 continues to work like a charm without a problem, and my year old 360 is dying, that doesn't cut it.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
NinSoX said:
Mithos Yggdrasill
Banned
It is only an impression, or people such Moore, Bach, Miyamoto and co. have A LOT of time to lose ? Go to work guys !!