brandonh83
Banned
It's not, though.
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Final Fantasy XV Episode Duscae 2.0 coming in May | Trailer at E3, more at Gamescom
- Thread starter LuuKyK
- Start date
It's not, though.
SolidSnakex
Member
It's not a sequel. They're going to patch the demo to address some of the issues that people had with it.
YankeeDonB
Member
I wouldn't think this even needs to be said, but Japan has many people with many different viewpoints. Are there cultural trends that, from a humanistic Western standpoint seem odd or troubling? Sure. But so too in every country (including Western ones). And even so, none of these enjoy approbation across all demographics in Japan.
If this isn't just a hyperbolic way of saying you wish basic feminism had more broad acceptance in Japan (which, so do I, and likewise in India, the US, and every other country), but is actually reflective of your opinion of the entire country en toto, you're being very reductive.
Note, I'm not embracing moral relativism here - I think a strong universal case can be made for treating all humans with dignity and respect. But to suggest that Japan as a whole has a unique problem with this versus other countries is silly. With literally minimal effort I could marshal far more egregious offenses to human dignity in any country than an objectified side character designed for the male gaze or some ill considered words about female character design made off the cuff by a marketing director.
CrowDieSlow
Banned
I have to ask, why does Tabata or anyone at SE need to justify Cidney being sexy? This whole argument seems like it's extremely overblowing something that really shouldn't be an issue.
Cause people love being morally outraged and offended.
I should go back and count the amount of times they apologized in the video.
Apology Fantasy XV.
The Smoking Bun
Banned
I can't wait until S-E signs another promotional deal, this time with AutoZone and then they dress Cindy up in the greasiest, manliest uniform possible and she gives you terrible customer service instead of being bubbly.
Pictured: The internet cheering for interesting character design.
Are you saying Cindy covered head to toe in oil and grease wouldn't be sexy?
Having her crawl out from under a car all sweaty and mucky is more appealing than what we got
In that case I have no interest in enjoying media that comes from such a culture. If I'm a prudish nun for wanting a mechanic to dress properly for work then so be it. The problem here is that developer or marketer fails to understand why this is a problem and then the Marketer calls us hypocrites for wanting a female member in the group because female member apparently implies she has to be sex-pot despite previous games proving otherwise.
I would rather they went full Micheal Bay and have slow-mo closeups of Cindy's boobs rather than pretend she doesn't exist mostly for titillation
They don't need to. They should ideally be open and say, "Yes Cindy was designed for the boys, you can pose her and ogle her all you please" but instead they act all embarrassed and say she's not meant to be erotic
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
If I may make a few assumptions about why this complain keeps happening, I think it's a combination of
1) Final Fantasy historically having some western appeal beyond a super niche audience like say, Neptunia.
2) Final Fantasy sporting a more realistic (though stylized) aesthetic than some more niche JRPGs. What I mean is that it just sticks out more when a game has a more realistic design then a completely unrealistic looking, cartoony game.
This isn't meant as a "group A is right" or "group A is wrong" statement, mind. It's just an observation as to why this particular incident of a pandering design is getting a lot more attention/scrutiny.
ActuallyHulk
Banned
I'm glad they're looking into the lock-on and camera movement.
ãInaba Residentã
Banned
Its a patch.
SolidSnakex
Member
I remember someone asking Kamiya if he's ever apologized for Bayonetta and his exact response was "Apologize? No fucking way!".
Cause Japan is the only country in the world that sexualizes women? You yourself just listed Michael Bay an American as an example for his movies oversexualizing women . Are you gonna boycott American culture now? lol
The Smoking Bun
Banned
Very good catch. When your game looks like GTA + Monster Hunter with realistic bodies and clothing made by & sold by a real company then when you introduce a character dressed like Cindy it sticks out like sore thumb. She's more Debbie Does Dallas than Rosie the Riveter
I probably should have shortened culture to company/creator. I avoided and dislike the Transformers movies, so I'll avoid FFXV too. Most likely I'll still play it but bargain bin or brought second hand just for everything else
Leaving all exaggerations and hyperbole aside, I just want them to admit that Cindy was designed for titillation purposes. Something for the boys to dream about on those long and lonely nights
CrowDieSlow
Banned
I really don't think they should be put in that position in the first place though.
RPGCrazied
Member
Nice. Never seen an update on a Demo before, from anyone. My biggest problem was the framerate and 0 AA. It was rough.
and that is your own point of view.. Stop trying to force it on everyone else by making yourself sound all high and mighty.
The sweet thing about being a human is that not all of us feel the same way and that's ok. I jump the gun a bit in this thread since it is technically on topic but in others it gets tiring reading through post after post of dudes/dudettes telling you that you should be outraged over a design and if you aren't you obviously are sexist (or a pedo). Again I am more than ok with people not liking the design, feeling it to be gross and I also agree that they should just admit it is a sexy design made to be sexy because there isn't anything wrong with that. I stop being ok with it when it starts to dominate threads not about it, people start putting down whole cultures and people, and generally start acting like some better than thou type jerkoff (not you btw). It is really hard to have a legit discussion of anything if one person is approaching it as if they are this superior being for not fucking liking a design.
This has bee gradually getting worse over the whole forum as of late. And I know I know, if I don't like it...then leave but still I just want people to know how irritating it can be to go into a thread and see the same arguments and no one respecting the other side making it more pointless.
Itchy//Tasty
Member
So are we looking at new content, or just changes to the system and mechanics? I think some new enemies would be cool.
threelights
Member
Hah. If someone at Square does that, people (mainly GAF) will eat them alive for it.
Either way, too bad to see that this thread became mainly this... Guess I'll have to stop visiting FFXV threads too.
I don't care though, I've seen that they will be shitting all over the game's systems due to fans, so that's more than enough to kill a lot of my hype and make me go look somewhere else =X
SolidSnakex
Member
This is what's on the table for 2.0
http://gematsu.com/2015/04/final-fa...full-report-episode-duscae-2-0-coming-mid-may
The Smoking Bun
Banned
Point taken. But would you care to elaborate on the "other side" that isn't getting much air time? I also apologize if I insulted any culture or implied that you or anyone else was sexist.
My Final Statement on the Cindy issue: Me no like Cindy. Me not buy. Maybe second hand.
On the other hand I'm totally drooling at all this. FFXV will be my first proper Final Fantasy game and besides one or two issues is practically tailor made for me
artsi
Member
They're most likely just doing changes to the engine, fighting system etc., improvements that carry on to the main game. Demo should have enough content already for the feedback purposes.
And about Cindy, personally I like her and her design.
BossDarkseid
Member
We might not even get it. It depends on if they can even patch it to the public. If not, they'll have it at trade shows and the like.
Felessan
Member
I just remembered what exactly it reminds me...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up7pvPqNkuU
And it's a perfectly mainstream video which heavily exploit sexualization of characters.
And I don't really understand the root of complaint. Every attractive girl I know exploit their attractiveness in some way. Not usually in such exaggerated way, but they still do use they attractiveness (and sexiness too) for their own benefit. Everyone, both men and women knows it, and music/film industry exploited it for decades. But it suddenly became bad if it's shown in game, that is just beyond my comprehension.
It's not like it is a first time such exaggeration is used. Watch this video - it does have some "mechanics" that even less dressed than Cindy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up7pvPqNkuU
And it's a perfectly mainstream video which heavily exploit sexualization of characters.
And I don't really understand the root of complaint. Every attractive girl I know exploit their attractiveness in some way. Not usually in such exaggerated way, but they still do use they attractiveness (and sexiness too) for their own benefit. Everyone, both men and women knows it, and music/film industry exploited it for decades. But it suddenly became bad if it's shown in game, that is just beyond my comprehension.
I don't feel they're being subtle about her role from a design perspective, but she does serve a role beyond that as a facilitator for vehicle-related gameplay. In my mind, she exists primarily as a game mechanic, and her design is mostly fluff. It's a personal choice.
It seems a bit ridiculous to demand realism in design for the female NPC when all of the game's main cast of characters are dressed rather ridiculously (none of them are sensibly dressed). I don't quite understand your developer/marketer analogy; are you suggesting that women who bare skin are sex-pots?
I feel anger over unfair treatment is a factor. Pretty people may not all have easy lives, but it cannot be denied that attractiveness can greatly impact your interactions and outcomes with other people. It's a huge advantage to have in life, and it is certainly not fair. It's understandable to strive for a level playing field, even when it's not realistic.
Fair enough. In other threads with similar topics, most of the thread is just people insulting each other in the most covert ways (both sides) so any actual dialog is drowned out which makes the entire topic a chore....especially when there are more interesting things to talk about generally.
If you feel that way , it great and I respect that...its when someone feels that way and expects others to feel the same way and if they don't they must be sexist or something.
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
I don't think the question is so much about mainstream as it is about balance. Games have a history of being too pandering in their designs and the complaints come I think not from a desire to eliminate, but to balance.
And FF gets more attention in this regard because it's considered one of the biggest franchises in the industry. It's, in effect, an industry representative, as it were.
I'm not happy with this. You could say everything in a game is pandering to a demographic. I don't see how this is a bad thing.
illmatic22
Banned
LOL Gtfo with that, what happened JP? NA too stronk
Is Colony 6/9 really a grassland or more of a town area? I'm not sure I want a bunch of man-made buildings filling up what's obviously supposed to be an open natural environment landscape filled with small-medium-large wildlife. Once you fill it up with man-made clutter it no longer becomes a grassland. I think we're still getting small settlements here and there in the final world. I've seen some grasslands in Xenoblade and they're basically like FFXV but even flatter and more barren. I think the Duscae region is interesting enough, they just need to give us more things to do and better quests. We're also still missing Adamantoise in this area.
If they can increase the grass density that cast shadows like in the October build then it'll look a lot better too.
And going out of the restricted area actually shows more elevation changes although graphically unfinished.
Zoe
Member
But this is like one of the worst series to complain about in that regard.
The Smoking Bun
Banned
I agree that they are not being subtle. She wouldn't look out of place in Fast & The Furious but this isn't F'n'F is it? How are Noctis and friends dressed ridiculously? These guys are uber expensive wearing ramp model clothes by virtue of being high society types. Even then they are modest or prudish compared to Miss Visible Bra and Thong. I wasn't making any analogy, the Marketer who was answering questions/commenting on the issues raised said that it was hypocritical for fans to ask for a female companion when they don't like Cindy. I said this before, if Cindy started off as zipped up and then unzipped her jacket slightly to flirt with Noctis or whoever that would make sense. Women who bare-skin aren't sex pots but Square Enix seem to think so.
I think a Rihanna music video is a bad comparison. Again, those women are there for audience appeal, most music videos are sexually charged depending on the song. Is FFXV about sex? Is so then Cindy's design makes sense.
JumPeRJumPzZ
Banned
I hope they remove this dark edges. It looks like a photoshop effect and makes the game darker.
Hopefully they can patch it; it's almost the same as MGS: Ground Zeroes in content barring some side missions which received a couple of updates.
Yes .
Spiritwalker
Member
Prompto was the least popular one? Glad I'm not the only one who found him annoying and whiny.
I guess you'll want to stick to one language in a demo to limit the download size. Having a choice would also have had a negative impact on various survey points i.e. how you like the localiztion and individual characters.
I don't think Adamantoise will be in Dusace. In the Adamantoise scene in the trailer, the area seems more barren, like desert-like.
Nose Master
Member
Seems like a waste of time to polish up and patch a demo. It's a demo, everyone should know stuff like the frame rate is subject to change. If it's the same content but with a smoother framerate and less camera pans over Cid's ass, who cares?
dragonzdogma
Member
#1.Noctis
#2.Gladious
#3.prompto
#4.Ignis
Anyone else?
If not what's your take?
#2.Gladious
#3.prompto
#4.Ignis
Anyone else?
If not what's your take?
threelights
Member
They've said that it's in Duscae. Just not in the part where the demo happens.
RurouniZel
Asks questions so Ezalc doesn't have to
Oh. I stand corrected then.