KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
I'm sitting at the edge of my seat waiting for #4.
Don't leave us hanging
Uhh, I'm pretty sure mobile has always been a bigger thing in Japan.
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Sony: climate "not healthy" for PlayStation Vita successor
- Thread starter chadskin
- Start date
dragonyeuw
Member
We're not in disagreement on any of that. The external forces I mentioned are referring to the various devices that have entered the market since the PSP's heyday.
StoppedInTracks
Member
Kind of a lukewarm response to Sony leaving the handheld market in here. Was it the same when SEGA left console market after Dreamcast?
I guess the majority of gamers/ casuals does not care about Sony's handhelds future. They didnn't notice the Vita existing and will not notice its successor missing.
A true pity because Sony did so many things right when it comes to handhelds:
- analog sticks
- great performance
- high-end hardware
- pristine OLED screen technology
- cartridge/ UMD and digital downloads
- trophy system
I guess the majority of gamers/ casuals does not care about Sony's handhelds future. They didnn't notice the Vita existing and will not notice its successor missing.
A true pity because Sony did so many things right when it comes to handhelds:
- analog sticks
- great performance
- high-end hardware
- pristine OLED screen technology
- cartridge/ UMD and digital downloads
- trophy system
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Funny you say this yet mobile is probably the easiest platform to pirate on, you don't even have do anything other then Google search and download, it's very comical actually.
In fact I'd that is the reason mobile has killed off Handhelds and even the general use of PC, it's only the hardcore PC gamers who really uses them now let's me honest and business men use a Tab or a iPad instead of laptops.
Mobile is pirating machine for anyone and anything, music, movies, games
You either illegally download them or its free anyway
And the great thing is you don't even have to buy one outright, just get it on contract.
Everyone wants something for free and the PSP's piracy was the reason it was the first none Nintendo handheld to sell 80mill.
And what #4?
Speaking from a retail perspective, everyone who blames the memory cards or major first party support for the failings of the Vita in the US is merely demonstrating their lack of awareness of the actual market realities. Y2Kev was the most accurate in terms of his discussion of what the reasons were.
When customers come into our stores, they are largely unaware of what a Vita even *is*, and when they see what it is, often they are confused as to what the appeal is by comparison with their existing smart devices. I adore my Vita, and the games available for it are exactly what I want from it. The 3DS still sells okay, but even that isn't doing phenomenal by any means.
There has to be genuine interest for the conversation in the memory cards to even come up people. And that doesn't happen. It wasn't happening often even around the time of launch, when there was a really strong lineup of big games, and it has only gotten less likely since then. The memory cards have rarely dissuaded anyone except those who were already interested in it in the first place and interested in that type of device. And even then, there's been plenty of bundle options that include an 8GB memory card, which is plenty for people not going to be buying digital games (the non-hardcore audience that people seem to be discussing in here so much).
As to the library, Sony's major franchises were never the reasons people bought the PSP in the first place. I bought mine for the JRPG support, that's why I bought my Vita as well, and it continues to have been a worthwhile investment on that scope.
I would love a Vita successor! Absolutely. Do I think Sony would be stupid to pursue one? Yes. Yes I do.
When customers come into our stores, they are largely unaware of what a Vita even *is*, and when they see what it is, often they are confused as to what the appeal is by comparison with their existing smart devices. I adore my Vita, and the games available for it are exactly what I want from it. The 3DS still sells okay, but even that isn't doing phenomenal by any means.
There has to be genuine interest for the conversation in the memory cards to even come up people. And that doesn't happen. It wasn't happening often even around the time of launch, when there was a really strong lineup of big games, and it has only gotten less likely since then. The memory cards have rarely dissuaded anyone except those who were already interested in it in the first place and interested in that type of device. And even then, there's been plenty of bundle options that include an 8GB memory card, which is plenty for people not going to be buying digital games (the non-hardcore audience that people seem to be discussing in here so much).
As to the library, Sony's major franchises were never the reasons people bought the PSP in the first place. I bought mine for the JRPG support, that's why I bought my Vita as well, and it continues to have been a worthwhile investment on that scope.
I would love a Vita successor! Absolutely. Do I think Sony would be stupid to pursue one? Yes. Yes I do.
dragonyeuw
Member
Probably because while disapppointing( for the small legion of Vita fans), its not exactly shocking.
gundamkyoukai
Member
yep you could see this coming from miles away .
It'd have been relevant for a year, then in need of a new model or be left in the dust.
paragonpro
Banned
Makes sense, but it still sucks, the vita is an awesome hand held, i dont have one, but i can absolutley see why it has a fan base, but with smart phones, there isn really a market for hand helds is niche, even the once infallible DS brand has been seeing a sharp decline.
I know why I bought a psp and why I avoided Vita.
I am a handheld type of guy so that means I already have plenty of experience with Nintendo's offering and also that I'm patient and will prefer to wait to get actual games I want.
I mean I got a DS because of Mario Kart (in a bundle actually) and a psp for that MHFU bundle (so that guy at Sony that greenlighted that bundle didn't do it for nothing at least).
I bought KH on it, MGS Peace Walker and a few other games because they were actual good games that I couldn't find somewhere else.
3DS rolled around with little to offer and a disgraceful high price, I waited because there was nothing on it (and when I got my hands on the launch games later on, I was glad I waited on).
The best thing 3DS had to offer at the time was OoT 3D that I had on n64, GC (in 2 different dics) so I was in no hurry to get that for 250 bucks.
Funnily enough my wife have and it's what I'm playing nonstop now
Vita offered a pretty good value for what it was when I wasn't in a market for a 3DS,
then Sony decided that if you had UMDs you were better off keeping your Psp than buying a Vita (and i just got the special edition of Tactics Ogre at the time so I wasn't getting rid of a UMD player).
The launch games weren't interesting and Gravity Rush did nothing for me.
Nintendo dropped the price and released Mario Kart and 3DLand.
So yeah I bought a 3DS, at least my collection of games from the gen before didn't need to go up in flame.
I would have had a Vita if Sony proposed anything at all to allow me to do something about the UMD games I had. The issues with the price and game selection I could have managed.
The memcard was just cherry on top.
And now a few years down the line with Sony porting anything the Vita had that was even mildly interesting on ps3/4 I see that I did the right choice.
I am a handheld type of guy so that means I already have plenty of experience with Nintendo's offering and also that I'm patient and will prefer to wait to get actual games I want.
I mean I got a DS because of Mario Kart (in a bundle actually) and a psp for that MHFU bundle (so that guy at Sony that greenlighted that bundle didn't do it for nothing at least).
I bought KH on it, MGS Peace Walker and a few other games because they were actual good games that I couldn't find somewhere else.
3DS rolled around with little to offer and a disgraceful high price, I waited because there was nothing on it (and when I got my hands on the launch games later on, I was glad I waited on).
The best thing 3DS had to offer at the time was OoT 3D that I had on n64, GC (in 2 different dics) so I was in no hurry to get that for 250 bucks.
Funnily enough my wife have and it's what I'm playing nonstop now
Vita offered a pretty good value for what it was when I wasn't in a market for a 3DS,
then Sony decided that if you had UMDs you were better off keeping your Psp than buying a Vita (and i just got the special edition of Tactics Ogre at the time so I wasn't getting rid of a UMD player).
The launch games weren't interesting and Gravity Rush did nothing for me.
Nintendo dropped the price and released Mario Kart and 3DLand.
So yeah I bought a 3DS, at least my collection of games from the gen before didn't need to go up in flame.
I would have had a Vita if Sony proposed anything at all to allow me to do something about the UMD games I had. The issues with the price and game selection I could have managed.
The memcard was just cherry on top.
And now a few years down the line with Sony porting anything the Vita had that was even mildly interesting on ps3/4 I see that I did the right choice.
xXCrazyCostaXX
Member
I thought they said the attach rate was super strong, shouldn't that matter?
Then what is the point? You said that it made it a bigger deal for you, so i was just curious to which other device you would have used it on. If you didnt want to use it on any other device, then why does it matter if it only work on one device?
EDIT: I fixed a typo.
Missunderstood you, sorry. It would have been nice to transfer movies from my PC onto my memory card and watch on the go.
But the way it is, you pay an extra price for a ghetto.
I actually didn't mind the idea of UMD video: Portable DVD's on a handheld was a pretty neat (if dated even at the time) idea. Now that storage space is getting cheap and smaller, there's no need for that idea though.
test_account
XP-39C²
No worries =) Cant you transfer movies to the Vita by the way? Not sure if i've tried it, but i know that it has the ability to play movie files at least.
SavoyPrime
Member
It wouldn't make sense. Nintendo owns the handheld market. No need for Sony to keep pumping money into that market since they can't seem to get sure-footing in it. That money can be better spent elsewhere.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Easy to have high attach rate when most of your games are indie game with indie price. I probably have around hundred mobile games under my account by now.
TheDarkTriforce
Banned
If Nintendo alone can make 20-25 AAA games for the Nintendo Wii U than Sony should do at least 50 games with all the third party support and if you consider how they praised the PS Vita as tripple A game machine when they announced it before they forgot that the PS Vita exists in my opinion!
Why do you think Microsoft introduced a 4GB Xbox 360 and Sony introduced a 12GB PS3.
They sold MILLIONS!
You say people on phones need lots of memory, but Vita isn't a phone and doesn't have the same usage cases.
Cheat Code
Member
I love the games with all my heart but if you think the average budget for a big Nintendo game is anywhere near that of the average budget for a big SCE game you have no idea how game development works.
lyrick
Member
Go on... Tell us how the costs to create & market Zelda Wii U compare to a Big SCE title...
autoduelist
Member
That will matter in the long term for Vita, because we will continue to get games for it long after most devices would be retired. But many of us will continue to play our Vita for quite some time, and continue to buy games for it. As it's powerful enough for jrpgs and indies for the foreseeable futre, it'll continue to get them as long as we buy them. It doesn't mean we'll get a vita 2 though.
No, it's really not easy.
The Vita attach rate is surprisingly strong, and it's why our favorite 'dead' device will continue to live a long life. I own hundreds of games for it; enough to fill over three 64 gig cards. I won't be buying the next Nintendo handheld.
It's why I'm a holdout for the [unfortunately likely never to happen] vita 1.5 I mentioned earlier, that adds ps2 support and better remote play controls. Sony has a lot of us deeply invested in it's ecosystem, and it's arguably in its best interest to keep us there. While Vita tech will be 'good enough' for quite a few years, at some point it they'll need to update us or lose us [perhaps forever]. It's why I still hold out for that minuscule chance of the new version, since it would allow them to keep that foothold in the sector. A [relatively minor] hardware revision that adds something major [ps2 support] would be a nice, low-effort bridge that would keep many in their fold for quite a few extra years. While it wouldn't suddenly sell like hotcakes, ps2 support is nothing to sneer at and there's a lot of value in keeping Sony gamers as Sony gamers.
test_account
XP-39C²
Nintendo has not made 20-25 AAA titles for the WiiU. And 3rd party support has no affect on how many 1st party games that can be made.
The budget for most of Nintendo's games doesn't come anywhere close to the amount that Sony generally spends. Maybe the cost of something like Tearaway is more comparable, but it's not like Uncharted: Golden Abyss and Link Between Worlds are costing the same thing. This is a bizarre statement...
dragonyeuw
Member
Those consoles you refer to were mid/late gen options designed to get to a certain price point. But, they weren't restricted to proprietary storage for those who wanted to expand( 360 wasn't like that from the get-go, but MS eventually opened up to non-proprietary storage options, Ps3 was like that from day one).
Vita isn't a phone, but Sony is/was pushing it as a digital consumption device.
GhostTrick
Banned
Except... they didn't. Nintendo published, the only AAA I can think of on Wii U are TW101, Bayo 2, Smash Bros 4, Xeno X and Zelda U... which isn't released yet.
TheDarkTriforce
Banned
I don't care about what a game costs! Sony is anyway not able to develop 1 AAA game for the PS Vita because they forget that the PS Vita exists
Nintendo is at least developing games for the Nintendo Wii U.Yeah, having a mechanical spinning drive on a power starved handheld was a smart idea.
I'm sarcastic
Right... you've kind of proved y2kevs point there. Read his post again.
(Think mandatory installs as well)
Cheat Code
Member
Average, AVERAGE. The last home console Zelda will be five years old when Zelda U is meant to be coming out.
You can't genuinely think that Yoshi's Woolly World, Super Mario Maker, Splatoon and Xenoblade X would cost Nintendo as much as Bloodborne, Until Dawn, The Order: 1886 and MLB 15 would cost Sony.
Zelda U is essentially Nintendo's Uncharted 4, and there is no way the budget of Zelda U would be comparable. Stuff like motion capture and voice acting costs a hell of a lot of money,
This of course has nothing to do with quality, but budget wise there is gonna be a gap.
One of these is not like the others.
EDIT: Also fairly sure Nintendo uses mocap quite a bit. I remember a Nintendo Direct being filmed in their mocap studio.
QuantumZebra
Member
I just hope this means the Vita will continue to have support for a long time... it is a wonderful handheld, best I've ever owned.
GhostTrick
Banned
I don't care about what a game costs! Sony is anyway not able to develop 1 AAA game for the PS Vita because they forget that the PS Vita exists
You may not, but the people making it sure as hell do.
Cheat Code
Member
It's the only big 3D game Nintendo published this year, and Devil's Third sure as hell isn't AAA.
Even if Zelda U did feature mocap, it's not going to be as intensive as U4 unless they completely switch gears. U4 is gonna have a shitload of action setpieces.
You are aware of how averages work?
The average of three 10s and a 50 is 20. The average of four 50s is 50.
Outrun
Member
I bought my PSP because of the promise of Gran Turismo....It was a shame that by the time it actually came, I had already traded my PSP in...
You say that as if a yearly sports rehash is an AAA release. Well one that isn't Fifa or Madden anyway.
Cheat Code
Member
It's a series with exclusive MLB branding and full team, player and stadium licensing. That's not gonna be a cheap game.
Just gonna clarify this, but Zelda has been utilizing mocap since Wind Waker. You're right, it's nowhere near as extensive as Uncharted or most other major games, but it absolutely does.
Cheat Code
Member
Thanks for the info, gonna update my first post.
GhostTrick
Banned
Okay, first of all, do you need to be condescendanting ? I wasn't talking about average cost or something. I was just telling you how can you put Xenoblade Chronicles X in the same basket as Yoshi's Wooly World, Splatoon and Mario Maker ? Because in term of scope and budget, they're nothing alike. Really.
What the hell's the difference if Zelda UNX costs 50 million and Uncharted 4 costs 80? I don't think that's the point. Nintendo's spent a ton of money making games and marketing them for their failed system (btw, in certain regions marketing for games like Splatoon and Mario Maker is absolutely comparable to some AAA titles). The point is that Sony did not put anywhere near the money or developmental muscle on its failed system.
MLB is only popular in the US and I'm not even sure the games sell well there yet they keep making them every year. They're not AAA.
Cheat Code
Member
Well fine let's just have Xenoblade X vs. Bloodborne, The Order: 1886, Until Dawn. That's way better.
If MLB isn't AAA then Nintendo haven't released an AAA game since Smash 4.
GhostTrick
Banned
Popularity and sales have nothing to do with whether it's AAA or not, budget does. Besides, as the only licensed baseball game on the market, it's had decent sales (don't forget it's also on consoles) over the years. What makes you think Fifa and Madden are AAA but The Show isn't?
Wait so you seriously think yearly MLB games have a budget comparable to an open world RPG that was in development for five years? Really?
You don't keep giving a big budget to low selling games. Fifa and Madden sell literally millions more than MLB every year and are probably much more expensive licenses because those sports and clubs are much popular and make much more money.
What's decent sales btw? Do those games even top a million copies?(honestly not sure)
EDIT: Before you point it out I'm aware Xenoblade won't top a million but it will also be a massive bomb and not get yearly sequels.
Cheat Code
Member
No but I did forget it released in Japan already on account of not being Japanese.
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