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Street Fighter V is getting thrashed by the Steam reviews
- Thread starter Exile20
- Start date
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2016/02/18/capcom-looking-into-adding-arcade-mode-for-street-fighter-v/#38e425b3419a
I'm not sure how reliable a Forbes contributor is in this instance but there you go. If they are going to bother to add an Arcade mode I'm sure Vs. CPU will be coming with it.
I'm not sure how reliable a Forbes contributor is in this instance but there you go. If they are going to bother to add an Arcade mode I'm sure Vs. CPU will be coming with it.
Gunslinger
Member
The harsh truth is they are not interested in actually learning the game IMO. Same with MK most who buy play story mode once or twice, go online get bodied one or two times and move on to the next big game. That's why MK have such a huge playerbase drop.
ALBOFIGHTER
Member
I doubt Xbox owners even care about exclusivity when most of them got the pc version.
Game got bad reviews because of the issues and lack of content. It's that simple.
Game got bad reviews because of the issues and lack of content. It's that simple.
Nah a lot of people just made the assumption that the classic FG features that's universal with all fighting games would be in. They are fair to judge and criticize SF in this instance.
It's not just exclusive to MK, a lot of fighting game playerbases do that. It'll happen to Street Fighter too. No one 'really' wants to play fighting games. Why waste time gettting ebtter in one game when you can play an RPG or some shit
Sword Of Doom
Member
But without those players these games would
Not exist cause the FGC alone is not enough
Tatsumaki Senpuukyaku!
Member
I haven't bought the game. I am disappointed Capcom released an unfinished game. I could tell from reading the previews that they were rushing it out before it was ready. The fact that they were upfront about releasing an unfinished game does not absolve them from releasing an unfinished game.
Pathfinder
Member
Right, because online communities are generally so accommodating and kind to new players.
DonasaurusRex
Online Ho Champ
i was really upset about the controller drivers...i mean come on
Yes, of course it is. Telling people in advance the game will be incomplete at launch, then launching an incomplete game doesnt magically make it incomplete. There's also the fact that no amount of research would have told you that there was no arcade mode, or that your licenced arcade stick wouldnt work with the game, or so on.
And the game does such an excellent job of trying with its in depth tutorial that mirrors the best of Skullgirls, Guilty Gear XRD, VF 4, etc. and with its robust and complete in-game movelist that tells you the properties of moves and what, for example, your characters V-TRIGGER does. Wait, whats that? The game has none of that stuff? No wonder its so hard to teach people how to play it.
princemarth23
Member
You know you can play against the AI in training mode right? Or survival?
Hope this is true. Like I have said, it can't be too hard to add.
Look at all the modes in this game. Jesus.
Goodness. I would kill for a new World Tour mode.
Online play has become a crutch for a lot of companies. Offer less and less and just say "This is designed for online...blah blah"
Man, I have more to do in Nitroplus Blasterz+ than I do in Street Fighter Fucking Five.
OrbitalBeard
Member
Thanks for posting this. Glad to know Capcom is listening to feedback.
I think Capcom's approach with Street Fighter V was to do the MOBA model but they were too afraid to go whole hog. I figure they will eventually, though, a few years down the line. SFV will be F2P and, if that's successful, SFVI will likely never have a retail release.
You get the resources and advice, it's up to YOU to get better. Don't expect to be a better player overnight.
There's a great FG thread for newcomers and the SF OT has been commendable in helping. Even SRK which has been a shithole for years has gotten better. Dustloop, Skullheart, the FG discord groups, twitter -- ALL excellent resources for newcomers.
We WANT to cultivate and grow our scenes, both online and offline. Get rid of your stigma and you could probably see that.
Because not everybody obsessively follows every bit of information about every upcoming game. I don't think it was unreasonable for me to buy this game mostly blind, expecting at least as many features as I got in vanilla SFIV seven years ago.
It depends on the community. I think the FGC is pretty good at accommodating new players because they realize they're fairly small in the eSports scheme of things so bringing in new blood is ultimately good for the health of their community. It's the MOBAs that have the bad rap for being extremely difficult into because people don't want to be paired up with new players.
Fighting games don't have that fundamental problem. You have no team to let down because it's one on one. If you're bad your just a free win for the other guy. And generally, the toxic comment level from online fighting games is dramatically lower than any FPS just because no one really speaks during matches.
Sometimes in character action games my favorite fights aren't against the giant boss monsters but against those characters with similar skills to the protagonist(e.g Jeanne in Bayonetta), which really is much like an AI fighting game opponent.
If this is true, then complaining making our voices heard has made a difference. So all the people telling us to shut up because we're not an important enough demographic will have been proved wrong. But yeah forbes contributor so I'll wait and see on that one.
Gunslinger
Member
I agree and you are right for financial success you need those people.
People are too lazy. They tend to make excuses about how little time they have as well, when it doesn't take that much of an effort to simply learn how to play.
family_guy
Member
The game isn't interested in teaching you either. Thanks for the 2 minute tutorial. Anyway I wouldn't use lack of online players to indicate people aren't interested in learning. Some just don't want to play online. Others just don't like the lag and connection problems that have plagued games like MK and by the sounds of it, this game isn't making a great case for online either.
If you grew up not having anyone to play against or only playing vs the computer in arcades so you don't get kicked off the machine in one match, then perhaps you might better understand how some people are upset their default go-to mode is missing for the first time.
the SFV OT has been really great at helping those who need help. FGC Gaf in general is pretty dang good actually
Pathfinder
Member
That's the second time FGC has been mentioned on this page alone. Might be worth looking into once Capcom fleshes out the game a little more.
Look at all the modes in this game. Jesus.
Now I feel like an old man going "back in MY day, we had a TON of modes!"
... But we really did.
... And some of these aren't that old. Street Fighter V just, well... isn't competitive in this area.
Gunslinger
Member
Plenty of help to be had in this very website. Just ask and we will play together. We can teach you characters you are interested in that if you are really interested in learning the game instead of playing the casuals are frowned upon card.....
Yeah, those are my favorite too but I rarely find that fighting games actually do AI well. The difficulty comes from input reading and going into a canned combo every time they block a specific move. The only one I think excels at this, and excels at offering a great single player campaign in genreral, is Virtua Fighter 4: Evo. The AI had a wide variety of difficulty, learned from your habits, and even included AI based on top players in Japan. Fighting against a specific Kage actually felt like playing against a different player, instead of how in most fighting games all level 9 Ryus play the same.
I think the thing to take away from this is your voices matter if it's to implement features that would take very little work. I feel if this does come to pass people will be upset that the arcade mode doesn't have a unique final boss like SF2, 3, or 4 or there's no character endings. Those things take a lot of time and money.
yyyyup
I doubt it. I think it's mostly people who genuinely don't care about the missing features and just want to play new Street Fighter online. It just happens that an unfortunate number of those people are the same people that make the fighting game community disgusting and offputting for everybody else. It's their club and they don't want you there unless you want exactly what they do.
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
I think this is bullshit. Sure Im not going to compete in evo anytime soon, but ive been playing fighters longer than some of you have been alive. I just come from a generation that was satisified with playing a game to final boss and clocking it. I enjoyed the betas and even got into the 1600 club on the last one, but I dont really feel the need to push further. Its just not that serious to me.
I prefer single player modes because I want to get in, play a few rounds and then go do something else. I dont really like online gaming in general, the whole thing is far more time consuming.
I know I could hop online in SF5 and hold my own somewhat, but I generally dont want to. Its got nothing to do with "not wanting to learn the game".
Capcom had plenty of feedback from the moment the game was announced. Ono said the majority of feature requests he got wasn't for characters, stages or fighting mechanics, but was for single player content. And yet, as launch, publicised roadmap, and their response today shows, they never had any intention of including an arcade mode or basic single player features that every other fighting game included.
I'm very happy that it will get an arcade mode. That's where I spent the majority of my time in SFIV. But I am still struggling to comprehend the rational behind Capcom deciding to not include it in the released game. I can't believe that the critical mauling that SFV has received could have been a surprise to them. And yet it seems like they are surprised that people would want an arcade mode.
Zomba13
Member
But really, you guys are doing that on your own. Shit like "Oh, they don't really want to learn anyway" "Oh, they are just lazy", saying that stuff to valid complaints about modes that help people learn. Yes, Arcade modes don't help you beat Daigo. Tutorials won't teach you strats against Justin Wong but they do help you get comfortable with a character before going online and losing a bunch.
Yes, there are a lot of resources from the FGC about basics and combos and how best to play characters, the thread you made does a good job at pointing that out to people. But still, when you dismiss peoples complaints about modes that have in the past helped them get comfortable with the game and characters, that explain systems and mechanics, as them just being lazy or not wanting to learnt he game and just wanting to play a story it just gets annoying and builds upon the FGC being full of elitist anti-casual people.
why? the actual game mechanics are there for you to learn now!
This is like those people who'll claim to buy GG when their favorite character is in and they never buy it in the end :c
then SFV isn't for you ATM. Sucks that you didn't find out until it was too late...but IIRC you got a refund for it right?
But as is SFV doesn't have enough content for you...
Steve Youngblood
Member
Eh, I just think there's a difference in expectations. Honestly, I get it. If you're into the competitive fighting scene (competitive fighting being the main draw of these games), almost everything you need is functioning as you need it to. Yes, there's some issues with the servers right now, and the functionality that is there could also stand to be fleshed out some more. But the core product is there. You can play matches against other human beings and the engine is fine for a 1.0 release. There's a sizable audience that only needs that to deem this worthy of plopping down money for.
The problem is just that when you are targeting 2 million sales within the first 45 days of release, there are expectations that come with a AAA $60 product. And without any data to go off of, I'm not going to hazard a guess as to how the title will perform. But I think that the current release state is risky given that I think it comes woefully short of what I think the mass audience expects. And you need the mainstream markets to buy in with those kinds of sales targets.
I don't think they have any obligations to consumers to not release it as it. But as I said, I think it's a gamble to do it this way. Given that there are a myriad of different ways to market and release your game in this day and age, it's a bit surprising to me that it shipped to retail in this fashion.
DryEyeRelief
Member
No, they really don't care about the single player stuff. Some people would have bought the 4 character beta for 60.
It's just the need for single player makes it seem like everything else SFV delivered on isn't as important. If you pick up whatever single player game, you can enjoy it however way you want and it won't affect anyone. Play it for 20 minutes and return it to gamestop, or play it a million times and learn how to speedrun it, it doesn't matter. It's different for this type of game because fighting game community is a shared experience. If potential supporters/buyers of the game hate the game in its current form then it threatens that experience.
Pathfinder
Member
The game mechanics might be there for me to learn now, but the game itself isn't worth $60 to me without an Arcade Mode for offline practice.
I'm not trying to be difficult, but that is my basic expectation for a fighting game.
There would have been an executive decision at Capcom to rush out the game in its current state to ensure it would be part of their Pro Tour and Capcom Cups.
I have no idea how much of a money earner these tours would be for Capcom. I would assume they exist to drive interest in the underlying game, rather than the music industry where tours, not albums, are the real money makers. If the tours themselves aren't decent sources of revenue, then Capcom seem to have made a stupefyingly bad call. The end user reaction to the game from non-competitive player must hurt their sales significantly.
Steve Youngblood
Member
There are ways to release the game in Early Access that would have allowed the game to get into the hands of pros or aspiring pros. I really don't buy that it had to be released to retail to ensure the integrity of their pro tour. That might be part of it, sure. But the real issue seems to be that they were targeting 2 million sales before the end of the fiscal year on March 31. They certainly weren't going to hit that as a digitally exclusive Early Access release leading up to delayed retail launch.
DryEyeRelief
Member
that makes more sense
Ono said a lot of things... though I have no idea what was assumptions and what was mistranslated. Even major websites were reporting that there would be an Arcade mode, and it's obvious that was just a false assumption, even based on interviews with Ono.
Street Fighter began life in the Arcades. It's almost criminal it didn't launch with an Arcade mode.
Which is sad because they did the same for injustice like 1 month in. Hopefully injustice 2 last longer because I think the game itself is more fun to play than MK games.
Shpeshal Nick
aka Collingwood
I think one of the more concerning things about the state of the game is that this is what we're getting WITH Sony's "funding". I mean, did Capcom tip anything in at all?
Steve Youngblood
Member
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
It still amazes me how Alpha 3 max did not become the standard for SF.
Dramatic battle and reverse Dramatic battle are amazing, even now.
Let's see if this helps.
It's the type of player whose first game ever was Street Fighter II. The type of player who eventually went to arcades and got in a line behind folks to see if they can beat the game on a single quarter.
It's the type of player that grew up in a time when online wasn't a thing and primarily played on console by himself when his brothers or friends weren't around/available. The same type of player who went onto play 900+ hours of mulitplayer in Street Fighter IV after first investing a significant amount of time into arcade mode with every single character and do all the character trials (and enjoying every second of it).
The type of player that has seen every variation of modes in street fighter games over the years with Arcade and Versus being a given in every entry.
The type of player who grew to appreciate every single piece of content capcom put in their past fighting games because they're his favorite kinds of games. That's the type of player who values single player mode like arcade so highly in a fighting game like Street Fighter and is now extremely disappointed with Capcom for such an oversight and bad communication in regards to the single player modes available at launch.
Capcom said they were going to the bare minimum, but the bare minimum should've included Arcade mode. I can completely understand the people saying they've been tricked, and they want their money back. Capcom didn't communicate this properly. This is a game that is going to have things added later, but the fact that there is no arcade mode or proper vs AI at launch is just ridiculous, now I don't know if that forbes article is true or not, but it makes it sound like they previously had no plans to include an arcade mode in the first place.
Also, if you want to know why survival is not the same as arcade, two words. Unnecessary frustration. Here's an example, I can go through arcade, and if I lose I can continue right from the opponent who I lost to. I don't have to go through everyone I just defeated earlier.
Survival on the other hand, you can play perfectly for 29 matches in a row, get to the 30th and final round (final round on normal that is) without a scratch on you, and if you lose, not only do you not get any partial rewards, you have to go through those 29 matches all over again, no matter how boring or easy they were, wasting 20-30 minutes to get back to the only opponent you had trouble with.