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[Bel_Air_Jeff]

This is sad. Nintendo is the only company that really feels passionate for games. Their legacy will forever outlive any other gaming developer.

Hope they can turn this around some how, and push some sales this holiday season

 

[Caporale]

This is sad. Nintendo is the only company that really feels passionate for games. Their legacy will forever outlive any other gaming developer.

Hope they can turn this around some how, and push some sales this holiday season

Nintendo's made a ton of great games, but I think that's a bit much. Other companies are just as passionate as Nintendo. No single company really makes or breaks gaming. There are a lot of people doing good work.

 

[Schnozberry]

This is sad. Nintendo is the only company that really feels passionate for games. Their legacy will forever outlive any other gaming developer.

Hope they can turn this around some how, and push some sales this holiday season

I wouldn't sweat too much over it. Nintendo has billions of dollars in cash reserves. They aren't going anywhere. The problem is they need to return to profitability as soon as possible. The 3DS is now making money on hardware, and they are releasing a deluge of software for it. The Wii U should have some big titles in March and then going forward. E3 should be an eye opener about what to expect for the holidays. I'm assuming we'll see bundles and a SKU consolidation from Nintendo, and maybe a price drop. Those basic units aren't selling for shit.

 

[Interceptor]

Most of us like Nintendo, but that does not hide they are in a rather awful financial situation and Iwata could lose his job over it.

It´s not good but it´s far away from awful. Nintendo could do like this for ten years and would not be in the same financial trouble as sony is in nowadays. But hey, it´s Nintendo, so they must be dooomed. Sometimes i think the only role people can accept Nintendo in is the one of an underdog. Everything else? How dare they to interrupt with our cool business?!

Let´s stick with the facts. Nintendo is making a proft again. Great games are announced. Pokemon figurines with nfc are coming.

Nintendo can survive just with their own franchises and hardware. they may not lead the market but they won´t be doomed.

 

[ViewtifulJC]

What CEO is gonna get me a proper Star Fox or F-Zero game

hire that man

 

[Coolwhip]

It´s not good but it´s far away from awful. Nintendo could do like this for ten years and would not be in the same financial trouble as sony is in nowadays. But hey, it´s Nintendo, so they must be dooomed. Sometimes i think the only role people can accept Nintendo in is the one of an underdog. Everything else? How dare they to interrupt with our cool business?!

Let´s stick with the facts. Nintendo is making a proft again. Great games are announced. Pokemon figurines with nfc are coming.

Nintendo can survive just with their own franchises and hardware. they may not lead the market but they won´t be doomed.

Nintendo is a popular target to 'hate' on. Since there is a huge group of people that grew up with Nintendo. What easier way to get hits than to bash something people like?

 

[Maxxan]

Although we don't know who pulls which strings at Nintendo, the company has certainly set the bar high with Wii and the DS. Also, Iwata looks like the nicest person ever. How about they kick Reggie instead?

 

[Synth_floyd]

They need good games on the Wii U. Right now they have little 3rd party support, weak marketing and a high price. The 3DS was in the same situation but they dropped the price and finally sales picked up and now they have plenty of 3rd party support.


GAMES GAMES GAMES. What are they doing about the games? Not enough.

 

[Aquamarine]

This is sad. Nintendo is the only company that really feels passionate for games. Their legacy will forever outlive any other gaming developer.

Hope they can turn this around some how, and push some sales this holiday season

How could you even say something like that?

 

[CadetMahoney]

(kaz laughs)

heh

 

[velvet_nitemare]

Hopefully the next guy will push for higher tech region free consoles/handhelds with purchases tied to an account instead of hardware.

 

[Diablos54]

Creating a few western studios isn't as easy as a lot of people think it is, they can't just hire a ton of people, create a studio and go 'Go and make western titles'. There's a reason Nintendo are so hesitant when buying developers, and that's the same reason creating a few western studios isn't that easy. What happens if they want to leave, go somewhere else? They've already had this happen with Retro with a lot of them leaving after Metroid Prime. Employee turnover is a lot higher in the west than it is for Nintendo, a lot of their employees have been there for decades, if not their whole career.

 

[Caporale]

I'm sure it can benefit in some ways. But is that so significant that the game wont be worthwhile for developers to work on? That's crazy talk imo. I hope developers see more challenges in making fun and interesting games. Not in the technology aspect.

For developers, I think it boils down to this:

1) Do I like this platform? Does it have something unique I want to exploit?
2) Does anyone own this console to buy the game that I'm going to release for it?
3) Is making my game for this platform going to be really painful because of a weird hardware design or bad tools?
4) Will the game I want to make even run on this platform? Is it technically feasible?

We can point to specific examples where people don't make games for platforms because of #3 and #4 alone. Many games like Rage weren't released for the original Wii because the hardware just couldn't do them.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

I personally don't think that a sales slump was an inevitability. The fact that Nintendo can continue to do as well as they are now despite some struggles with launching new hardware and very little meaningful third-party support is a pretty clear indication that they aren't some dinosaur that's facing extinction in a world where they are no longer relevant. Not that building hardware is an easy thing to do, but I personally think their biggest impediment right now to cruising down easy street is that they've backed the wrong horses on these last couple of outings.

I don't think glassless-3D was the right hook for the 3DS, and I also don't think the GamePad was the right hook for the Wii U. Instead, both are just having to fall back on software alone for the most part to get people on board. What should they have done? I don't know. It's a tough game to predict. The usual path people take is just throwing more powerful tech under the hood, and I understand why Nintendo doesn't think that's their bag. But I also don't think their alternative ideas these past couple of years have panned out as well as they needed them to.

 

[I H8 Memes]

It was obviously a stupid move to release an underpowered console and once again play chicken with disaster. All they had to do was release a console good enough for slightly lower quality 720p ports of next gen games from 3rd parties and now that not going to happen. No 3rd party company has the time, money, or resources to make a game that will only sell on one console.

This is 100% on Nintendo fans for being enablers. When devotion to a company overrides common sense you end up with Nintendo thinking that they will be fine to release an underpowered console again because their fans are the worlds biggest echo chamber..

 

[TheCongressman1]

I agree with the sentiments towards Reggie. The sales are down in North America, so if anyone has to go it should be Reggie.

Although on the other hand, what I'm getting from what he said is that he wanted to appeal to the investors by laying his job on the line. He can't really shut investors up by telling them they are going to fire NOA's president.

This is 100% on Nintendo fans for being enablers. When devotion to a company overrides common sense you end up with Nintendo thinking that they will be fine to release an underpowered console again because their fans are the worlds biggest echo chamber..

This is pure bullshit. Wow. Consumers are not the only factor in company operations.

 

[Effect]

I'm just quoting this post as an example of something, with a question: do you really think games like Starfox, no matter how well produced a new title is, will steamroll a western market that wants Call of Duty, Assassin's Creed, and such?

This is where I think major investments in marketing, community outreach and interaction, and hype building would really play an important role if not THE most important role. Things that Nintendo I feel really suffers with.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I personally don't think that a sales slump was an inevitability. The fact that Nintendo can continue to do as well as they are now despite some struggles with launching new hardware and very little meaningful third-party support is a pretty clear indication that they aren't some dinosaur that's facing extinction in a world where they are no longer relevant. Not that building hardware is an easy thing to do, but I personally think their biggest impediment right now to cruising down easy street is that they've backed the wrong horses on these last couple of outings.

I don't think glassless-3D was the right hook for the 3DS, and I also don't think the GamePad was the right hook for the Wii U. Instead, both are just having to fall back on software alone for the most part to get people on board. What should they have done? I don't know. It's a tough game to predict. The usual path people take is just throwing more powerful tech under the hood, and I understand why Nintendo doesn't think that's their bag. But I also don't think their alternative ideas these past couple of years have panned out as well as they needed them to.

Glassless-3D was a fantastic hook, but it was perhaps both too early - the tech is still a little iffy, and the sweetspot is definitely an issue for some - and too late - it hit as the public was starting to burn out on 3D thanks to the way it was handled in the cinema.

 

[nbthedude]

I agree with the sentiments towards Reggie. The sales are down in North America, so if anyone has to go it should be Reggie.

Although on the other hand, what I'm getting from what he said is that he wanted to appeal to the investors by laying his job on the line. He can't really shut investors up by telling them they are going to fire NOA's president.

But Nintendo is notorious for their top down hierarchy. Reggie is essentially a yes man. It would make little sense to fire him.

I don't honestly know what he does behind the scenes, but as a PR frontman, I find him absolutely terrible. He talks to people as if he is Mr. Rogers talking to 5 year olds, in short single claused sentences and empty cliches which he repeats ad nauseum. But firing him wouldn't do anything at all to address Nintendo's problems. Reggie just seems like a prop, albeit not a very good one.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Glassless-3D was a fantastic hook, but it was perhaps both too early - the tech is still a little iffy, and the sweetspot is definitely an issue for some - and too late - it hit as the public was starting to burn out on 3D thanks to the way it was handled in the cinema.

I'm not trying to be combative, but this strikes me as an odd rebuttal. "You're way off the mark! It was a great idea save for these five reasons that mostly nullify its appeal."

 

[eighty(one)]

Interesting... I wonder what alignment of circumstances is necessary for that profit to happen. Is it even possible with a Wii U price cut?

Price cut, 3D Mario for WiiU, MarioKart for WiiU and Super Smash (which I thinks farther along than many suspect - its being worked on by top tier Namco members, for ideas and speedy development).

 

[Linkhero1]

I agree with the sentiments towards Reggie. The sales are down in North America, so if anyone has to go it should be Reggie.

Although on the other hand, what I'm getting from what he said is that he wanted to appeal to the investors by laying his job on the line. He can't really shut investors up by telling them they are going to fire NOA's president.

I agree that Reggie has made some poor decisions in terms of localization, which we've seen with Xenoblade, TLS, and Pandora's Tower, but I don't entirely blame him for the poor sales here. Isn't it true that Reggie is pretty limited on what he can do as President of NoA because they have to go through NCL first? If NCL is micromanaging NoA then that's a an issue itself.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I'm not trying to be combative, but this strikes me as an odd rebuttal. "You're way off the mark! It was a great idea save for these five reasons that mostly nullify its appeal."

It's OK, I know what you mean :-D

EDIT:

Dunno if this is clearer:

I look at the glassless 3D of the 3DS a little like the motion control of the Wii - a great, fun idea (with some gameplay benefits) that has instant appeal, but came a little too early to be completely solid tech. Unlike the Wii, though, the 3DS launched when the buzz was coming off 3D thanks to the way it had been handled in the cinema, and the that, along with the niggles in implementation, made what should have been a real "Wow!" feature far less of one. Make more sense?

 

[Kenka]

There are many talented people working on mobile games, but none of the best studios prioritize mobile games for a reason. You're really not pushing anything there.
Technology has a bigger impact on games than "polygons and bumpmaps."

For example, let's say a new console generation ships with SSDs. Because developers know they can install to an SSD, it's a game changer in terms of how they'd design games. They could do a lot more with streaming content.

Do you really think Xenoblade couldn't benefit from the capability to have larger areas with more sophisticated geometry and having no noticeable load time when changing regions?

Caporale, I don't think you are right with your first assertion. Regarding your second, you forget to put the price of this in the balance and the financial sacrifices involved in producing more content: to me Xenoblade doesn't need higher resolution gfx because the experience is engrossing enough as it is, and I would have bought it anyway. Sometimes, fewer load times and details in geometry are not proportional to enjoyment and consumer satisfaction. But back to your first one: there are studios of big established companies in the console space that make profit in the mobile space also, Ubisoft being one of them. So your premise was wrong and secondly, the reason you give to defend it is wrong too: it's not because you're not "pushing anything" that you wouldn't apparently develop in the mobile space, you don't do it because you want to focus your efforts in the high-end sector, just like Blancpain doesn't enter Casio's segment when it comes to watches.

Big companies have an interest in keeping entry fees in the high-end segment high so they can go on dominating it. Of course, other small studio staff can be as smart/productive as theirs but they can outmuscle any small company in the AAA sector and they want to keep this privilege.

I hope you don't feel offended, I just want to point at the interesting points in your argumentation.

 

[mantidor]

Most of us like Nintendo, but that does not hide they are in a rather awful financial situation and Iwata could lose his job over it.

This is clearly overblown, there are some struggles, but calling it "awful" is just exaggerated, specially because this refers to projected outcomes, is not something that is happening right now. Nintendo even reported profits.

Now is there a tough way ahead? of course, that's for sure.

 

[chaosblade]

It was obviously a stupid move to release an underpowered console and once again play chicken with disaster. All they had to do was release a console good enough for slightly lower quality 720p ports of next gen games from 3rd parties and now that not going to happen. No 3rd party company has the time, money, or resources to make a game that will only sell on one console.

This is 100% on Nintendo fans for being enablers. When devotion to a company overrides common sense you end up with Nintendo thinking that they will be fine to release an underpowered console again because their fans are the worlds biggest echo chamber..

Engine tech is scalable these days from high end PCs more powerful than next gen consoles all the way down to smartphones. WiiU has the featureset necessary to get downports, it's just a matter of whether or not 3rd parties want to port the games.

WiiU won't get ports of third party games because third parties don't care to port the games. It's happening with PS3/360 games right now, and it will happen to next-gen titles too.

 

[Busaiku]

I don't think there's anyone a better fit for the company than him at this point.
If he goes now, I really think Nintendo's gonna face some serious problems.

 

[goldenpp72]

His strategy seems to be to ignore all advances the other 2 make while hoping the next gimmick takes off, and that worked really well for the DS and Wii, and not very well for the 3DS and Wii U (i'd say the touch screen and 3d novelties are very small to even off putting bullet points depending)

Hopefully Nintendo will rejoin the power race some day, and if that means Iwata has to go away then so be it. Considering Nintendo hasn't made a console truly at parity or better than their competitors since the Snes, it would be cool to see.

 

[le.phat]

I like Iwata, but maybe new leadership would inject some common sense into the company. Common sense Nintendo would steamroll the competition.

Star Fox Wii U!
F-Zero HD!
2D Metroid on 3DS
3D Metroid on Wii U
Super Mario 64 HD
3D Pokemon MMO
Virtual Console with almost every game available

The list goes on and on...

yeah, the non-nintendo fan would really go apeshit over that list :|

 

[airmangataosenai]

That would be bad - they might hire someone competent in his place.

First post and done.

 

[Subaru]

Iwata, please, read my post: (laughs)

1) Fix NoA, please! I know that games like Project x Zone and Bravely Default possibily won't sell what you Nin wants in US, but some people would buy a 3DS for playing this game and... guess what? They would start to buy ANOTHER GAMES! That's Brilliant, huh?

2) We need HYPE. Altough I love the new strategy to announce games near launch, some hype will definetly help Wii U. How many people bought PS3 for Last Guardian and Versus XIII? They are disappointed, but still, they have a PS3 and buy games for the console.

3) People want to play some games in HD. DKCR e SMG are awesome the way they are, but games like Xenoblade, Last Story and Fatal Frame NEEDS HD graphics. And no, I don't think Nintendo should spend lots of time investing in REMAKES for these games, but release HD Ver. with upscale, ANTI ALIASING and stuff. Like PS3/X360 HD Collections or even Monster Hunter Ultimate. There's lots of Wii games that most people didn't buy because it hasn't been released in US or it's too ugly to play in HDTV.

4) Accounts!

5) Invest more in 2D games - especially in DKC! C'mon, where is DKCR2? Where is a new Super Mario game with a good art direction? I bet that 2D games are really easier to make and people LOVE!

6) Launch Virtual Console U with TONS of games. Also, Virtual Console 3DS needs games too! Nintendo have the most AMAZING catalogue ever and we can't buy these games because they aren't available!

 

[JavyOO7]

I'd rather Nintendo just call it a day and end development all together if they ever think of going 3rd party. Put all their titles in a vault forever...

 

[PhantomR]

I like Iwata and don't want to see him have to go but I do think Nintendo in general needs a bit of a shakeup. NCL is way too Japan oriented for the fact Japan makes up such a small portion of the overall pie. NCL would really benefit from a more diverse leadership that includes some non Japanese.

Nintendo is always designing everything with Japan in mind and hoping the rest of the world buys in. Need to start designing with a more global outlook and work on convincing Japan to buy in.

I agree....TO AN EXTENT.


I'm okay with boosting up resources at overseas studios (NST, Retro Studios), and purchasing studios that will fit nicely within Nintendo's culture (Next Level Games). But I am absolutely against anything that will mess with EAD's internal development culture. The level of game design these cats perform at is ridiculous. That needs to be cultivated and protected at all costs.

Now as far as diversifying NCL perhaps from a business standpoint and technical standpoint (Online network design/administration, revamping licensing, more cohesive and global marketing strategies) I'm totally down with. Just not messing with NCL from a software design standpoint.


There's lots of other things that could be greatly improved between NCL and NOA that I don't know if Iwata can fix right away considering how high up he is. We should talk offline sometime.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Hopefully Nintendo will rejoin the power race some day, and if that means Iwata has to go away then so be it.

As critical as I can be of Nintendo at times, I don't really agree that the power race is the right route for them in the current market. I agree that the specs of the Wii U are too low, but I think the main problem is that the tradeoff for the GamePad was too great and that they have simultaneously failed to meaningfully market a real vision for the controller.

 

[anotherVegan]

Nintendo is finished! Nintendo is finished!

 

[Winterfang]

Why not make give his place to Reggie? Wasn't him the one the actually turn Nintendo's place around?

 

[Aquamarine]

I don't think there's anyone a better fit for the company than him at this point.
If he goes now, I really think Nintendo's gonna face some serious problems.

Really? Because the stock says otherwise.

 

[The Horror the horror]

I'd rather Nintendo just call it a day and end development all together if they ever think of going 3rd party. Put all their titles in a vault forever...

And the jobs?

 

[EVOL 100%]

Yeesh. Wasn't expecting it to get this bad. Iwata has been very good for Nintendo, but the losses they've been making these days is pretty nasty. Can't believe it's coming to this.

Why not make give his place to Reggie? Wasn't him the one the actually turn Nintendo's place around?

AFAIK Reggie is just a figurehead.

 

[Schnozberry]

I'm not trying to be combative, but this strikes me as an odd rebuttal. "You're way off the mark! It was a great idea save for these five reasons that mostly nullify its appeal."

I think 3D has it's place. It worked well in Resident Evil and Super Mario 3D Land. I think you're right though that making it the selling point of the machine was putting the cart before the horse. They didn't have the games ready to show off the tech. Same goes for Wii U and the gamepad. They need software to sell the uniqueness of the pad, and they haven't done that well enough yet. The Rayman Legends Demo does it pretty well if you can get more than one person to play, but that game hasn't gotten a big push for some reason.

 

[Chû Totoro]

Top 10 2012 ww selling games are :
- Cod Bops II 360
- Cod Bops II PS3
- Halo 4
- Pokemon B W version 2
- Fifa 13 PS3
- NSMB 2
- Just Dance 4
- Kinect Adventures
- AC III PS3
- Fifa 13 360


I really don't want to see Nintendo making CoD or Halo games just to make sales... Nintendo have their own games and this is a real advantage for them and it will stay the same for a long time.

Their biggest fail with the Wii U is that they have difficulties to have 3rd party support and when they manage to have it it's not that satisfaying (rushed port or Wii like shovelware...).
Also not having MS and Sony next gen systems make them fighting against a ghost which is more difficult than having concrete arguments vs the two other systems.

They must support indie dev a lot so they can have awesome little games for cheap.
And indie are the one who will do their best to use the gamepad and other Wii U peripherals because it's a good way for them not to be compared with bigger budget games.

They must have like the TOP 5 most wanted multi-platform games on their system but having GTA V would give a huge bump in credibility for them (both for devs/editors and players).

Also I'm curious to see top 10 most wanted games of 2013 because there is already like 5 Nintendo games that could seriously fit in.

 

[MisterHero]

*bangs head on desk*

Why would he do that now? Nintendo's been in way worse spots, including when Iwata started.

 

[I H8 Memes]

This is pure bullshit. Wow. Consumers are not the only factor in company operations.

Being a reassuring echo chamber doesn't help. I sure as hell don't remember any Nintendo fans saying that launching another underpowered console was a stupid idea. Anytime any one would even suggest it was they were drowned out by the devout who somehow thought this would be the chosen Nintendo device that would finally bring back the 3rd party games.

By all rights Nintendo shouldn't even be around right now. Nintendo fans dont want to hear it, but soccer moms are the sole reason for the Wii's success. Gamers buy software, and software sales were incredibly weak on the Wii. The soccer moms supported the hardware side, but the hardcore Nintendo fans couldn't do enough on the software side, and the underpowered Wii couldnt attract the fat middle section of casual gamers that push most software sales. And betting on striking gold with another underpowered console with another controller gadget was Nintendo playing chicken with disaster. Sure it's a nice controller and much more interesting to me than the nunchuck, but you don't sink money into a controller that could be spent on better hardware in the box instead.

I'm going to say something else that Nintendo fans really dont want to hear. And I expect the same echo chamber to all reassure each other that it isnt true. This will be Nintendos last console. They played chicken with disaster too many times against competition that isnt fucking around, especially MS, and unless something big happens for them in the handheld space to keep the console side afloat, you will never see another new console from Nintendo.

 

[moulels]

Reading how they are planning to achieve this goal is reassuring.

 

[Busaiku]

Really? Because the stock says otherwise.

Yeah, he hasn't been doing a great job at keeping the company on the up, but he's definitely done great work with Nintendo's staff and Japanese developers.
I don't know who his replacement would be to keep up that.

Basically, I think the shift in Nintendo will be really drastic without him.
It could pay off, but I definitely see a lot more risk as well.

 

[ari]

I give it 5 months until wii u is blowing up japan and the US to start selling decently come fall. I learned my lesson with the 3ds, i never gave that a chance for anything.

This forum feels exactly like it did in 2011 for the 3ds.

 

[TheCongressman1]

I agree that Reggie has made some poor decisions in terms of localization, which we've seen with Xenoblade, TLS, and Pandora's Tower, but I don't entirely blame him for the poor sales here. Isn't it true that Reggie is pretty limited on what he can do as President of NoA because they have to go through NCL first? If NCL is micromanaging NoA then that's a an issue itself.

Oh, I don't blame him entirely either. Of course NCL has the final say on issues, but there is no way they make all the decisions for them.

 

[Tobor]

He has to do something here. If he isn't going to fall on the sword, who is?

Sony fired Kutaragi over the PS3. Who will Iwata fire and when?

 

[Mr_Moogle]

Time to roll out a full HD console Pokemon.
Would make billions alone.

This. Its really mind boggling they haven't done this already. I dont think any franchise has as much potential in the MMO arena as Pokemon does but they could probably still get away with making it predominantly single player if they wanted.

 

[PhantomR]

Being a reassuring echo chamber doesn't help. I sure as hell don't remember any Nintendo fans saying that launching another underpowered console was a stupid idea. Anytime any one would even suggest it was they were drowned out by the devout who somehow thought this would be the chosen Nintendo device that would finally bring back the 3rd party games.

By all rights Nintendo shouldn't even be around right now. Nintendo fans dont want to hear it, but soccer moms are the sole reason for the Wii's success. And betting on striking gold with another underpowered console with another controller gadget was Nintendo playing chicken with disaster. Sure it's a nice controller and much more interesting to me than the nunchuck, but you don't sink money into a controller that could be spent on better hardware in the box instead.

I'm going to say something else that Nintendo fans really dont want to hear. And I expect the same echo chamber to all reassure each other that it isnt true. This will be Nintendos last console. They played chicken with disaster too many times against competition that isnt fucking around, especially MS, and unless something big happens for them in the handheld space to keep the console side afloat, you will never see another new console from Nintendo.

This post makes absolutely no sense whatsoever on multiple levels. Did your cat die this morning or something? Seriously bro.