Console wars. Serious business.
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Microsoft: Xbox One leading sales in US since price cut, nearly 10 million sold-in
- Thread starter Majine
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Console wars. Serious business.
LyleLanley
Banned
I imagine they're hoping that if Sony takes a beating during the holiday period it will push them to become more aggressive either via price cuts or announcing more games.
Many people that owned a 360 or had a 360 as their first video game console wanted the Xbox one to be successful and beat the PlayStation brand I suppose.
Edit:
There even was a very old thread of expectations for next gen (current gen now) where people where expecting Nintendo to be Nintendo, Microsoft to go and get first place this time and Sony to leave the console businesses
With all the constant 'doom and gloom' regarding X1 on this forum, i just wanted to ask a question about X1 and past consoles to the people that know about past console numbers etc.
Ignoring the amazing PS4 numbers. With 10mil X1 consoles sold in i'd guess that would mean 8+mil sold to customers?, well compared to first year sales for past consoles, would first year sales of 8mil be good?.
I just have a feeling that the X1 isn't doing quite as bad as some make out on here.
Thanks in advance.
Ignoring the amazing PS4 numbers. With 10mil X1 consoles sold in i'd guess that would mean 8+mil sold to customers?, well compared to first year sales for past consoles, would first year sales of 8mil be good?.
I just have a feeling that the X1 isn't doing quite as bad as some make out on here.
Thanks in advance.
Wildarmsjecht
Member
Ahh, gotcha.
Eh wut.
But If they announce games that aren't ready to be announced, then there's a long lull before they release and people bitch...if they do a price cut that's not necessary, they forfeit much needed profit that would eventually go into creating games (hopefully)
If they rush out titles then they pull a Ubisoft.
I don't even...
Edit- thanks for the input tho Lyle, I was really staring at my screen like "what in the...." But if that's certain peoples expectations then I'm just...pfffffffttt lol
Only if we get to see fistacuffs with Bill Gates, he's actually a lot more of a heavyweight than he looks. Secret muscles and stuff.
sturgboski
Member
I know right? Severely devaluing your console is all the rage and the only thing possible so god willing Sony has to do it too.
As for games, I do miss the Sony of the PS3 generation that pumped out tons of games (some hits some misses). They do seem to be resting on indies and third parties a lot more this gen, but then again, the market is showing that 3rd parties and indies are what help sell a console. But I would really love to know what came of all those WWS studios titles that were supposed to come in the first year. I mean its not like WWS is putting a lot of effort in PS3 nor Vita (which is a shame). Ah well, like I said, ton of content already out there for the system. Sure, no SO or MCC, but we also know of two big hitters for Sony early next year...
John Bender
Banned
No chance in hell.
I think Microsoft is putting themselves into a really hairy situation with this temporary price cut. It just seems very short sighted.
What do they have planned after the holiday season is over and the price jacks back up to $399? I imagine sales will stagnate at that point up until they permanently lower the price back down to $349. And if I were a betting man, that announcement would come around the time of E3. Sure, the holiday season draws big numbers, but are they really willing to sacrifice the 4 to 6 months of steady sales afterwards for it? I know sales dwindle after the November-December period, but it just isn't financially healthy for a product to have peaks and valleys like that. It just doesn't seem like a very healthy business approach.
What do they have planned after the holiday season is over and the price jacks back up to $399? I imagine sales will stagnate at that point up until they permanently lower the price back down to $349. And if I were a betting man, that announcement would come around the time of E3. Sure, the holiday season draws big numbers, but are they really willing to sacrifice the 4 to 6 months of steady sales afterwards for it? I know sales dwindle after the November-December period, but it just isn't financially healthy for a product to have peaks and valleys like that. It just doesn't seem like a very healthy business approach.
I'd be surprised if it wasn't at 8mil. I have worked in retail and you don't keep ordering stock if you have stores full of said stock. Microsoft don't automatically send out X1's to stores, they have to order them.
Besides they said they had sold 6mil to customers months ago didn't they?
Maybe they want to see PS4 get thrashed a bit because they actually want to buy a PS4 but can't afford it, and don't want to buy an XB1? I certainly would love PS4 to have a price drop since it has more games I would enjoy than XB1 does and I can't afford one yet. I just also know that PS4 is in the dominant position and has no need for a price drop.
They haven't said anything about sell through since last year.
But you're wrong.
markedbravado
Member
Wrong! Just stop. These incorrect numbers being spread are just crazy.
About what?, you want to be more specific?
rokkerkory
Member
They will raise prices back up to $500 and with kinect only sku.
How do you know its wrong if we haven't had any official numbers?, do you think there are 3 or 4 million X1's sat on store shelves?.
You're sold through numbers. Which I've been beaten but still quoted me ignoring the others who said you were wrong.
Were using some gaffers numbers using data extrapolated over the past few npds. At least they have deductive reasoning behind theirs. Yours? Tales from your ass.
Those shipments include what they are shipping for this holiday I believe.
If you wouldve said microsoft will sell around 8-9million after this holiday then it'll be more believable.
Jesus, what the hells your problem?
I don't have one? I'm telling you why its wrong and questioning why you keep questioning people who are telling you the same thing.
Sony served the best versions for pretty much every meaningful 3rd party title, along with the most indie games, and a healthy number of exclusive titles. So if anything, they deserve every win they nailed this year. You are just terribly jaded and think microsoft's graveling should somehow set a prescedent that needs to be matched by sony. Im sorry you feel this way, bro.
My guess is that these "temporary" price cuts become permanent. We'll hear about it after the holidays. At the end of the game, pricing is a huge factor when it comes to demand. They aren't going to annouce permanent pricing now though, as they want to artificially increase demand over the holidays with "discounts".
BuggeryBugz
Member
Then what are the bloody numbers if he is wrong? Don't tell him he is wrong if you can't provide numbers, he is guessing like everyone else.
I'm sorry but if there are no hard numbers then its all wrong and all guess work.
Besides this has nothing to do with my orig question.
You better back these claims up with some solid sources if you want to shake of this whiff of tales-from-assnes.
No it was a question hense the '?'
And I answered it earlier.
Dragonborn
Member
It just gets tiring to see the same misinformation spreading. Like the other poster said, we can get an idea of what they have sold through based on NPD data and previous official announcements (estimating WW numbers via percentage of overall sales). There is no way the X1 is at 8 million or even 7. At best it's around 6.5, and it'll still be selling through the 10 million well into Feb/March.
MS put out this PR to fool people and it seems to work incredibly well.
Sources for what?, the 6mil bit?, it was a question hense the question mark.
Jesus what the hell is wrong with some of you?
Hockeymac18
Member
You really think after the holiday they will only be at 8 million? I think you're being ridiculously conservative. The XB1 will sell well over the holidays...because it's the holidays. Almost everything sells well. They'll likely work through most of what has been shipped out to retailers by January (of which we know is close to 10 million).
They might go back to having issues selling consoles next year, but I think MS only having 8 million XB1s sold after the holidays is a lot harder to believe than them being at 8 million now (which I don't think is the case).
BuggeryBugz
Member
I'm amazed that on this forum you can offer your opinion and estimate/guess what you think hardware sales are without someone ripping into you and not providing numbers themselves.
Thanks for the fair post.
I haven't been fooled though, i just find it hard to believe there would be 3-4mil X1's sitting on store shelves.
I don't know how you can be so obtuse. I'm not addressing his guess of 8 million. If he's using his retail experience to come to that guess, I don't have a problem with that.
He ASKED if MS had released sell through numbers some months ago. I said they didn't.
You still got a problem with that?
Okay I apologize since its being discern with too much emotion. But according to GAF users who are pretty good at discerning data had concluded that it probably has not sold at that suggestive numbers. Now I believe that's better than saying a random number without much reasoning behind it as "well they shipped this much so let's subtract one million... And voila this number seems right".
I think it will sell around 9 million region myself. My range is 8-10mill.
I think it will sell around 9 million region myself. My range is 8-10mill.
Didn't you see the Major's tweet? Almost 10 million units sold. There's your answer.
Wynne... I hate you! Lol
JumpJeff84
Member
Whether the number is 8m or not, Xbone is doing very well. It's selling better than the 360 did at the same point in it's life cycle. Xbone just isn't doing as well as the PS4, which is doing uncommonly well.
It's not doom and gloom for MS by any means.
BuggeryBugz
Member
You specifically said:
This wasn't a guess.
When In fact it was.
People get too tied up in others peoples opinions/guess saying they are spreading mis-information because heaven forbid people agree with him. Who honestly cares? Once we get correct numbers, then berate him all you like.
Sold in lol.
Forget my question, it must be a touchy subject or something.
Boy i have learnt my lesson though!
Then the problem turns into the hardware being sold at a huge loss. They can't be making profit even at the $399 price point only a year into this generation And I see MS willing to take a huge hit for the console being sold at $349 in order to become a loss leader during the holidays. But afterwards, would MS want to keep selling it for so low after the holidays? I don't see that being viable either.
JayhawkerStL
Banned
I would expect price cut to become permanent, and there will probably always be a bundle of some sort with it. The benefit of slightly less powerful specs is that it was easier for MS to drop the Kinect and undercut Sony. Sony has a more expensive console and far less the bank to wage an actual price war.
The other thing Microsoft has done that has to help sales is get playable demo units up in stores. I think they thought that the Kinect would not function well in that environment and went with units just showing video clips. With a lower price and playable demos, it kind of puts to bed that notion that the XB1 is a system that struggles to play the best games.
Microsoft's play here is for 360 owners that have not upgraded yet. It's pretty clear that of those that did, they were losing massive numbers to the PS4. But XBL and friends lists are still a good draw. If folks see their friends playing on XB1's via those friends lists, it makes it easier to sell the console to those gamers.
It also helps that this holiday season Microsoft has three exclusives that are games that have reviewed super well and are system sellers in FH2, SO, and the MCC. Obviously the MCC is taking a beating because of matchmaking, but I don't know anyone that doesn't believe that won;t be fixed sooner than later.
Sony just has the same games you can get on the XB1, bit for a higher price point. Going forward Sony will have some great exclusives, but so far, only Infamous is really worth bragging about. Regardless, Microsoft will have to keep pushing post Christmas to keep the consoles moving.
Microsoft is doing fine in absolute numbers, but the marketshare matters, because it is what will drive those who not upgraded yet over to the PS4 is Microsoft does not correct it. At some point, it allows developers to ignore Microsoft, and they would have a huge problem. Right now, they would have been ecstatic with the numbers they've generated. But they are not selling in a vacuum, and no thought Sony would do Wii like numbers. And unlike the Wii, the PS4 is a direct competitor that has the same games.
Mostly, Microsoft's bungling mess of a launch turned the console war into a sort of mandate on the treatment of gamers, and a ton of people bought consoles because of the hype around Microsoft hating gamers. While that is starting to fade, the massive numbers have led many to choose the PS4, because that's where their friends are.
Price is the one tool Microsoft has right now to overturn all of the hate they generated. Well, that and great exclusive games. They could really use Quantam Break to be great (I wouldn't count on it) and for Screamride to catch the interest of younger games that are looking for a new creative playground after Minecraft (more likely). but dieter are games that anyone is going to be really hyped for.
JumpJeff84
Member
yeah no way they're not taking a significant loss on every console sold.
I mean, I can't say for sure, but I doubt they're making money if they've dropped the price by $ 150 in a year.
Dragonborn
Member
You have to realize a few things.
1. They said 10 million "soon" so they haven't actually shipped 10 million.
2. MS has a history of stuffing the channel, just look at last year.
3. The consoles being shipped are for Oct. Nov. And Dec., not just one month.
Hopefully that clears it up a bit?
We will have a much better idea once the next quarterly report is out along with some official numbers (whatever crumbs we manage to get)
Do they really need to make a profit on hardware though? I've never understood this, they should be selling it at a loss to sell more units to customers THEN make the money back from games and xbox live
Anyways, they were profiting at $500 and now they removed kinect and selling it for $400 while selling kinect seperate for $150, so I'd say they're probably still making a profit at $400.
I don't know how that fits the definition of a guess but suit yourself.
So I'm meant to provide evidence that they DIDN'T release sell through numbers some months ago. Ummm, how am I supposed to do that?
Good to hear they are out in the wild, now to get them into people's homes.
Let's be honest, an ideal scenario is this goes back and forth all generation, both companies trying to out do the other one. Can't see that happening with Sony's lead, but aggressive (desperate?) Microsoft has been a pretty good Microsoft this year. Look at the deals available; can't help but feel we are the winners here.
I genuinely believe it's in the industry's interest to have more than one powerhouse fighting for the number one spot. It doesn't even matter who leads and by how much; as long as the other one is trying to play catch up, both have to stay ahead of the game and try and garner favours from the consumers. Healthy competition and all.
Now, all prospective X1 owners, go buy Sunset Overdrive, enjoy it, and help greenlight a sequel.
Let's be honest, an ideal scenario is this goes back and forth all generation, both companies trying to out do the other one. Can't see that happening with Sony's lead, but aggressive (desperate?) Microsoft has been a pretty good Microsoft this year. Look at the deals available; can't help but feel we are the winners here.
I genuinely believe it's in the industry's interest to have more than one powerhouse fighting for the number one spot. It doesn't even matter who leads and by how much; as long as the other one is trying to play catch up, both have to stay ahead of the game and try and garner favours from the consumers. Healthy competition and all.
Now, all prospective X1 owners, go buy Sunset Overdrive, enjoy it, and help greenlight a sequel.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Though without direct breakdowns from MS it's hard to say the exact cost of production... Sony for all intents should have the cheaper to produce hardware.
The GPU in One is huge in comparison because of the on die ESRAM. SRAM is expensive in the first place. 32MB directly on the chip will increase costs exponentially.
Sony could probably undercut MS on price and still be profiting on every unit sale.
Exactly. Dropping the price by 30% in a year while cost to manufacture and distribute is still at its highest point in the console cycle? I could only see red in the balance sheets.
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