Insane Metal
Gold Member
Lol. Nice job ND.
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PS4 Pro: TLOU Remastered performs worse than base PS4....even at 1080P
- Thread starter psychotron
- Start date
No worries.
Really, all they need to do is add a mode that renders at 1080p with a solid 60fps, if possible, and I think any and all controversy would end.
Nachtfalke
Member
This.
Marty Chinn
Member
The funny thing to me about all this was before people were saying how easy and quick it's is to support the Pro. Some even played it off as just toggling a few things. That this is no drain on a developer at all. Now in this thread people are saying, man devs should really take the time to make sure everything works great. You can't have it both ways.
Stuggernaut
Grandma's Chippy
I honestly came in this thread expecting worse. the title made me think "wow must be really bad if it has a big thread"
After reading some stuff, and watching a few vids/screen caps, it seems more like drama than anything I should be concerned with.
"PS4 Pro: TLOU Remastered trades slight performance for higher resolution"
That would have been more accurate.
And yes, I consider even 10fps a slight hit....
I watched that entire DF video too, and the places it drops looks like it could be fixed, but even if it didn't it seems like I personally would never notice.
I will definitely have to try it out for myself though
After reading some stuff, and watching a few vids/screen caps, it seems more like drama than anything I should be concerned with.
"PS4 Pro: TLOU Remastered trades slight performance for higher resolution"
That would have been more accurate.
And yes, I consider even 10fps a slight hit....
I watched that entire DF video too, and the places it drops looks like it could be fixed, but even if it didn't it seems like I personally would never notice.
I will definitely have to try it out for myself though
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The frame-rate is fundamentally the same. Most people, and that includes a lot of developers, aren't that obsessive over maintaining a perfect match with the target.
Its a detail, and for many people the larger picture matters more. The reality is that the game plays perfectly fine at 30fps, and that being the case is it really that big a deal if over an hours worth of play the framerate averages at 55fps not 60?
EmeraldSwords
Banned
The more options , the better and honestly if more games stick to this format; I could see more people interested in the system.
Equanimity
Member
If your game is dropping frames at 1800p, maybe It's best to drop the resolution to 1440p for those extra frames so it's locked at 60.
Not a big deal. The only problem with the current wording of the thread is that people are reading the topic and then making drivebys like this one:
I honestly dono wtf is going on in this thread.
But I have a pro, and TLOU runs jaw-dropping amazing on the pro with the unlocked FPS.
Itr smoother, its pretty, and downright incredible.
I don't usually do or say this, but this is a terrible thread, and I dono what people are talking about.
50 FPS @ 1800 is incredible.
But I have a pro, and TLOU runs jaw-dropping amazing on the pro with the unlocked FPS.
Itr smoother, its pretty, and downright incredible.
I don't usually do or say this, but this is a terrible thread, and I dono what people are talking about.
50 FPS @ 1800 is incredible.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Well with downsampling you always get better IQ. Annoying it does introduce 1-3 fps stutters in a few titles tho.
93xfan
Banned
I agree. That should be a standard option. This is worrying.
They should at least do 1440p with a locked 60fps.
thelastword
Banned
A drop to 1440p is not required for a more consistent 60fps, if anything 1620p or 1800p checkerboarding will be more than fine. I'm thinking that 2160p checkerboarding will be just fine as well.......at solid 60fps...
1620p, checkerboarding 1800p and checkerboarding 2160p are all less resourceful than 1800p. The dips are not bad enough to warrant 1440p, if it needs it at all.
And please remember, this game is already rendering at native 4k at 30fps with the best shadows and it never dips, so at 4k native it has to be running much higher than 30....
It's already doing that at 4k native with no dips with the best shadows..Pachinko said:
Enigmatic Rainbow
Member
Just because you don't care, doesn't mean it shouldn't for others. They should of still had an option available to play at 1080p 60FPS.
The thing is that I figured is that the pro was directed at the people who care about this stuff, because the majority of buyers don't own a 4k tv and don't care about a downsampled pictures either
Reading some of these posts, it's no wonder Trump is going to be president.
thelastword
Banned
I'd say for a quick and dirty patch, it's pretty awesome what have here. I mean come on now, 3200*1800 native render at 50-60fps, average in between or closer to 60fps. Have you seen how good it looks? and it plays awesome too...
Also there is 4k native res at 30fps with the best shadows, never skips a beat, you downsample that and you're jelly if you're at 1080p. How can you turn that around and say this is going to need a whole lot more time to sort out some framerate issues at 60fps.
I get the feeling that people believe every game will run at locked 60fps on the Pro, but with the boost in resolution and in some games graphical settings, that will not be the case everytime. I agree in TLOU that it should be achieved, but just like people were willing to forgive CD PRoject Red for not doing a patch because of one major project and Gwent...ND is literally looking into TLOU2, UC4 DLC, Collection Pro Patch, UC4 Pro patch update etc...It's only one day after the launch tbh...
I'll take the higher resolution at 50-60fps coupled with better IQ and sharpness anyday, don't decrease resolution in the name of a few dips from 60....1440p will look way worse than 1800p.
People who want consistency can play at 30fps locked, like they've always maintained. Persons like me have the unlocked mode.
holygeesus
Banned
It's not one game though is it? I would sell my PS4 if I bought a Pro, so would want at least the base PS4 performance at 1080p.
So far, The Last of Us, Skyrim, Mantis Burn Racing and the latest Deus Ex, all suffer from the problem. If it was one title, then sure, mark it down as an anomaly but to have multiple titles show the same issues, is a worry for me.
I know all about 4K gaming, coming from doing so on a PC, and my priorities are in frame-rate first and foremost. Upping resolution for the sake of performance, is not for me, but I understand that is not an issue for others, but that is why I am delaying my purchase.
1080p/60fps should have been the target with this console IMO.
This sets a bad precedent.
In this case, it's not so bad, because it's a bit under 60, and it's ND, who will probably look into it.
But I can see this becoming a problem if this is ok with Sony. Say you have a 30FPS locked game made by a less stellar developer that drops lower on Pro than on the OG PS4. (Skyrim for example). At 30FPS, those frames start to matter a lot more. And you as a user have no way to opt for the standard experience.
This is certainly not why I bought a pro.
In this case, it's not so bad, because it's a bit under 60, and it's ND, who will probably look into it.
But I can see this becoming a problem if this is ok with Sony. Say you have a 30FPS locked game made by a less stellar developer that drops lower on Pro than on the OG PS4. (Skyrim for example). At 30FPS, those frames start to matter a lot more. And you as a user have no way to opt for the standard experience.
This is certainly not why I bought a pro.
TrojanBlade
Member
Ummmmm guys....I have my Pro unopened...should I return? Is Pro doomed?????
perfectsil
Member
You can't choose to run 1080p native on the Pro. That's an option some here are asking
Pretty much this. If devs can't be arsed optimizing properly for Pro, at least let me choose the base mode.
Enigmatic Rainbow
Member
If there's some case you're trying to prove, it's not by making posts like these.
I wonder if they could make a system level feature where you could manually select a game to run in base mode. Hitting options on a game in the main menu and another option there to toggle between base and pro.
Read up more closely, the game has two options just as it did originally on PS4. There's a 30fps lock which runs the game at native 4K with HQ shadows, and not selecting this runs the game at 1800p, regular shadows targeting 60fps.
Read up more closely, the game has two options just as it did originally on PS4. There's a 30fps lock which runs the game at native 4K with HQ shadows, and not selecting this runs the game at 1800p, regular shadows targeting 60fps.
Same here. Played over an hour and didn't notice any problems.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
I guess it's about the principle of things. ND didnt even bother using checkerboard rendering to run their flagship game at 4k. And didnt bother optimizing TLOU remaster.
I understand they dont have to do any of this but it just doesnt look good.
SSAA is a scary thing in the world of performance issues.
Also I see the comparison shots from OG PS4 and PS4 Pro for TLoU and they look damn near identical that makes me wonder why even bother?
SSAA can do wonders if it have textures at native res or higher otherwise you're trading in performance for edge smoothness.
Also I dunno... Infamous Second Son on OG PS4 has some amazing AA option used. Guess people quickly forget all the detail being shown off from before.
Also I see the comparison shots from OG PS4 and PS4 Pro for TLoU and they look damn near identical that makes me wonder why even bother?
SSAA can do wonders if it have textures at native res or higher otherwise you're trading in performance for edge smoothness.
Also I dunno... Infamous Second Son on OG PS4 has some amazing AA option used. Guess people quickly forget all the detail being shown off from before.
Too many people in here excusing things. Yes, the drops aren't ruining the game and making it unplayable, but it is performing worse in like for like scenarios. It's the principle of the matter. You expect better performance and better image quality/graphics on the better, more expensive machine, especially considering that is what's promised.
The problem is some games, instead of a straight improvement across the board, have taken a tradeoff of better IQ/graphics at the expense of performance. More importantly, it's a tradeoff that you have no choice of making, since in some of these cases the game has a set Pro mode and you can't elect to run it in the base mode.
If people just excuse this and willingly accept it, what happens if/when the comparatively minor drops in TLOU become a 30fps game dropping into the low 20's upper teens? I don't want this to become the precedent and expected situation for games on the Pro. I hope this is just transitional growing pains.
The problem is some games, instead of a straight improvement across the board, have taken a tradeoff of better IQ/graphics at the expense of performance. More importantly, it's a tradeoff that you have no choice of making, since in some of these cases the game has a set Pro mode and you can't elect to run it in the base mode.
If people just excuse this and willingly accept it, what happens if/when the comparatively minor drops in TLOU become a 30fps game dropping into the low 20's upper teens? I don't want this to become the precedent and expected situation for games on the Pro. I hope this is just transitional growing pains.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Caring about presentation and performance is not the same thing as putting frame-rate above all else as the critical metric.
The bottom line is that in this case the decision was made to prioritize image quality above stringent adherence to the target frame-rate. Which makes perfect sense to me given that the game is entirely playable at 30fps.
Resolution does not only reap benefits moving in a single unitary step from 1080p to 4K; there are distinct levels of improvement the closer you get to the upper bound. So harping on about sub-native resolutions and frame-rates that aren't absolutely locked to a particular refresh frequency seems really pedantic and pointless to me.
55fps avg. is better than 30fps. 1800p is better than 1080p. Why are these things "bad", why are people so hung up on having a "perfect" stat for a particular metric?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Gen.Grievous
Member
Not that weird, they have a game to sell. ND is busy with developing a big piece of DLC and probably has the focus on that instead of making comprehensive patches for older games.
Not sure if serious lol
You must not be very perceptive or sensitive to framerate fluctuations, but I hate any framerate drops below 60fps or 30fps, which results in perceptible stutter and inconsistent controller response that I immediately notice. These framerate issues in games are the most disappointing thing about the PS4 Pro.
Nachtfalke
Member
Because you can play the game at a higher framerate on the "old" or Slim PS4, but not at the PS4 Pro. A system much more powerful. Some people care about that stuff. Sure, it's a minor group in comparison and it could be easily fixed. That's what bumms some pople. The least you should expect from this machine is "normal" PS4 performance. In some way or another. It's also not good publicity in general for that core audience.
Always-honest
Banned
People? Mark Cerny.
Looking at Deus Ex dropping to 20FPS on the Pro where the PS4 holds a steady 30FPS is the scenario that people should be discussing. That's NOT acceptable.
Always-honest
Banned
Some really hope so.Ummmmm guys....I have my Pro unopened...should I return? Is Pro doomed?????
You'll be fine though
DF should stop spreading the message Sony "demands" games to run at the same or better framerate.
- They are guidelines, not demands.
- They are from leaked slides, months before console launch, not intended for consumers.
- Sony never publicly made a claim all games would run the same or better.
Now, they are perfectly okay to point out their observations, just stop twisting the narrative.
Seems to me it's not as easy and quick as was said. I mean that's what It seems. If it was, we wouldn't have this thread. Or is it something that need to be implemented earlier on in development? I don't know much about developing games so that's why I'm asking. Any developers here with thier take on things? Is that easy ? Etc....