Melchiah
Member
That's actually a good idea, and it sounds reasonably realistic. What's even better, if you're not interested in the feature you could choose not to use it.
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vg247-PS4: new kits shipping now, AMD A10 used as base, final version next summer
- Thread starter Globox_82
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That's actually a good idea, and it sounds reasonably realistic. What's even better, if you're not interested in the feature you could choose not to use it.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
I think the central touch display is absolutely vital and wouldn't add too much cost to the overall product.
Sony needs to get creative in their approach to Vita's business, and by ensuring that every PS4 comes packed in with a controller that can play Vita content in proximity to a PS4 they greatly enhance the viability of Vita as a component of their overall gaming business strategy for years to come, not to mention increasing the appeal of owning a PS4 (would almost be like getting two systems) and Playstation Plus service.
If Sony simply keeps the Vita as is, they are destined for failure because people cannot justify paying money for a secondary product -- vita lacks a market for this reason alone; but if that product is accessible through a console (that is bound to be far more popular), then people will take advantage of it and buy Vita software to play on their PS4 controllers because the option is there by default.
I've a problem with a screen on the controller in sofar as it would probably be incompatible with the idea of a HMD. You wouldn't be able to see, or see what you're doing on, a controller screen with a hmd on.
Whilst a break apart controller, for example, would actually meld perfectly with a hmd while still working with tv play.
Whilst a break apart controller, for example, would actually meld perfectly with a hmd while still working with tv play.
jonnyp
Member
Do you spend a whole lot of time feeling up your consoles then?
Suggestion:
The boat has sailed.
I've seen some people compare Nintendo's move to 'tablet-ise' their controller as akin to the move to touch with the DS in terms of anticipating market desires. And that Sony, for example, with PSP 'missed the boat'.
However there is a key difference. Nintendo isn't anticipating anything this time. They're reacting to an extremely dominant thought leader after the fact. When DS launched, touch gaming wasn't 'a thing'. Nintendo had the chance to get ahead of that and establish themselves as the leader in that field. Which they did for several years.
Tablet-style home console controllers are not in the same position. Do you think when people look at Wii U, and the controller, and they think of tablets and Apple, that this is a helpful comparison for Wii U? I'd wager it's not the vast majority of the time and have overheard comment to that effect in a store ('sure you could get an iPad for the same kind of money'). If you hop on a trend - superficially or otherwise, and Wii U has, superficially - with a dominant thought leader after the fact you are risking making an equivalence between your product and that leader in the consumer's mind. It's not a comparison that works out well for anyone but the thought leader. It legitimises their approach while making your product look unnecessary if one already has or wants the thought leader's product. And everyone wants iPads right now.
(Microsoft, by the same token, is falling into the same trap with Windows 8 marketing - they're effectively putting iPad and iOS on a level playing field with Windows in a lot of their ads. It's like saying 'yeah, tablets are the future, and we're like that other tablet now too'...it only strengthens Apple!)
If Nintendo has zigged on the tablet-like trend where Apple has zigged before, Sony and MS should definitely zag IMO. They need to make their offerings clearly different. Hopping on this boat is just hopping on a boat being steered by Apple...I think it's one they should want to miss.
/rant
The controllers need less grooves in them for skin and dust to get stuck in.
Karak
Member
The Kinect, as we know it, has gone through one revision that doesn't incorporate the normal Kinect features and isn't the term for JUST the bar of sensors we see now. Home theater setups like this are still possible.
Correct. The wii U is just a consolized hd version of the DS.
Giant Panda
Member
This would be very expensive and take resources from the console. PS4 would end up like WiiU.
I agree with you about the fact that Nintendo has failed with both the 3DS and Wii U to come up with an innovation that can get casual users on board like what they did with the dual touch screens on the DS and the remote controller on the Wii. At this point a tablet controller not only doesn't look like an innovation but it's probably seen like a 'me too' approach.
But Sony and Microsoft aren't in the same postion of Nintendo. They don't need to bet the farm on some kind of gimmick to attract the masses because they have their 'safe' market made of core gamers which they can expand upon like they did with 360 and PS3.
At the same time though they need to enhance the gameplay experience their systems can provide to keep the interest alive and to do that it's not like they have many options. There are motion tracking cameras, motion controls (and other sensors) and touch screens/touch pads. They have to come up with a combination of those. In this sense I don't think that, for example, putting a touch device on the controller means surrendering to Apple because they're using the technology for their own purposes to please their own market.
Yeah, I've nothing against including technology like that as a part of a whole, but I caution against making it your defining USP or feature. Being one part of a suite of technology that combines into something bigger or whatever...sure. But don't make a controller that looks like a tablet, and spotlight that as The Big Thing. Don't make people think 'Apple' when they look at your product. You'll lose.
IMO, the 'next big thing' from Sony/MS for the core probably should be some combination of optional new display mechanism (hmd) + enhanced motion control & player-state sensing - which is why I favour the idea of a breakapart 'VR' controller+dualshock in one vs a dualshock with a screen. You should be able to play with just a controller in front of a TV - and this is important for embedding your experiences into different contexts via cloud streaming - but there should be the option to go immersive. A breakout experience that zags away from what's possible on mobile/tablet devices would be ideal...I don't know if this kind of setup is it but it seems like the more obvious candidate right now.
yes he's going a little too far. But i think those are two interesting approaches. Two nunchuck controller, or a dual shock with a screen (small and used for features, not a "mini tv" ala WiiU). But they cannot be done in one only device.
jeff_rigby
Banned
From SemiAccurate uuse5
To whichever company using Amkor, could this be the confirmation of the rumors of delay for production?
PDF from Oct 2011
Page 2
Si Interposer + DDR + Logic
GPU / CPU (28nm)
http://sites.amd.com/la/Documents/TFE2011_001AMC.pdf
PDF from Feb 2012
Page 10
http://www.amkor.com/download.cfm?d...DC8BFAE253&typename=dmFile&fieldname=filename
On page 10 we see the same chart as in the Oct 2011 document, but with Si Interposer + DDR + Logic chip delayed 6 months, pushed into mid 2014
This explains the rumored delay for Sony unless some still don't believe Sony is supporting wide IO via transposer.
To whichever company using Amkor, could this be the confirmation of the rumors of delay for production?
PDF from Oct 2011
Page 2
Si Interposer + DDR + Logic
GPU / CPU (28nm)
http://sites.amd.com/la/Documents/TFE2011_001AMC.pdf
PDF from Feb 2012
Page 10
http://www.amkor.com/download.cfm?d...DC8BFAE253&typename=dmFile&fieldname=filename
On page 10 we see the same chart as in the Oct 2011 document, but with Si Interposer + DDR + Logic chip delayed 6 months, pushed into mid 2014
This explains the rumored delay for Sony unless some still don't believe Sony is supporting wide IO via transposer.
I want a controller that I consciously don't have to think about. Kind of like a mouse and keyboard on a pc. That's the holy grail of console controllers for me.
The DS3's trigger design is faulty because my fingers keep slipping off. I bought a pack of geoteck triggers/realtriggers addon clip and now it has the best triggers of any console for me.
The DS3 could also improve ergonomically.
Separating the controller into two hands sounds good, but a hard sell really.
History of Playstation controllers
The DS3's trigger design is faulty because my fingers keep slipping off. I bought a pack of geoteck triggers/realtriggers addon clip and now it has the best triggers of any console for me.
The DS3 could also improve ergonomically.
Separating the controller into two hands sounds good, but a hard sell really.
History of Playstation controllers
systemfehler
Member
Your delay was already published in October 2011 - http://imapsaz.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Amkor-IMAPS-presentation-Oct27-2011.pdf so I doubt this information is as relevant as you thought...
There was a rumour saying Sony would wait out for 3D stacking which would cause a 6 month delay.
There was a rumour that MS was having problems with the dies and was 6 month delayed as well.
You should do a head to head with jeff if it bothers you that much. Easy enough to see who will eat crow afterwards.
He's always been up front and clear that he is merely guessing. Educated guesses, but guesses nonetheless.
systemfehler
Member
Well I don't mind a curious mind who diggs through PDFs, blog posts, financial reports and whatnot but if the "news quality" is deteriorating and it looks more and more like a complex conspiracy theory based on names and Dan Brown writing I am out. This is sadly the case with the reccent posts by Jeff_Rigby - they get more and more obscure.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
The problem is head mounted displays are far too expensive, and it's not going to be a cornerstone of gaming just yet. It'll be more like a novelty if it ever happens, like 3D.
Eventually once Gaikai streaming tech catches on and becomes mainstream, companies will be able to offer head mounted displays as their "systems", but that's far in the future.
A screen on the controller is relatively cheap and useful for today's market, and can significantly help with sony's strategy with respect to Vita.
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
New threads are supposed to be created for new news. Not just hidden in mega threads.
I know why new threads are created, but we ABSOLUTELY dont know the basic architecture design of new consoles. He is speculating that new consoles will use interposer that have logic inside of them. There is nothing stopping both new consoles coming out in late 2013.
Jeff digs information and his sources are not unnamed like most of people present. He almost always present hard facts and his assumptions. He was the first one which pointed that stacking may become main thing about next gen consoles.
Jeff is not omnibus but he digs information like no other. He said HTML5 will be in PS3 no one believed and bam HTML5 happened.
runnin_blue
Banned
I honestly don't see Nintendo adding the screen as a 'me too' reaction to Apple products.
Rather, I see it as a natural evolution of game controllers, just like the analogue stick.
I feel that in 5 years time it'll seem crazy if a console's controller doesn't include a touch screen.
Hammers don't have touchscreen and somewhat they are still in use and probably this won't change in future.
I think Oculus is real future for gaming and that would render all touchscreen unusable. Simply field of view upgrade beyond 75-80 today standard will be awesome especially connected with proper lagless headtracking
"Destination Playstation" event will take place on 25-28th February 2013. I expect PS4 announcement:
http://www.sceainvites.com/
http://www.sceainvites.com/
Angelus Errare
Banned
Nah, expect talk about
Future of PS3
Future of Vita
Slides about Sales
Incoming changes to the Store that affect developers
Better tools for making Apps for PS3
Small Updates to Phyre Engine.
Show off a few games.
Isn't that just the same event where they invite all the retailers and do 1 or 2 announcements (we got LBP Karting and Sleeping Dogs this year I think?)
Also what's with people saying there needs to be a screen on the controller? There absolutely doesn't! Nintendo tried it, they bet their whole console on it and people just don't give a damn about it. So quite obviously the tablet isn't a new gimmick that Sony or MS need to catch up with like the Wii was.
Don't get your hopes up for PS4 there. I expect Last of Us multiplayer, GoW:A single player, Puppeteer, Beyond, and Vita stuff. They don't want to kill hype for their first half of 2013.
Hiro_Kunimi_80
Member
the third... age ? ( for italian gaf )
shinra-bansho
Member
If they intend to launch in 2013, then it makes sense to begin to share these plans with retail early enough, but after the Holiday season sales have passed. I expect both MS and Sony to begin publicly hinting at their next-gen systems in early 2013, if not outright announcing them.
Announce at Destination Playstation, reveal more at GDC about the hardware, showcase software at E3.
Goldrusher
Member
They'll have a Playstation Meeting in Japan to announce the PS4, just like they did with the PS3 and Vita.
I think they'll announce it before E3, just not in February. They have too many big titles coming before then. I think they'll tease it sometime around April, when it's close enough to Last of Us launch to not mess it up too much then show off games at E3.
Dr.Palutena
Member
http://now.msn.com/nokia-lumia-900-can-hammer-a-nail-with-its-touchscreen
Isn't destination playstation mostly a software based event that happens every year(and an SCEA one at that)? I mean, they had their own event specially for the Vita (then called NGP) that didn't have anything to do with it (and took place in japan), I think that if Sony wants to announce PS4 before E3 they would do something similar rather than using destination.
$599 confirmed.
LOL
I doubt that we'll see anything PS4 related at that event. It'll be closer to E3, if not at E3 itself.
shinra-bansho
Member
I don't really follow why the announcement of new hardware would have a major impact on a title's sales on the older platform.
Some people will get hyped for new hardware and ignore the major title or, if it would be a potential system seller, they'll just wait for the future console. Sony and Microsoft have both explicitly stated that's why they wouldn't be talking about next-gen before this holiday season and February would still be in the midst of a lot of quality games on current platforms. Best to wait until things slow down to announce next gen to keep as much sales momentum as possible.
this is what I expect. They did similar thing with vita. Show hardware at this event, then games at E3 so not to waste time on HW
That was a Playstation Meeting, not Destination.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I agree that it shouldn't make any difference. The PS3 was announced May 2005.
To name just 3 big PS2 games released in NA/EU around/after the announcement:
God of War: March/June 2005
God of War 2: March/April 2007
GT4: February/March 2005
Not at all, Destination is an SCEA event for retailer to figure out retail campaigns and has been going on for a few years. Meeting is a once-off event that is announced by SCE, held in Japan, and it's a press event for unveiling new hardware.meeting, destination same crap
joking.