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ARMS Global Testpunch Thread: Let's see if this has LEGS
- Thread starter donkey show
- Start date
wapplew
Member
Grab, grab, grab.
Most of this seems consistent with what I've been able to glean watching what bits of footage I could about the duo...except for the bit about being able to shorthop on Barq. I can't recall off the top of my head that ever being visibly demonstrated. Would a shorthop just be the normal bounce, and you get the high jump....what, by pressing jump again during the springing animation? That particular detail is not mentioned in his ingame notes anywhere.
Anecdotally, I'm sorry to say that last weekend I shared my jokey Flowchart Ninjara image on twitter, and someone this weekend actually commented back talking about how he used it and did much better this weekend as a result.
...What have I done?
Not that surprising with the complaining I hear about Ninjara lol
I do wonder if people realize that Ninjara's air teleport is just an air dash >_>
(like, you can hit him when he reappears and he cannot actually vary when he appears, from what I can understand)
His actual gimmick is easy mode counter move on the ground, which no one does anyway since they like jumping and then random air dash lol
(or because they don't block either :v)
(like, you can hit him when he reappears and he cannot actually vary when he appears, from what I can understand)
His actual gimmick is easy mode counter move on the ground, which no one does anyway since they like jumping and then random air dash lol
(or because they don't block either :v)
Single punch. Or you can just do a grab as well and it'll cancel out. If you're Min Min you can do a backdash. Sometimes it seems like you successfully dodged but it still catches you, that's due to lag.
I feel like I was trying to punch through it but I'd go under and the grab would still get me
Then again my memory might just be bad
That's what I did during the testpunch, I was using Twintelle, kept rushing in against a Ninjara.
He'd jump in the air and do a dash, I jump in the air towards him and wait till he reappears and throw my punch that it hits him.
He must have been overwhelmed since his tactic to just evade then throw an attack wasn't working.
Like, when Ninjara air teleports, I think he has only four options: left, right, forward, backwards.
But you know that people are only using two of those options, so you can narrow down your read to left or right air dash and hit them consistently.
I think this is why I was so mindfucked when a Ninjara simply jumped and then pushed a button lol
But you know that people are only using two of those options, so you can narrow down your read to left or right air dash and hit them consistently.
I think this is why I was so mindfucked when a Ninjara simply jumped and then pushed a button lol
UnemployedVillain
Member
What are you even responding to? Who ever said they would?
I assumed she controlled with her hands.
---
Ya know, people make jokes about Twintelle, but technically Mechanica's the biggest "cheater" using that mech suit of hers lol
AquaWateria
Member
I will give her a break since she's a incredible genius who created a suit from a garage at the age of 15.
There's a set amount of recovery after you use a single punch and before you can do anything other than punch with the other Arm (which you can do immediately). Just to toss out random numbers I'll say this is 30 frames. If I catch you doing that 30-frame recovery it's a guaranteed hit.
When you have both Arms out the recovery of the first Arm is the same (30 frames), but your movement is significantly lessened with both Arms out. So while you can still move after 30 frames, you only get a sort of half dash that makes it difficult to avoid an incoming attack.
If you attack me first all I have to do is connect a punch within that 30 frames and you can't avoid it. If you have both Arms out I have that 30 frames, plus the fact that your movement is impaired after the initial 30 frames.
(again, the 30 frames isn't correct, just a simple example)
In any fighting game the objective is to deplete your opponent's health meter. If I'm playing Tekken I'm going to try to mix you with with high, mid or low attacks, or a throw. I can also use frame advantage to force you on the defensive or eat an attack.
Arms doesn't have any of that. If I don't attack you in Arms all you can do is try to get close to me so I potentially can't react to a throw. My concern is that the best players will be able to react to that throw at close range. When that happens, you have no way to inflict damage if my defense is good and I don't attack first.
Okay, so I watched some of these matches and I'm not seeing how he gets an advantage or opens up the opponent just by curving. Not trying to call out donkey or anything, but he left himself open a lot. The opponent didn't capitalize on it, but there were plenty of times he could've taken damage if he was up against a better player.
You may not see it in my match videos, but what I'm constantly doing is trying to punish everything and do my best to keep myself safe. I'm only a week in so that doesn't happen 100% of the time, but I'm at a point now when I know when someone is open to an attack or when I leave myself open to an attack. It doesn't look like donkey has that down yet. Again, I mean no offense by that.
https://www.primagames.com/games/arms/tips/arms-tips-and-tricks-how-play-nintendo-switch
My current go-to setup with Twintelle is Sparky for the quick shock stun, then Megaton for the big damage follow up. I never attack with Megaton first. If I need more movement I'll swap out Sparky for Thunderbird. If I'm still having trouble catching a highly mobile character I'll switch out the Thunderbird and instead go with the Popper or Cracker because they have a wide hit box.
I believe people will pick the character they mesh with the most in terms of movement options, but the Arms selection is the real character selection of this game. I don't really have any incentive to pick a character other than Twintelle. If I have a matchup issue it's an Arms issue, not a character concern.
I don't mean to call you out, but instead of looking at how you're playing you should be looking at how your opponents are playing. To know whether or not your strategy is valid you need to play someone who's capable of getting around it.
First off, how are you knocking me down? Let's say I messed up. That's on me not being as good. Let's say you closed in on me and I got thrown (this will happen). Now I'm looking for your throw and I'm ready to counter it on wakeup if that's what you do. If you do anything else I can just block.
How many people did you see intentionally interrupting throws with a single punch? That's the kind of stuff you'll see high level players using.
This is 100% correct. All air movements have more recovery than ground movements. If you exhaust all of your aerial options you are completely open to an attack until you hit the ground. Unfortunately, this kind of means people likely won't jump as much at higher levels of play, further limiting your offensive options.
ClayKavalier
Banned
Man, this game has been a roller coaster for me. I went from barely paying attention to it, to having a ton of fun during the first test and pre-ordering, to probably cancelling that preorder.
I played the 11am test today and got my ass completely handed to me. In a majority of matches I played I only landed one or two punches. In the first test I was winning a majority of the time. And I have no clue what went wrong. It was super frustrating, I had no idea how I was supposed to improve. I'd block a throw, throw a punch and have my opponent recover fast enough to block it. I'd throw a punch, it wouldn't reach my opponent and they'd counterattack before I could recover. I couldn't get the hang of punch, very often a punch would come out at a wide angle, or wouldn't react to my inputs as I expected and I had no idea why. I'd throw a punch anticipating a dodge and guess their movement correctly, but my punch would still miss, often seemingly by a hair.
Really fun game but I don't want to spend hours practicing to get the point I won't get destroyed online.
I played the 11am test today and got my ass completely handed to me. In a majority of matches I played I only landed one or two punches. In the first test I was winning a majority of the time. And I have no clue what went wrong. It was super frustrating, I had no idea how I was supposed to improve. I'd block a throw, throw a punch and have my opponent recover fast enough to block it. I'd throw a punch, it wouldn't reach my opponent and they'd counterattack before I could recover. I couldn't get the hang of punch, very often a punch would come out at a wide angle, or wouldn't react to my inputs as I expected and I had no idea why. I'd throw a punch anticipating a dodge and guess their movement correctly, but my punch would still miss, often seemingly by a hair.
Really fun game but I don't want to spend hours practicing to get the point I won't get destroyed online.
That's par the course for fighting games. You can't expect to instantly be good in a few minutes. You need to put the time in to practice.
it works amazing on the toilet. This is what the Wii U was supposed to be like.
I guess you had it easy in the Testpunch too then? I've seen some other press people play on youtube but they didn't seem to play very well, almost never used charge shots. sometimes flailed around and let themselves wide open and lost because of that even during the testpunch against players that didn't have the game early it seems. I fear they haven't really grasped much of the game yet.
I'm curious to see some matches of those Pros @ E³ though.
So, what do you think of Ribbon Girls ability to air jump + air dodge at least twice without touching the ground? I felt like it was stronger than what Ninjara is offering.
I was only home for the Testpunch last Friday. For whatever reason it put me in a room full of Japanese players, which was my first taste of lag, but I ended with 93 points and only one loss in a 1v1 match (due to the lag). Beyond that one match, even with the lag I didn't have any issues winning 1v1 matches and carried my team through the 2v2 matches.
Press are notoriously bad at fighting games. Every single press tournament I've attended for a fighting game I won without any trouble at all. I even won a VF5 (arcade) tournament at Sega's office without having ANY experience in VF prior to that.
I assume all of the people invited to the E3 tournament have the game. I know D1 (one of the commentators) was playing last week. I got a few games in with him. Kayane has only been posting about Tekken, so I'm guessing she's not playing, but who knows. I'm curious if they'll have to play with motion controls or if they can use whatever control option they want.
I tried to get in on that invitational, but press doesn't have the highest priority for obvious reasons.
EDIT: Concerning Ribbon Girl's aerial movement, I just wait for her to punch and get close to the ground. As long as she doesn't connect with her punch she doesn't reset her aerial jumps, so there's a limited number. If I need to create an opening I just wait for her to hit that aerial limit, then attack. I haven't taken a really close look at every character yet (I'll do that this week), but at the moment I think Twintelle and Ribbon Girl are top 2 and Master Mummy is the worst. Helix and Byte/Barq have the highest learning curve so it's hard to say, but both of them and Mummy seem limited against the faster characters.
Not really, they're hard to grab but slow with punches, so it's easy to dode at closer range and counter with a grab (I do have dat reflexes, so that helps a lot in Hoops).
twothunder
Member
Everyone gets knocked down at some point in any game. Everyone. Whether or not a player can take advantage of this is on them.
Also, yes, I am looking at what people are doing... it's why I've been able to punish movement that involved no punches >_>
(actually, one of the first things I'll probably do with the real game is get an excel spread sheet out and map out the possible punishes for each movement option lol)
People I've played have generally not stood there when waking up and will always go to a mobility option.
(which is kind of funny since you can actually just block... but people don't like blocking in games and would rather mash cr lk on wakeup... I've seen dudes wakeup into active supers in this game because they apparently don't know that you can just hold block on wakeup >_>)
You observe what people like doing on wakeup and then input the appropriate response to the option you think they'll go to. When they start using another option, you try to predict this and adjust your response.
I'm not saying that I'll always guess right, but who does?
(I mean... you can play conservatively and just let them wakeup like a true gentleman, but I see no reason to do this if you're confident about your read)
Who are all these people that can react to point blank throw in this game?
I know I can't even after dicking around with friends offline to see whether or not you can actually consistently react to the thing... and this is me expecting it.
(but I'm also 30 and don't have those young man reactions)
It's harder than it seems.
(also, throws have different speeds depending on whether light, medium or heavy arms are equipped, so this is another thing to consider as I've actually not tested whether or not you can actually go through the entire process of wakeup guard and then inputting a punch to cancel the guard and then successfully breaking the fastest throws, assuming fastest reaction possible... this is even before considering the option where someone actually dashes around to mess with your lockon/timing)
You're in this theoretical world where S1 Chun-li is busted because of insta air legs in perfect execution, but Mika getting a random clap in is what bops most people in pools (or in top 32 :v).
Two high level players who can actually react to this stuff will probably be high level for a reason, but I sincerely doubt they can input the correct response to something 100% of the time.
So I see no reason how attacking first can be detrimental considering the options available to all the players.
(and you're not necessarily at a disadvantage for throwing something out there... for example, bird arm will retract quickly even on whiff and this is before considering the idea that you can cancel the majority of recovery and not get bopped if your spacing is not horrible... having read your posts, it honestly feels like you're saying that people are always at a disadvantage when throwing a random limb out because you can theoretically be punished, but people aren't this godlike 100% of the time)
Like... you don't necessarily have linear attack patterns in this game, so that in itself should give people a good idea as to the possibility of how strong offense can be... then we go back into this thing about whether or not it's even possible for people to react to point blank throws 100% of the time (since blocking negates almost all offense and this will be the only option left to someone being aggressive), which I don't think is possible unless you're like Xiaohai who can DP hops in KOF or whatever on reaction (but somehow misses anti-airs in SFV lol).
I mean, you're not really suppose to jump in a lot of FGs either if you can win the ground game.
Jumping is an option in this game, albeit risky, but you need to kind of take it sometimes if you think you can catch someone sleeping. Just like any other FG.
TheMoon
Member
Curving exists in part to get around the block shield in general. There are Arms that go over or around it. Coupled with movement and baiting, you're set.
Where is the incentive for that in any other fighting game?
I don't see it. I'm not buying this "defensive game" argument.
Some of this reads to me like the traditional "high level fighting game vets" are trying to apply that thinking to ARMS instead of playing ARMS like ARMS wants to be played.
Actually, guarding in this game covers all angles.
Having tested it in warmup, guard covers your back too even if it looks like it only covers a specific space in front of your character model.
The only way to break a shield is to throw or wail on it hard enough with super (there actually might be specific arms configuration meant for breaking shields, but I don't know since I don't have the full game yet).
That said, a point I keep bringing back is that I don't know how reactable throws are at certain distances. We can say that we can theoretically break all throws, but in practice, this probably doesn't happen.
Why would you block when 90% of the players follow with a grab anyway?
I would be surprised if they played with anything else but motion controls at this point. It's clear that Nintendo want's to differentiate itself with the joycons from their competitors. -thanks for your insight by the way.
It's true I think, you can guard a bomb that explodes behind you at least.
Refreshment.01
Member
Guard covers all angles, is what i saw also. Easy to see (and probable reason) is in free for alls where attacks can come from all angles and from opponents not facing each other.
And maybe is also the case for some explosive power ups, a player can guard even when it explodes from behind it seems.
TheMoon
Member
I vividly remember hitting people with my Thunderbird or Helix' blue blob arm OVER their shield, though.
They most likely simply stopped blocking the moment they were hit because they didn't expect the thunderbird to hit them from behind after it passed them.
Actually, neutral jump will beat someone who does throw on your wakeup.
So then, to beat your wakeup neutral jump, they jump and then throw you.
But this assumes that they guess correctly and that you will indeed jump on wakeup, but you could also tech left, right, forward or back.
So, you get them to think that you will go to those options, but then you beat their responses by just mashing throw on your wakeup to catch them while they're jumping.
But then they know that you're gonna mash throw on wakeup, so they'll just push a button to beat your wakeup throw.
But then you know that they're gonna punch, so you wake up and then successfully block the punch and use counter move to maybe get a punish assuming you don't mess up.
But you could also tech in a direction to not block altogether... but the enemy can also throw enough stuff out to cover your tech options and you would still have to block anyway.
There's like... a lot of configurations of how wakeup can work.
The mind read flowchart for this is similar to most FGs >_>
TheMoon
Member
Clearly this calls for Nintendo to turn the servers back on so we can test this for another, say, 500 hours or so
Just to be sure.
donkey show
Member
It's not a problem. ^^ I can see the reads, throw out to force action so I can react, and aim to punish landings, but the execution needs to be tighter and I need a better sense of spacing. I sometimes think I have more options to protect my own landings or give follow up attacks because of my Gundam EXVS background and the options they give you there. I also attempt to bait a lot which does leave myself open a fair amount. In EXVS, you don't have the luxury of playing the waiting game since there are multiple vectors of attack you have to worry about with it being 2v2. I'm also impatient, so that doesn't help. xD You're right in the fact playing the wait and react game is the way to go.
Anyway, it's become a lot better each testpunch though. You could argue the amount of time we've had with the game is still technically day 1/2-ish. And I'm sure once we have more intimate time with the game like you have, those habits will get better. I do appreciate your insight, so that's been helpful.
Plus that TT vid is so bad when I look at it again. Hardly doing stalls and extra dashes unlike the later vids!
Unicorn said:
As a big GVS fan, ARMS is exciting as it does bring 3D arena fighting more to the foreground. It's also fun because of its limitations in comparison to GVS. In that game, you have long range/close range options, cancels, formations, assisting your partner, need for more spatial awareness, lots of mobility and so on while being centered around 2v2 team gameplay. ARMS has effectively ripped out half of that, but still manages to be intriguing and scratch that itch. It does make me wish there were more close range options though, like if we could coil up our arms for some quicker short-range multi hitting combos or something like that.
And if you guys have any passing interest in gameplay similar to ARMS, please check out our Gundam Versus thread as the main series is finally coming stateside and they are currently running a trial version this month similar to the Testpunch: http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1383438
TheMoon
Member
And if you guys have any passing interest in gameplay similar to ARMS, please check out our Gundam Versus thread as the main series is finally coming stateside and they are currently running a trial version this month similar to the Testpunch: http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1383438
looks so good! :O
My friends were actually playing this on another setup lol
That said, I'm probably gonna show up to local anime meets and will play the game there since the setup for locals is too complicated on our own...
I'll just play Arms while I'm waiting for my turn on the setups lol
Clearly this calls for Nintendo to turn the servers back on so we can test this for another, say, 500 hours or so
Just to be sure.
The game will be released in roughly 264 hours though, so I guess 263 hours would suffice.
Yes a lot can happen, but honestly I'd avoid all the drama entirely and dodge to one side when waking up, I haven't been hit when standing up at all in the whole 10h I've played during the testpunch, granted some have tried and those who tried got countered most of the time by a punch of my own. Also jumping(without air-dodging at least) seems to be the most risky move.
ARMS and GVS are definitely my two most anticipated games at the moment.As a big GVS fan, ARMS is exciting as it does bring 3D arena fighting more to the foreground. It's also fun because of its limitations in comparison to GVS. In that game, you have long range/close range options, cancels, formations, assisting your partner, need for more spatial awareness, lots of mobility and so on while being centered around 2v2 team gameplay. ARMS has effectively ripped out half of that, but still manages to be intriguing and scratch that itch. It does make me wish there were more close range options though, like if we could coil up our arms for some quicker short-range multi hitting combos or something like that.
And if you guys have any passing interest in gameplay similar to ARMS, please check out our Gundam Versus thread as the main series is finally coming stateside and they are currently running a trial version this month similar to the Testpunch: http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1383438
your gifs reminding me of all the stuff I can't do and suck at in Gundam D=
TheMoon
Member
I maths good.
Steve McQueen
Member
Got dayum. After the first testpunch I thought ' nice, may buy this'. But during the second testpunch I switched to the ProController and suddendly it clicked.
Honestly, all I can't think of now is playing Arms. I suck a fighting games but now I actually feel in controle of what I'm doing and even managed to win a few rounds.
Really feels good.
Pre-ordered Arms and a set of neon yellow joycons so. bring on june 16 😉
Honestly, all I can't think of now is playing Arms. I suck a fighting games but now I actually feel in controle of what I'm doing and even managed to win a few rounds.
Really feels good.
Pre-ordered Arms and a set of neon yellow joycons so. bring on june 16 😉
So... you pre-ordered the yellow joycons to play ARMS on your Pro Controller?
Steve McQueen
Member
Sounds crazy doesn't it 😅 Playing on the go I will use the joycons attached. Also... I love the colors. Hope the Splatoon 2 Joycons will be available for pre-order soon, will get them too .
Animated shorts aren't cheap basically. You don't just create them for fun.
I think - unless you override it with the target toggle - all characters default to targetting the player who last made contact with them
casey_contra
Member
I was sold on ARMS... but what the testpunch sold me on was Party Mode. I feel like I might usually stray from modes like that but the "room" is executed so well.
Anyone else feel similarly?
Anyone else feel similarly?