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Pokemon Ultra Moon and Ultra Sun for Nintendo 3DS
- Thread starter Mysterious
- Start date
I really hate when people use this excuse. They throw these games on Switch, sales go up way faster then if they dont. They could of been released on both hardwares.
The Pokemon franchise is co-owned by Nintendo, so yes it is their job too. If it wasn't, then these games would release on other platforms, like mobile, which would make them a hell of a lot more money then only being on Nintendo hardware.
Honestly, I would say 2020. At this rate, it wouldn't surprise me to see DP remakes next year on 3DS. 2019 no game. 2020 next Gen.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
Yeah, nobody is buying a Switch nowadays.
Because the Switch is going to be the next platform they support? They should want it to be selling gangbusters now so the install base is even better by the time Gen 8 is due, no? I really don't know why there's so many people questioning this. The assets and models wouldn't even need to be redone so a HD port would not be some mammoth undertaking.
This actually actively hurts the Switch's momentum imo. They've just released a brand new console that is selling really well and people are excited about, and now they're releasing one of their biggest franchises on the old system. See this thread for the people that are like 'well I don't need to get a Switch then' for the reason why this is not the greatest idea.
There is literally no downside to releasing on both. You'd have millions of people buying the 3DS versions, and millions of people buying the Switch version. And you'd push Switch sales even more, too.
Literally nobody in the mass market knows or cares. This game is not going to hurt the switch lol. Maybe if everyone in the world posted on neogaf every day. Normal people arent looking at nintendos decisions and deciding to buy or not buy a nintendo switch based on the way they are handling an ip. They buy a console when theres a game or games they want. Its not that complicated
Takamura-San
Member
My money is on Mobile. I would not be surprised if the ROI on Pokemon Go was higher than any of the 3ds games.
pock3tmonster
Banned
Based on the data mining of Sun and Moon, Ultra Sun and Moon are the last games of Generation 7 though. If Diamond and Pearl remakes are coming, it'll be in Gen 8. I fully expect to see Gamefreak either release Gen 8 for Switch next year, or take a break and release Gen 8 in 2019. 2020 is too long a wait when this Generation has a smaller number of legendaries.
Renegade Frost
Banned
The downside is time and feasibility which you seem to think dont exist for some reason.
This isnt going to do damage to the Switches momentum
Nintendo could care less about the fact that hardcore gamers are losing their mind on neogaf over a rumor that was never true because they're anxious about having to buy two nintendo consoles instead of one
I didn't say the Switch is lacking sales now, but sure snark is helpful.
Or maybe they just started developing the Switch game and its too early to show?
Seems like the most obvious explanation, but noone seems to entertain it.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
If it hurts it enough so I can actually find one this year, I'm all for it.
Renegade Frost
Banned
Lmao same here!!
Gamefreak has already said they will never release mainline pokemon on mobile.
They're never releasing mainline pokemon on anything that isnt a nintendo system.
Yeah but that thing was hardly portable.
People are crying for no reason. Obviously the Switch is going to get its own mainline Pokemon game. You'd be foolish to think otherwise.
True I suppose.
Still, those people walking into a store and seeing Mario Kart and Pokemon already on the Switch could get them off the fence. Plus there are also definitely people who would be much more likely to upgrade to a Switch for the HD port.
They could have been readying this alongside Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon. As I said, the assets are HD ready, so time and feasibility shouldn't be an issue.
Then again, this is GameFreak.
NightwingRebirth
Member
Here's why I'm upset this is on the 3DS:
We've spent all of Generation 6 without third versions, which means I bought Pokemon Sun thinking this was the only version of Alola I'd be playing. USM is basically telling me I made a poor decision in buying the lesser game of Gen. 7, when I should've waited to play the one with more forms and potentially more content.
USM also tells me I have to deal with the 3DS and all its shortcomings again (I was okay with the idea of "replaying" through Alola if it was in HD, but I guess that's on me).
Pokemon SM also had some performance issues that I ignored only because I was led to believe an HD version with better performance was coming soon.
Here's why I hoped/believed this was coming to the Switch:
Pokemon SM had performance issues for no real reason other than "future-proofing," which would've made sense if this was actually coming to the Switch. But it's not, which basically means Game Freak allowed it to be this way on purpose.
Pokemon SM used the second screen much less than previous games (I mean, Festival Plaza) and it ultimately wasn't to move to a single screen, it was just a bad implementation in some aspects.
Obviously, the Stars rumour.
I'd also believed Nintendo wasn't playing around this time, and a big-selling Pokemon game so soon would definitely lead to a larger install base, which would then lead to third-party support (yeah lol, I was dumb to think this was happening).
So, what I'm saying is, I'm not really upset that this isn't on the Switch, I'm way more upset that this retroactively makes me dislike my Pokemon Sun cartridge sitting at home. Like, I paid for something that wasn't as valuable as I thought, and so I'm salty af.
Hope this game still turns out okay, though.
We've spent all of Generation 6 without third versions, which means I bought Pokemon Sun thinking this was the only version of Alola I'd be playing. USM is basically telling me I made a poor decision in buying the lesser game of Gen. 7, when I should've waited to play the one with more forms and potentially more content.
USM also tells me I have to deal with the 3DS and all its shortcomings again (I was okay with the idea of "replaying" through Alola if it was in HD, but I guess that's on me).
Pokemon SM also had some performance issues that I ignored only because I was led to believe an HD version with better performance was coming soon.
Here's why I hoped/believed this was coming to the Switch:
Pokemon SM had performance issues for no real reason other than "future-proofing," which would've made sense if this was actually coming to the Switch. But it's not, which basically means Game Freak allowed it to be this way on purpose.
Pokemon SM used the second screen much less than previous games (I mean, Festival Plaza) and it ultimately wasn't to move to a single screen, it was just a bad implementation in some aspects.
Obviously, the Stars rumour.
I'd also believed Nintendo wasn't playing around this time, and a big-selling Pokemon game so soon would definitely lead to a larger install base, which would then lead to third-party support (yeah lol, I was dumb to think this was happening).
So, what I'm saying is, I'm not really upset that this isn't on the Switch, I'm way more upset that this retroactively makes me dislike my Pokemon Sun cartridge sitting at home. Like, I paid for something that wasn't as valuable as I thought, and so I'm salty af.
Hope this game still turns out okay, though.
Out of curiosity, what led you to believe it would perform better on the Switch?
I've seen numerous people complain about performance on the 3DS, and yeah that's fair, it has its problems, but do you really think going to the Switch would somehow change everything? You're only setting yourself up for more disappointment here.
The Switch is fairly more powerful than the 3DS.
Not playing a game in 240p in 2017 is a start.
NightwingRebirth
Member
Yes? Why wouldn't it run better on a much more powerful console? The problem with 3DS Pokemon games is that they weren't optimized properly, and I'm sure a hypothetical Switch game wouldn't be perfect 1080p60 or something without optimization, but I really do think it'd be a much better game than what we got.
Yeah.
The Pokemon models' high polygon count may slow down the 3DS, but the overworld in SuMo look acceptable even with the simple graphics work.
The cartoony artstyle helps, I think they can reach an acceptable performance if they target 720p in handheld mode.
It'd certainly be improved, I'll agree to that, but it amuses me to see people here and elsewhere bashing Game Freak and how they've handled 3D thus far, and then them (and others) going "but it'd be great on the switch!"
So if Game Freak is, according to some, rather incompetent with 3D, why would jumping to the Switch be a solution to this? I'm just confused by this. People are just setting themselves up for some disappointment if they think it'll be a cure-all.
Gamefreak aren't the quickest to take to new tech. XandY had issue and then Sun and Moon had issues...and that was with the same tech. They seem to be a much smaller studio than their worth states they should be lol.
And yes it would have moved some Switches to have it on there but its not going to be the end of the world for it either. I could see this argument holding more weight if the Console was bombing but it isn't....so saving the Pokebomb for when things slow down also makes sense too. Not to mention perhaps they could get some slackers to buy a 3ds this christmas and then get hooked to buy a Switch next year. They want to get their hooks in so you buy all the shit, not just the newest one.
its funny to see people so mad that for the first time in a long time, Nintendo isn't leaving a previous system to die. the 3DSs swan song is quite nice lol.
GuessMyUserName
Member
Having more power would indeed solve the problem of 3DS not having the power to run their own games.
R10Neymarfan
Member
gamefreak can't do HD towns guys. They can barely achieve 240p stereo 3D towns
DragonGirl
Member
Eh, this isn't really surprising.; Gamefreak has always been slow to adopt new platforms. It took forever for them to get off the DS. Also, as much as Nintendo would love for them to make a mainline Pokemon game for Switch, Gamefreak is under no obligation to do so. I figure they eventually will, but they'll do it whenever they're ready.
Pokken makes me happy though. I bought it on the WiiU but it has been sitting on my backlog ever since. I'd rather play it on the Switch so time to flip one for the other.
Pokken makes me happy though. I bought it on the WiiU but it has been sitting on my backlog ever since. I'd rather play it on the Switch so time to flip one for the other.
I'm fine with them taking the time to adjust to new hardware, I just think the Switch is sufficiently powerful to achieve HD Pokemon with minimal performance issues, even if they just reuse their current assets.
If we get a mainline game at some point, performance issues would be disappointing unless they're really trying to push the hardware with additional graphical effects - which isn't necessary with these games. I'd rather have 1080p 30/60.
yanipheonu
Member
If the graphical prowess of the console is better, Game Freak won't run into the same problems with their high poly models.
we're talking a gap of a 6 year old underpowered portable versus a recently released console closer to a Wii U in power.
It will just run better, intrinsically.
NightwingRebirth
Member
Because it'd be better. Idk how to explain what I mean, but it's like, sure, Goku isn't the smartest guy around, and it'll take a whole lot for him to go Super Saiyan Blue, but his Super Saiyan is lame and I'd rather see Super Saiyan 2. That's about it. A 240p experience with somewhat poor performance is kinda lame for $40. That same experience in 720p on a bigger screen and with better performance is all I could ask for right now.
I know game development isn't easy or cheap, so we're not getting a ground-up Switch game any time soon, but this hypothetical Stars would be leagues better than SM and, as far as I know, USM, too. Maybe Game Freak will go on to develop a terrible HD Pokemon game seeing as they've had trouble with the 3DS, but Stars would be better than SM.
Carl-Sagan
Member
I get where you're coming up. I'm just not exactly following why you're upset about this. There have been plenty of Pokemon titles that have had its better version released. It wasn't until Black and White where we saw four copies release and not three. It is sort of to be expected at this point. Nothing wrong with it either. Become a patient gamer and don't get releases of popular video games until later down the road.
The target audience is people who already own a 3DS. There isn't much money to be made if they sell the game as a Nintendo Switch exclusive, compared to the people who already own a 3DS. People who already own a Nintendo Switch probably already own a 3DS. Expecting HD graphics on a handheld is setting your expectations way to high.
I'm not copying how performance issues = future proofing. There was talk months ago about people suspecting high poly models is equivalent to Game Freak future proofing the title. That honestly is a bit to trivial for Game Freak or any experienced developer to do in my opinion.
Not quite following how this relates to your original complaint.
There isn't really a point in me repeating what I said in the first part of my reply. I'd be repeating how you seem experienced in the series well enough to expect a better version of essentially the same game - with some added tweaking of course.
Hopefully it turns out alright. Kind of hope they add a bit more to the story or maybe introduce new features. Not getting my hopes high on this one.
It will run better in some ways, yes, but what I'm arguing is that people expecting a jump to the Switch to be a cure for all that ails the recent games are likely fooling themselves. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what people are expecting. Its just, like I said, I see people bemoaning how Game Freak has had problems with 3D with the 3DS, and yet seem to have high expectations for performance on the Switch.
All I'm saying is, be realistic here. I would've expected them to have had a grasp on how the 3DS works by SM. I mean, its their third game on the handheld (fifth and sixth if you count each game separately) and they still have problems with it. Expect an eventual Switch version to have problems. But I am the sort of person that prefers to temper expectations. If they prove me wrong, I'll happily eat crow. Feel free to remind me, even! I'll be happy if it comes out great, whenever it is.
Just...don't expect them to be absolute wizards with it, that's all.
Well, see what I said above, for the most part. I don't think it'd be a cure-all. But its all hypothetical anyway.
We'll see at some point in the future, I guess. Again, will be happy if I'm wrong!
It makes sense that the 3DS's weaker overall hardware can make achieving good framerate with high polycount models and stereoscopic 3D more difficult.
The Switch can offer more breathing room, at the very least. My lowest expectations of 720p with a solid 30 fps would still make the games look fairly pretty, since the art is good and they use cel-shading.
It's surely not a simple matter of "dump the code and hit upres", but I assume they've had more than a couple of months to familiarize themselves. I'm willing to wait a bit longer if it means a better looking and running game.
NightwingRebirth
Member
I mean, that's my point. I thought I wouldn't need to wait because there wasn't going to be a third version. The last time we got something like that was BW2, and how many years ago was that? They broke the pattern, and so I had no reason to believe they were going back to it.
I mean, expecting a developer to not develop an HD game for a console with a 240p screen would be common sense, but apparently Game Freak doesn't care about that at all. So, knowing that they were doing it anyways, I believed that there was actually a reason behind using "future-proofed" assets, and not just ruining the performance of the game for no reason.
Um. They are high poly models. Try looking up Sun and Moon running on the Citra emulator on YT, plenty of videos showing off a 1080p SM without any of the performance issues.
Well, this post isn't a complaint at all. It was just my reasoning for being salty, really. If I came in to post something like, "wow, I'm so disappointed," people would be jumping at my ass.
Anyways, the first point was to say, "they changed something for the worse, which made me think that they had a reason for doing it." They didn't.
The second point was talking about my own naivety, which I wanted to acknowledge before someone else did.
I'm in fact experienced in the series enough that I believed Pokemon games stopped working in patterns. No more third versions, no way to predict when remakes will come out, and maybe no sequels aside from BW2 (since XY got nothing). Then they go back to the Gen. 5 way of doing things, which I normally would support, but yeah, I wasn't expecting it and got burned. Obviously, my lack of a purchase is not going to affect the sales of this game at all, but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to post about how I feel about it.
Well, alternate story implies we'll get at least as much as the last new third version, Platinum. I still do like the Pokemon series, so I'd rather it do really well than not.
Renegade Frost
Banned
As I have mentioned before to UltraHD, the already HD ready Zelda on the WII U which was released on the Switch with no optimizaton done took 9 months to make.
And that's EAD Tokyo. How long do you think it would have taken Gamefreak to make a switch port? Surely beyond 2018 dont you think?
ZiggyPalffyLA
Member
Hopefully Game Freak has a different team working on USUM, at least for the online integration. I'd be happy if they just copied over everything from X/Y. The PSS/O-Power thing was awesome.
Renegade Frost
Banned
Nah keep festival plaza
Shadow Broker
Banned
No. Please don't. That thing is a abomination. Keep it as something else but bring back the PSS.
The Plaza is fine for what it is, but as a replacement for PSS it's clunky, PSS made everything pretty simple and straightforward without missing anything.
Sigismundo
Member
If I had to guess this is almost certainly a B-team game. I don't think A-team has ever done a sequel/third version/remake.
NightwingRebirth
Member
SM is also a much smaller game. Even if we said it'd take 12 months, that's about when Ultra SM are coming out. We're also talking about Game Freak. As much as some call them incompetent, and as trash as they are at making games for the 3DS, they also release games nearly annually. They could handle it. And even if it took them until January or something... that wouldn't really make a difference? It's Pokemon after all.
zelhawks37
Member
Depends on what content will be on these, but it will take a lot to buy these remakes...
Renegade Frost
Banned
PSS Is kind of hard to navigate tho.
Festival Plaza is not
GameFreak doesnt have A or B teams.
megarockexe
Member
Guys, this is definitely their last 3DS game. It was always wishful thinking a version would come to Switch about now, but it's now clear that will be with Gen 8.
UnemployedVillain
Member
Yeah they do. Remakes are handled by a different team from the main games
Well, not as much clear as it being "Damn it Nintendo, please don't fuck this up" lol
The idea that GAF is somehow not representative of gamers, and therefore its opinion should be ignored is beyond ridiculous. "no one cares outside of hardcore gamers", what are you even basing this off?
GAF is a microcosm of popular opinion, accentuated.
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