BoxManLocke
Member
Marketing so far doesn't line up with such a product, unless you're from 2006 and called Sony.
Team $399 for sure. I believe Microsoft wants to have an impact here.
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Xbox Scorpio Pricing Discussion
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Marketing so far doesn't line up with such a product, unless you're from 2006 and called Sony.
Team $399 for sure. I believe Microsoft wants to have an impact here.
therealbigrich
Member
This is a good example of why I can see it being 400. Add the fact that this is 6-7 months away and getting parts at a substantial price reduction .
Sure they do. They do not indicate a $499+ price point in late 2017.
I still don't think it will have much of an impact at $399, but it sure as hell will perform better than anything above that.
Yep. I think they're talking it up to set the expectation for $499, but will hit $399 for the PR win. Honestly I'm not seeing a whole lot in the specs to suggest anything more than $399
CassidyIzABeast
Member
Its jaguar and a RX 480 with 4 more CUs. Don't let the optimization, liquid cooled vapor chamber, or commercial-grade HVAC centrifugal fan talk fool you into thinking they're only going to make a 5 dollar profit on this thing at $499.
Problem is it's not that simple. You have to look at the other components amd the size of the APU to get a better idea.
Problem is that isn't really what's happening anymore. Major performance increases generally comes from process shrinks. There hasn't been one in the past year.
I'm happy to be wrong but the specs do indicate a $499 price point. Larger APU, more expensive cooling, more memory, 384-Bit interface, UHD player, etc.
It all adds up and I don't see them selling it for less than $449 with $499 being more likely.
Edit:
We'll see. I'd love to be wrong on this.
Nameless
Member
Yeah there very well could be a premium SKU with an Elite controller and beefier hard drive, but $399 makes the most sense, especially since it will likely be sitting next to a $349 Pro and $199 OG consoles(plus some attractive video cards) this holiday. Nice system but ~$600 after tax and a game is a lot to ask for what you're getting, even for the enthusiast crowd.
Jesus Christ People^^^
Also it's 14/16nm chips that make Pro and Scorpio possible.
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
$499
They will not leave money on the table. Sell to the hard core, then lower the price. They are not going mass market with this console, they are going for PR power narrative. The funny part is the battle has moved on, the Scopio is a response to the PS4 vs XB1 power from two years ago, but now it's all about games.
They will not leave money on the table. Sell to the hard core, then lower the price. They are not going mass market with this console, they are going for PR power narrative. The funny part is the battle has moved on, the Scopio is a response to the PS4 vs XB1 power from two years ago, but now it's all about games.
Maxwell House
Member
Why in the hell would Microsoft not aim for mass market? Of course they are and always have. Do you really think Microsoft is ok spending billions to try to just be a niche player? How does that make any sense. They have always aimed for mass market and always will as does Nintendo, Sony and any large company.
MS sees this console as a way to take back the market mindshare.
True but if they go with 399 they can truly win over many more gamers imo.
That's a price even the casual gamer would be tempted to consider especially if they can sell it really well during E3.
Dee Dah Dave
Member
At $499 they ONLY sell it to their hardcore user base, plus one or two stragglers. They aren't gaining anything by selling people an Xbox who already own one.
They want people to come in and buy multiplat software on this thing. That's more valuable in the long term than $50-100 upfront for the price of the console.
They want people to come in and buy multiplat software on this thing. That's more valuable in the long term than $50-100 upfront for the price of the console.
BoxManLocke
Member
Funny part is people bringing up games in hardware discussions like it's relevant.
They aren't aiming for Mass market with Scorpio just like Sony wasn't with the Pro. The OG consoles are for the mass market, the same market where 1080p is good enough.
If AMD have managed to get Microsoft on the hook at premium pricing for a Jaguar and Polaris based APU then they're snake oil salesmen and someone at Microsoft needs to be fired.
TheKastorian
Member
I really don't understand how they could sell this at $399 without taking a loss. 12GB of RAM plus the cooling solution (not to mention GPU etc) will still be pretty damn expensive even by late 2017.
Maxwell House
Member
MS is marketing to get expectations up before E3 that it will cost $599 to get a huge PR win when it's announced at $399. MS is known for lying for marketing purposes. The parts do not warrant a price much higher than $399.
michaelius
Banned
360mm^2 silicon die (GP104 in gtx 1070/1080 is 312, PS4 Pro is 232)
12GB of GDDR5 vs 8 in Pro or gtx1070
384 bit memory bus which complicates mainboard
Vapour Chamber cooling like gtx 780ti/980ti/1080ti
4k BR drive
If it hit's 400$ it will be at near zero profit or loss leader
Yeah I think it's pretty clear you don't even care to understand why your posts are not making sense.
Thank you. This is exactly what I'm talking about.
BoxManLocke
Member
Why is the PR approach so different then ?
Why waste so much on marketing fanfare if this is just supposed to cater to the most hardcore, who were going to buy it no matter what ?
I understand fine why you think all of the tweaks and the larger die make a difference. I simply don't given the age of the underlying architecture.
Yeah I know, but I don't think MS is in a market position to shoot much higher than break-even. The specs are in line with something I would expect a year after the Pro while staying in the same family.
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
We wanted all this power and a premium non cheaped out console right? Now we will pay for it 499.
It's basically the only thing in volume chip manufacturing that makes a cost difference.
Nameless
Member
I think part of waiting nearly a year and a half from announcement to release was precisely to bring costs down. Plus they aren't exactly paying off the shelf prices.
Five seconds shopping for RAM or SD cards, and you'd see the error yourself.
Sell Scorpio at 499 to 1m potential gamers (while making a small profit per sold unit)
or
Sell Scorpio at 399 to 5m+ potential gamers (while taking a loss per sold unit)
If you have the opportunity to sell this to a lot more gamers who will buy your games, subscriptions then selling the console at a loss per unit is the way to go imo considering software income is where its at. Plus you win back a lot more gamers this way for your brand.
or
Sell Scorpio at 399 to 5m+ potential gamers (while taking a loss per sold unit)
If you have the opportunity to sell this to a lot more gamers who will buy your games, subscriptions then selling the console at a loss per unit is the way to go imo considering software income is where its at. Plus you win back a lot more gamers this way for your brand.
SwordStruck
Member
I'm guessing $400, but if it's higher than that I doubt they would price it anywhere above $450.
At the scale MS are buying it won't make a huge difference.
Allonym
There should be more tampons in gaming
If Microsoft even tries to price this machine at $500.00+ they are extremely foolish and will readily be out of the console market by the time the next generation of consoles comes around. They don't have any exclusive content to push people towards the console and if their GFW initiative is all encompassing that will further lessen their consumer base.
PC Gamers likely won't go for it because the games will also be on PC and perform better there. PS gamers will be waiting for something that's defined as a next generational console with far better hardware than Scorpio. With the Scorpio being a stopgap measure and releasing Holiday 2017, that makes the introduction of another console very unlikely to counter PS5 unless it's some upgraded version.
They should've kept pace with the XB1 and waited to release Scorpio with enhanced hardware later but that's done now. Hopefully they learn from '06 Sony and don't release Scorpio for more than $400.00. The XB1 is performing as well as they hoped, why would a more expensive version with upgraded internals with no exclusive software fare any better?
PC Gamers likely won't go for it because the games will also be on PC and perform better there. PS gamers will be waiting for something that's defined as a next generational console with far better hardware than Scorpio. With the Scorpio being a stopgap measure and releasing Holiday 2017, that makes the introduction of another console very unlikely to counter PS5 unless it's some upgraded version.
They should've kept pace with the XB1 and waited to release Scorpio with enhanced hardware later but that's done now. Hopefully they learn from '06 Sony and don't release Scorpio for more than $400.00. The XB1 is performing as well as they hoped, why would a more expensive version with upgraded internals with no exclusive software fare any better?
Fallout-with-swords
Banned
What marketing has there been for the Scorpio? I mean Digital Foundry is a pretty niche site that only "hardcore" gamers would watch or know about.
All their messaging has been that this is not for everyone and it's an enthusiasts machine, I can kind of buy they are dropping hints that it's going to be expensive to then shock people with a lower price, but nothing currently suggest this will or should be $399.
Nobody buys stuff 'no matter what'. Price matters.
The audience for a 500+ dollar console when there's huge competition on shelves is not large.
I think Microsoft is aiming for the E3 PR win by talking up the specs and it being 'premium' all up until the day they announce actual pricing.
They'll announce it at 399USD and people by then will be conditioned to feel that it is exceptional value. It's a smart strategy.
I just think that on GAF, a lot of gamers realize that the components they used really aren't all that unconventional or bleeding-edge to warrant a price above 399USD. Like I said before, it's the Xbox One Pro with the hardware bump expected from a year's delay. I'm convinced they explicitly designed this thing with a fixed 399USD pricepoint in mind.
I don't think they did much of marketing at all. Everything has been pretty low key IMO because they know it won't appeal to the masses.
But little has changed in terms of cost of the architecture. I'm sure yields have improved since the first RX 480 rolled off the line but it's still the same die size as last year.
Judging by this thread and common sense, the consensus is 399.
Pretty good price for whats in the box, too bad my entire library is PS4 games.
I believe the PS5 will be fully backwards compatible so im not gonna jump ship.
For those who are already invested in all things Xbox, you're getting a big bang for the buck here, have fun.
Pretty good price for whats in the box, too bad my entire library is PS4 games.
I believe the PS5 will be fully backwards compatible so im not gonna jump ship.
For those who are already invested in all things Xbox, you're getting a big bang for the buck here, have fun.
You and me both. They know what they gotta do this time around.
MightyHedgehog
Member
Expecting $499, though I hope it's more aggressively priced at $449.
I believe I am in their target demographic; existing users wanting an upgrade. As such, I already have all of this taken care of. It wouldn't really sway me that much.
Edit: A 'power user upgrade' package would be perfect for me. Includes the console and power cable only. Nothing else. Cheapest possible SKU.
And the price of an RX480 has accordingly dropped throughout the year as it's become older technology.
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
499 with 449 being the lowest price point. I know Gaf says it will make more sense to launch it at 399 but Microsoft is not looking at GAF to make there business decisions. Hell I hope for 399 as well but I think it will be priced higher then that.
Papacheeks
Banned
No we're being realistic in what we know will add cost to this unit and how Microsoft won't want to lose money on it as the have with xbox hardware the majority of this gen.
Fredrik
Member
has anybody else started looking for XB1 versions for multiplats yet to prepare to get the console-definitive versions when Scorpio launches?
Awesome 1st party games needs to be shown but to me they definitely sold me on Scorpio from a multiplats perspective in the latest DF videos, unless it's all lies this will be my multiplat console for sure the rest of this generation, well until my PC setup gets upgraded of course. Hype +1!
Price really needs to be below 499 though... Seriously. This can not sell for 499. You hear me, MS?
Awesome 1st party games needs to be shown but to me they definitely sold me on Scorpio from a multiplats perspective in the latest DF videos, unless it's all lies this will be my multiplat console for sure the rest of this generation, well until my PC setup gets upgraded of course. Hype +1!
Price really needs to be below 499 though... Seriously. This can not sell for 499. You hear me, MS?
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