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Gamexplain Explains the Joy-Con Desyncing Problem

T

The Shadow Knight

Member
mindsale said:
Nintendo Switch |OT| Pro's & JoyCons.
Click to expand...

That's much more elegant, well done.

---

I hope Nintendo will make a statement on this within a reasonable time frame. It's not something likely to affect me directly as I'm going to be pretty close to the device at all times when playing, but it's something that really shouldn't be an issue.
 
M

mindsale

Member
The Shadow Knight said:
That's much more elegant, well done.

---

I hope Nintendo will make a statement on this within a reasonable time frame. It's not something likely to affect me directly as I'm going to be pretty close to the device at all times when playing, but it's something that really shouldn't be an issue.
Click to expand...

Thanks!

I just hope that my Pro Controller arrives on launch day so I don't have to convulse through Hyrule with the JoyCons.
 
B

Busty

Banned
Tom Nook Sawyer said:
Thought this was thread-worthy because it explains what's happening to the left joy-con, as Gamexpkain was able to reliably replicate the Joy-Con connectivity problem. Turns out your hand is enough to block the signal, but it's not actually desyncing the controller--just interrupting the signal. And both Joy-Cons are affected.
Click to expand...

Just when you think you'll heard it all...,

Man alive.
 
Darklor01

Darklor01

Might need to stop sniffing glue
So, basically:

Wifi interference? - http://packetworks.net/blog/common-causes-of-wifi-interference:
Frequency Interference
If your wifi signal seems to be strong, but then suddenly will drop for periods of time, that may be a symptom of frequency interference. Frequency interference is when another wireless signal passes through your home that is on a similar bandwidth to your wifi network, overpowering or corrupting the wifi signal. The following is a list of common sources for signal interference that you might find in a home.


Microwave - If the router is located near a microwave, massive network interference will often be experencied while the microwave is heating something up. Many microwaves operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum, which is the same spectrum as older wireless routers.
Cordless Phone - Cordless phones that operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum can cause large signal interference in the same way as the microwave. Interference will be experienced while receiving a call, or talking on the handset.
Poorly Wired Satellite Dish - Some satellite dishes can leak signal interference if they are not wired up correctly, or the current wiring is deteriorating.
Other Wireless Devices - Any other wireless device can technically cause signal interence. These devices could include: wireless speakers, baby monitors, garage door openers, etc.
Neighbours WiFi Network - Powerful wifi networks in a close proximity can detract from eachother's performance.
The most common and simple switch for frequency interference is to change the channel on your wifi router. Typically the channel can be set from 1-11 for the broadcast frequency. More expensive routers will allow for broadcast on the 5 Ghz frequency, which is an even better solution.



Other Barriers
There are some other barriers that may affect an individuals wifi experience that don't fall under the traditional categories of physical or frequency. These barriers can include:

Hearing aid - Slight signal disruption in a very close proximity.
Blasting area - Such as a mine, can cause interference.
Power lines, railway tracks and power stations - There is debate as to whether or not this actually effects the signal, but if you believe it does, try changing your broadcast channel.
Your hand - Your hand can and will effect the wifi performance of your phone or other device if positioned in the wrong way. Try changing your grip for better signal.
 
GlamFM

GlamFM

Banned
Darklor01 said:
So, basically:

Wifi interference? - http://packetworks.net/blog/common-causes-of-wifi-interference:
Frequency Interference
If your wifi signal seems to be strong, but then suddenly will drop for periods of time, that may be a symptom of frequency interference. Frequency interference is when another wireless signal passes through your home that is on a similar bandwidth to your wifi network, overpowering or corrupting the wifi signal. The following is a list of common sources for signal interference that you might find in a home.


Microwave - If the router is located near a microwave, massive network interference will often be experencied while the microwave is heating something up. Many microwaves operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum, which is the same spectrum as older wireless routers.
Cordless Phone - Cordless phones that operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum can cause large signal interference in the same way as the microwave. Interference will be experienced while receiving a call, or talking on the handset.
Poorly Wired Satellite Dish - Some satellite dishes can leak signal interference if they are not wired up correctly, or the current wiring is deteriorating.
Other Wireless Devices - Any other wireless device can technically cause signal interence. These devices could include: wireless speakers, baby monitors, garage door openers, etc.
Neighbours WiFi Network - Powerful wifi networks in a close proximity can detract from eachother's performance.
The most common and simple switch for frequency interference is to change the channel on your wifi router. Typically the channel can be set from 1-11 for the broadcast frequency. More expensive routers will allow for broadcast on the 5 Ghz frequency, which is an even better solution.



Other Barriers
There are some other barriers that may affect an individuals wifi experience that don't fall under the traditional categories of physical or frequency. These barriers can include:

Hearing aid - Slight signal disruption in a very close proximity.
Blasting area - Such as a mine, can cause interference.
Power lines, railway tracks and power stations - There is debate as to whether or not this actually effects the signal, but if you believe it does, try changing your broadcast channel.
Your hand - Your hand can and will effect the wifi performance of your phone or other device if positioned in the wrong way. Try changing your grip for better signal.
Click to expand...

I think it´s bluetooth, no?
 
L

Living the Dream

Member
Darklor01 said:
So, basically:

Wifi interference? - http://packetworks.net/blog/common-causes-of-wifi-interference:
Frequency Interference
If your wifi signal seems to be strong, but then suddenly will drop for periods of time, that may be a symptom of frequency interference. Frequency interference is when another wireless signal passes through your home that is on a similar bandwidth to your wifi network, overpowering or corrupting the wifi signal. The following is a list of common sources for signal interference that you might find in a home.


Microwave - If the router is located near a microwave, massive network interference will often be experencied while the microwave is heating something up. Many microwaves operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum, which is the same spectrum as older wireless routers.
Cordless Phone - Cordless phones that operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum can cause large signal interference in the same way as the microwave. Interference will be experienced while receiving a call, or talking on the handset.
Poorly Wired Satellite Dish - Some satellite dishes can leak signal interference if they are not wired up correctly, or the current wiring is deteriorating.
Other Wireless Devices - Any other wireless device can technically cause signal interence. These devices could include: wireless speakers, baby monitors, garage door openers, etc.
Neighbours WiFi Network - Powerful wifi networks in a close proximity can detract from eachother's performance.
The most common and simple switch for frequency interference is to change the channel on your wifi router. Typically the channel can be set from 1-11 for the broadcast frequency. More expensive routers will allow for broadcast on the 5 Ghz frequency, which is an even better solution.



Other Barriers
There are some other barriers that may affect an individuals wifi experience that don't fall under the traditional categories of physical or frequency. These barriers can include:

Hearing aid - Slight signal disruption in a very close proximity.
Blasting area - Such as a mine, can cause interference.
Power lines, railway tracks and power stations - There is debate as to whether or not this actually effects the signal, but if you believe it does, try changing your broadcast channel.
Your hand - Your hand can and will effect the wifi performance of your phone or other device if positioned in the wrong way. Try changing your grip for better signal.
Click to expand...

No.
 
S

Seik

Banned
Twenty7KVN said:
what could Nintendo really say now that would change your mind? They will probably just say something " we are aware of the issue and are working on a solution". I mean you can cancel when ever you want, but waiting a few more days won't hurt.
Click to expand...

They need to do a public statement about this like, yesterday.

Every additional day of silence might hurt them because it draws bad press and word of mouth. If at least they say that there will be a day 1 patch or that they're working on it, it would easy many folks getting upset.

I mean, you can't blame people who don't want to risk investing 300$US for something that may not work properly.
 
K

Koppai

Member
I wonder if all of the people who are saying they are going to cancel their preorders are really going to do it over something minor that can be fixed later? I understand that the product should work correctly out of the box but I honestly have never seen any game hardware work the way it should the first day either.

I am still getting mine and several games and a Pro controller. I have like 2 extra orders of the Pro controller if anyone is interested.
 
M

mindsale

Member
Darklor01 said:
So, basically:

Wifi interference? - http://packetworks.net/blog/common-causes-of-wifi-interference:
Frequency Interference
If your wifi signal seems to be strong, but then suddenly will drop for periods of time, that may be a symptom of frequency interference. Frequency interference is when another wireless signal passes through your home that is on a similar bandwidth to your wifi network, overpowering or corrupting the wifi signal. The following is a list of common sources for signal interference that you might find in a home.


Microwave - If the router is located near a microwave, massive network interference will often be experencied while the microwave is heating something up. Many microwaves operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum, which is the same spectrum as older wireless routers.
Cordless Phone - Cordless phones that operate on the 2.4 GHz spectrum can cause large signal interference in the same way as the microwave. Interference will be experienced while receiving a call, or talking on the handset.
Poorly Wired Satellite Dish - Some satellite dishes can leak signal interference if they are not wired up correctly, or the current wiring is deteriorating.
Other Wireless Devices - Any other wireless device can technically cause signal interence. These devices could include: wireless speakers, baby monitors, garage door openers, etc.
Neighbours WiFi Network - Powerful wifi networks in a close proximity can detract from eachother's performance.
The most common and simple switch for frequency interference is to change the channel on your wifi router. Typically the channel can be set from 1-11 for the broadcast frequency. More expensive routers will allow for broadcast on the 5 Ghz frequency, which is an even better solution.



Other Barriers
There are some other barriers that may affect an individuals wifi experience that don't fall under the traditional categories of physical or frequency. These barriers can include:

Hearing aid - Slight signal disruption in a very close proximity.
Blasting area - Such as a mine, can cause interference.
Power lines, railway tracks and power stations - There is debate as to whether or not this actually effects the signal, but if you believe it does, try changing your broadcast channel.
Your hand - Your hand can and will effect the wifi performance of your phone or other device if positioned in the wrong way. Try changing your grip for better signal.
Click to expand...

If you examine the GameXplain video closely you can see that there are two microwaves heating Hot Pockets concurrently and that Andre has a hearing aid in both ears. Also for at least a few frames you can see industrial blasting going on through a window, which may explain Andre's hearing aids.

You should check out my YouTube channel, HearingAidXplain.
 
S

Skyzard

Banned
I'm at the event now and tested it from pretty far away and it works fine here. They're so damn small too, they're pretty cool. Analogue feels good.

Also the pro controller is actually pretty great, great ergonomics but the dpad is a little stiff.

Zelda seems cool...didn't get to play it for long...felt a bit slow when attacking to be honest. Framerate wasn't too hot. I liked playing it more in handheld mode as the screen shows off details well.

The console itself is much smaller than I thought it would be. Liking it a lot.
 
C

casey_contra

Member
Skyzard said:
I'm at the event now and tested it from pretty far away and it works fine here. They're so damn small too, they're pretty cool. Analogue feels good.

Also the pro controller is actually pretty great, great ergonomics but the dpad is a little stiff.

Zelda seems cool...didn't get to play it for long...felt a bit slow when attacking to be honest. Framerate wasn't too hot. I liked playing it more in handheld mode as the screen shows off details well.

The console itself is much smaller than I thought it would be. Liking it a lot.
Click to expand...

At the Chicago event I was at least 12-15 feet away from the unit (which was on the ground) playing ARMS and everything worked fine. But also, that game relies on more broad motion controls, so it feasibly could have popped in and out without me even knowing it vs. someone who is precisely using a joy stick.
 
S

Skyzard

Banned
I was just using the joystick to go left and right at the character select screen and stood about 3 to 4 meters away. No delay or anything. I'll try it again, about to check out splatoon2.

Also the Joycons are awesome! Tiny little cool things.
 
kunonabi

kunonabi

Member
Koppai said:
I wonder if all of the people who are saying they are going to cancel their preorders are really going to do it over something minor that can be fixed later? I understand that the product should work correctly out of the box but I honestly have never seen any game hardware work the way it should the first day either.

I am still getting mine and several games and a Pro controller. I have like 2 extra orders of the Pro controller if anyone is interested.
Click to expand...

Then you don't have much experience with game hardware.
 
G

God Dayumm

Banned
Twenty7KVN said:
what could Nintendo really say now that would change your mind? They will probably just say something " we are aware of the issue and are working on a solution". I mean you can cancel when ever you want, but waiting a few more days won't hurt.
Click to expand...

Nothing. Just reduce the price accordingly, to about half or so
 
E

Erv

Member
I haven't gone through this thread and honestly don't know much about the technical aspects of systems so can this be fixed with an update?
 
O

Otnopolit

Member
Erv said:
I haven't gone through this thread and honestly don't know much about the technical aspects of systems so can this be fixed with an update?
Click to expand...

Tons of speculation, but we don't know. Apparently a dude with Nintendo sources say an update will fix this before launch, but the further away we heard that the less I believe it. Were it so simple, they would've said as much officially by now.
 
D

DragonGirl

Member
I just don't see this as a major issue. Living tissue full of water blocks wireless signals. This isn't a new discovery and has caused challenges for wireless designs before. The joycons are small so it's easy to engulf them in your hands if you have large hands, thus causing the signal to weaken but it seems like an easy problem to avoid if you know not to cover the top of the controller. I also don't think anyone needs to rearrange their room to play. Living tissue is many orders of magnitude more efficient at blocking a signal than furniture or walls.

Before anyone mashes the panic button, maybe see if you actually have a problem while using the joycon, if it's difficult for you to hold it naturally while not covering the top of the controller, assuming you want to use the controllers without the grip as I imagine the grip would keep your hands from covering the signal emitter. Or see if the wrist strap attachment adds enough mass to the controller to make it easier to hold without engulfing the controller in your hand.
 
R

RichiRamjag

Member
Koppai said:
I wonder if all of the people who are saying they are going to cancel their preorders are really going to do it over something minor that can be fixed later? I understand that the product should work correctly out of the box but I honestly have never seen any game hardware work the way it should the first day either.

I am still getting mine and several games and a Pro controller. I have like 2 extra orders of the Pro controller if anyone is interested.
Click to expand...

If I don't get word that it's gonna be resolved, then I sure will. I'm not bullshiting about my preorder and I've never once threatened to cancel before now. I work hard for my money. Even if I'm well off, I'm not going to go out and buy something knowing it's potentially faulty off the bat and the company did/said nothing before launch.
 
C

CDX

Member
Skyzard said:
I'm at the event now and tested it from pretty far away and it works fine here. They're so damn small too, they're pretty cool. Analogue feels good.

Also the pro controller is actually pretty great, great ergonomics but the dpad is a little stiff.

Zelda seems cool...didn't get to play it for long...felt a bit slow when attacking to be honest. Framerate wasn't too hot. I liked playing it more in handheld mode as the screen shows off details well.

The console itself is much smaller than I thought it would be. Liking it a lot.
Click to expand...

Skyzard said:
I was just using the joystick to go left and right at the character select screen and stood about 3 to 4 meters away. No delay or anything. I'll try it again, about to check out splatoon2.

Also the Joycons are awesome! Tiny little cool things.
Click to expand...

That's good news.
 
GlamFM

GlamFM

Banned
Koppai said:
I wonder if all of the people who are saying they are going to cancel their preorders are really going to do it over something minor that can be fixed later? I understand that the product should work correctly out of the box but I honestly have never seen any game hardware work the way it should the first day either.

I am still getting mine and several games and a Pro controller. I have like 2 extra orders of the Pro controller if anyone is interested.
Click to expand...

I´ve cancelled my pre-order last week. Before JoyConGate.

But I feel even better about it now for sure.

I´ll get a switch one day though.
 
G

Glix

Member
I played the zelda demo in both TV and handheld mode and from what I can remember had zero lag or drops.

I played Arms from much further away, but like another poster said, I probably wouldn't have noticed even if it did drop.

I really hope I am not affected by this.
 
LordRaptor

LordRaptor

Member
RichiRamjag said:
If I don't get word that it's gonna be resolved, then I sure will. I'm not bullshiting about my preorder and I've never once threatened to cancel before now. I work hard for my money. Even if I'm well off, I'm not going to go out and buy something knowing it's potentially faulty off the bat and the company did/said nothing before launch.
Click to expand...

Literally every product is potentially faulty off the bat though.
Thats why return policies exist in the first place.

There's not really any indication this is like an RROD thing where every single console is inevitably going to get hit by it, and without knowing how many pre-launch units were shipped worldwide there's not even any idea of how widely spread it even is, or what usage cases wouldn't even notice.

e:
I mean, if nintendo shipped 1000 'first batch' builds to media outlets around the world, and 5 have reported an issue, thats well within standard electronic devices failure rates and not really a thing you should need to make a PR statement about (or would want to due to streisand effect) - just really shitty luck some of those bad builds landed in the hands of big press like IGN.
If its 5 units out of 20 sent round the world, then yeah, it might be an actual real problem that needs commenting on, because thats a 25% failure rate and well above standard failure tolerance rates.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
DragonGirl said:
I just don't see this as a major issue. Living tissue full of water blocks wireless signals. This isn't a new discovery and has caused challenges for wireless designs before. The joycons are small so it's easy to engulf them in your hands if you have large hands, thus causing the signal to weaken but it seems like an easy problem to avoid if you know not to cover the top of the controller. I also don't think anyone needs to rearrange their room to play. Living tissue is many orders of magnitude more efficient at blocking a signal than furniture or walls.
Click to expand...

This isn't an excuse though. I could sit here and tell you that it's fundamental to the design of my new laptop that the space bar be on the back of the screen, and so any typing errors you experience are just a common issue with products like mine.

The real question is why design something poorly in the first place.
 
B

b00_thegh0st

Member
The goddamn controller doesn't seem to work properly when used at more than 6~8 feet from the console and they still have said nothing.

I understand the cancellations.
 
GlamFM

GlamFM

Banned
shanafan said:
I would wait until Nintendo makes a formal announcement. Anyone that cancels right now is jumping the gun.
Click to expand...

I mean... he still has the Switch itself and the Pro Controller pre-ordered.

Canceling the extra set of JoyCons seems like the safe approach.
 
K

KingSnake

The Birthday Skeleton
LordRaptor said:
No, I mean, if you have a grey switch, and you have a busted joycon, at least some shops would just give you a brand new joycon there and then at the returns desk instead of a full RMA, but a neon one replacement wouldnt be the same colour
Click to expand...

Where from would the shops get revised joycons so quickly if the issue is with the hardware?

Or are you assuming that Nintendo is well aware of the issue and already manufacturing new joycons but deliberately selling Switch with faulty ones?

It would take at least some weeks to get replacements.

nynt9 said:
So if you're playing 12Switch against someone you give them the left joycon right?
Click to expand...

Lol, we need a statistic about how many wins the right joycon got in the hands-on session.
 
O

opricnik

Banned
Wow what a trash hardware testing. Did they test like at all?


people should really wait on this machine and may play Wii U Zeruda instead.
 
R

Ripenen

Member
LordRaptor said:
Literally every product is potentially faulty off the bat though.
Thats why return policies exist in the first place.

There's not really any indication this is like an RROD thing where every single console is inevitably going to get hit by it, and without knowing how many pre-launch units were shipped worldwide there's not even any idea of how widely spread it even is, or what usage cases wouldn't even notice.

e:
I mean, if nintendo shipped 1000 'first batch' builds to media outlets around the world, and 5 have reported an issue, thats well within standard electronic devices failure rates and not really a thing you should need to make a PR statement about (or would want to due to streisand effect) - just really shitty luck some of those bad builds landed in the hands of big press like IGN.
If its 5 units out of 20 sent round the world, then yeah, it might be an actual real problem that needs commenting on, because thats a 25% failure rate and well above standard failure tolerance rates.
Click to expand...

If it's caused by the way the controller sits in the player's hand it's not an issue of failure, it's an issue of poor design.
 
D

DragonGirl

Member
AntraxSuicide said:
This isn't an excuse though. I could sit here and tell you that it's fundamental to the design of my new laptop that the space bar be on the back of the screen, and so any typing errors you experience are just a common issue with products like mine.

The real question is why design something poorly in the first place.
Click to expand...

Sometimes issues are the nature of the beast, not poor design. I'm not saying that is the case here, just pointing out that most people are speaking from a non expert platform. It's easy to make assumptions and default to blame when you don't understand the challenges or limitations inherent in any particular design or technology. It's like saying the Switch has a cheap crappy battery because Zelda can only run 2.5 hours in handheld mode without having any understanding of the limitations in battery technology.

People are quick to panic and condemn before even understanding the whys and wherefores. This problem as it exists seems limited to a particular scenario, and within that scenario it can probably be mitigated with a stronger signal. At this point, I just can't work myself up into a torches and pitchforks frame of mind.
 
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