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[cj_iwakura]

You simply have different tastes. 3DS got much better support than the Vita overall but the Vita is better at niche RPG and visual novels.

As for upcoming games both are pretty much bad at upcoming support but Nintendo is still supporting the 3DS with games like Fire Emblem if while Sony bailed out a long time ago.

You got me on the first party support, but I feel like the third parties seem to be siding with the Vita.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Something to debate or a question if you will. If you really want to lay all the blame at the feet of the mobile market then why is it the PSP and the Vita to an extent are still doing better in the Japanese markets and getting support there in an arguably more entrenched and advanced mobile market than the U.S. ?

Portable dedicated substitution of stationary dedicated mitigates the degree of convergent mobile substitution of portable dedicated.

 

[Vamphuntr]

You got me on the first party support, but I feel like the third parties seem to be siding with the Vita.

Absolutely but then you have to ask if the support itself is worthwhile. Quantity doesn't mean quality. For most players most of these vita games aren't interesting. A ton of visual novels, mid-low tier JRPGS or otaku games or indie games. Most of these are only available online on PSN for the Vita they don't have and most of the retail releases are quite rare. You won't find most Vita games from Aksys or NISA in retail stores outside Gamestop and small independent stores.

 

[Waikis]

You got me on the first party support, but I feel like the third parties seem to be siding with the Vita.

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

 

[Lexxism]

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

He's probably talking about quantity. There's quite a Japanese 3rd party for PSV but most of the quality 3rd party are on 3DS.

 

[TC McQueen]

You got me on the first party support, but I feel like the third parties seem to be siding with the Vita.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Vita's one screen makes it easier to develop for, just by subtracting one extra thing they have to design graphics for or something like that.

 

[Tohsaka]

Absolutely but then you have to ask if the support itself is worthwhile. Quantity doesn't mean quality. For most players most of these vita games aren't interesting. A ton of visual novels, mid-low tier JRPGS or otaku games or indie games. Most of these are only available online on PSN for the Vita they don't have and most of the retail releases are quite rare. You won't find most Vita games from Aksys or NISA in retail stores outside Gamestop and small independent stores.

You can just order them from Amazon, certainly not an unknown website or anything. I get pretty much all my games, Vita and otherwise from them.

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

There are more Vita games coming out than on 3DS in the near future, at least in the west. If you look at the upcoming release lists on Gamestop's website there's two pages of games for Vita and only one for 3DS.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Vita's highpoint in its short life was Ken Levine holding it up at e3 and announcing a bioshock game for it. It was all downhill from there.

 

[QaaQer]

Do you really think that Vita didn't sell well because proprietary memory cards and the price of console?

Of course.

A Naughty Dog game, a GT game, a $199 launch price, and use of cheap sd cards and the thing would have sold probably 150 000 000 units by now easy. Sony really blew it with the Vita.

They could have been the Apple of gaming.

 

[cj_iwakura]

Absolutely but then you have to ask if the support itself is worthwhile. Quantity doesn't mean quality. For most players most of these vita games aren't interesting. A ton of visual novels, mid-low tier JRPGS or otaku games or indie games. Most of these are only available online on PSN for the Vita they don't have and most of the retail releases are quite rare. You won't find most Vita games from Aksys or NISA in retail stores outside Gamestop and small independent stores.

My tastes always run more to the niche(and not IF's garbage), so I'm happy with where things are going. If by some miracle the 3DS gets another third party gem, then that's good too.

 

[……forgetit]

But conversely Vita games are getting physical and limited editions left and right.

Why is the more successful system not getting the software support? Not trying to start a handheld debate, genuinely curious.

I own both, for the record, but I have double the Vita games so far. I went 3DS strictly for SMT, and after SMTIV, the support kind of dried up.

Well the first factor is power, you can just do more on vita for about the same cost, the second us your taste varies from the typical 3DS owner. I love the little thing.

 

[Voysa Reezun]

What really sort of sucks as a huge fan of the Vita is that I feel like I did as a huge fan of the Dreamcast and how I perceive some WiiU/Nintendo fans to feel right now; I am part of an extremely small market for the things that I like so much about (handheld) gaming.

I feel like I'm going to just buy two more Vitas at some point and store them because I have no interest in playing games by phone or in Nintendo's handheld hardware. I just got back into handheld gaming, so yeah, the fact that (basically) no one else really wants the same things I do in that market and the market will react accordingly just stinks.

 

[……forgetit]

What really sort of sucks as a huge fan of the Vita is that I feel like I did as a huge fan of the Dreamcast and how I perceive some WiiU/Nintendo fans to feel right now; I am part of an extremely small market for the things that I like so much about (handheld) gaming.

I feel like I'm going to just buy two more Vitas at some point and store them because I have no interest in playing games by phone or in Nintendo's handheld hardware. I just got back into handheld gaming, so yeah, the fact that (basically) no one else really wants the same things I do in that market and the market will react accordingly just stinks.

Never say never, you may like the NX

 

[RM8]

Vita's 3rd party support is rather "anime girl face". It's no wonder people into visual novels and very minor JRPGs like it, but to say Vita is a healthy platform is a stretch.

 

[To Far Away Times]

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

Yeah, I definitely can't agree with that.

 

[Steel]

Absolutely but then you have to ask if the support itself is worthwhile. Quantity doesn't mean quality. For most players most of these vita games aren't interesting. A ton of visual novels, mid-low tier JRPGS or otaku games or indie games. Most of these are only available online on PSN for the Vita they don't have and most of the retail releases are quite rare. You won't find most Vita games from Aksys or NISA in retail stores outside Gamestop and small independent stores.

You're also ignoring indies, which lean quite heavily toward vita and are still being ported to the thing left and right. They don't have physical versions, true, but they still do count and there's a good variety of them.

Vita's 3rd party support is rather "anime girl face". It's no wonder people into visual novels and very minor JRPGs like it, but to say Vita is a healthy platform is a stretch.

More indies don't count, I see.

 

[……forgetit]

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

Ya know, before this year I couldn't agree either, but going forward I can't think of a good upcoming game I want to play on either of them

 

[Vamphuntr]

There are more Vita games coming out than on 3DS in the near future, at least in the west. If you look at the upcoming release lists on Gamestop's website there's two pages of games for Vita and only one for 3DS.

This is ebgames (Gamestop Canada branding) main's page. Find what's wrong with it.

 

[kubricks]

I guess this will settle the agruement whether Vita is dead or not in the West.

Now we can concentrate on talking about Japanese 3rd party games and localized rpgs right? To be honest, I stop caring about Sony's support on the platform since .... day one?
Well ok there is Gravity rush......

 

[……forgetit]

This is ebgames (Gamestop Canada branding) main's page. Find what's wrong with it.

Splatoon for $70? WTF Canada.

 

[RM8]

More indies don't count, I see.

3DS has indie games too, some of them are even exclusive like the G-STYLE games.

Regardless, my point is that Vita is (sadly) not a very healthy platform, not that it "has no games".

 

[Steel]

3DS has indie games too, some of them are even exclusive like the G-STYLE games.

I know it has indies. And the Vita has playstation exclusive indies like velocity, resogun, etc. My point was the quantity is nowhere near the same.

To your edit: yeah, it's not a healthy platform financially, I agree.

 

[Tohsaka]

This is ebgames (Gamestop Canada branding) main's page. Find what's wrong with it.

Well, it's still on the top of Gamestop's website at least.

 

[cj_iwakura]

This is ebgames (Gamestop Canada branding) main's page. Find what's wrong with it.

It's still on the US site. Once NHL 2015 hits the Vita, we'll see who comes out ahead.
(That won't happen ever)

 

[ascii42]

Portable dedicated substitution of stationary dedicated mitigates the degree of convergent mobile substitution of portable dedicated.

It definitely took more than one read to parse that.

 

[RM8]

I know it has indies. And the Vita has playstation exclusive indies like velocity, resogun, etc. My point was the quantity is nowhere near the same.

To your edit: yeah, it's not a healthy platform financially, I agree.

Do we have any vague idea of the numbers? Because I buy lots of indie games on 3DS, there's no shortage of them even if Vita out-indies 3DS.

 

[Lexxism]

Splatoon for $70? WTF Canada.

It's actually cheaper if you convert it to USD. 56 USD. Yeah, our dollar sucks.

 

[Prelude.]

The clarification should be added to the OP, btw.

Vita has better third party support than 3DS? are you serious?
Even Yoshida acknowledges that it has been difficult for them to attract third party publishers.

Yoshida's talking about worlwide, which is true, no one in the west cares about making handheld games and that's what their PSP/Vita "strategy" consisted of. Making portable console-like experiences.

He's probably talking about quantity. There's quite a Japanese 3rd party for PSV but most of the quality 3rd party are on 3DS.

Nah, it's just your opinion. I think the 3ds' library can't hold a candle to the Vita's, honestly. But, hey, it's my opinion, it's not facts.

Vita's 3rd party support is rather "anime girl face". It's no wonder people into visual novels and very minor JRPGs like it, but to say Vita is a healthy platform is a stretch.

It's not successful in the way that Sony wants to but it is healthy for western publishers.
If it wasn't healthy we wouldn't see so many localizations, they're clearly making a profit.
If you check the amount of games the PSP got from publishers like NISA or Aksys in like, what, 10 years, you'd see that the Vita so far has got around the same or even more games in just 3.

 

[……forgetit]

It's actually cheaper if you convert it to USD. 56 USD. Yeah, our dollar sucks.

Ah, welp have fun with that Canada.

 

[ArtHands]

I think generally people don't really care about indies, since they can always get them on any platforms they already have like PC or PS3.

 

[Lexxism]

Ah, welp have fun with that Canada.

Yeah, it really sucks. Good thing we had an E3 deal last year and got the game for $45 (36 USD). Seeing how it's getting worst for us, I don't know if we ever see this deal again this year

 

[……forgetit]

Yeah, it really sucks. Good thing we had an E3 deal last year and got the game for $45 (36 USD). Seeing how it's getting worst for us, I don't know if we ever see this deal again this year

That's insanely good, but no time for a thread derailment. Yeah, Vita is dead in the west, it's sad, ect, ect.

 

[……forgetit]

The clarification should be added to the OP, btw.

Why? Most are rightfully calling it BS PR speak.

 

[shark sandwich]

"We screwed up to begin with, so lets position our product so that it fails some more."

Responding to perceived or real failure by setting your product up so that it fails some more has never been a good business strategy. But it's been Sony's MO with the PSP and Vita in regards to western markets. It's devastating too, because the Vita is an impressive set of hardware despite it's flaws.

Sometimes the best thing to do is put a product out of its misery. Better than throwing good money after bad.

E.g. first thing Steve Jobs did when he returned to Apple was cancel the Newton.

 

[zroid]

quite a bummer to hear it from the House's mouth like this

 

[Y2Kev]

It certainly didn't help. The target demo for the system is (was?) core gamers and Vita's dated memory solution has been a key issue for that group. It's not the 1990s anymore.

Sure, it didn't help. But the Vita's price being $250 and not $300 also helped. It's not a major reason why the Vita was not successful or that the Vita was not able to penetrate the larger core market that buys console and PC hardware.

I don't think core gamers care what year it is. They are very price inelastic. The problem is not the core. The PS3 sold to like 5 million core gamers at $600.

 

[Man God]

Mobile devices are moving too fast, Vita is 3.5 years old by now. 3DS has also been legacy for a while now.

I'm absolutely ok with asian, indies and cross platform games.

Uh yeah damage control is a must when there's misinformation running wild. Andrew House should have picked his words more carefully. Frankly I thought it was a weird statement initially since there's like 300+ inbound vita games. The logic of his statement made no sense

Nintendo has one or two games left in the 3DS pipeline that will likely outsell those 300 games combined.

 

[IvorB]

Sony has supported the vita with the market that actually bought the device exceptionally well. It has created a port studio just to port shit that annoying and obsessive people like to the platform, like borderlands 2, one of the worst games ever created.

"Relative success" of other platforms? Yeah I mean compared to Nintendo, who is dealing with a catastrophic erosion of a core pillar of their business and is much better equipped to handle the audience that remains (kids and manbabby), Sony mismanaged vita. But there was never another alternative.

What did you expect of Sony? To throw money after the dead platform in the U.S. Because of loyalty to consumers? I don't know what people expected. They shifted focus and have supported it really well IMO. It's virtual boy tier in the U.S. But still has a vibrant store and Japanese game community.

I don't really know how mismanagement is ever the right alternative in any situation. Whatever your thoughts on Nintendo's customers, those customers are still receiving software support and don't have their purchase written off as a "legacy platform". Even Sony knows that's not on, hence the attempted PR coverup. People expected better from Sony. And yes, I would have expected them to support their platform out of loyalty to their customers, beyond three years at least. Of course, now we all know better.

 

[Steel]

Do we have any vague idea of the numbers? Because I buy lots of indie games on 3DS, there's no shortage of them even if Vita out-indies 3DS.

There are a total of 65 indies on the 3ds. There are hundreds on the vita.

 

[Qwark]

Why? Most are rightfully calling it BS PR speak.

Because it's additional info. I agree that it should be added to the OP. It's clarification, whether it's PR or not, it's still another discussion point that many people don't know about it. That, and maybe random people will stop posting the link every couple pages.

 

[shinra-bansho]

I don't really know how mismanagement is ever the right alternative in any situation. Whatever your thoughts on Nintendo's customers, those customers are still receiving software support and don't have their purchase written off as a "legacy platform". Even Sony knows that's not on, hence the attempted PR coverup. People expected better from Sony. And yes, I would have expected them to support their platform out of loyalty to their customers, beyond three years at least. Of course, now we all know better.

Mismanagement would be investing significantly in a product that you're gradually deleting from your portfolio, in a market you intend to divest from entirely. That's cash better spent elsewhere.

Nintendo still intends to compete in some form for the home console segment [apparently]. They're also heavily dependent on a core fanbase market segment, and will still be going forward. Even given that, the Wii U isn't going to get much more than 3 years of major support from Nintendo post-launch; titles that are coming either aren't major endeavours or were in development prior to its failure.

 

[sörine]

There are a total of 65 indies on the 3ds. There are hundreds on the vita.

3DS has 865 games currently available in the US, I can assure you there are more than 65 indies in that. I own 41 indie games on 3DS and have far from a comprehensive collection.

 

[QaaQer]

Why is there a Nintendo v Sony pissing contest? Vita is dead and Ninty will need an act of god to save their hh business long term. Who cares how many indies are on vita v 3ds?

 

[Steel]

3DS has 865 games currently available in the US, I can assure you there are more than 65 indies in that. I own 41 indie games on 3DS and have far from a comprehensive collection.

My source is the 3ds indie category on the Eshop. I counted them. There are only 65 spread over 3 pages.

Edit: It's also worth noting: there are a total of 1015 games(natively, but not all localized) for the vita compared to the 3ds's 865(looking it up, that's not a U.S. number, that's a total number, not all localized) if you're going on a pure numbers comparison. And the 3ds has been out a year longer.

 

[ArtHands]

I don't really know how mismanagement is ever the right alternative in any situation. Whatever your thoughts on Nintendo's customers, those customers are still receiving software support and don't have their purchase written off as a "legacy platform". Even Sony knows that's not on, hence the attempted PR coverup. People expected better from Sony. And yes, I would have expected them to support their platform out of loyalty to their customers, beyond three years at least. Of course, now we all know better.

The PSPGo and the lack of BC on the Vita is more than enough for everyone to see that though imo.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

My source is the 3ds indie category on the Eshop. I counted them. There are only 65 spread over 3 pages.

Edit: It's also worth noting: there are a total of 1015 games(natively, but not all localized) for the vita compared to the 3ds's 865(looking it up, that's not a U.S. number, that's a total number, not all localized) if you're going on a pure numbers comparison. And the 3ds has been out a year longer.

Well, that's a really bad source surprisingly. That's only a fraction of the indie titles on 3DS. Nintendo has some work to do on improving the eShop's layout. The Virtual Console tab also only shows a small portion of VC games on the store.

 

[NolbertoS]

More indies don't count, I see.

I bought a Vita for the games and JRPGs. Not for indies. Some indies are fun like Guacamelee, but others suck. But in reality if you're using the Vita as ONLY an indie device, then its a big paper weight. Might as well bought an Nvidia Shield or Iphone for indie games. The Vita had the PSP's low sales curse as part of its stigma, so it didn't help the Vita either. After the PSP, Sony should've taken some years of R & D and properly create many new IP upon release and catered to the Iphone crowd too. Alot of coulda, shoulda, woulda's. Nintendo will remain the monopoly in the portable gaming.

 

[Game Guru]

To be fair, it does seem like Sony is trying to get Japanese developers still on the PS3 & Vita on board with making PS4 games. I mean, I've joked about this, but clearly if there is a Japanese game announced for PS4 at the moment, you can pretty much bet it will have a Western release. And it seems like a good majority of Japanese developers on the PS3 & Vita are making PS4 releases specifically because that console sells outside of Japan while PS3 and Vita are dead. I actually believe that Namco Bandai, Square Enix, and Koei Tecmo are actually going to benefit as big Japanese game companies supporting the PS4 relatively early on, mostly because of the West.

 

[sörine]

My source is the 3ds indie category on the Eshop. I counted them. There are only 65 spread over 3 pages.

Edit: It's also worth noting: there are a total of 1015 games(natively, but not all localized) for the vita compared to the 3ds's 865(looking it up, that's not a U.S. number, that's a total number, not all localized) if you're going on a pure numbers comparison. And the 3ds has been out a year longer.

Sorry, it's 863 3DS games, not 865. And that is US releases not worldwide, but also includes 153 VC games so it's 710 native 3DS games.

For comparison Vita has 367 native releases in the US, not including PS mobile, Classics or PSP. Both these counts come from PlayStation's and Nintendo's US sites.

 

[Steel]

Well, that's a really bad source surprisingly. That's only a fraction of the indie titles on 3DS. Nintendo has some work to do on improving the eShop's layout. The Virtual Console tab also only shows a small portion of VC games on the store.

That's... Really terrible. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised considering it's the Eshop, but still.

I bought a Vita for the games and JRPGs. Not for indies. Some indies are fun like Guacamelee, but others suck. But in reality if you're using the Vita as ONLY an indie device, then its a big paper weight. Might as well bought an Nvidia Shield or Iphone for indie games. The Vita had the PSP's low sales curse as part of its stigma, so it didn't help the Vita either. After the PSP, Sony should've taken some years of R & D and properly create many new IP upon release and catered to the Iphone crowd too. Alot of coulda, shoulda, woulda's. Nintendo will remain the monopoly in the portable gaming.

There's some real bad revisionist history with the psp going on here. It sold 17 million in the U.S. alone out of a total of 80 million units. The PSP didn't beat the DS, but it was still one of the best selling portables of all time.