Support NeoGAF

[Mandelbo]

Fast Travel is back?


fuck

To be fair, I'm perfectly fine with fast travel from the start so long as there are far fewer bonfires, like one per area or so, balanced out with more loop around shortcuts. I'd much rather an area had lots of shortcuts and alternative routes that looped back to one central bonfire rather than having lots of bonfires dotted around the area. That way, you could still have fast travel while also maintaining interesting level design.

e:

Honestly, sounds like DkS2 is worth your time if you haven't checked that out. While I understand some of the 'hate' the game gets, the DLC is seriously phenomenal and adds like 50% more content to the game. Worth dipping your toes just for that honestly.

Worth bearing in mind here that the death penalty is much harsher in DS2 than it is in DS1. While in DS1 your health only got cut if you were killed via curse, in DS2 your health gets cut by 10%(?) every time you die up to a minimum of 50% of your total health. This can be slowed with a ring you find early on, but getting rid of it completely requires beating all the DLC first.

 

[RangerBAD]

You can choose.

Very nice.

 

[HK-47]

Most likely. It would probably be too much with the weapon arts system.

As much as I liked Power Stancing, I'm somewhat glad they're not keeping it. If they didn't have anything to replace it with, then it would be a shame, but as it is, it just means Dark Souls II has it as its own thing, it's always nice to have particular elements to each game.

Except when those elements are so awesome they should be carried over, like powerstancing.

 

[Game4life]

This looks like a good game, but its probably going to be a bad bloodborne game.

Truth.

Footage actually looks kind of boring.

 

[HK-47]

Thats actually been known for sometime. As long as the world is on par with ds1, im fine with it.

Part of what made the world of DS1 was the lack of fast travel until Anor Londo.

 

[V-Faction]

I do not want Fast Travel until it is no longer feasible in the game world to progress comfortably without Fast Traveling.

Ergo: Make it an unlock. Or, artificially bump up the load times to make you feel more incentivized to use shortcuts even if they equal the same length of time.

 

[Srey Plaughtered]

To be fair, I'm perfectly fine with fast travel from the start so long as there are far fewer bonfires, like one per area or so, balanced out with more loop around shortcuts. I'd much rather an area had lots of shortcuts and alternative routes that looped back to one central bonfire rather than having lots of bonfires dotted around the area. That way, you could still have fast travel while also maintaining interesting level design.

I personally am in Team #NoWarp but I can see them making warps interesting by not letting you warp to every bonfire. Let's say if there are 4 Bonfires in an area, you're only able to warp from and to one main bonfire of that area and not from the others. Kind of like Archstones except these arch-bonfires let you warp from-and-to other arch-bonfires only. You'll still be able to use the other bonfires for the usual things like leveling & resting. It'll encourage more exploration at least.

Partly why I don't remember much of Dark 2's levels is because how everything was made easy with warping whereas Dark Souls 1 is still fresh in my mind.

 

[Mandelbo]

I personally am in Team #NoWarp but I can see them making warps interesting by not letting you warp to every bonfire. Let's say if there are 4 Bonfires in an area, you're only able to warp from and to one main bonfire of that area and not from the others. Kind of like Archstones except these arch-bonfires let you warp from-and-to other arch-bonfires only. You'll still be able to use the other bonfires for the usual things like leveling & resting. It'll encourage more exploration at least.

Partly why I don't remember much of Dark 2's levels is because how everything was made easy with warping whereas Dark Souls 1 is still fresh in my mind.

That's sort of what I think will happen if the rumours of being able to make your own bonfires are true. Pre-existing bonfires could be warpable and fairly scarce, while player made bonfires wouldn't be available for warping and would essentially serve as checkpoints. In order to stop you from making too many bonfires, they could make it so the only way of getting more bonfire swords is to reclaim ones you've already used, thus destroying the bonfire.

 

[Killer Queen]

If you look closely, there are heads on the sides too along with hair. Whatever it is, is a mass of women fused into some centipede beast.

Because Gaping dragon and Queelag weren't enough. I'll be shocked and impressed if they really go through with a god damn human centipede. That's extreme even for From

 

[T.O.P]

I personally am in Team #NoWarp but I can see them making warps interesting by not letting you warp to every bonfire. Let's say if there are 4 Bonfires in an area, you're only able to warp from and to one main bonfire of that area and not from the others. Kind of like Archstones except these arch-bonfires let you warp from-and-to other arch-bonfires only. You'll still be able to use the other bonfires for the usual things like leveling & resting. It'll encourage more exploration at least.

Partly why I don't remember much of Dark 2's levels is because how everything was made easy with warping whereas Dark Souls 1 is still fresh in my mind.

This i would like, the less the better

Also yeah, i can't remember shit about DkS2, most of the time i had zero clue about wich area were connected to the other

 

[Gator86]

I do not want Fast Travel until it is no longer feasible in the game world to progress comfortably without Fast Traveling.

Ergo: Make it an unlock. Or, artificially bump up the load times to make you feel more incentivized to use shortcuts even if they equal the same length of time.

This is a hilariously ridiculous idea. I've seen a lot of bad game ideas online, but this might be the worst. Artificially increasing load times to irritate players using a particular mechanic just because you don't like it? Wow.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

This is a hilariously ridiculous idea. I've seen a lot of bad game ideas online, but this might be the worst. Artificially increasing load times to irritate players using a particular mechanic just because you don't like it? Wow.

Yeah, I really hope that's a joke. lol

 

[Grief.exe]

I'm of a mind that the bonfire warping from the beginning of Dark Souls II was less of a gameplay decision and more of a realization the world they created was not intrinsically connected.

IE warping from the start leads to less interesting world building. Dark Souls had all these interesting connections and shortcuts that were completely lost in the sequel.

 

[Manu]

I'm of a mind that the bonfire warping from the beginning of Dark Souls II was less of a gameplay decision and more of a realization the world they created was not intrinsically connected.

IE warping from the start leads to less interesting world building. Dark Souls had all these interesting connections and shortcuts that were completely lost in the sequel.

It was actually the other way around iirc. They made a ton of areas that were supposed to be connected but didn't actually have time to do it so what we got was just thrown around in a hurry.

 

[Memento]

Oh.My.God.

I take away everything I've said about the graphics in the gameplay trailer thread. This looks amazing (still not Bloodborne art direction amazing though). It is so fucking good. I want it now!

The only problem I have is that the walking is really faster, and even though I don't have a problem with adding speed to the combat, I think it needs to work together with the animations, because it is kind of weird-looking and distracting the way the movement is now. It looks like a speed up video. Really weird.

Otherwise, Day-0 as always. Also, I was weak and watched the Boss video... I REGRET NOTHING. Delicious enemy design, arghhhh!

 

[Trakan]

I'm of a mind that the bonfire warping from the beginning of Dark Souls II was less of a gameplay decision and more of a realization the world they created was not intrinsically connected.

IE warping from the start leads to less interesting world building. Dark Souls had all these interesting connections and shortcuts that were completely lost in the sequel.

Warping has nothing to do with how well the game world can be designed. DS1 even goes against your theory. In a later patch, they made a whole bunch of existing bonfires newly warpable and included all the DLC bonfires as warpable as well. It's about convenience. You shouldn't have to backtrack tediously through areas to reach the one you want to actually get to.

 

[Mandelbo]

It was actually the other way around iirc. They made a ton of areas that were supposed to be connected but didn't actually have time to do it so what we got was just thrown around in a hurry.

I remember reading the design works interview and I think there was something about the team having to scrap quite a large chunk of the game midway through development, and had to rework what they already had to fit the new direction. There're remnants of this left in the game too - iirc, Drangleic Castle was actually supposed to have another entrance via the aquaduct you can see in the Shaded Woods, which you can still see parts of if you look at the game files.

 

[HK-47]

Yeah, I really hope that's a joke. lol

Hey they already did it basically in BB when they decided you had to go to the fucking Hunter's Dream every time you wanted to fast travel.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

Hey they already did it basically in BB when they decided you had to go to the fucking Hunter's Dream every time you wanted to fast travel.

lmao

 

[Jombie]

That's the biggest issue with Bloodborne; it's why I'm glad there's no disconnected hub in this game.

 

[SamusPrime]

I thought both the DeS and DS1 worlds were quite perfect in their own respective rights serving each game in terms of levels & hub and open world & bonfires. After that, it seems like they keep fixing something that's not broken and not getting it as right as either of those.

 

[Srey Plaughtered]

That's sort of what I think will happen if the rumours of being able to make your own bonfires are true. Pre-existing bonfires could be warpable and fairly scarce, while player made bonfires wouldn't be available for warping and would essentially serve as checkpoints. In order to stop you from making too many bonfires, they could make it so the only way of getting more bonfire swords is to reclaim ones you've already used, thus destroying the bonfire.

Oh yeah, I totally forgot about the making your own bonfire rumor. The part at 1:10 in the trailer might be it. I'm guessing you'll have to physically go and reclaim your bonfire or else it'll be really exploitable. That's a lot more interesting than simply finding bonfires. As for how many we'll be able to place

Spoiler

I imagine it'll have something to do with the whole Lords of Cinder thing. The more lords you hunt down, the more bonfires you could place.

This i would like, the less the better

Also yeah, i can't remember shit about DkS2, most of the time i had zero clue about wich area were connected to the other

Dark 2 took many steps in the right direction but quite a few in the wrong ones as well, though part of the level design and connectivity issues were due to developmental issues iirc. Not entirely sure.

 

[GwyndolinCinder]

Warping has nothing to do with how well the game world can be designed. DS1 even goes against your theory. In a later patch, they made a whole bunch of existing bonfires newly warpable and included all the DLC bonfires as warpable as well. It's about convenience. You shouldn't have to backtrack tediously through areas to reach the one you want to actually get to.

It has everything about how the game world is designed, ds2 is linear paths cause you can just warp back.
"Backtracking"/ no warping created immersion in ds1 by making you feel trapped in blighttown/ash lake etc

 

[The Xtortionist]

Bloodborne had it right, I think. Usually only one lantern per area, with tons of shortcuts that loop back. Even with warping, I know the game like the back of my hand at this point (except Nightmare Frontier - that swamp always throws me for a loop :l).

 

[Gbraga]

So it sounds like DS3 might be worth my time if the hollowed debuffs aren't present, thanks. Hopefully there's an open beta at some point.

Dark Souls 1 doesn't debuff you either. On the contrary, you're safer while hollow, since you can't get invaded.

Except when those elements are so awesome they should be carried over, like powerstancing.

Maybe they thought power stancing would make it too powerful, since it has no limitations as opposed to wepaon arts? I don't know, they must have their reasons, the HUD alone shows that they're not shying away from picking up stuff from Dark II they think they should.

If absolutely everything good about Dark Souls II is in Dark Souls III and more, it kinda makes Dark II obsolete, and I wouldn't like that. I like having reasons to replay every single Souls game all the time.

 

[FlyingSaucer]

I hope From bring back the unlimited Curse stacking from vanilla Dark Souls 1 !

 

[Iva Demilcol]

This looks like a good game, but its probably going to be a bad bloodborne game.

Best thing that could happen to DS III.


=D

 

[theSlacker]

Thats actually been known for sometime. As long as the world is on par with ds1, im fine with it.

That is the rub though, isn't it? A game designed around knowing fast travel will always be there is different from one designed when it is not. Sure. they can make the choice to try and make the world flow as much as one without fast travel would but we will not know that till the game itself comes out.

Truthfully I would still prefer no warping right away even with the better designed world, but it having that better design and warping is still better then it not being designed well like DS2.

 

[DaciaJC]

Sounds like they're getting rid of power-stancing in favor of these weapon arts. That's disappointing, as it was one of the best improvements Dark Souls II brought to the series.

Hopefully parrying with bare fists/gloves/gauntlets is still allowed.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

I do not want Fast Travel until it is no longer feasible in the game world to progress comfortably without Fast Traveling.

Ergo: Make it an unlock. Or, artificially bump up the load times to make you feel more incentivized to use shortcuts even if they equal the same length of time.

This is one of the worst ideas I've read today.

Seriously, all souls games (including Bloodborne) has had fast travel, there's no reason not to have it in DS III.

 

[Melchiah]

So, no more dedicated heal button? Hmm.

So, how are you healing yourself in the heat of the battle? Genuine question. I haven't played Dark Souls, and don't remember how it was in Demon's Souls. Loved the triangle button for healing in Bloodborne. Saved and damned my ass countless of times.

 

[Tactics18]

DaveControl's remarks about the level design in the demo are a little concerning.

But it's an alpha build so I'm not going to read too much into it just yet.

 

[The Xtortionist]

So, how are you healing yourself in the heat of the battle? Genuine question. I haven't played Dark Souls, and don't remember how it was in Demon's Souls. Loved the triangle button for healing in Bloodborne. Saved and damned my ass countless of times.

You press the item button while your healing item is selected

 

[Auctopus]

So, how are you healing yourself in the heat of the battle? Genuine question. I haven't played Dark Souls, and don't remember how it was in Demon's Souls. Loved the triangle button for healing in Bloodborne. Saved and damned my ass countless of times.

You have to have your healing item selected and use the 'use item' button.

 

[sn00zer]

The press sucks at games.

Devs always turn the difficulty way down when demoing games like this.

Of course.

So lame they turn down the difficulty just to help some lame ass journos who have 10 meetings to attend that day and are required to play and take notes on the game in the middle of a floor of crowded people because their job literally depends on it.

 

[Dynasty8]

I really hope they get rid of Chalice Dungeons and focus on additional areas for the game. As amazing as Bloodborne was, Chalice Dungeons were generic and boring. A HUGE part of what makes Souls games so amazing is the level design...randomly generated areas don't work too well IMO.

 

[Melchiah]

You press the item button while your healing item is selected

So you have to juggle between healing and offensive items during the battle. Not to mention, if you need to use something like antidote as well. Plus, the healing item will take one quick inventory slot. Can't say I like it that way.

 

[Manmademan]

This looks like a good game, but its probably going to be a bad bloodborne game.

I understood this reference.gif

 

[Gbraga]

I really hope they get rid of Chalice Dungeons and focus on additional areas for the game. As amazing as Bloodborne was, Chalice Dungeons were generic and boring. A HUGE part of what makes Souls games so amazing is the level design...randomly generated areas don't work too well IMO.

Yuuup. Hopefully they realized it was trash and never go back to it.

 

[Melchiah]

Yuuup. Hopefully they realized it was trash and never go back to it.

To call them trash is nothing short of hyperbole.

 

[Zaventem]

To call them trash is nothing short of hyperbole.

I think they're trash too. I'm forcing myself to get the plat. I rather see all that work made for a well made developer level. I think the idea has some merit though. Maybe we'll get some form of a boss rush in the future.

 

[Grief.exe]

It was actually the other way around iirc. They made a ton of areas that were supposed to be connected but didn't actually have time to do it so what we got was just thrown around in a hurry.

Same end result, but that's interesting.

Warping has nothing to do with how well the game world can be designed. DS1 even goes against your theory. In a later patch, they made a whole bunch of existing bonfires newly warpable and included all the DLC bonfires as warpable as well. It's about convenience. You shouldn't have to backtrack tediously through areas to reach the one you want to actually get to.

So your point is, From designed the world around getting the ability to warp, then added more convenient bonfires after you acquire that ability. Yet this discounts my opinion?

I don't think you thought this through.

 

[Arby 'n' the Chief]

I really hope they get rid of Chalice Dungeons and focus on additional areas for the game. As amazing as Bloodborne was, Chalice Dungeons were generic and boring. A HUGE part of what makes Souls games so amazing is the level design...randomly generated areas don't work too well IMO.

Agreed, it was really annoying traveling the same recycled areas over and over just to fight scrub bosses, and they didn't even get interesting until after you did 5-6 dungeons

 

[bidguy]

So you have to juggle between healing and offensive items during the battle. Not to mention, if you need to use something like antidote as well. Plus, the healing item will take one quick inventory slot. Can't say I like it that way.

thats part of the difficulty.

youll get used to it eventually no need to make them change it and cater to the weak

 

[Jobbs]

I love how it looks. I want it so bad. Finally a new gen Dark Souls.

 

[Gbraga]

To call them trash is nothing short of hyperbole.

No, it really isn't, I do think they're garbage. Straight up.

It has a couple of cool bosses, but even then, having to do garbage dungeons to get to them makes it worse.

I wish the campaign had more bosses instead of making more bosses and locking them behind chalice dungeons.

Btw, where is your avatar from? Reminds me of the eyes that appear on TV in Alan Wake.

 

[Melchiah]

I think they're trash too. I'm forcing myself to get the plat. I rather see all that work made for a well made developer level. I think the idea has some merit though. Maybe we'll get some form of a boss rush in the future.

I've went through them all, and found the later ones more entertaining and challenging. I've actually continued playing fetid+rotten root variants of them after getting the platinum.

It makes me gringe when something is labelled trash, eventhough it's just a matter of taste. Visit the Bloodborne threads, and you can see many players enjoying them.

thats part of the difficulty.

youll get used to it eventually no need to make them change it and cater to the weak

So, Bloodborne is catering the weak? Is this some kind of new hardcore stance, that I've missed somehow?

Ease of use isn't the same as easy. You shouldn't have to fight against the interface as well.



EDIT:

No, it really isn't, I do think they're garbage. Straight up.

It has a couple of cool bosses, but even then, having to do garbage dungeons to get to them makes it worse.

I wish the campaign had more bosses instead of making more bosses and locking them behind chalice dungeons.

Btw, where is your avatar from? Reminds me of the eyes that appear on TV in Alan Wake.

It's a pic of my own eye.

I don't think the BB campaign was lacking in any way, and I kinda liked the idea that some of the hardest bosses could only be found in the chalices. Apart from the first Pthumeru chalices, they didn't feel tiresome to me at all.

 

[pmj]

I watched three minutes of the 16 minute IGN video and really regretted it because of the spoilers. Then, a few hours later, I watched the rest.

Fuck this looks good. Like some others I have concerns about them lifting things from Bloodborne that don't belong in a Souls game, but it's still clearly a lot more Souls than Bloodborne so I think I can live with it.I just hope that the whole game won't have a grey filter over it.

 

[Gbraga]

Ease of use isn't the same as easy. You shouldn't have to fight against the interface as well.

While I agree with your overall sentiment and have nothing against the way healing is handled in Bloodborne, the same could be said for it. People who played their previous games had to fight against the interface to adapt to this new method of healing and transforming your weapon. Many people struggled with not pressing /\ to transform, especially those who were using weapons that went into a 2 handed mode when transformed.

I watched three minutes of the 16 minute IGN video and really regretted it because of the spoilers. Then, a few hours later, I watched the rest.

Fuck this looks good. Like some others I have concerns about them lifting things from Bloodborne that don't belong in a Souls game, but it's still clearly a lot more Souls than Bloodborne so I think I can live with it.I just hope that the whole game won't have a grey filter over it.

I really hope they do the same as they did in Dark Souls 1, the moment you step into a new area, it gets a different filter and lighting. Might not be the most organic or consistent solution, but I love it. Blighttown wouldn't feel nearly the same if it didn't get the piss filter.

 

[doofy102]

Simply watching the guy jog around that area is satisfying. Classic Souls level design doing wonders.