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Media Create Sales: Week 29, 2017 (Jul 17 - Jul 23)

T

TheLegendaryN

Member
DarkLordMalik said:
I will never understand how can people mistake roman numerals. I consider V as having two I and V as having three I. I rarely make a mistake between both. The rest of the numbering system is pretty easy, atleast no game has been released yet which has crossed XX numerals.
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Well, there was Metroid: Other M...
sorry not sorry :p
 
G

Gotdatmoney

Member
whyreggielie said:
Are people saying this because they don't like anime characters? Because this:

Is in no way better than Xenoblade 2:

The characters are actually more Anime looking this time instead of this weird mix of realistic and anime that X had which made them look hideous. I'm really confused as to what some other people are seeing in 2 that is worse than X. Also, anyone who has played X knows that the animation quality is no where near Xenoblade 2.
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Yes the anime hurts it. The designs in X were not good but the realistic mish mash was hit an miss. Some of the characters had decent designs some didn't but the overall art direction was definitely more western friendly vs Xenoblade 2.

The characters should haved looked more in line to the Xenoblade 1 models from Smash 4. That would have been a better path. As of now the way XBC2 looks will limit it internationally imo. Personall I bought XBC and XCX but the look of XBC2 just turns me off so I'm out.

Renegade Frost said:
All that matters is if the target market likes the game enough to buy it and what the size of the target market is. The rest is focusing on the forest instead of the trees.

Imagine if every Zelda looks like Twilight princess due to the backlash from Wind waker and the Gamecube being perceived as kiddy by the target market at the time

we wouldnt have gottten BOTW, which is on its way to outselling every single zelda game that came before.

I mean lets be honest, do you think The Wonderful 101 would have sold better if they used a grittier artstyle? I doubt it, the marketing wasnt doing what it needed to do.
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The audience interested in the game is smaller because of how it looks. And Zelda is a franchise with a large variety of games using a large variety of art styles. The team always experiments. W101 didn't bomb because of looks. No one ever argued that to begin with so I dunno why you're even mentioning that.
 
A

Alrus

Member
At some point install base becomes less relevant to a game's success and it's more a matter of the platform having an active audience interested in the game you're trying to sell.
 
A

Aters

Member
Alrus said:
One thing I don't really understand about SE's global strategy is their refusal to try and cultivate an audience for their rpgs on Xbox outside of their biggest name.

Why have FF and KH on the platform but release any spin-off in the meantime to grow the audience? If you think it's not worth it, why even bother porting KH and FF to it in the first place?
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The Last Remnant? Infinite Undiscovery? Star Ocean 4? Nier? SE gave XBOX more chances than it deserves. JRPG on XBOX well never sell, end of the story. What they really need to do is to bring everything they've got to Steam.
 
A

Alrus

Member
Aters said:
The Last Remnant? Infinite Undiscovery? Star Ocean 4? Nier? SE gave XBOX more chances than it deserves. JRPG on XBOX well never sell, end of the story. What they really need to do is to bring everything they've got to Steam.
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Then why spend money porting KH3 and FFXV to it? Games that aren't announced for a PC release btw.
 
C

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
Alrus said:
One thing I don't really understand about SE's global strategy is their refusal to try and cultivate an audience for their rpgs on Xbox outside of their biggest name.

Why have FF and KH on the platform but release any spin-off in the meantime to grow the audience? If you think it's not worth it, why even bother porting KH and FF to it in the first place?
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The thing is....if you are interested in JRPGs you own a PS4 or at least a PC. With Nintendo you also know that since they are providing first party games like Pokemon, Fire Emblem and are strong in Japan that there will be some overlap.

So what you are asking is why SE isnt targeting a customer that is interested in their games but doesnt own a Sony/Nintendo plattform or a PC/mobile. Does this customer exist ?

Alrus said:
Then why spend money porting KH3 and FFXV to it? Games that aren't announced for a PC release btw.
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These games were announce early in the gen as multiplattform games - those franchises were too big to just bet on one system. Also those IPs are so big that they might at least sell up to 1m on Xbox and not completely tank.
 
T

TheLegendaryN

Member
We don't know whether/with how much Microsoft helped Square Enix to fund FFXV and KH3, but I think that's (a huge) part of the reason why we see those games on Xbox One.
 
A

Aters

Member
Alrus said:
Then why spend money porting KH3 and FFXV to it? Games that aren't announced for a PC release btw.
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Because they thought XONE would be as well as X360 but found out that wasn't the case? Also, FFXV is an open-world action RPG with realistic graphic, why shouldn't it be on XONE? They did port Type-0 to XONE too.

TheLegendaryN said:
We don't know whether/with how much Microsoft helped Square Enix to fund FFXV and KH3, but I think that's (a huge) part of the reason why we see those games on Xbox One.
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No way Microsoft helped funding FFXV and KH3.
 
Z

Zedark

Member
Kenzodielocke said:
FF13 did reasonably well and they didn't anticipate such a PS4 dominance. And it's bad form to cancel a version of a game already announced.
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It's not like those versions won't make them money, either. Whether that profit is enough to justify the time spent is to be determined, but when you're already working on it, there's no reason to cancel it at all. What's more, it's probably worth the time investment, too, so we will continue to see it happen. PC will be added to new projects most likely.
 
C

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
TheLegendaryN said:
We don't know whether/with how much Microsoft helped Square Enix to fund FFXV and KH3, but I think that's (a huge) part of the reason why we see those games on Xbox One.
Click to expand...

All FF13 games were on 360 and the 360 sold amazing in the US - so if you were to announce big games with worldwide appeal in 2012 you would be crazy to not target the 360 successor as well.
 
K

KillerMan91

Member
TheLegendaryN said:
We don't know whether/with how much Microsoft helped Square Enix to fund FFXV and KH3, but I think that's (a huge) part of the reason why we see those games on Xbox One.
Click to expand...

Well FF XV actually had also decent launch on Xbox One. If I remember right something like 400k units sold in US during launch month. I would think global sales of Xbox One version would be at least close to a million nowadays. Considering the similarity of the consoles I would say that easily pays for the port.
 
R

Renegade Frost

Banned
Gotdatmoney said:
Yes the anime hurts it. The designs in X were not good but the realistic mish mash was hit an miss. Some of the characters had decent designs some didn't but the overall art direction was definitely more western friendly vs Xenoblade 2.

The characters should haved looked more in line to the Xenoblade 1 models from Smash 4. That would have been a better path. As of now the way XBC2 looks will limit it internationally imo. Personall I bought XBC and XCX but the look of XBC2 just turns me off so I'm out.



The audience interested in the game is smaller because of how it looks. And Zelda is a franchise with a large variety of games using a large variety of art styles. The team always experiments. W101 didn't bomb because of looks. No one ever argued that to begin with so I dunno why you're even mentioning that.
Click to expand...

I mentioned The wonderful 101 because this is a debate the Development staff had during production.

You chose an art style based off the market you want to sell your game too, imo.
I trust developers to do decent market research so they know this before hand
 
W

wrowa

Member
From what I read in the past, management of the Dragon Quest franchise largely seems to boil down to: "Whatever Yuji Horii wants". He/Armor Project seem to own a significant part of the franchise and as long as he isn't going completely crazy SE seems to be content with giving him free reign. Strictly looking at Japan, I don't actually think that developing a PS4 version made a whole lot of financial sense -- given PS4's audience, most people who pick up DQXI on PS4 would likely also have bought it on 3DS if the PS4 version didn't exist -- but Horii wanted to create an HD RPG for DQ's anniversary, the numbers checked out well enough and so that's what they did. I don't think they ever had any false hopes that developing DQXI for PS4 would "reignite the console game market" in Japan (as Aters put it). No one would have expected at any point that PS4 would somehow sell well enough in Japan so that DQXI could sell its usual 3m+ copies on PS4 alone.

Considering how old Sugiyama is and with Yuji Horii and Akira Toriyama quickly approaching what could be considered as old enough to retire, I wonder if Dragon Quest XI might be the last mainline game developed by the three "founding fathers".
 
T

TheLegendaryN

Member
Aters said:
Because they thought XONE would be as well as X360 but found out that wasn't the case? Also, FFXV is an open-world action RPG with realistic graphic, why shouldn't it be on XONE? They did port Type-0 to XONE too.

No way Microsoft helped funding FFXV and KH3.
Click to expand...

cw_sasuke said:
All FF13 games were on 360 and the 360 sold amazing in the US - so if you were to announce big games with worldwide appeal in 2012 you would be crazy to not target the 360 successor as well.
Click to expand...

KillerMan91 said:
Well FF XV actually had also decent launch on Xbox One. If I remember right something like 400k units sold in US during launch month. I would think global sales of Xbox One version would be at least close to a million nowadays. Considering the similarity of the consoles I would say that easily pays for the port.
Click to expand...

Oh well, my bad. As I said, it was just a guess. Didn't know how well the FFXIII games did (nor FFXV itself) on Xbox.
 
S

Skullwaker

Member
Oregano said:
Hypothetical question, will Nintendo be the only publisher to have a post-3DS game sell 2 million copies?
Click to expand...

Capcom and Level-5 maybe. Capcom with a MH game and Level-5 with...something. Maybe a new breakout hit. Or perhaps YW will see a revival on the Switch (I kinda doubt that though).
 
V

Vena

Member
Skullwaker said:
Depends on if MHW damages the brand in Japan at all and when the hypothetical MH Switch releases.
Click to expand...

Well it certainly isn't going to grow the brand. And depending on the time tables, it could just atrophy by age and time as the audience moves on and younger audiences aren't brought in due to absence.
 
C

cw_sasuke

If all DLC came tied to $13 figurines, I'd consider all DLC to be free
MHW damaging the brand ? The games looks awesome and is the next big step for the series. If MH Tri didnt hurt the brand i doubt a good looking new main MH on PS4/XB/PC will kill it.

Assuming that they will have a new Switch MH out in a timely fashion.
 
S

Skullwaker

Member
Vena said:
Well it certainly isn't going to grow the brand. And depending on the time tables, it could just atrophy by age and time as the audience moves on and younger audiences aren't brought in due to absence.
Click to expand...

cw_sasuke said:
MHW damaging the brand ? The games looks awesome and is the next big step for the series. If MH Tri didnt hurt the brand i doubt a good looking new main MH on PS4/XB/PC will kill it.

Assuming that they will have a new Switch MH out in a timely fashion.
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This is what I mean. MHW in 2018 and then a MH game on Switch in 2019 would be fine. It wouldn't leave such a large gap that fans of the handheld games would be discouraged by and thus feel that they should move on. But releasing it in 2020 or later? That's running the risk of alienating your key audience for too long.

Alrus said:
It's not going to damage the brand more than MH XX did that's for sure.
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I think if MHW does end up damaging the brand, it won't be for the same reasons as MHXX at all.
 
W

wrowa

Member
jonno394 said:
Who and what are you thinking?
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I don't see neither Monster Hunter nor Dragon Quest somehow collapsing so badly that either series will never break 2m again. And generally speaking, I'm sure there will be also a new hit IP at some point: No one would have expected Yokai Watch to blow up the way it did prior to its release and look what happened.

Who knows how the market will develop in the future anyway. Maybe we're looking at a crazy future where FF16 will be released on both PS5 and Switch 2, leading to the series finally breaking 2m again. Who knows! Claiming that no 3rd party will ever release a game that breaks 2m definitely strikes me as unnecessarily pessimistic.
 
J

jonno394

Member
wrowa said:
I don't see neither Monster Hunter nor Dragon Quest somehow collapsing so badly that either series will never break 2m again. And generally speaking, I'm sure there will be also a new hit IP at some point: No one would have expected Yokai Watch to blow up the way it did prior to its release and look what happened.

Who knows how the market will develop in the future anyway. Maybe we're looking at a crazy future where FF16 will be released on both PS5 and Switch 2, leading to the series finally breaking 2m again. Who knows! Claiming that no 3rd party will ever release a game that breaks 2m definitely strikes me as unnecessarily pessimistic.
Click to expand...

Ah ok, i assumed the original poster was referencing single console exclusives, my mistake if you didn't read it like that. With exclusives i can't see Sony getting 2m sellers on ps4, only nintendo with Switch.
 
S

Skullwaker

Member
jonno394 said:
Ah ok, i assumed the original poster was referencing single console exclusives, my mistake if you didn't read it like that. With exclusives i can't see Sony getting 2m sellers, only Switch.
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This is the way I read it as well. If that's not what Oregano meant, then I definitely think DQ will remain in the 2m+ category.
 
P

Psycho_Mantis

Banned
Aters said:
No. handling a franchise is much more than just making games. DQ is handled extremely poorly by SE. DQX, an MMORPG was released on Wii in 2012, just a month before WiiU launch. That was a huge mistake. It killed the momentum of the series. Core DQ fans in Japan might enjoy it, but as others have pointed out, DQ is a very casual franchise that relies on a much broader audience. The MMO nature blocked all those people from entering the franchise. Not to mention it never came to the west so what little fanbase DQVIII and IX cultivated here was simply abandoned. For the greater audience, there's an almost a decade of vacuum for Dragon Quest, and that definitely hurts the relevance of the franchise.

DQXI is another example of brand mismanagement. It started out as a PS4 game, yet they have to bring it to 3DS because SE vastly overestimated their ability to "reignite the console game market" in Japan. What we got here is a great console DQ on a pathetically small install base, probably the smallest a mainline DQ has ever been on, and a great portable DQ on an outdated system whose successor is already out. Not an ideal situation.
Click to expand...

This seems like a very insular way of thinking and I'm glad SE did not follow it.

First you have the dev time and ambitions, and there definitely seems to be a want to make a DQ with updated visuals and ambitious scope. A similar thing with the MH devs.

Then you have the PS4 doing exceedingly well overseas, and a want to expand over seas sales (especially when KH and FF sell 5 million+ overseas). Again similar to MH devs.

DQ releasing late on a system is also nothing new so I fail to see why you paint this as such a negative. Also now that a PS4 SKU exists, porting is not nearly as cumbersome to future platforms.

What we have now is am ambitious DQ game, that pleases both fans and devs and has potential to become the best selling entry in the series.

Alrus said:
One thing I don't really understand about SE's global strategy is their refusal to try and cultivate an audience for their rpgs on Xbox outside of their biggest name.

Why have FF and KH on the platform but release any spin-off in the meantime to grow the audience? If you think it's not worth it, why even bother porting KH and FF to it in the first place?
Click to expand...

FFXV shipped 6 million. XB1 probably accounted for 800k- max 1 million. Thats around 15%. If you have a game like Nier, you are looking at 150k sales. While there is an audience there, with smaller titles the proportion interested are too little for it to be worthwhile.

Also there hasn't been an KH spin off for any platform other than the PS4 recently.
 
L

LordKano

Member
Also there hasn't been an KH spin off for any platform other than the PS4 recently.
Click to expand...

The last fully-fledged KH spin-off is DDD on 3DS if I'm not wrong, unless you count collections or a 3 hour demo prequel on the same level.
 
O

Oregano

Member
jonno394 said:
Ah ok, i assumed the original poster was referencing single console exclusives, my mistake if you didn't read it like that. With exclusives i can't see Sony getting 2m sellers on ps4, only nintendo with Switch.
Click to expand...

Skullwaker said:
This is the way I read it as well. If that's not what Oregano meant, then I definitely think DQ will remain in the 2m+ category.
Click to expand...

I wasn't talking specifically console exclusives. The difficult(but fun part) is considering when those games will release. A portable Monster Hunter is at least two years away and a new DQ is probably more like five or six years away.
 
T

TheLegendaryN

Member
Level-5 used to be capable of creating breakout hits. They weren't able to maintain those hits, however. In the past year, Level-5 seems to have become a mess. There's a lot of delays, Yo-kai Watch 3 wasn't as successful as everyone hoped after YW2, it doesn't seem like there's (ever been) much hype for The Snack World. It's a mess.

I haven't been following the responses to Lady Layton, but it doesn't seem like a bad game, does it? I also have high hopes for Inazuma Eleven Ares. Let's hope that hope is correct and that these projects will lead the way back to the top for Level-5, because they have a lot of potential. The big question is of course how long they'll keep making games for consoles. 3DS ports and smallers projects for smartphones are already available/in development. It may take a couple of years, but I think Level-5 will come up with something huge again sooner or later. Question is whether it'll be for consoles or smartphones... (I think Nintendo is doing great in making the Switch an attractive alternative for kids (which are Level-5's main audience, ofc) to smartphones, so I think Hino & co. will keep making console games for now.)
 
G

ggx2ac

Member
Capcom's Q&A is up but only in Japanese.

Capcom has HIGH expectations for Monster Hunter World, believes they will achieve their 10.3 million units sales goal:

This is Google translated but you can interpret it.

Q: The number of new projects for the full year in Consumer is 10.3 million units, which is on par with the previous term, is not it a bullish setting as the year after the release of "Resident Evil Resident Evil"? I would like to ask about the future prospects including the expectation for "Monster Hunter: World" released this season.

A: The number of new plan for the full term is composed of 37 titles (SKU base) including the transplant title etc. of the past work of the past work, so I think that achievement is sufficiently possible. In addition, "Monster Hunter: World" got a good feeling, such as getting high evaluation at the announcement of E3. Looking ahead, we will try to maximize sales by not only acting on the Japanese market but also actively implementing policies in Europe and the US market.
Click to expand...

http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/data/explanation.html

There's more in the link, for example their answers related mobile gaming doesn't give much confidence.
 
A

Alrus

Member
I sincerely hope Capcom doesn't expect MH World to sell better than what Resident Evil usually does worldwide. That seems a bit crazy.

Edit: I mean it's nice that they believe the game will sell well since that means they'll push it pretty hard but still...
 
R

Reki

Member
Why do they keep setting unrealistic expectations when they fail to meet them? Is there any financial advantage to that, like projecting a better image to investors in the short term?
 
G

ggx2ac

Member
Sandfox said:
MH only has to sell like 7-8 million to hit their goal. Totally realistic.
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Alrus said:
I sincerely hope Capcom doesn't expect MH World to sell better than what Resident Evil usually does worldwide. That seems a bit crazy.
Click to expand...

Reki said:
Why do they keep setting unrealistic expectations when they fail to meet them? Is there any financial advantage to that, like projecting a better image to investors in the short term?
Click to expand...

Well, you know. Handhelds were holding the series back in the west so it's time to see those multi-million sales numbers that will appear at launch.
 
G

gtj1092

Member
Isn't there sales goal pretty close to what they sold this year. 10 million sales off of 37 skus doesn't seem unrealistic. They will be half way there with just MHW and MvC initial shipments.
 
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