frankie_baby
Member
Fury beat klitschko, can beating klitschko seriously be considered an acheivement any more?
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Why do the Brits never vote for Mo Farah in SPOTY?
- Thread starter CrazyHorse
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Fury beat klitschko, can beating klitschko seriously be considered an acheivement any more?
Could you not even read the next paragraph?
frankie_baby
Member
Yes there are racists, doesn't mean most of us are racist though
So just because you have had a few bad experiences ( not saying you deserve them and sorry you had to go through them) you paint the rest of the UK as the same? I am Black and Bi. I was bullied all my school life because of being gay at the time, I was bullied so badly that i now suffer from a form of PTSD, Yet I will not paint the area i live with the same brush.
Where do you live? I still don't think the number of crazies out there is enough to have much of an impact on something like this. For what it's worth, I personally think this time around Farrah should probably have come ahead of Brownlee, but Murray and Skelton were good value for first and second.
Rumblebones
Banned
He's black, of Somalian descent (there's very specific bigotry against them here), and Muslim.
You can be any one of these and win.
Two would be an exceptional challenge.
You most definitely cannot be all three.
You can be any one of these and win.
Two would be an exceptional challenge.
You most definitely cannot be all three.
CrazyHorse
Junior Member
I live in a town which has a BNP councillor. TBH in recent years the racism has gone down. Although my mum did get stones thrown at her a while ago with racist remarks. In past year I couldn't even leave the house out of fear.
SlipperyFishes
Banned
Andy Murray finally climbed to the very top of his profession. That doesn't default to racism.
Bnp? Yowzers, I figured they'd have all been ousted by UKIP by now. It's fucked up that this stuff still happens, but I can't imagine these are all the people that are voting in SPOTY. They're probably the kind of morons that boycott the BBC after reading one of the mails hate pieces on them.
Billy_Pilgrim
Member
Because he's nowhere near the best sports personality in Britain. It's really as simple as that.
CrazyHorse
Junior Member
Someone who gets it
It's not just because he is black. He is Somalian. He is an immigrant . And he is a Muslim. And he prays after races. It's the whole combination.You are right about how people see Somalians here. It's a disgrace.
Anyway although I am disappointed at GAF for not giving this enough thought, I am so happy that lots of people on Twitter get it. https://twitter.com/search?q=mo+farah
E.g. Guardian Journalist
Simon Hattenstone ‏@shattenstone 3h3 hours ago
Absolutely disgusting to not have Mo Farah in top 3, let alone winning. Double double gold medallist & nothing? What a joke #spoty
Bits N Pieces
Member
So are we saying that Ore Oduba got robbed?
CrazyHorse
Junior Member
Yeah it's true that these are not all the guys voting for SPOTY. I mean Mo was 4th and that proves that a lot of people do like him. I should be really happy that we live in a world where things have improved a lot. I should look at the positives. Obama was president for 8 years.
But I see racism as being implicit. Even science has demonstrated it. E.g. the implicit association tests on racism.
Being in a thread like this is a kind of suffering for me (as someone mentioned earlier). I know you are good guys with good intentions but my past abuse gives me pain.
Charles Brandon
Member
get the fuck outta here
Murray was an obvious winner, Brownlee is a true all-time great and had the helping his brother over the line thing, Skelton won an olympic gold at the age of 58 after breaking his neck and became a symbol of the team.
We love Mo and he came above people like the Trotts and Jamie Vardy. Chris Froome didn't even get a nomination. But really, he was expected to win, he won, there is no real story there as much as he deserves his plaudits.
People can bring up other long distance runners who did win but they forget that in some of those years we were shit at all sports, all the time. So anyone who won anything had a chance. We're much better now, so competition is tougher.
Murray was an obvious winner, Brownlee is a true all-time great and had the helping his brother over the line thing, Skelton won an olympic gold at the age of 58 after breaking his neck and became a symbol of the team.
We love Mo and he came above people like the Trotts and Jamie Vardy. Chris Froome didn't even get a nomination. But really, he was expected to win, he won, there is no real story there as much as he deserves his plaudits.
People can bring up other long distance runners who did win but they forget that in some of those years we were shit at all sports, all the time. So anyone who won anything had a chance. We're much better now, so competition is tougher.
frankie_baby
Member
Someone who gets it
You are right about how people see Somalians here. It's a disgrace.
Anyway although I am disappointed at GAF for not giving this enough thought, I am so happy that lots of people on Twitter get it. https://twitter.com/search?q=mo+farah
E.g. Guardian Journalist
Simon Hattenstone ‏@shattenstone 3h3 hours ago
Absolutely disgusting to not have Mo Farah in top 3, let alone winning. Double double gold medallist & nothing? What a joke #spoty
Not everything has to be about race though, i live in an incredibly white area a village in the cotswolds where the only non white faces you ever see are working in the curry house, wouldn't say its particularly liberal either, its a rock solid tory area (though surprisingly remain won here in the referendum) but every one was proper behind him in the olympics, prople love him but it is a FACT there were 3 sportsmen with bigger stories this year
orthodoxy1095
Banned
What does Islam have to do with anything? Didn't Muhammad Ali win the Personality of the Century Award?
I don't see why you can't accept it. Brownlee was the first person to defend an Olympic triathlon title and had that tremendous photo of him helping his brother across the finish line. Skelton came back from breaking his neck over a decade ago (an injury that would probably end most show jumping careers) and became the oldest British Olympic champion in over a century as well as the oldest Olympic equestrian champion. Both of those fellows are incredibly deserving.
Aye.
travisbickle
Member
People voted for him, that's how he got fourth. And his odds for a podium were very good so the bookies favored him.
Problem is unique voters who vote solely on narrative, Mo didn't cry like a baby at Wimbledon last year, help his brother while competing, or break his neck.
Problem is unique voters who vote solely on narrative, Mo didn't cry like a baby at Wimbledon last year, help his brother while competing, or break his neck.
holygeesus
Banned
I know a few people who have met him, and they told me he is a monumental self-important prick, so it might be more to do with that than his skin colour...
milanbaros
Member?
There is an argument for Andy Murray being the greatest British sportsman of all time. That is why he has won more than anyone. Mo winning would have been ridiculous.
autumnleaf
Member
There was no way Andy Murray wasn't going to win, he's had one of the greatest years any British sportsman has ever had AND he won an Olympic gold like all those other Olympian nominees.
Skelton getting third was nonsense and Farrah should have had that spot but that's the British middle class for you, they love their horses and boats.
Skelton getting third was nonsense and Farrah should have had that spot but that's the British middle class for you, they love their horses and boats.
Booya_base
Member
I really don't think it's racism, in fact it's funny how even normally racist people seem to have an exemption for sports people :/ Andy Murray definitely deserved winner this time around.
I would say Mo has just been unlucky but the real reason is that the guy advertises Quorn. QUORN! It's like advertising death itself. He'll never be my SPOTY
I would say Mo has just been unlucky but the real reason is that the guy advertises Quorn. QUORN! It's like advertising death itself. He'll never be my SPOTY
Triggerhappytel
Member
It sounds like the top three were all highly deserving of their place. Who did Mo lose to the last time he did a major athletics achievement? (Presumably in 2012?)
autumnleaf
Member
2012
Bradley Wiggins (Tour de France, 7th Olympic medal)
Jessica Ennis (Olympic gold, face of the games in the UK)
Andy Murray (US Open and Olympic gold)
2013 he probably should have come top 3 actually but Murray won Wimbledon so there was only going to be one winner there.
Farrah's problem is the UK team has done so well at the past two Olympics he has a more difficult time standing out at the same time as lots of athlete's won gold.
I'd also say he is actually really popular in the UK, it's not a race thing. He's actually finished 3rd once and 4th 3 times.
QuicheFontaine
Member
I really don't think it's racism, in fact it's funny how even normally racist people seem to have an exemption for sports people :/ Andy Murray definitely deserved winner this time around.
I would say Mo has just been unlucky but the real reason is that the guy advertises Quorn. QUORN! It's like advertising death itself. He'll never be my SPOTY
This comes up in the first ten seconds of every real-life conversation where Mo Farah's name is mentioned.
Yeah, it's hard to square racism in a sporting popularity contest where a middle class horse rider got 3rd place, and Ore winning strictly.
To be honest, it's probably more just the narratives that meant he got 4th place. Andy Murray was always going to win, the Brownless brother had the amazing story of helping his brother over the finish line, and 3rd place had the 'broke his neck, end of his career' story. Mo did amazing at the olympics, but outside of that the only time he's really featured in the press has been the drugs accusations for his coach.
To be honest, it's probably more just the narratives that meant he got 4th place. Andy Murray was always going to win, the Brownless brother had the amazing story of helping his brother over the finish line, and 3rd place had the 'broke his neck, end of his career' story. Mo did amazing at the olympics, but outside of that the only time he's really featured in the press has been the drugs accusations for his coach.
aygomyownroad
Member
Sports PERSONALITY of the year award is a sham anyway OP.
Andy Murray is probably the best sportsman in British History but he has no personality...
Mo Farah situation is a tough one without descending into racism as he has done very well and won plenty of Golds, but he isn't "British", born in Somalia and moved here very young, there will be a selection of people who don't see him worthy of that name because of his place of Birth, some may think he has had an easy ride to Gold as all he has to do is run a few 100 metres. Then there is the Doping allegations which didn't go anywhere but are enough to tarnish a name.
Mo Farah is great, should have been higher
Andy Murray is probably the best sportsman in British History but he has no personality...
Mo Farah situation is a tough one without descending into racism as he has done very well and won plenty of Golds, but he isn't "British", born in Somalia and moved here very young, there will be a selection of people who don't see him worthy of that name because of his place of Birth, some may think he has had an easy ride to Gold as all he has to do is run a few 100 metres. Then there is the Doping allegations which didn't go anywhere but are enough to tarnish a name.
Mo Farah is great, should have been higher
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
The only reason he's been in the news since the Olympics is because of doping. All the others won Olympic medals so that doesn't make him special. Brownlee and Skelton both had unique positive hooks (injury recovery and brother story).
Worth noting that all these racists voted for Simone Biles...
Worth noting that all these racists voted for Simone Biles...
No way is this true, the guy is well known across the country and gets huge praise for his character and attitude.
The fact is that long distance running just isn't that important to us as brits, Wimbledon etc. gets millions of viewers, i don't think running gets the same exposure.
Triggerhappytel
Member
I saw that dude dance in an episode a week or two back and he was shit hot. Seems absolutely well deserved.
Yeah, I agree - that's obviously Mo's issue. He's been up against big achievements in more popular sports like tennis and cycling.
Also, it obviously doesn't matter as much as I'm sure many people don't realise, but Jessica Ennis-Hill is mixed race, so maybe it's not a racism thing and Mo has just got unlucky?
Kelly Holmes is black, so I think your are disproving your own point.
Yes, Britain has massive issues with racism and xenophobia, but the majority of those kind of people consider Olympic winners 'some of the "good ones"' (ugh). This means, that for something like SPOTY, racist sentiment will have much less of an influence than for job interviews, for example. Mo Farah has also just been really unlucky in his years of success, as other athletes have arguably outperformed him in more recognizable sports those years.
EDIT: It also depends on how close the votes are as well, if Mo Farah is only 1 or even 2 % away from being in a better position, then you could argue that if he was white he would have done better. I am also willing to admit I am wrong about this, the country has been really dissapointing this past year.
The thing is, if someone is mixed race, but many people don't know that, than racism can't really have much of an influence on perception of that person really. You can't use that as a counterexample to people not being racist, as people would have to know that info before making a racist descision.
I don't watch it but the mrs said it absolutely was as well.
Andy Murray is probably the greatest ever British sportsperson, so no Farah doesn't deserve it.
Also Lewis Hamilton won it two years ago, so I don't think it's anything about race. On top of that, Kelly Holmes (2004), Lennox Lewis (1999), Linford Christie (1993) and Fatima Whitehead (1987) are all people of colour and have won in the past.
Also Lewis Hamilton won it two years ago, so I don't think it's anything about race. On top of that, Kelly Holmes (2004), Lennox Lewis (1999), Linford Christie (1993) and Fatima Whitehead (1987) are all people of colour and have won in the past.
JonathanEx
Member
I think it's the quorn. People hate quorn.
Though in all seriousness with all this talk of narrative being important I do wonder for how many people the prevailing narrative they know about him is the quorn advertising
Though in all seriousness with all this talk of narrative being important I do wonder for how many people the prevailing narrative they know about him is the quorn advertising
ReplacementPelican
Member
Dude, nobody in this thread is saying that racism doesn't exist or that bias doesn't exist, they're saying that they don't think that's the case here. Mo' had a fantastic year but he's against far more popular sports and sports-people. People in this thread have outlined why the others finished above; British hero of a massively popular sport who finally achieved World Number 1; A brother who was selfless in his sport against his own brother; A man who broke his neck and overcame it. This isn't as simple nor as binary as white athletes and black athletes. You even say yourself how popular Mo' is so I don't quite get why you think he's disliked for his race when he's almost universally loved.
Also, who even votes in this? I sure as shit don't know anyone who does.
War Peaceman
You're a big guy.
and Simone Biles won the international award this year...
I think you might be a little bit off with that generalization. Juuuuuuuust a little bit off.
While it's true that athletes frequently get recognition due to very questionable reasons, and while it's true there are humans who dislike other humans because they have a different prayer and haircut, most of the time, the reasons athletes get overlooked has more to do with money over everything else. For example, a female athlete won't be considered for an award because men have, traditionally, sold significantly more clothes and watches and shoes and cars etc. for companies. This is why you should pay attention to the sponsors, donors, organizers, and founders of an award. Institutional recognition is always a game of politics, and if you should find yourself going up against a really marketable athlete/entertainer/politician etc. with a huge following, you should know that your chances of winning aren't going to be as high.
CyclopsRock
Member
He's a gooner, too.
So this thread is really about inventing a controversy that doesn't actually exist, only to pivot on page 2 and turn it into a personal thing.
I think that's called projecting. Might want to be more conscious of that in the future.
It sucks that you live in a BNP area & feel threatened by racism, but this whole Mo Farah angle makes no sense at all. He's universally loved, but;
Murray finally had the banner year he's been so close to for a long time,
Brownlee showed amazing sportsmanship with his brother in Mexico this year (he gave up winning a race to help his brother over the finish line when he was on the brink of collapse)
and Skelton came back from a broken neck that was supposed to stop him competing & won golds in both 2012 and now 2016, which also makes him the oldest British gold medallist since 1908.
I think that's called projecting. Might want to be more conscious of that in the future.
It sucks that you live in a BNP area & feel threatened by racism, but this whole Mo Farah angle makes no sense at all. He's universally loved, but;
Murray finally had the banner year he's been so close to for a long time,
Brownlee showed amazing sportsmanship with his brother in Mexico this year (he gave up winning a race to help his brother over the finish line when he was on the brink of collapse)
and Skelton came back from a broken neck that was supposed to stop him competing & won golds in both 2012 and now 2016, which also makes him the oldest British gold medallist since 1908.
Camp Freddie
Member
I think Mo deserves a lot more votes than he got. Both this year and previous years.
However, him not winning is no big surprise given the actual winners. Murray is a clear winner this year.
I'm also surprised at all the "Loneliness of the long distance runner" justifications.
Bullshit.
Especially when 2nd place goes to a Triathlon winner.
I think the 2nd place shows the power of a good story though. I had to look him up to find out that he's the guy that dragged his brother over the finish line.
I'm very surprised by the 3rd place though. I know it's another great story that he broke his neck and still won a gold, but... showjumping? I've seen about 100x more coverage of long-distance running than I have of showjumping, which is a sport for posh blokes that no-one takes seriously.
I've seen Mo on TV a lot more than I've seen the showjumper (again, I had to google who he is), whether that's competing, giving interviews or doing general 'celebrity' appearances.
However, him not winning is no big surprise given the actual winners. Murray is a clear winner this year.
I'm also surprised at all the "Loneliness of the long distance runner" justifications.
Bullshit.
Especially when 2nd place goes to a Triathlon winner.
I think the 2nd place shows the power of a good story though. I had to look him up to find out that he's the guy that dragged his brother over the finish line.
I'm very surprised by the 3rd place though. I know it's another great story that he broke his neck and still won a gold, but... showjumping? I've seen about 100x more coverage of long-distance running than I have of showjumping, which is a sport for posh blokes that no-one takes seriously.
I've seen Mo on TV a lot more than I've seen the showjumper (again, I had to google who he is), whether that's competing, giving interviews or doing general 'celebrity' appearances.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Quorn is the fucking best, you heathens. THE BEST!
Yeah, that's a fair point.
Hmm. He's great, and his career has had a really rewarding upswing, but I'm not sure I'd call him the greatest British sportsperson ever. Steve Redgrave? Matthew Pinsent? Chris Hoy? Sally Gunnel? Jason and Laura Kenny? Denise Lewis?
I think my personal favourite Bristish sportsperson ever is probably Lennox Lewis.
Yeah, that's a fair point.
Hmm. He's great, and his career has had a really rewarding upswing, but I'm not sure I'd call him the greatest British sportsperson ever. Steve Redgrave? Matthew Pinsent? Chris Hoy? Sally Gunnel? Jason and Laura Kenny? Denise Lewis?
I think my personal favourite Bristish sportsperson ever is probably Lennox Lewis.
Oldest gold winner we've had since 1908 and the equestrian community are huge in this country and very tight-knit (I used to date a dressage rider) - they'll have voted for him in spades.
Plus, yeah, he's coming back from a broken neck. That's a great story.
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