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[JABEE]

Eh... maybe you were lucky? PS2s were a disaster for me.

I had 4 PS2s (I still use my 4th)

I'm on my third Xbox 360.

The difference? I paid for all 4 of the PS2s. Only paid for the first Xbox 360.

I'm on my 2nd Wii. The first one had an overheated GPU that caused all of the games I played to have terrible artifacting that got progressively worse.

 

[thuway]

year of the ps3

This is an overused, overplayed, boring meme. Let it go. Fuck man. Along with the M$, "Japanese expert", and Nintendo needs to make games for Apple bullshit.

 

[davepoobond]

maybe this includes what they spent on buying out Ericcson from the mobile business?

 

[Krappadizzle]

Eh... maybe you were lucky? PS2s were a disaster for me.

I had 4 PS2s (I still use my 4th)

I'm on my third Xbox 360.

The difference? I paid for all 4 of the PS2s. Only paid for the first Xbox 360.

This exact thing happened to me. I lost a lot of faith after my launch PS2 burnt out 2 weeks after waranty expired. I was so pissed, I treated that thing like it was damn Fabergé egg. I had little faith in Sony after that, though, I will say that my launch PS3 still works, though truthfully, I hardly turn it on anymore.

 

[patsu]

Hacks? Do you mean the lulsec stuff or??

The hack was projected to lose $170 million although later they said it's less than expected.

I don't know how much the totaled damage for all the 2011 disasters were though. The CFO did say that PS3 was affected.

I just don't think it's one item (e.g., PS4 R&D). The earlier 2010 - 2011 fiscal year discussion threw me off. 8^P

They will also need to invest in updated SEN infrastructure, as well as Vita stuff. Weren't there some sort of tax charges as well ? How are they accounted for w.r.t. SCE ?

 

[JABEE]

There have been multiple articles in the past week about what Nintendo must fix to make a "comeback" with 3DS and WiiU.

Sony gets articles about its financials because the company isn't doing well. They are doing historically bad, even. Pretending like this has no impact on the entertainment division was a lofty goal, but now that's out the window. Kaz has a lot of work cut out for him. Something has to give at the company before it's too late.

That's probably why they have been laying off and shutting down under-performing studios. I think the move to what seems like standard PC components for their next system also seems like a step to put out a system that can be profitable in a shorter amount of time. Sony has to compete with the 720 if their gaming division wants to survive.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Not to mention there budgets are small compare to allot of AAA games.
Well if Sony goes i will miss there games that is for certain .

Those same devs would more than likely keep making games, you would just see a different publishers logo at the beginning. Remember, the vast majority of Sony owned studios were independent before they were acquired.

Some devs though don't like not being a first party and will leave like what happened to a lot of Sega's talent.

 

[KillerTravis]

This is an overused, overplayed, boring meme. Let it go. Fuck man. Along with the M$, "Japanese expert", and Nintendo needs to make games for Apple bullshit.

Calm down, I'm sure Sony is not going under yet.

 

[Misterhbk]

Sony losing money.

SHOCKING NEWS!

 

[Lord Error]

Games or hardware? If something drastic did happen, they would just sell off their game studios to other publishers and then those same developers would still be making the games you like to play today. They would just make them for other platforms.

Worked great for Sega! But it didn't And they were in the more favorable position that what you're suggesting, as they didn't sell studios off. They are still a pale shadow of what they were once. These kinds of transitions never go smoothly.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Oh jesus christ, here we go again. Why does it seem like the only company to get regular posts, editorials and so on about their losses this gen, is Sony? It's on a WEEKLY basis it seems. Other companies lose money, maybe not as much as Sony lately, but it seems like everyone just has it out for them. They've made mistakes (hence why I didn't get a PS3 at launch) but they've come a long way since then..

I'm just so very tired of all these doom and gloom articles about financials. I just like to talk about good GAMES, not bad sales, especially during a time when Sony's PS3 sales dipped and their P&R had to handle a shitstorm with the hacking fiasco. They constantly had hackers and hacker collectives threatening their security. Leading up to that, their sales were growing consistently so I dunno why everyone is turning a blind eye to that and are now running around yelling DOOOOOOOOOMED from the rooftops.

This. And the amount of people who have no clue what they are talking about in such threads is incredible. Sony is a big company. They have 168,200 employees and had a operating revenue of $79 billion in the last fiscal year, total assets = $167.3 billion, total equity = $25.5 billion). So they lost $1.2 billion or $5.5 billion. Who cares? They will still be there next year, and they will be there in 5, 10 and 20 years.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

Worked great for Sega! But it didn't And they were in the more favorable position that what you're suggesting, as they didn't sell studios off. They are still a pale shadow of what they were once. These kinds of transitions never go smoothly.

Difference is that Sega created all their internal studios... Sony bought theirs. Sony can sell them off as easily as they bought them in the first place. Again, the vast majority of Sony's current studios were independent before being acquired.

A perfect example would be something like Bungie. Independent studio that was acquired by a first party then set free to be independent again.

 

[ghst]

Look at MS and Nintendo's hardware this gen. It's either super dated or doomed to red ring. Only Sony can make cutting edge hardware that is of a high manufacturing standard.

i'd say something about being as cutting edge as the spruce goose, but that work of opulence over function never would've launched with a piss-weak gpu and barely enough ram to run paintbrush.

 

[patsu]

It's more lucrative to create your own platform + titles, than just title businesses. Didn't Iwata say the same thing ?

 

[gundamkyoukai]

There have been multiple articles in the past week about what Nintendo must fix to make a "comeback" with 3DS and WiiU.

Sony gets articles about its financials because the company isn't doing well. They are doing historically bad, even. Pretending like this has no impact on the entertainment division was a lofty goal, but now that's out the window. Kaz has a lot of work cut out for him. Something has to give at the company before it's too late.

If Kaz had any balls the first thing he would do is get rid of the TV part or cut it down by allot.
Who cares how much TVs you sell when they at a lost that would be a good first step .

Those same devs would more than likely keep making games, you would just see a different publishers logo at the beginning. Remember, the vast majority of Sony owned studios were independent before they were acquired.

i know but truth is i think certain games won't get the same budget or treatment if they were not first party .

 

[bangai-o]

Not to mention there budgets are small compare to allot of AAA games.

how small comparably?

 

[patsu]

If Kaz had any balls the first thing he would do is get rid of the TV part or cut it down by allot.
Who cares how much TVs you sell when they at a lost .

Kaz did say he's going to give the TV division a fair shot. He's open to all options, but if it doesn't work out, he will cut his losses too (i.e., get rid of the TV division).

 

[OldJadedGamer]

It's more lucrative to create your own platform + titles, than just title businesses. Didn't Iwata said the same thing ?

I'm sure Activision/Blizzard makes more off their game software than Sony does and they don't make any hardware.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Worked great for Sega! But it didn't And they were in the more favorable position that what you're suggesting, as they didn't sell studios off. They are still a pale shadow of what they were once. These kinds of transitions never go smoothly.

Sega did sell or shut down all their external acquired 1st party studios. Visual Concepts/Kush Games were sold to Take Two, Red Entertainment/Sims/Nextech/Access Games all bought out Sega's take and went independent and No Cliché was shut down.

 

[mysticwhip]

just hitting it's stride

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

Oh dear.

If that's the case, I'd guess Vita being sold at a loss, Vita launch advertising, the PS3 price drop, and underperforming 1st party software as the culprits.





.

They aren't necessarily loosing money off of vita when you add in the super expensive proprietary memory cards they are just barely making a profit. And they spent 50 mill on advertising lmfao thats chump change even for Sony.

 

[patsu]

I'm sure Activision/Blizzard makes more off their game software than Sony does and they don't make any hardware.

A title business is hit and miss. It can also be hit now, misses tomorrow.

A platform business has longer term and sustained advantage if they can get it working.

 

[Anteo]

Sony losing money.

SHOCKING NEWS!

The way you put it. It is sad. =/

 

[Misterhbk]

The way you put it. It is sad. =/

Yeah it's pretty sad, and sucks as I prefer Sony first party games to the other companies, but it's not like they haven't been bleeding for years.

When it boils down to it, if Sony doesn't quickly turn things around I see them becoming "PlayStation" and only do gaming and no longer Sony. Honestly it probably wouldn't be such a bad thing.

They better hope Spiderman is a hit.

 

[bangai-o]

Difference is that Sega created all their internal studios... Sony bought theirs. Sony can sell them off as easily as they bought them in the first place. Again, the vast majority of Sony's current studios were independent before being acquired.

better be careful. those are fightin words around here.

 

[TunaLover]

This is relevant: Sony FY2011: $5.5B Loss; PS3 is #1 despite Thai Flood

SCE lost $1.2B USD, Sony lost $5.5B USD total

Edit: to be fair, it's not really that simple. But basically, SCE is helping drag down Sony.

Holy cow!, SCE is the division with better performance *something* *something*

 

[gundamkyoukai]

Kaz did say he's going to give the TV division a fair shot. He's open to all options, but if it doesn't work out, he will cut his losses too (i.e., get rid of the TV division).

The TV business has been losing money for 10 years now i think it had a fair shot .
Either cut it or sell less TVs at a profit which hard to do unless they come up with new tech because TVs have razor thin profits now.

 

[AAK]

Does anyone know how Sega's earnings were looking before they went 3rd party? Was it worse than this?

 

[patsu]

The TV business has been losing money for 10 years now i think it had a fair shot .
Either cut it or sell less TVs at a profit which hard to do unless they come up with new tech because TV have razor thin profits now.

Not our call. The board and the execs have to take a hard look and decide.

 

[Averon]

Sony just entered a partnership with Panasonic to make OLED TVs. I don't think they're cutting the TV division anytime soon.

 

[Misterhbk]

Sony just entered a partnership with Panasonic to make OLED TVs. I don't think they're cutting the TV division anytime soon.

Banking on OLED huh? The Vita does look sooooo good! Just price your shit right Sony.

 

[EatinOlives]

Sony just entered a partnership with Panasonic to make OLED TVs. I don't think they're cutting the TV division anytime soon.

Yep. I think at first we'll see some kind of downsizing, if anything. God knows their TV division needs downsizing, it's bloated as all hell.

 

[Ryoku]

Banking on OLED huh? The Vita does look sooooo good! Just price your shit right Sony.

OLEDs are fucking sexy as hell. Too bad Microsoft dropped support for Zune a year after I got my Zune HD It's one of the best screens I've laid my eyes on.....

 

[HyperionX]

This. And the amount of people who have no clue what they are talking about in such threads is incredible. Sony is a big company. They have 168,200 employees and had a operating revenue of $79 billion in the last fiscal year, total assets = $167.3 billion, total equity = $25.5 billion). So they lost $1.2 billion or $5.5 billion. Who cares? They will still be there next year, and they will be there in 5, 10 and 20 years.

You should seriously reassess your claims. Sony only has net tangible assets of $20.365 billion as of March 2011, which is basically the total sum of everything that has real value minus their debts. That's before the $5.5 billion loss that they've just annouced.

That means they can only sustain their current rate of losses for about 3 years. Any longer and they will have literally zero net value (i.e. they are worthless as a whole company). The end usually comes pretty soon after a company hits that point. So while they probably will be around in one year, they might be gone in 5 years if Kaz does poorly.

 

[RukusProvider]

Not worried one bit about a Sony less future. If they die off, it's because the competition has done a better job of providing products and services to the consumer. At that point all we are losing is a brand. Outside of corporate worshippers no one will care.

The talent dismissed will still be in the industry.

This applies to any company.

 

[patsu]

Not worried one bit about a Sony less future. If they die off, it's because the competition has done a better job of providing products and services to the consumer. At that point all we are losing is a brand. Outside of corporate worshippers no one will care.

The talent dismissed will still be in the industry.

This applies to any company.

Yap, basically, they should just focus on their job and try to make the best out of it. If they do a great job, people will appreciate their contribution regardless of whether the Sony brand is around or not.

 

[Lord Error]

Difference is that Sega created all their internal studios... Sony bought theirs. Sony can sell them off as easily as they bought them in the first place. Again, the vast majority of Sony's current studios were independent before being acquired.

A perfect example would be something like Bungie. Independent studio that was acquired by a first party then set free to be independent again.

Except for PD, which was still created from scratch but is now kind of a separate entity, Sony's best studios are either internal or have been acquired so long ago that they are completely different now than they were then. Key people would leave and teams would morph into something different, that's almost for sure, IMO. Bungie even has yet to show that they can deliver anything comparable to what they used to. Genre they are tackling doesn't make me feel good about what they're doing either, seeing how many others have failed (and on a personal level, I'll never care about it).

 

[Zabuza]

Man I just want Sony to stay alive.

 

[Misterhbk]

Yap, basically, they should just focus on their job and try to make the best out of it. If they do a great job, people will appreciate their contribution regardless of whether the Sony brand is around or not.

Hypothetically speaking, if Sony was dissolved, I'd hope to god Nintendo acquired studios like Naughty Dog. I'd hate to see what MS would force them to make.

Jak and Daxter Kinect....

That being said, I really don't see Sony, or as I said early, PlayStation going anywhere. If Sony falls, I could see them cutting their losses and keeping the PlayStation brand. PS4 will undoubtedly be much cheaper than the PS3 was and Sony will most likely go into next gen in the position MS is in this gen, right in the middle of the Wii U and the 720.

 

[TunaLover]

I wonder how much money Sony has to pay in debts.

 

[Lhexh]

How the fuck isn't Sony dead? God forbid but, When will they ever make a buck.

 

[Lord Error]

So what's the deal with that chart few pages back that shows SCE made a profit in FY2011? Wasn't that also from some financial report?

 

[Lion Heart]

Not worried one bit about a Sony less future. If they die off, it's because the competition has done a better job of providing products and services to the consumer. At that point all we are losing is a brand. Outside of corporate worshippers no one will care.

The talent dismissed will still be in the industry.

This applies to any company.

Compare Segas games during Dreamcast to post-Dreamcast. Secondly, I don't want to have to pay for Kinect, nor do I want to pay to play online, nor do I want underpowered hardware with a gimmick.

So yes, they would be missed.

 

[Misterhbk]

How the fuck isn't Sony dead? God forbid but, When will they ever make a buck.

they had A LOT of money stockpiled before. Gotta remember, in the 90's and early 2000's Sony was on top. Walkman, PS1, PS2, their tvs, their movies and so on. They could do no wrong.

Then all hell broke loose.

 

[specialguy]

I'm guessing it's true that the PS4 chip is a 1 billion dollar investment.



"The Cell Broadband Engine that powered the PS3 cost $400m to develop; the main SoC for the incoming console is likely to be a 3D stack incorporating thru-silicon-via technology and could be the first $1bn hardware design project."

Umm, LOL no.

Like Sony wasnt losing money hand over fist for years, this is nothing new.

Absent wild Cell style flights of fancy, console R&D shouldn't be that expensive. It's a matter of slapping together some components.

 

[perfectchaos007]

How the fuck isn't Sony dead? God forbid but, When will they ever make a buck.

They should move HQ to America for a government bailout.

 

[Reg]

What's causing the division to lose money?

 

[Auto_aim1]

Hypothetically speaking, if Sony was dissolved, I'd hope to god Nintendo acquired studios like Naughty Dog. I'd hate to see what MS would force them to make.

You really think Nintendo would give them $20-$30 million to make an ambitious AAA game?

Anyway, this shouldn't affect the PS4 as it is vital to their business model, so gimping that is out of the question.

I wonder how much money Sony has to pay in debts.

$12 billion.

What's causing the division to lose money?

Could be many things, 2011 was a bad year for them, so I'm not surprised. I think it includes the PS4 R&D as well.

 

[Misterhbk]

You really think Nintendo would give them $20-$30 million to make an ambitious AAA game?

Anyway, this shouldn't affect the PS4 as it is vital to their business model, so gimping that is out of the question.



$12 billion.

Good point. God Sony, please turn this ship around asap.

 

[BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO]

A no-Sony future is a horrifying thought.

Would probably quit gaming or go PC only. Nintendo cheaps out on hardware and lacks third party support for home consoles And Microsoft is basically satan