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[Zaph]

If that's true - how did Ore Oduba win Strictly at the weekend?

Ore is very much a traditionally British gentleman who happens to be black.

Race and class issues in the UK are different, and more nuanced compared to, say, the US. GAF seems to really struggle with this. And again, this isn't about winning, but overall recognition.

Forget about being white, if Mo was like most British-born black people with a Christian background (West Indies, Nigerian ethnicity etc), I think his recognition would be different and closer to Linford Christie (but not as big).

 

[fanboi]

Have a black person never won? Muslim?

 

[Acorn]

Have a black person never won? Muslim?

Lewis Hamilton and I think amir khan got a young spoty award or something.

 

[fanboi]

Lewis Hamilton and I think amir khan got a young spoty award or something.

Wouldn't that disprove OPs claim?

 

[DeathyBoy]

Ore is very much a traditionally British gentleman who happens to be black.

Race and class issues in the UK are different, and more nuanced compared to, say, the US. GAF seems to really struggle with this. And again, this isn't about winning, but overall recognition.

Forget about being white, if Mo was like most British-born black people with a Christian background (West Indies, Nigerian ethnicity etc), I think his recognition would be different and closer to Linford Christie (but not as big).

I think you're reaching if you think the majority of people racist against Farrah have any idea what his background is.

 

[Acorn]

Wouldn't that disprove OPs claim?

You'd think so but apparently not.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Have a black person never won? Muslim?

Fatima Whitbread
Linford Christie
Daley Thompson
Lennox Lewis
Kelly Holmes
Lewis Hamilton
Ryan Giggs

have all won and all of them are black or mixed race.

As for Muslims, I guess whitbread might be Muslim but there doesn't seem to be any information about it on the web. She is half-turkish-cypriot.

 

[autumnleaf]

Have a black person never won? Muslim?

Yes but as Zaph pointed out in the post before yours it's not quite that simple. Lewis Hamilton, Kelly Holmes, Lennox Lewis and others have all won it but racism in this country isn't as simple just being the colour of your skin, most people wouldn't have a problem with any of those I just mentioned. Let's say the racists idiots down the pub probably loved Frank Bruno but hated Amir Khan. (Edit: Khan actually was quite popular initially so that's probably not the best example).

But again in this case I don't think its about race. Farah is a very popular guy here.

 

[Bold One]

Tbf it's hard to make a significant response to your entirely unsubstantiated assertion though, opinion or no. "Codswallop" is, if not particularly well thought out, a similar assertion of opinion with no evidence to back it up. I mean come on: "One thing is certain, were he a white man, he would have won." It's demonstrably not "certain", so it kinda is codswallop.

Where he a white man he would have it by now, I stand by that, perhaps not this year, though, I made that clear in original post, I stated in clear terms that AM was a worthy winner regardless of politics, the dude had a banner year.

Farah is the only reason the country watched long-distance running, he is the only hope for a medal in his field and has dominated in a manner befitting a true great. He single-handedly raised the profile of the sport ignored by the ruling classes for nearly a decade now.

 

[IdreamofHIME]

All depends on the context, some would say Chris Froome would be as winning probably the toughest sporting event in the world 3 times is quite the achievement.

But Chris Froome wasn't even on the short list this year.
Such prejudice.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Where he a white man he would have it by now, I stand by that, perhaps not this year, though, I made that clear in original post, I stated in clear terms that AM was a worthy winner regardless of politics, the dude had a banner year.

Farah is the only reason the country watched long-distance running, he is the only hope for a medal in his field and has dominated in a manner befitting a true great. He single-handedly raised the profile of the sport ignored by the ruling classes for nearly a decade now.

Which year is it that you think he should have won?

 

[Zaph]

I think you're reaching if you think the majority of people racist against Farrah have any idea what his background is.

and I think you're blind if you think people don't notice him on the jumbotron kneeling down and praying after every win.

And this isn't about something as overt as straight racism, but more of a combined set of issues (some legitimate and some illegitimate) distancing him from the British public. People saying "no, we've had black winners before so his overall rank doesn't mean anything" obviously have no interest in even thinking the more nuanced, underlying issues with our society.

 

[Acorn]

and I think you're blind if you think people don't notice him on the jumbotron kneeling down and praying after every win.

And this isn't about something as overt as straight racism, but more of a combined set of issues (some legitimate and some illegitimate) distancing him from the British public. People saying "no, we've had black winners before so his overall rank doesn't mean anything" obviously have no interest in even thinking the more nuanced, underlying issues with our society.

You're reaching hard. He's immensely popular here with nunerous runs on chat shows etc. Where is the evidence to invalidate these remarkable athletes awards?

 

[ReplacementPelican]

and I think you're blind if you think people don't notice him on the jumbotron kneeling down and praying after every win.

And this isn't about something as overt as straight racism, but more of a combined set of issues (some legitimate and some illegitimate) distancing him from the British public. People saying "no, we've had black winners before so his overall rank doesn't mean anything" obviously have no interest in even thinking the more nuanced, underlying issues with our society.

Its really not conducive to your argument when you say that people in this thread who are posting well thought-out positions with reasons for why they think he's not won and you're just saying 'obviously they have no interest in nuance' and saying that people 'struggle to grasp it'.

Mo' is incredibly popular in this country and loved by a lot of people, he's the sole reason we even know when these events are happening, how is he distanced from the rest of us? He's the face a major brand. Also, you're discussing 'society' but this thread isn't about that, nobody here is saying Britain doesn't have issues but just that they think this argument of its manifestation is tenuous at best.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Also, you're discussing 'society' but this thread isn't about that, nobody here is saying Britain doesn't have issues but just that they think this argument of its manifestation is tenuous at best.

Yeah this is the crux of it. There is no question that Islamophobia is a problem in this country. But just because you acknowledge that does not mean that Islamophobia is necessarily the cause of Mo Farah not doing better at SPOTY.

 

[Zaph]

You're reaching hard. He's immensely popular here with nunerous runs on chat shows etc. Where is the evidence to invalidate these remarkable athletes awards?

Its really not conducive to your argument when you say that people in this thread who are posting well thought-out positions with reasons for why they think he's not won and you're just saying 'obviously they have no interest in nuance' and saying that people 'struggle to grasp it'.

Mo' is incredibly popular in this country and loved by a lot of people, he's the sole reason we even know when these events are happening, how is he distanced from the rest of us? He's the face a major brand. Also, you're discussing 'society' but this thread isn't about that, nobody here is saying Britain doesn't have issues but just that they think this argument of its manifestation is tenuous at best.

"immensely popular"
"numerous runs on chat shows"
"loved by a lot of people"
"sole reason we even know when these events are happening"

He is our most successful track and field athlete in modern Olympic history, and yes, television producers recognise that because they book him, yet when it's time for the public to put pen to paper in the popular vote, he consistently underperforms. You really think his ethnicity, religion, and the fact he doesn't try to hide it, doesn't play a part in this?

 

[Bold One]

Which year is it that you think he should have won?

Any year between 2011 and 2015/6 where he's broken several British records including his own,

Completed a historical and unprecedented double-double in the Olympics, been crowned European and World champion several times whilst carrying the sport and the nation's flag.

Some things a lot of posters here a very quick to disregard and refuse to acknowledge is that his heritage plays a part in SPOTY snubs for the last five years. His detractors like to point out that he spends a lot of his time outside the country training, he is often derided because he lives elsewhere. His popularity may not be in question, his 'Britishness' certainly is.

 

[Charles Brandon]

pick one in particular so that we can weigh his achievements against those who finished above him and thereby judge if your theory carries water.

 

[autumnleaf]

If he was going to win it should probably have been either

2011 (Breakthrough year, highest finish)
Finished 3rd behind : Mark Cavendish (Tour de France) and Darren Clarke.

2015
Finished 7th behind : Andy Murray (Davis Cup), Kevin Sinfield, Jessica Ennis, Tyson Fury (WTF), Lewis Hamilton and Chris Froome

In retrospect maybe Murray shouldn't have won last year but then Froome and Hamilton should have been higher as well. The other years he just got drowned out in the crowd of other Olympians and Murray.

 

[Charles Brandon]

2011 is a tough call. Cav is arguably the best road sprinter in pro-cycling history and in that year he won Britain's first ever major jersey at the TDF AND became Britain's first ever World champion. Darren Clarke won the Open, no mean feat. Mo won a World Championships gold but it isn't immediately obvious that that eclipses the achievements of the other two.

2015 - agree that 7th seems low. If it has been him, Hamilton and Froome in the top three that would have probably been more appropriate than the three that were there. However, I don't really remember his achievements getting a lot of press last year and that was the year the doping story broke so I guess that could explain it.

 

[Kinyou]

Disappointed with GAF. Not quite as liberal as I thought.

Yes and that's why you guys thought Trump wont win. You live in a liberal bubble and never see the other side. I too am liberal but at least I admit a problem when I see it. You think the world is exactly like your social community and what you see in the media.

Isn't it a bit of a contradiction to first complain that Gaf isn't liberal enough to back you up on this and then talk about how it's a liberal echo chamber?

 

[Camp Freddie]

Oldest gold winner we've had since 1908 and the equestrian community are huge in this country and very tight-knit (I used to date a dressage rider) - they'll have voted for him in spades.

Plus, yeah, he's coming back from a broken neck. That's a great story.

Yeah, I guess the equestrian community is a bit more motivated than the distance running community. I had a dressage-riding girlfriend once (only at local level and we were both about 16 at the time) and yes, my shock that this was an actual sport was matched by my shock that a lot of people seemed interested in it. I honestly thought she was joking when she said people could win an olympic medal for it.
At least showjumping is a 'real' sport (and a dangerous one, as Nick Skelton has demonstrated), though I can't help but think that the horses deserve the medals rather than the riders.

 

[CyclopsRock]

Where he a white man he would have it by now, I stand by that, perhaps not this year, though, I made that clear in original post, I stated in clear terms that AM was a worthy winner regardless of politics, the dude had a banner year.

So which year? I mean, SPOTY isn't an accumulative award - in what year did he deserve to win it more than anyone else?

Farah is the only reason the country watched long-distance running, he is the only hope for a medal in his field and has dominated in a manner befitting a true great. He single-handedly raised the profile of the sport ignored by the ruling classes for nearly a decade now.

You can say this about a lot of people, though. Who watched Gymnastics before Beth Tweddle and Louis Smith? Who cared about Diving until Tom Daly? Elevating a sport that no one cares about that much with your success is laudable but that doesn't actually elevate the success achieved.

And I suspect Paula Radcliffe would contest the idea that the only reason people watched long distanced running was because of Mo. It may be the only reason people watched that specific subset of that specific subset of a section of track and field, though (which, even taken as a whole, is hardly a great British sport favourite).

 

[ReplacementPelican]

"immensely popular"
"numerous runs on chat shows"
"loved by a lot of people"
"sole reason we even know when these events are happening"

He is our most successful track and field athlete in modern Olympic history, and yes, television producers recognise that because they book him, yet when it's time for the public to put pen to paper in the popular vote, he consistently underperforms. You really think his ethnicity, religion, and the fact he doesn't try to hide it, doesn't play a part in this?

If he was a white, Christian man he wouldn't have won either. That's the point here.

Maybe its because people don't like the sport as much? Maybe tennis fans are more likely to vote? I don't know but you're really jumping to conclusions without any proof.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

He'll probably win it next year, but then we'll still be racist because a white person won some other competition

 

[autumnleaf]

You also have to think about the type of person watching and voting something on BBC One 8pm on a Sunday night. There's a reason things like Equestrian, Show Jumping, Rowing, Tennis etc. do well. Remember the year Zara Phillips won?

It's your Antiques Roadshow crowd.

 

[Mase Gumble]

He'll probably win it next year, but then we'll still be racist because a white person won some other competition

If Anthony Joshua beats Klitsckho and someone else who isnt a bum it will be his to lose imo.

There might well be something to this, but I think Farrah not winning is down to there being someone with flashier achievements, 'better stories' or a campaign behind them like there was for Phil Taylor (fuck him) or that Rugby League guy last year, in his bigger years for the most part.

 

[Podge293]

Irrelevant. Mo has never been in the top 3. That's what is relevant.

I've never watched the show and the article you quoted from the telegraph even says he was 3rd in 2011.

Dude is practically nonexistent outside of the Olympics. He doesn't interview, keeps fairly private and he quickly drops from everyone's mind.

Murray just recently got confirmed as the top dog in tennis, it's big news and recent.

Number 2 had that whole story of being carried over the line or carrying his brother over the line. Massive stories. Kept him in the public eye.

Third dude had the sob story or something(I've no clue but going on above posts) so he's got the sympathy vote.

Mo did nothing to keep him relevant in the public eye

 

[Zaph]

If he was a white, Christian man he wouldn't have won either. That's the point here.

Maybe its because people don't like the sport as much? Maybe tennis fans are more likely to vote? I don't know but you're really jumping to conclusions without any proof.

Again, since you're not bothering to read replies, it's not about who won, nobody can argue Murray deserved it this year, it's trying to understand why Britain's most awarded track and field athlete in modern Olympic history has been so low on the rankings over multiple years.

I think his heritage and religion played a part in this (not the entire reason, just part of the reason), you obviously do not.

Well. there have been two years in which his Olympic success has been relevant and in both years he was eclipsed by other Olympians. In other years his Olympic success doesn't count for anything. You need to point at a year or years in particular instead of just saying "he should have won it some point".

I don't think he should have won any (given the competition), but his overall ranking across multiple years is oddly low. Pulling off the double-double and coming 4th? 7th in 2011? I would think someone who put British Track and Field back on the map would at least come second or third a few times.

 

[Charles Brandon]

Again, since you're not bothering to read replies, it's not about who won, nobody can argue Murray deserved it this year, it's trying to understand why Britain's most awarded track and field athlete in modern Olympic history has been so low on the rankings over multiple years.

I think his heritage and religion played a part in this (not the entire reason, just part of the reason), you obviously do not.

Well. there have been two years in which his Olympic success has been relevant and in both years he was eclipsed by other Olympians. In other years his Olympic success doesn't count for anything. You need to point at a year or years in particular instead of just saying "he should have won it some point".

 

[Jezbollah]

You also have to think about the type of person watching and voting something on BBC One 8pm on a Sunday night. There's a reason things like Equestrian, Show Jumping, Rowing, Tennis etc. do well. Remember the year Zara Phillips won?

It's your Antiques Roadshow crowd.

And its this audience that the BBC panders to and for who they obtain their "type" of sports rights. It's the stars of these sports that the BBC pushes for their Top 10 of SPOTY. The likelyhood of seeing a British world champion out of the rights they dont have or is unknown to the Antiques Roadshow demographic is remote except if youre credentials are completely undeniable.

With regards to Mo Farah, I think this demographic is just bored of him. They want to support their next new face of success. They would rather jump on the back of an Alistair BrownLee, who got two-and-a-half times Farah's vote, when I bet hardly any of those have seen him in the flesh or heard about his achievements before the last few years.

 

[milanbaros]

And its this audience that the BBC panders to and for who they obtain their "type" of sports rights. It's the stars of these sports that the BBC pushes for their Top 10 of SPOTY. The likelyhood of seeing a British world champion out of the rights they dont have or is unknown to the Antiques Roadshow demographic is remote except if youre credentials are completely undeniable.

With regards to Mo Farah, I think this demographic is just bored of him. They want to support their next new face of success. They would rather jump on the back of an Alistair BrownLee, who got two-and-a-half times Farah's vote, when I bet hardly any of those have seen him in the flesh or heard about his achievements before the last few years.

Except the Brownlee brothers were two of the poster athletes of London 2012 and Alistair won gold. Mo and the Brownlees became popular at the same time. Murray a few years before that.

 

[CrazyHorse]

There are plenty of legitimate reasons why Mo wouldn't be higher ranked overall, but if people think his immigrant background and tendency to visibly practice Islam post-win don't factor in to that, they're kidding themselves about this country.

Even members of my row club raised eyebrows over his low rank a few years ago, especially given the fact Mo gives us someone to cheer once the track and field events start - a place where we generally underachieve.



OP has said multiple times he's not disputing Andy's win (I don't think any sane person could), but Mo's overall ranking across many years.

Thank you.

It's so good to see that more people on GAF understand where I am coming from. The initial posts were all disregarding my points but overnight more posters can see that I have a point. I guess the more thoughtful people tend to post a bit later.

Let me make it clear again that Murray is a very deserving winner.

However please don't think to yourselves that racism has not played a part in how Mo has not ranked higher over the years. If he was a white British born man, he would have surely gotten more votes.

Yes I know that other black people and even the Muslim Muhammad Ali won the award, but Mo has a combination of things that make him less popular than he should be. Most importantly he is a Somalian immigrant and to a lesser degree a practising Muslim at a time when terrorism has been in the news a lot. In the past the latter would not be such a problem.

If Mo had the same ethnicity, place of birth and culture as Linford Christie, he would have ranked a lot higher over the years. Disagree with that?

A huge amount of Brits hate immigrants. They cheer for Mo but don't like him as much as they would if wasn't a Somalian immigrant.

 

[CrazyHorse]

You also have to think about the type of person watching and voting something on BBC One 8pm on a Sunday night. There's a reason things like Equestrian, Show Jumping, Rowing, Tennis etc. do well. Remember the year Zara Phillips won?

It's your Antiques Roadshow crowd.

It's a fair point.

It's a bit like the elections. The old and wealthy are more likely to vote.

 

[milanbaros]

Thank you.

It's so good to see that more people on GAF understand where I am coming from. The initial posts were all disregarding my points but overnight more posters can see that I have a point. I guess the more thoughtful people tend to post a bit later.

Let me make it clear again that Murray is a very deserving winner.

However please don't think to yourselves that racism has not played a part in how Mo has not ranked higher over the years. If he was a white British born man, he would have surely gotten more votes.

Yes I know that other black people and even the Muslim Muhammad Ali won the award, but Mo has a combination of things that make him less popular than he should be. Most importantly he is a Somalian immigrant and to a lesser degree a practising Muslim at a time when terrorism has been in the news a lot. In the past the latter would not be such a problem.

If Mo had the same ethnicity, place of birth and culture as Linford Christie, he would have ranked a lot higher over the years. Disagree with that?

A huge amount of Brits hate immigrants. They cheer for Mo but don't like him as much as they would if wasn't a Somalian immigrant.

I do agree that some people will not have voted for Mo based on his background, which is awful. I also believe he gets fewer votes than normal because of the drugs scandal.

I also believe that his story has made him more popular with some people than he would have been had he not overcame everything he has and was instead a white middle class man from Basingstoke.

I don't think he would have materially more votes if he was the latter than the former. I think 4th sounds about right for 2016.

 

[Charles Brandon]

I'm no sure I agree with the statement "a huge amount of Brits hate immigrants".

 

[Jezbollah]

Except the Brownlee brothers were two of the poster athletes of London 2012 and Alistair won gold. Mo and the Brownlees became popular at the same time. Murray a few years before that.

The Brownlees were unknown then. They didnt make the nominations of the 2012 SPOTY (Farah and Ennis were). Funnily enough, so was Brad Wiggins - who won Olympic gold.

Given Froome won the TDF for the third time this year and wasnt nominated, however Wiggins won it once and the Olympic Gold in the same year and was (and won), what does that say?

It shows that the BBC are clearly biased to nominate sports persons who achieve great success on their own channels vs others that achieve success on rival networks.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

I don't think this argument that he should have won at some point is that convincing. Look at each year and pick out one that you think he should have won. The year that stands out to me is 2011, incidentally his highest finish, as having had a weaker slate of candidates of past years. He definitely could have won that year.

2012? Maybe you could argue that he should have placed Top 3 instead of Ennis, but I see why the other two are above him.

2013? Maybe he could have been Top 3 over McCoy, but no, he's not winning top spot in that year. Never.

2014? No argument for him there.

2015? He was certainly great, but there's a really standout slate of athletes that year. Hard to see how he gets above Murray, Sinfield, Ennis, Fury, Hamilton or even Froome.

And 2016? Well we've covered the media narratives there and it's pretty easy to see how the tight communities they came from and the great media moments they had propelled them to victory.

 

[Stevey]

Because his stupid victory dance/pose thing is cringe itself.

 

[MCN]

Because he manages to be duller than Andy Murray, and nobody likes Quorn.

 

[Bold One]

So which year? I mean, SPOTY isn't an accumulative award - in what year did he deserve to win it more than anyone else?



You can say this about a lot of people, though. Who watched Gymnastics before Beth Tweddle and Louis Smith? Who cared about Diving until Tom Daly? Elevating a sport that no one cares about that much with your success is laudable but that doesn't actually elevate the success achieved.

And I suspect Paula Radcliffe would contest the idea that the only reason people watched long distanced running was because of Mo. It may be the only reason people watched that specific subset of that specific subset of a section of track and field, though (which, even taken as a whole, is hardly a great British sport favourite).

I already answered this - please, his achievements are a google search away. You can make an argument for the winners one way or the other within the top 3 a lot of times the margins are slim.

the fact that you compared Daley, Tweddle and Loui Smith's achievements to Farah is really weird. Sure they brought some visibility to their sport, but all of their combined success did not compare to the unparalleled level of success and dominance on the local, European, Global or Olympic levels as Mo'

His popularity may not be in question, his 'Britishness' certainly is.

A bunch of other posters have done their best to hand-wave away my posts but Alistair Bronwlee said it himself, not even cracking the top 3 after all he's achieved

Alistair Brownlee has admitted his surprise that Mo Farah yet again failed to make the top three of the BBC’s Sports Personality of the Year on Sunday night and suggested it might be because “some people don’t see him as British”.

Brownlee said he would have voted for Farah, who came fourth in the awards despite retaining his Olympic 5,000m and 10,000m titles in style in Rio, and felt it was “really sad” that he did not get the respect his success deserved.

“For me Mo’s achievements are incredible and what stands out about them is that no one from this country has ever done them before,” Brownlee said. “There is a good chance that no one will again. It’s not like someone does it every year – it is a complete one-off in what are two very competitive, blue riband athletic events.”

Brownlee, who finished in second place behind Andy Murray on Sunday night, said he was flabbergasted that Farah had finished in the top three of Spoty only once, in 2011. “I’m not sure why he’s not in the top three,” he said. “It doesn’t necessarily help if you’re not there on the night; maybe some people don’t see him as British.

“It’s really sad, because for me he is the perfect British story. It’s what we should be about: a person who comes to Britain as a young man, as a refugee, and an ex‑schoolteacher identifies something that he’s brilliant at and he represents Britain as the best in the world. I think that’s a fantastic British story.”

Farah’s case was also supported by the 58-year-old showjumper Nick Skelton, another gold medallist in Rio, who finished third on Sunday night.

I'm sure this will be waved away as well..

 

[StWilson85]

The reasons are fourfold.

1. He's dull
2. He's got links to some dodgy dopsters
3. Those dire adverts
4. Nobody really gives a fuck about the SPOTY.

 

[SmokinGunZ1981]

I'm sure this will be waved away as well..

So are you saying that if he had finished in the top 3 everything would have been OK? That one place sounds very arbitrary!

 

[cilonen]

No deserves recognition but to be honest I believe he gets it. I've seen him run and the reception he gets from he crowd is universally awesome.

The thing is Tennis is, in the U.K., oddly revered as the most important sport ever created for some reason.

Wimbledon men's singles final viewing figures: 13.3 million.
http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/atoz/faq_and_facts_and_figures.html

Rio Olympic highest viewing figures: 11.1 million - for Jason Kenny winning the Keirin.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/37156975

Mo finished above Jason Kenny this year too, not that that proves a lot, but the fact that popular male tennis player wins both a second Olympic gold and the country's favourite sporting event for the second time amid fierce competition and then goes on to finish the year as world number one in that sport means that the result should not be surprising.

You're painting your own really bad and unforgivable experiences on to a sporting popularity contest where there was only ever going to be one winner, even in an Olympic year.

 

[DeathyBoy]

So are you saying that if he had finished in the top 3 everything would have been OK? That one place sounds very arbitrary!

If he finishes in the top three it confirms Britain is not racist. Until we get a thread complaining he's not in the top two. Then things will be better. Until we get a thread complaining he didn't win completely.

But boy, when he wins completrly... w"" get a thread saying he would have won sooner if not for racism.

 

[CrazyHorse]

Now even Alistair Brownlee agrees with my sentiment:

"Alistair Brownlee has admitted his surprise that Mo Farah yet again failed to make the top three of the BBC’s Sports Personality of the Year on Sunday night and suggested it might be because “some people don’t see him as British”.

Brownlee said he would have voted for Farah, who came fourth in the awards despite retaining his Olympic 5,000m and 10,000m titles in style in Rio, and felt it was “really sad” that he did not get the respect his success deserved."

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...orts-personality-2016-award-alistair-brownlee

 

[CrazyHorse]

I have said on this thread before that Andy Murray was a deserving winner. But on second thoughts I realised that what Murray did has been done by many other great tennis players. There are a number of players who have constantly achieved more than him E.g. Sampras, Nadal etc.

But what Mo Farah has done is not just exceptional for the UK but on the world stage. Only Lasse Viren has done the double double and he too did not win as many other golds in other events.

 

[King_Moc]

I have said on this thread before that Andy Murray was a deserving winner. But on second thoughts I realised that what Murray did has been done by many other great tennis players. There are a number of players who have constantly achieved more than him E.g. Sampras, Nadal etc.

But what Mo Farah has done is not just exceptional for the UK but on the world stage. Only Lasse Viren has done the double double and he too did not win as many other golds in other events.

Oh, for fucks sake.

How many british players have done what Murray has done? And how many people in this country care about long distance running vs Tennis? Mo is mentioned once every 4 years as no one cares otherwise. Murray is in the news and on the TV all the time. Case closed.

 

[CrazyHorse]

Oh, for fucks sake.

How many british players have done what Murray has done? And how many people in this country care about long distance running vs Tennis? Mo is mentioned once every 4 years as no one cares otherwise. Murray is in the news and on the TV all the time. Case closed.

No Brit has done what Murray has done. But many non-Brits have done what he has done. However Mo stands above that because only one person has done what he did.

Look at end of the day I have one question: Did his background status not make a significant difference over the years? Forget about whether he deserved it more than Murray, the main point is why are you denying the racism aspect? Why can't you admit that it may have had some impact even if you think Murray deserves the award? Let's assume Murray deserved it. Even Brownlee who came 2nd agrees that Mo's background made a difference.

 

[King_Moc]

No Brit has done what Murray has done. But many non-Brits have done what he has done. However Mo stands above that because only one person has done what he did.

Look at end of the day I have one question: Did his background status not make a significant difference over the years? Forget about whether he deserved it more than Murray, the main point is why are you denying the racism aspect? Why can't you admit that it may have had some impact even if you think Murray deserves the award? Let's assume Murray deserved it. Even Brownlee who came 2nd agrees that Mo's background made a difference.

Some difference? Sure. the difference between the number of votes Murray got and the number of votes Farah got? No way.

I've already said that if it was up to me he'd at the very least be above Brownlee.