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VGLeaks: Details multiple devkits evolution of Orbis

P

Psychotext

Member
That's only really of much use if they were targetting 1080p with significant AA though, otherwise we're looking at a sub 720p jaggy mess... and I'm fairly certain we'd notice.

Casuals might not, but a bad hardcore reception would be enough to seriously hurt a 720 product launch.

(This is all off topic, blame how many next gen threads there are at the moment!)
 
AgentP

AgentP

Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
thuway said:
Early Durango devkits were essentially beasts, but I wonder how any of this will translate over to final silicon. .
Click to expand...

I wonder if they are just beast without context. Meaning that a beefier GPU in the devkit was just to emulate a less powerful GPU that was on a faster bus with eSRAM. The devkit could look better if you cherry pick parts, but the system overall might be on par due to devkit bottlenecks and inefficiencies..
 
E

emacs

Member
phosphor112 said:
Believe it or not, not everyone has an entertainment center that looks like this.
Click to expand...

a rather impressive array of games consoles. aesthetically and ergonomically, however, the setup is horrible.

the bottom edge of the small display appears to be at least 1.5 metres from the the floor. i wonder how far back one needs to sit without having to look up at the display. also, the cabinet housing the consoles is far too dominant; its a visual distraction especially since the display itself is so small. i suppose the setup is like this due to budget and space constraints.

overall, however, the gaming possibilities of this setup is quite nice.
 
B

B.O.O.M

Member
I think the controller will play a big part in whether they will go for BC or not. If the controller is expensive they most likely won't imo
 
T

thuway

Member
B.O.O.M said:
I think the controller will play a big part in whether they will go for BC or not. If the controller is expensive they most likely won't imo
Click to expand...

A fanboy dream inside me is that either Microsoft or Sony go with a Wii U type controller. There is something sexy about Miracast streaming to a tablet.
 
Death Dealer

Death Dealer

Member
thuway said:
In the worst case scenario, the weaker machine will be Gamecube and the stronger machine Xbox. Technically superior doesn't outweigh factors such as which machine your friends own, diverse online ecosystems, and a reliable network
Click to expand...

Not to digress too far, but roughly how did GC and Xbox compare to each other ? I know Xbox was considered more powerful, but were there things GC did better ?
 
G

googleplex

Member
thuway said:
A fanboy dream inside me is that either Microsoft or Sony go with a Wii U type controller. There is something sexy about Miracast streaming to a tablet.
Click to expand...

Overly expensive and not worth it in my opinion. I hope they go with the Move/Dual Shock brake apart controller. Mostly because I hope they push VR down the line and pointer controls are awesome.
 
P

phosphor112

Banned
Sid said:
How much exactly will it cost?
Click to expand...

In 2009, the cell was ~39 bucks. But those are huge even compared to the Cell in the PS3 super slims.

These PE's that are mentioned in the patent are basically "Half" of a cell. This would increase yields, making them cheaper to make. I'd honestly say about 20 bucks or so, even with the inclusion of putting it on the mobo... it uses the same ram and bus as everything else, the controller interface is on the PE itself so no real significant increase.

Then again this is just taking a stab at it. I have no idea how much these things really cost or how much costs for stuff decrease when yields increase.
 
S

Sid

Member
phosphor112 said:
In 2009, the cell was ~39 bucks. But those are huge even compared to the Cell in the PS3 super slims.

These PE's that are mentioned in the patent are basically "Half" of a cell. This would increase yields, making them cheaper to make. I'd honestly say about 20 bucks or so, even with the inclusion of putting it on the mobo... it uses the same ram and bus as everything else, the controller interface is on the PE itself so no real significant increase.

Then again this is just taking a stab at it. I have no idea how much these things really cost or how much costs for stuff decrease when yields increase.
Click to expand...
Alright but what about the RSX?wouldn't Nvidia need to be involved in ensuring BC?
 
P

phosphor112

Banned
Sid said:
Oh and wouldn't it matter that the PS3 uses XDR? how easily can such a BC solution be incorporated into the MOBO?
Click to expand...

While the patent suggests using XDR in the chip, it is suggested because it's low power and high bandwidth (SpursEngine by toshiba is basically the same design, but the XDR is built into the chip, that's not the case here). This patent lets you use a shared memory pool, whether inside the actual chip or outside of it, as long as it has the bandwidth that the XDR provided, it should be solid. GDDR5 exceeds those requirements.
 
S

Sid

Member
phosphor112 said:
While the patent suggests using XDR in the chip, it is suggested because it's low power and high bandwidth (SpursEngine by toshiba is basically the same design, but the XDR is built into the chip, that's not the case here). This patent lets you use a shared memory pool, whether inside the actual chip or outside of it, as long as it has the bandwidth that the XDR provided, it should be solid. GDDR5 exceeds those requirements.
Click to expand...
Hmm.....I still don't think BC would be in especially after the introduction of the HD collections but we'll see.
 
P

phosphor112

Banned
Sid said:
Hmm.....I still don't think BC would be in especially after the introduction of the HD collections but we'll see.
Click to expand...

HD collections would only work for PS2 titles, but that would still mean they'd have to recode the ones that are already on PS3 to work on the PS4.

And you can't "HD collection" PS3 games without completely scrapping the code altogether.
 
A

AuthenticM

Member
ricen-beans said:
Idk how much it would cost but I don't see why they wouldn't. Especially when Vita already has wireless N comparability.
Click to expand...

The PS3's wifi is so terrible. I have to hook it up with an ethernet cable just to stream 720p video to it from my laptop. Ugh. Why couldn't they have added better wifi to it with the super slim ? Christ, Microsoft not only added internal wifi to their slim, but it supports wireless N and is pretty good.

sigh
 
P

phosphor112

Banned
AuthenticM said:
The PS3's wifi is so terrible. I have to hook it up with an ethernet cable just to stream 720p video to it from my laptop. Ugh. Why couldn't they have added better wifi to it with the super slim ? Christ, Microsoft not only added internal wifi to their slim, but it supports wireless N and is pretty good.

sigh
Click to expand...

It works fine for me. I use PMS (PS3 Media Server). My router is relatively new, so that can be something to look into. I know when I use it at my friends house, his router is super old so it struggles at 720p. I end up usually lowering the bit quality for that (there are options for everything including video AND sound bitrates and depths). I've only been able to do 1080p streaming through LAN though. Wireless G is showing its age.
 
S

Sid

Member
phosphor112 said:
HD collections would only work for PS2 titles, but that would still mean they'd have to recode the ones that are already on PS3 to work on the PS4.

And you can't "HD collection" PS3 games without completely scrapping the code altogether.
Click to expand...
OK so what do you think,BC in or out?
 
B

B.O.O.M

Member
thuway said:
A fanboy dream inside me is that either Microsoft or Sony go with a Wii U type controller. There is something sexy about Miracast streaming to a tablet.
Click to expand...

I have a slightly different pint of view. I hope ALL three will go a different route with control options.

Wiiu - Pad controller
720 - Kinect + controller combo
PS4 - Something different to those two. This is why I really hope they go with either a break away controller or better yet biometric controller.

Three systems, with their own unique appeal = awesomeness

Sid said:
They won't be going for BC either way,it would just raise costs unnecessarily.
Click to expand...

I think there won't be either....but that's me keeping my hopes as low as possible lol less room for disappointment that way
 
R

Razgreez

Member
AuthenticM said:
The PS3's wifi is so terrible. I have to hook it up with an ethernet cable just to stream 720p video to it from my laptop. Ugh. Why couldn't they have added better wifi to it with the super slim ? Christ, Microsoft not only added internal wifi to their slim, but it supports wireless N and is pretty good.

sigh
Click to expand...

Unless what you were streaming had some hectic sound quality 720p should stream easily over wireless G. It's when you start streaming decent quality 1080p that things go awry

phosphor112 said:
It works fine for me. I use PMS (PS3 Media Server). My router is relatively new, so that can be something to look into. I know when I use it at my friends house, his router is super old so it struggles at 720p. I end up usually lowering the bit quality for that (there are options for everything including video AND sound bitrates and depths). I've only been able to do 1080p streaming through LAN though. Wireless G is showing its age.
Click to expand...

Ditto
 
A

AuthenticM

Member
phosphor112 said:
It works fine for me. I use PMS (PS3 Media Server). My router is relatively new, so that can be something to look into. I know when I use it at my friends house, his router is super old so it struggles at 720p. I end up usually lowering the bit quality for that (there are options for everything including video AND sound bitrates and depths). I've only been able to do 1080p streaming through LAN though. Wireless G is showing its age.
Click to expand...

My router is the LinksysE4200, which is supposedly amongst the best on the market. I also use PS3 Media Server. Maybe it's because my PS3 is a 60GB launch model ? Have the slims or super slims been reported to have better wifi ?
 
R

Razgreez

Member
Sid said:
OK so what do you think,BC in or out?
Click to expand...

If i was to speculate from a business standpoint, not having BC would put some serious strain on the playstation ecosystem so it really does need to be in. Sony has proven in the past that they often don't follow logical best practices though
 
O

oversitting

Banned
ps3 BC will not be done in hardware. Same reason xbox 360 can't do BC properly. Nvidia are not going to let it happen for free. And software emulation can be at best, the same as the 360's BC.
 
D

davious88

Banned
AuthenticM said:
The PS3's wifi is so terrible. I have to hook it up with an ethernet cable just to stream 720p video to it from my laptop. Ugh. Why couldn't they have added better wifi to it with the super slim ? Christ, Microsoft not only added internal wifi to their slim, but it supports wireless N and is pretty good.

sigh
Click to expand...

Wireless G isn't fit for streaming 720p in general. Try home plugs if applicable.

Edit... Oh Razgreez, you!
 
P

pharmboy044

Member
phosphor112 said:
BC in. It doubles as extra processing for PS4 as well. That's why I think its in there. Otherwise if it didn't help the PS4, it wouldn't be in.
Click to expand...

Motherfudger, stop playing with my emotions. I was set to not have BC in PS4 and now this?

Dear god, I would jump for joy if we had BC in PS4.
 
D

davious88

Banned
pharmboy044 said:
Motherfudger, stop playing with my emotions. I was set to not have BC in PS4 and now this?

Dear god, I would jump for joy if we had BC in PS4.
Click to expand...

Even if Sony charge (arrggg!) to buy the a module which plugs-in (discrete like) or to download the activator form the store, - this is another option.
 
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