I'm definitely digging this series, shedding some light on stuff I wasn't aware of. Didn't realize you could customize the HUD...
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Splinter Cell Blacklist (anti)hype thread | Experience All 5 Stages of Ironside Loss
- Thread starter Sober
- Start date
I'm definitely digging this series, shedding some light on stuff I wasn't aware of. Didn't realize you could customize the HUD...
haha oh man who asked for this? Fuck I was thinking of giving it a chance to try a no kill sneak playthrough but god damn stealth looks dumb as shit. See This part
What don't you like about it? I think the guy that playing kinda sucked and stuff he does makes me cringe, but I still think a no kill sneak playthrough will be a blast.
NotTheGuyYouKill
Member
Oh, that's good.
vasametropolis
Member
SC: Blacklist |OT| (stealth) ACTION
Junky AI has always been a part of Splinter Cell and the stealth genre though. It's why I've been harping about Ubisoft actually punishing players for breaking stealth and getting smarter AI to where ghosting and shit has to be a slight puzzle and some smart play. :/ Alas, they opened it up to a sandbox (not a bad thing) but don't punish you for going loud and "shootbang"ing people in the face where enemies fortify positions to get ready to take you down in three seconds if they see you coming. *sigh*
Edit: Nor have they smartened the AI up too much. I'm really worried that going "panther" and using Mark and Execute on anything lower than Perfectionist (that turns it off?) breaks the game as hard as it did in Conviction where I cry tears of blood for the stealth genre being dead.
He's complaining about the fact he walked into an open light with the two guards there and there really doesn't seem to be much in the way so it should be right in their periphery. He is also playing on perfectionist so he's not wrong to find that a bit fishy.
^^ Actually I'm also concerned because it looks like they really wanted to emphasize they built up the AI to work together, call one another for help or notice people going missing and then we have ... that. I checked earlier a few seconds when he pings them with the sonar goggles and they really aren't looking away from the direction so much as they just don't have much in the way of peripheral vision (they are looking down the steps in their direction).
edit: in all fairness if AI was ever that good in stealth games they would probably end up requiring more cover than is needed. That and guards would also have to adapt to being able to discern movement in the dark (even without audio cues).
Did he meant to say at about the 1:30 mark, that the game allows us do disable lethal attacks, so we won't accidently trigger them?
SC: Blacklist |OT| No Ironside
In the weapon wheel, it is a toggle between non-lethal and lethal so you won't accidentally hit the wrong trigger like in Chaos Theory. In BL the melee attack is on a face button, so it needs a toggle anyway.
Great, now if the game does not force me to kill ever, I'll buy
Still sour about the one story demanded kill in Chaos Theory.
SirIgbyCeaser
Banned
Damn this game is so forgettable except for the fact they're bringing back Spy Vs Mercs
Its that damn call of duty/BF3 syndrom.
Its that damn call of duty/BF3 syndrom.
So here is Spies vs. Mercs part 1 (spy): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nZlecnpMFE
And Spies vs. Mercs part 2 (merc): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m56J7RwqaGY
Basically the same match, each team switches after a round and the team with the most progress is the winner. Interesting tidbits include mercs using security cameras in the spawn/death camera and even those can be disabled by spies. Also shows off a few torso abilities like the digital guille suit (invisible cloak) or the merc that can launch a trirotor drone and fly it around. Both teams can also zap one another's gadgets with an EMP-like ability. Looks like there are other gadgets too like prox mines, grenades, and a radar that marks enemies in a silhouette.
For SP, I guess here is another video preview from Rob Cram about the level design:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-jOneibULQ
Looks like as I expected, objectives are generally set up at a chokepoint area but as soon as you pass into the next area it opens up fairly wide into a nice playable sandboxy area for you to explore and navigate, repeat a couple of times with varying degrees and it sounds almost like what Chaos Theory offered. He shows off a small segment of the Panama estate map so not much spoilers unless you want to explore it for yourself.
And Spies vs. Mercs part 2 (merc): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m56J7RwqaGY
Basically the same match, each team switches after a round and the team with the most progress is the winner. Interesting tidbits include mercs using security cameras in the spawn/death camera and even those can be disabled by spies. Also shows off a few torso abilities like the digital guille suit (invisible cloak) or the merc that can launch a trirotor drone and fly it around. Both teams can also zap one another's gadgets with an EMP-like ability. Looks like there are other gadgets too like prox mines, grenades, and a radar that marks enemies in a silhouette.
For SP, I guess here is another video preview from Rob Cram about the level design:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-jOneibULQ
Looks like as I expected, objectives are generally set up at a chokepoint area but as soon as you pass into the next area it opens up fairly wide into a nice playable sandboxy area for you to explore and navigate, repeat a couple of times with varying degrees and it sounds almost like what Chaos Theory offered. He shows off a small segment of the Panama estate map so not much spoilers unless you want to explore it for yourself.
So I was inspired by this (horribly low res) image to create a high res version of it for mobile wallpaper. I liked the concept of the image, so I tried my best to recreate it faithfully in high res.
I made an iOS variety:
and Android variety:
I made an iOS variety:
and Android variety:
NullPointer
Member
+1 to this.
Perfect!
Jaded Alyx
Member
Soo......try looking at all the trailers and footage since then?
brucewaynegretzky
Member
Question I can't find the answer to anywhere:
Will the Wii U version support the Pro Controller for single player?
Will the Wii U version support the Pro Controller for single player?
I thought the same thing, dismissed it as COD chasing trash, but they've done a lot to try to prove that it is faithful to the old Splinter Cell games. Adding more (optional) action does not take away from the fact that you can stealth the entire game. It introduces more people to the series, and maybe makes a few more stealth fans while it's at it.
Yeah, but at the same time players wouldn't be moving through open light with no notice, you know?
It's a fine line between "game" and "realistic" along with "hard vs easy."
But I really do want the AI to react to players and call in reinforcements and the like and have the player have to think about their actions and what they'll do if things go south instead of just shooting people in the head with a silenced pistol or running through open light to stab someone without the other guard noticing, you know?
Oh I definitely agree with the stepping into the light clearly in view in that video, that's pretty stupid, no argument there.
From what I can tell from what little gameplay footage of people not talking over all of it, they made the AI convincing enough that they seem (mostly) capable and real, will work together if you cause enough suspicion. That or simply just through enough smoke and mirrors they pulled it off but missed a few spots.
...
On another topic, it looks like the perfectionist "no frontal takedowns" line might actually be only for heavies (regardless of difficulty) and when they are fully detected. There is a small moment where your detection arc flashes white meaning they've spotted you but haven't made up their minds yet where you can take them down when they turn around.
There's also the matter of Mark and Execute. Looks like they put a gauge on it. Disabled in Perfectionist, obviously but it seems inconsistent watching gameplay vids. But it seems like a melee grab/takedown will fill the gauge to full while it looks like non-lethal ranged knockouts (gadgets mostly) will fill somewhere between 25-50% (a pip or two); same goes for lethal, ranged kills. It might even be affected by difficulty. Needless to say it's probably more complicated to use if you don't want to dart into melee to auto-fill the gauge but you can something, I guess, on your path to earning a token.
Looks like UbiTO flew in a bunch of YouTubers to join them. Not sure why this didn't happen sooner, because there is finally some legit SvM footage out on the internet which could've been put out there a little sooner. This August seems a bit busier than usual with people trying to avoid getting caught in the GTA/CoD crossfire later in the year.
SP videos have spoilers, obviously
There might be some more coming onto YT but for now here are some previews:
First 15 minutes of Blacklist which mostly covers the opening cinematics and maybe 2 minutes of gameplay until you reach the SMI aka the main menu interface, though I've been told you can skip them if you really just want to jump into SvM/Co-op after setting up UPlay.
Here is a 30 minute walkthrough of the level "Safehouse" which is the first actual mission of the game.
Console Creatures Interview with Maxime Beland. He is also playing SP during the interview. Also one of the very few times before the game releases you might actually see someone move slowly while crouched. Purple goggles warning.
Here is a preview/impressions from some YouTubers from WikiGameGuides. - shows off some SP and SvM footage.
Here is a 20 minute match between some YouTubers (their POV) versus the devs in 2v2 Spies vs. Mercs Classic
SP videos have spoilers, obviously
There might be some more coming onto YT but for now here are some previews:
First 15 minutes of Blacklist which mostly covers the opening cinematics and maybe 2 minutes of gameplay until you reach the SMI aka the main menu interface, though I've been told you can skip them if you really just want to jump into SvM/Co-op after setting up UPlay.
Here is a 30 minute walkthrough of the level "Safehouse" which is the first actual mission of the game.
Console Creatures Interview with Maxime Beland. He is also playing SP during the interview. Also one of the very few times before the game releases you might actually see someone move slowly while crouched. Purple goggles warning.
Here is a preview/impressions from some YouTubers from WikiGameGuides. - shows off some SP and SvM footage.
Here is a 20 minute match between some YouTubers (their POV) versus the devs in 2v2 Spies vs. Mercs Classic
New trailer: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOxgKZYPxj4
wow that looks awesome
I forgot that Carlo Rota was playing the bad guy.
Looks like there will be one charismatic character, at least.
This game has too many trailers.
Carlo Rota finally playing a bad guy eh.
You know they already teased a launch trailer? That's how you know the game has too many trailers, when it teases one just the other day and then this. :lol
doniewhalberg
Member
Cancelled my pre-order since we're getting a new pc at the end of the month and it looks like I'll get the game free with my GPU. It'll probably one of the first games I played on the new rig, ~exciting! Haven't been following news on the pc edition, is it looking like a good one?
I knew I recognized that guy as Morris from 24.
Since you are clearly buying a nvidia GPU: http://youtu.be/CwFtQPhaQBU
doniewhalberg
Member
Sober, you're going to be able to take credit for at least half the game's sales. Perfect video, looks very exciting with plenty of neat features. Haha yea, there's an outside chance I'll overegg the cake at the last minute and get a 780, but probably a 770.
This is a Blacklist 4v4 match Not entirely off camera, but not a direct recording either.
The POV team is probably new to the game and not the devs because lol at that scoreboard. When they were spies they couldn't pull off a single full hack because well ... at least the guy playing was trying to KDR chase. Guess what that gets you?
In all fairness he did pull off some killstreaks but a few other times he tried to run out into the open and got gunned down super quick. A few times spies were shooting back at mercs. Once at the start from merc POV, got easily mowed down while I guess shooting a merc will work too, but it'll empty your clip and causes quite a lot of crosshair bloom in doing so.
Otherwise the video shows off some of the preset classes but not really much of the digging through menus to change the custom loadouts.
That and mercs really are tough as fuck unless you can catch them either unawares or if you can bull rush them and get lucky that they aren't as fast as you or they are in the middle of a reload or something.
edit: If anyone cares, here is someone browsing through most of the SP/Co-op customization menus
legacyzero
Banned
Edit: I did a new thread.. Direct feed footage
I wanna know this as well. I like playing as a Spy that has to hide. I hope that the PC version at least get host features.
I wanna know this as well. I like playing as a Spy that has to hide. I hope that the PC version at least get host features.
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._taking_the_series_forward_and_wii_u_features
So am I reading this right? All versions will have offline co-op except for the Wii U version?
So am I reading this right? All versions will have offline co-op except for the Wii U version?
ebullientprism
Member
I think maybe they mean offline as in Gamepad + TV. Splitscreen should still be in.
Yeah. I never thought I would say this but having just heard the new guy for the first time, it just sounds so wrong. I never really thought having Ironside was such a big deal but this feels like watching a Halo cutscene where its just some random dude doing the VO for Master Chief instead of Steve Downes. You dont think its a big deal until you see it happen. It just doesnt feel right.
Its not a deal breaker for me though. But goddamn is it a bummer.
Yeah. I never thought I would say this but having just heard the new guy for the first time, it just sounds so wrong. I never really thought having Ironside was such a big deal but this feels like watching a Halo cutscene where its just some random dude doing the VO for Master Chief instead of Steve Downes. You dont think its a big deal until you see it happen. It just doesnt feel right.
Its not a deal breaker for me though. But goddamn is it a bummer.
VE3TRO
Formerly Gizmowned
Big fan of Splinter Cell. Will pick this up on PC.
With Blacklist I've been avoiding it since it's announcement because I wanted to jump in being totally unaware of how it plays.
Checked out some of the videos today and I'm really pleased with how it looks. From the gameplay and level designs it seems to be a true sequel to Chaos Theory.
I've decided that when I get the game I'll be playing through Panther style. Will go for Ghost eventually once I've learned the levels inside out.
Such a shame about Ironside.
With Blacklist I've been avoiding it since it's announcement because I wanted to jump in being totally unaware of how it plays.
Checked out some of the videos today and I'm really pleased with how it looks. From the gameplay and level designs it seems to be a true sequel to Chaos Theory.
I've decided that when I get the game I'll be playing through Panther style. Will go for Ghost eventually once I've learned the levels inside out.
Such a shame about Ironside.
Hmm, the messaging seems like it. If it really doesn't have any kind of local coop, then that's a bummer. But then I'll still get the Wii U version as I don't have the other consoles or a gaming PC.
The Stealth Fox
Junior Member
I haven't read the entire thread, but I feel like there should be an active attempt to discourage frontal assault, but it seems that the devs want to offer it as a viable playstyle (I watched that abandoned mill video). Being an old-school CT fan myself, I don't approve of this, even if they are throwing stealth players a bone here.
I guess there's perfectionist mode though.
I guess there's perfectionist mode though.
That was pretty tough to watch those spies. There's got to be another way into those rooms without walking through the front door.... right?
Here is someone ghosting completely through the first mission on Perfectionist
Okay, sorta wrong because he fucks up near the end but it's almost pulled off correctly. Might've spotted a reload in the middle there.
After Action Report also says it is on Realistic but all the signs of it being Perfectionist difficulty are there (no M&E gauge, no ammo boxes to refill ammo/gadgets at).
Slightly disappointed there was an area or two where you can literally bypass 4-5 guards just shimmying along the edge. Thought they would've figured that shouldn't fly due to their shitty attempt at "stealth" in the E3 video. Also seem like either he was really good, or the AI still isn't that great at detection since it seemed like he was close to but not spotted in open daylight a few times.
But the police station part looked cool, fairly large room with some patrols and lots of stuff to break line of sight/is dark inside and no real sign of a simple bypass like giant fucking pipe crawling along the ceiling to the next waypoint.
I believe getting a detected a bit but slipping out also grants you points when you reach the point of no return in the form of panther points.
You also have to pretty much gear up for assault, which means you specifically need to buy weapons/gear for it for not much return (ghosts can make almost 100% more points over someone playing assault). As far as I have seen it is not possible to play it like a straight cover shooter because the enemy is competent enough to fix and flank you, toss grenades and there are other enemy archetypes that will ruin you if you stand there and try to pop and shoot. Apparently they also have designated people who are better at co-ordinating other AI.
Snipers pretty much one-shot anyone in full armour on nearly any difficulty unless they've changed that; dogs will force you to "mash X to break free" and force you out of cover; tech enemies jam your goggles (NVGs too) and send suicide R/C cars at you; heavies have shotguns and more armour and can't be immediately headshot; also enemies with NVG.
Okay, sorta wrong because he fucks up near the end but it's almost pulled off correctly. Might've spotted a reload in the middle there.
After Action Report also says it is on Realistic but all the signs of it being Perfectionist difficulty are there (no M&E gauge, no ammo boxes to refill ammo/gadgets at).
Slightly disappointed there was an area or two where you can literally bypass 4-5 guards just shimmying along the edge. Thought they would've figured that shouldn't fly due to their shitty attempt at "stealth" in the E3 video. Also seem like either he was really good, or the AI still isn't that great at detection since it seemed like he was close to but not spotted in open daylight a few times.
But the police station part looked cool, fairly large room with some patrols and lots of stuff to break line of sight/is dark inside and no real sign of a simple bypass like giant fucking pipe crawling along the ceiling to the next waypoint.
Points scale to playstyle. In normal it looks like it is 150 per enemy undisturbed (ghost) > 125 non-lethal KO (ghost) > 100 silent kill (panther) > 75 combat kill/takedown. They scale per difficulty but obviously the differences are about the same.
I believe getting a detected a bit but slipping out also grants you points when you reach the point of no return in the form of panther points.
You also have to pretty much gear up for assault, which means you specifically need to buy weapons/gear for it for not much return (ghosts can make almost 100% more points over someone playing assault). As far as I have seen it is not possible to play it like a straight cover shooter because the enemy is competent enough to fix and flank you, toss grenades and there are other enemy archetypes that will ruin you if you stand there and try to pop and shoot. Apparently they also have designated people who are better at co-ordinating other AI.
Snipers pretty much one-shot anyone in full armour on nearly any difficulty unless they've changed that; dogs will force you to "mash X to break free" and force you out of cover; tech enemies jam your goggles (NVGs too) and send suicide R/C cars at you; heavies have shotguns and more armour and can't be immediately headshot; also enemies with NVG.
Oh, fuck off. Now you got me all excited and shit and I don't wanna give Ubi money.
IGN is streaming SvM against the devs right now
Featuring the lead SvM level designer Jeff Elenor and the creator of SvM, Gunther Gallipot
Featuring the lead SvM level designer Jeff Elenor and the creator of SvM, Gunther Gallipot
Mercs have radar that ping spies moving too fast.
They also have vision modes too apparently but haven't used them. They also have area gadgets that can light up a spy as a silhouette.