MassiveNights
Banned
OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯\_(ツ
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A polite discourse amongst friends on the importance of MP-elements in No Man's Sky
- Thread starter flkraven
- Start date
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I bought the game because of this controversy - I just had to know what the fuck the game even is to be able to process what people are arguing about. (And I never would have learned as much about the game as I did because of this thread.) It's kind of terrible that I rewarded poor dev behaviour with a sale, but that's how it ended up.
Anyway, I've played for two hours and man, I love the hell out of it so far. It's absolutely incredible, even if some of the seams are already starting to show and I'm already dreaming of a sequel that improves the algorithm and makes certain changes. But I love it, and am sure I'll get my money's worth.
But now I have a better handle on what it means to consider whether or not it matters that you could possibly (but very probably never) run into another person. And I think the idea that a million other players are out there, light years away... that's important to selling the scale of the game and giving you that overwhelming 'I'm an insignificant ant' feeling.
BUT... since the universe is the same for everyone (don't ask me how that works, I cannot understand it) that sensation is still present, just diminished. The idea that someone can stand where I stood, see things I've seen, that I might follow in the footsteps of others and know that I am when I see their named discoveries... it's a good fallback. And it's 99.9% likely to be the same experience I would have had if the MP feature WAS in. But potentially seeing another player would really give the journey that bit more spice.
So it's not game-changing by any measure, it's really not. There are multiple features I'd rather see them focus on before tackling this, put it that way.
But that's not the point, I suppose. The point is that the devs appear to have been deliberately vague and misleading and that's 100% not okay. Sean absolutely deserves to be raked through the coals for this. It's just sad that this entirely self-made controversy has overshadowed the launch of a really amazing achievement in gaming.
Anyway, I've played for two hours and man, I love the hell out of it so far. It's absolutely incredible, even if some of the seams are already starting to show and I'm already dreaming of a sequel that improves the algorithm and makes certain changes. But I love it, and am sure I'll get my money's worth.
But now I have a better handle on what it means to consider whether or not it matters that you could possibly (but very probably never) run into another person. And I think the idea that a million other players are out there, light years away... that's important to selling the scale of the game and giving you that overwhelming 'I'm an insignificant ant' feeling.
BUT... since the universe is the same for everyone (don't ask me how that works, I cannot understand it) that sensation is still present, just diminished. The idea that someone can stand where I stood, see things I've seen, that I might follow in the footsteps of others and know that I am when I see their named discoveries... it's a good fallback. And it's 99.9% likely to be the same experience I would have had if the MP feature WAS in. But potentially seeing another player would really give the journey that bit more spice.
So it's not game-changing by any measure, it's really not. There are multiple features I'd rather see them focus on before tackling this, put it that way.
But that's not the point, I suppose. The point is that the devs appear to have been deliberately vague and misleading and that's 100% not okay. Sean absolutely deserves to be raked through the coals for this. It's just sad that this entirely self-made controversy has overshadowed the launch of a really amazing achievement in gaming.
OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯\_(ツ
They were in the third and the fourth test.
OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯\_(ツ
Sure man. Keep grasping at straws.
MassiveNights
Banned
The first three they definitely weren't. When was the fourth?
SaganIsGOAT
Junior Member
OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯_(ツ
Saving for posterity
Uiki
Member
OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯\_(ツ
Not this again
InfiniteUnrest
Member
5 quintillion planets, which if you subdivided among 10 billion players (reality is maybe a few million, so further subdivide that by a magnitude of 1000-10000), would result in what, 500 million planets per player, in a game with no way to easily find each other even if you could see each other, and we're worried about whether there's multiplayer or not?
Honestly, I never intended to play this game with other people based on the math and insane unlikelihood of ever encountering someone. You might as well try to count out Avogadro's number during your life time if that was your intent.
Why would you even spend any development time whatsoever on such a feature if you're already encountering scope creep considering how unlikely of a scenario this is, and considering the procedurally generative nature of the game where no two people would see the same exact thing even if they were in the same location?
Honestly, I never intended to play this game with other people based on the math and insane unlikelihood of ever encountering someone. You might as well try to count out Avogadro's number during your life time if that was your intent.
Why would you even spend any development time whatsoever on such a feature if you're already encountering scope creep considering how unlikely of a scenario this is, and considering the procedurally generative nature of the game where no two people would see the same exact thing even if they were in the same location?
MassiveNights
Banned
No grasping at straws, I am in the "I wish we had more clarification/nothing can be said with certainty" camp.
Not even close, but at least you got to feel cool by repeating the same silly putdown a dozen other people already made.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-05-12-lionhead-the-inside-story
ClosingADoor
Member
Except they did that later.OP updates OP "for clarity" but fails to mention Twitch streamers were not connecting to servers at same time regardless of NAT or PS+. ¯_(ツ
I don't have a horse in this race, but at some point you have to accept that the simplest explanation is probably the true one: there is no MP.
Spring-Loaded
Member
Mengy
wishes it were bannable to say mean things about Marvel
Agreed 1000%. The game still looks very good, it just sucks that he mislead people for a very long time. This is a controversy that could have been easily avoided by simply being up front and truthful with the customers, but now the vagueness has become more important than the game itself. Terribly easy to avoid, I dont know why HG doesnt just come out and clarify it in black and white once and for all. This kind of publicity is hurting them, not helping them.
Like I said, once they get those first week sales we will get a comment.
RichiRamjag
Member
Once that wears off, they'll be calling him Derek Smart!
DOWN
Banned
Even Journey level multiplayer would be fine. He said we could see our friends and we can't.
MassiveNights
Banned
When was their last stream? I would like to see that, I have been trying to follow their progress.
My only horse in this race is "I want to find out for sure".
NAT type doesn't even matter when we know that the game just doesn't send MP info to servers other than discoveries.
I can't really discuss this unless you don't want to get spoiled, but when you begin the game there is actually less planets than 18 quintillion that are available to you. Also considering the structure of the Galaxy, starter planets would only be a small fraction of all planets.
Regardless, people can just meet up. Even in their patch notes they mention tools for enabling people to know if there are other players nearby. And there are many posts on Reddit about people discovering planets marked by other players very close to their starting planet.
The scale of this game seems to be vastly exaggerated, at least in terms of your starting location in the game.
TheVoidDragon
Member
Maybe people are upset because they said many, many times that you would be able to encounter other players in the game, not just because there isn't actually multiplayer (or so it seems).
I've seen the "why would they even develop it?" defense used so many times now. They should include it in the game because they said they would. That's why it's a problem; they said they would many times, but it doesn't seem to actually be there.
RichiRamjag
Member
Journey was random instanced multiplayer. That doesn't equate to meeting with friends. The guy has said a ton of contradicting shit regarding the game and usually went a bit more in-depth on how it wouldn't work.
He was a knucklehead for never giving a clear statement, but you all were fooling yourselves if at any point you thought you were going to be flying around with your mates. He talks about for like two minutes in that interview linked above.
And we can find ten over videos where he says it wasn't possible. Maybe I'm just a pessimist, but I wasn't betting my hopes and dreams on such mixed messaging.
I think he's wrong for being unclear, but I never thought it was going to be in from what I saw during development. Showing me a video after the fact doesn't change that.
He is not talking about NAT, he is talking about them being connected to the No Man's Sky servers, which it said they were when both of them were in the exact same spot standing next to some Heridium and looking at the sea.
Zomba13
Member
People either don't understand plain English, are wilfully ignorant or just pop in to say "well, he never said it had multiplayer" because they are the same people who said "but what do you do!?" because they can't fucking understand him because he's a cute, shy little Englishman.
GinoFelino
Member
Thanks for trying to break this particular Bullshit Loop..
Saint of Killers
Member
Speaking of which! I would love to know what people think of the theory below. (I have no idea how any of this works.)
I sincerely hope all you who haven't bought the game yet are holding onto your money until Murray finds his balls and gives us an explanation. People who are pre-ordering and buying game despite this vague nonsense are basically sending the message 'This is OK. Jerking us around like this is OK, games industry.'
MMaRsu
Banned
Yeah I guess he did expect it! I mean he is obviously furious that he has been "misled" and "lied to".
If only you could see other people this game would be so much better!!
/s.
People really need to stop bitching and have fun playing the game. Its a one of a kind experience I can tell ypu that much.
MassiveNights
Banned
Cool, I must have missed this update.
I just saw they are trying again tonight, they seem to think the servers are still unstable
I am enjoying the love story. This is some Desmond shit.
GinoFelino
Member
I'm actually WAY more peeved about the Limited Edition having a static PS4 theme despite advertising it with a dynamic theme in the pre-order information.
That's actual lying in actual advertisements.
You're right, who cares if you're lied to as long as the game's good!
Oh wait, some of us have standards.
MMaRsu
Banned
You are preordering on the bases of vague implications that if it did happen that two people were able to meet up, they could see eachother?
This is why people have preordered? Who are these people? Can we get a show of hands here? Some of yall seem delusional and honstly getting a little crazy in here.
This game is a beautiful experience. I dont need anyone to stand beside me to know this.
UncleSporky
Member
It's a math thing. You feed a number into a series of complicated functions and it spits out a planet, or series of planets, or a universe.
Computers don't actually generate random numbers, they can only be mostly random at best. And there's the concept of the "seed" upon which all other random numbers are based after you choose one. Every time you boot up the game, seed 25, which means when you roll the dice the next rolls will be 4, 1, 1, 2, 6, 4, in that order etc. Most games pick a random seed when they start up, based on the current time in milliseconds on the user's computer. But you can just as easily use the same seed every time to ensure that every player has the same experience.
Pop
Member
I think you need to go back and listen carefully. He said traces of other people, meaning discoveries. Naming of animals, planets etc. All said in that short clip. He also said you cannot see other players right at the 4 min mark.
Even people in the YouTube comments can understand what Murray was saying. C'mon now
I don't own and won't until we have multiplayer.......so, I'll keep bitching until Sean gives us a clear fucking answer instead of beating us around with bullshit. I knew this game was a wait and see......glad I did.
MMaRsu
Banned
Haha great fucking argument. Stay mad and salty as fuck over NOTHING then.
Sean and Hello Games explicitly said on many occasions : THIS IS NOT A MULTIPLAYER GAME.
Gamezone
Gold Member
Actually the game isn't really that good. And not nearly good enough to defend lies.
https://www.twitch.tv/psytokat/v/82817804
In this video from yesterday at 5:50 both players are in the exact same spot.
He is online connected to the servers. Both of them are, I was there live watching this, with both streams in multicast.
In this video from yesterday at 5:50 both players are in the exact same spot.
He is online connected to the servers. Both of them are, I was there live watching this, with both streams in multicast.
I've keep up with maybe 60% of all the info since this game was announced. Didn't watch any of the dev video or Sean's commentary.
I knew that going into this game and purchasing it, that it might be possible to meet other players based on the things Hello Game told us. But I didn't expect to be able to cause of the size of the game.
My friend and I purchased this game, we were talking about how cool would if be if we can meet up, but we are not expecting to.
Some people are bending over backward, talking about suing and ending Hello Game because of this is pretty ridiculous. Its not like it's Destiny where they explicitly stated to can team up with your friends, play together. They just say, its a possibility.
If they want to include that feature in the future update, awesome. If not then I'm fine with exploring the universe alone.
Pokemon Go is even more broken than this game by a country mile, missing features that were promised at launch and feature that are taken away cause they don't work. This seem insignificant compared to it.
I knew that going into this game and purchasing it, that it might be possible to meet other players based on the things Hello Game told us. But I didn't expect to be able to cause of the size of the game.
My friend and I purchased this game, we were talking about how cool would if be if we can meet up, but we are not expecting to.
Some people are bending over backward, talking about suing and ending Hello Game because of this is pretty ridiculous. Its not like it's Destiny where they explicitly stated to can team up with your friends, play together. They just say, its a possibility.
If they want to include that feature in the future update, awesome. If not then I'm fine with exploring the universe alone.
Pokemon Go is even more broken than this game by a country mile, missing features that were promised at launch and feature that are taken away cause they don't work. This seem insignificant compared to it.
ClosingADoor
Member
One can enjoy a game and still ask for the developer to be more clear about the features in the game. It's truly strange that a feature talked about multiple times before launch can not be confirmed or denied to be in the actual game after it has launched now.
If that is on purpose to avoid controversy and maybe lower sales for the PC version that is just shady behavior and should be condemned.
He also stated on many occasion you could run into other people.
This is a much better YouTube video to reference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVrDaudzn64
Not only does it showcase many, many more times where Sean said definitively that there is multiplayer, but around 10 seconds in he even refers to cooperation with other players as necessary - an unequivocal statement that means multiplayer was initially touted as being far more integral to the game.
And then the video contrasts with Sean's statement on the day before release "clarifying" that this is a single player game in what is clearly a severe backtrack from his previous statements.
There is no way to spin this as not lying, try as hard as you might.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVrDaudzn64
Not only does it showcase many, many more times where Sean said definitively that there is multiplayer, but around 10 seconds in he even refers to cooperation with other players as necessary - an unequivocal statement that means multiplayer was initially touted as being far more integral to the game.
And then the video contrasts with Sean's statement on the day before release "clarifying" that this is a single player game in what is clearly a severe backtrack from his previous statements.
There is no way to spin this as not lying, try as hard as you might.
MMaRsu
Banned
Here let me spell it out for you again then so you can play otger games you actually enjoy instead of trying to turn a game into something that its not and getting angry over it.
NO MAN SKY IS NOT A MULTIPLAYER GAME. IT WILL NEVER BE ONE.
Holy shit some of yall are seriously crazy. Wtf is wrong with some of you? Yall dont even have the game and all you do is bitch bitch bitch, you havent even experienced how amazing this game is.
Go play a damn game or something instead of making up shit about "THEY LIED TO US" Yall sound like some babies.
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