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Why DmC's Dante is a Bad Character (Video)
- Thread starter HyperBitHero
- Start date
LightofRohan
Member
Don't bring reason to this.
But I'm finally watching the video. It's obnoxious as hell... it just sounds like the OP is really upset they are changing his favorite character and will pout about it no matter what. "Just...look at his face... it just makes me... grrr... I WANT TO PUNCH IT!" There is no logic/competence to any of this.
It's like if your gf broke up w/ you and is dating a new guy. Every thing about that guy just makes you rage inside. Even though he could actually be a really cool person, there's no way for you to see that w/ your blood curdling hatred fuming on the inside.
It's only going to get worse when the game actually releases. There's going to have to be two threads on GAF for the game or it would be impossible to discuss anything about it w/ out arguing. Even if the game comes out and is a literary masterpiece w/ dialogue that rivals Schindlers List and gameplay better than the deepest/richest action titles, it will be dissected and DESTROYED. So when the inevitable happens and it's just a "pretty good fun action game, w/ some campy dialogue but interesting premise", this forum will be a blood house.
dragonlife
Member
Agreed.
Like others have said, it would have been much better if a video of this kind came out after the full game released. As it is now, it's pretty much all hot air and yelling at clouds.
SlasherJPC
Banned
Yep definitely agree with this. It's a rant about a product that not out yet. Why not just judge every movie off a trailer and forget actually watching it? Sounds cool right.
electroshockwave
Member
So you've been posting in this thread since several pages back and you didn't even watch the video the thread is about until now?
"Someone's saying something bad about DmC, I better go blindly defend it!"
LightofRohan
Member
Yea I even stated that. I go blindly to defend it, while you guys go blindly to hate on it. It's a mutual relationship we got going
The way they rehash the same damn game over and over and over and make spin off after spin off just to suck out every last dollar w/ such a one toned boring character w/ a terrible design is embarrassing/despicable (*avatar quote*)
HyperBitHero
Member
But I never said anything like this. Never in the video did I complain that he's a bad character just because he's not the original Dante. The only time I even brought up Dante was to show how New Dante is trying and failing to be a common archetype, and using Dante as an example. I even say it's a bad thing that they're making him more like the original because it feels like shallow pandering, just look at the Devil Trigger part.
Him being Dante not important to me. If he was a good character, I'd have no problem with him. So, I don't know where you're getting this "really upset" assumption from.
But the goal of said trailers is to get us enticed enough to want to watch/play it. It's the marketer's job to convince me to want to even bother with their product. Sometimes a product sells itself, and sometimes people need more incentive to jump in. It's perfectly acceptable to debate this whole issue with the information we have now, because this is what they are showing us.
Ultimately they have a lot of work to do in order to convince fans of the series to give them a chance. If they wanted us to think about this differently, then they would take a different approach in their marketing. When there are so many things to spend money on, I'm simply not going to give them the benefit of the doubt when they are making such a drastic change to the character I like. I'm sure there are lots of people on both sides of the issue, though.
SlasherJPC
Banned
Well sadly this sorta viewpoint on this series would have happened no matter what. Hell even when Dead Rising 2 was announced, simply because it was another developer people were weary. I get it, your changing hands so to speak. I still just think people need to try something before they start judging it. As for trailers trying to sell a product, understandable but there have been bad trailers for good or descent things in the past as well. You won't see me condemning the game before I play it but you won't see me praising it either!
LightofRohan
Member
So, I'm suppose to believe you chose this character to make a video about -- due to him just being a poorly designed/written character? Perhaps I'd jump on board that assumption if this game was released and you were fairly able to make such a removed/distinct claim. But at this point, the majority of the hate has been superficial ramblings based off a few videos and your love for original Dante was border line romantic lust (in the video). So to say you are able to make an unbiased opinion is sort of mute at THIS particular time.
If this was just another Ninja Theory game, this video would not exist -- so to not correlate the hate for the new Dante w/ the love of the old Dante would be ignorant on my part.
Hell I agree w/ being hurt that a developer has "taken" one of your favorite franchises (I was upset when Rising was given away). But after a year of intense hate and ridiculous rationalizing of fears, it gets so tired. I'd just wish people could accept that their game is not going the way the would like it and just wait to pass judgement.
Shit, I even banned myself from DMC discussions for around 6 months. But I've played the demo a few times and really enjoyed it, it's disappointing I can never have a civil discussion about it ever.
Normally, I agree, but there's only so much money to go around. I buy a large number of games per year and I'm already wary of what I've seen, so I don't see the point in bothering with this game based on what they've shown me. That's not on me. It's their job to get us to want to buy. In the beginning, I was relatively open about what they were trying to do, but the more they've shown the less interested I've become. I have no real desire to see the character I liked turned into this. Maybe taken as the whole picture paints the character in a better light, but the trailers they've shown so far really don't convince me of that, and apparently others feel the same way. They were already against the 8-ball because they weren't the original developers, but their handling of the situation (as well as Capcom) didn't make it any better...at least for me.
You're right though, sometimes good movies/games/shows get bad trailers, but again, that's not our fault. It's someone's job to keep this from happening. Maybe some time in the future someone will give it a shot, or perhaps word of mouth will compensate for bad marketing. Either way, all they've done is convince me I can avoid it (at least in the near term). As a fan of the series, it's kind of sad.
HyperBitHero
Member
I do a lot of videos on characters, and I wanted to do a video on this character. This whole "lustful love" thing you think I have for Dante is without any merit, and just a way to try to invalidate my opinion in the most juvenile of ways.
SlasherJPC
Banned
Well I'm not saying to go out and buy the game, or that it will be worth your money! To each their own.Though lets just pretend for a minute this is just a new Ninja Theory game. No Devil May Cry ties. Just looking at it from a gameplay perspective and not with Devil May Cry tinted glasses or expectations of what characters should or shouldn't be. I've played the series since day one! Hell I got a copy two weeks early when I worked at Electronic Boutique so that I could sell and hype the pre-orders at my store. So I know the series and know it well. I was crushed with how different DMC 2 was. Loved 3 and was entertained but ultimately disappointed with DMC 4.
Does the new style bother me? Nope. Do I think it's going to be a terrible game compared to the other DMC? Nope. Am I excited to play a new entry in the series and see what a new company does with it. Yep! Will I be disappointed with what Ninja Theory ultimately brings to the table? I don't know, I can't say. What I can say is I find it funny that people just seem to forget that Capcom themselves made Dante a completely different character in DMC2 totally unlike he was in the first game. It was OK then though apparently? Who knows. I don't follow any of these "rules". I just like gaming and having fun. The new DMC looks to be just that and I refuse to put it under a magnifying glass of scrutiny before I play it.
I guess I don't understand why they should wait to pass judgement? Developer/Publisher decides to do something people don't like with a beloved franchise (be it movie/TV show/game) and the fan base should simply roll over and accept that? <shrug> I think there are far too many bad decisions in the world of entertainment (who the hell thought making a movie about Battleship?) that fans should voice their concern/displeasure about what someone does with what they like. Ultimately it will come down to the dollars/yen/euro, but these companies are trying to get our money for whatever product they're trying to sell. The danger of picking up something that people like and "re-imagining" it is that the fans of said series will not support that decision.
Of course, some people take it too far (on both sides), but that's the reality of it. Surely Capcom should have seen the folly in what they were attempting. Maybe some people on this forum don't care for/didn't like the original Dante, but there are lots of people who do and tampering with their image of the character was always going to be controversial. Like I said earlier, it's the same situation Nintendo got into with Samus. The Samus in Other M just seems too far removed from the way people envisioned the character. Getting people to jump on board was going to be a hard sell and they should have known that going in. They stuck to their guns in the end and Ninja Theory and Capcom seem to be doing the same, but they should also accept the consequences of this change and how it will impact the game they're trying to sell. I just feel like they're going to be bitter about it at the end of the day and they really shouldn't be. They made a relatively unpopular decision and they should suck it up and do better next time.
The way I look at it is that they're trying to appeal to fans of the series. Which means there will be scrutiny. If they didn't want that, then they would have given it a different name and not have had it tied to DMC at all...new world, new characters, same gameplay. It's like the most recent Syndicate game. They named it Syndicate to appeal to the fans of the original, yet it was nothing like the original. The game was setup for failure from the beginning. If they would have named it something different and marketed it as something completely different, maybe more people would have jumped on board and it would have sold better. At least in DmC's case they're at least in the same genre, but I know plenty of people who play DMC games to be Dante. They're more of a fan of the character than the game itself. The same goes for Mario, Half Life, Final Fantasy VII, etc. To be honest, I really enjoy the Shadow Hearts games, but I'm a huge fan of Yuri (the main character), the second game really had nothing to do with him, so I simply didn't buy it. I'm not going to buy a Shadow Hearts game that doesn't star Yuri. He's the main reason I started playing the game in the first place. If the characters we play in these games didn't matter, then why have them at all?
Because it makes sense. Unless you want to do some sort of prequel with him before the Temen-ni-Gru incident but then you'd get people going, "Where's Dante!?" Sometimes, you just got to let sleeping dogs sleep. They got a future with Nero imo. I don't like him as much as Dante but he is pretty much an open book of opportunities for future DMC games and he isn't nearly as disliked as Raiden was in MGS2 either.
rosaceadude2112
Member
Please do not discuss the developers' intent for the story/character as if you know what they are or that they matter.
SlasherJPC
Banned
That makes total sense, but if they were totally changing Dante to a prude, sophisticated, intelligent yet gentle character, I would understand. They are not. He still is a joker, sarcastic, seems to have an attitude. Sure it's a bit different in style, but it's not a complete character changer which people are acting like it is.
As for Shadow Hearts, awesome series but I think your referring to part 3. 1 and 2 starred Yuri.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
the game isn't even out. this is embarrassing.
Yeah. I meant 3. Heh, getting ready for work, so that got by me.
Well, for me, Dante is just too over the top. Sure, he was over the top before, but in a different way. We have him telling people "fuck off" and all that jazz and that just isn't the character we knew. I'm not a prude or anything, but I liked how the old Dante was smug about things without resorting to swearing and the like. I always got the impression that Dante himself was a nice guy. This guy just seems to be too much of a bastard to really like and that turns me off. There's just too much of that sort of thing all around these days.
Joseph Flemming
Member
Devil May Cry- Dante is a smart Ass one liner guy doing good.
Devil May Cry 3- Pizza eating pool playing, sarcastic jerk until he finds himself. And a little big mentally unstable with his random goofiness.
DMC4- Older Wiser, seasoned Demon Hunting Rouge with a heart of gold. Still cracks jokes, more restrained though, smother, more lighthearted. Confident, less overtly cocky. Part Cowboy, part Han Solo, part Antonio Bendearas "El"
All of these Dante's are over the top, my eyes rolled a plenty while playing DMC3, but by the end of the game, he grew up.. Grew to DMC1 Dante... Watch the same will happen here.
Devil May Cry 3- Pizza eating pool playing, sarcastic jerk until he finds himself. And a little big mentally unstable with his random goofiness.
DMC4- Older Wiser, seasoned Demon Hunting Rouge with a heart of gold. Still cracks jokes, more restrained though, smother, more lighthearted. Confident, less overtly cocky. Part Cowboy, part Han Solo, part Antonio Bendearas "El"
All of these Dante's are over the top, my eyes rolled a plenty while playing DMC3, but by the end of the game, he grew up.. Grew to DMC1 Dante... Watch the same will happen here.
It's not the same continuity, so no, it isn't a prequel. Original Dante and DmC Dante are literally two completely different characters (the former is half-demon, half-human, while the latter isn't even human at all, instead being half-demon, half-angel).
With Capcom claiming that it's possible for them to potentially continue DmC if successful, yet also bring back the main series, the question remains if there's any truth to what they say.
WrenchNinja
Member
I wonder if people went as nuts about this as they did with Battle Network.
HyperBitHero
Member
That's pretty common for YouTube comments.
So you're saying that people who don't like the character should just accept it because that's just the way it is? I don't care if he is a spin-off Dante. Right now I think he is a bad character and nobody has to wait until release to have an opinion. This is especially true for trying gauge a character we have been shown so much of.
KingItachi
Member
He can because Tameem started shit talking Dante and complaining how about how Japanesy Bayonetta is.
You have a right to an opinion based on the information released thus far. We have a right to laugh at you.
Continuity
Member
Watching 3D action games die in general is the worst thing to happen this gen for me, SAVE US REVENGEANCE
Tony Redgrave
Member
I don't really get it, DmC Dante seems pretty much DMC3 with a little less hyperactive but slightly more aggressive personality, with a different hair color/cut and a shirt on.
He is supposed to be and overpowered angry teenager, not a cool wise guy, neither is he supposed to be a carbon copy of OG Dante, because you know, that's the point of the reboot.
He is supposed to be and overpowered angry teenager, not a cool wise guy, neither is he supposed to be a carbon copy of OG Dante, because you know, that's the point of the reboot.
Continuity
Member
Because different = bad, forever
megamerican
Member
So Capcom made a really safe, by the numbers HD version of DmC in 4 and people complained that it was getting stale.
So they hire a new studio that has an interesting track record, known for their quality story and characters, who try and change things up. And I'll admit that Ninja Theory is not known for their quality marketing, but I will at least give them the benefit of the doubt before screaming betrayal.
So they hire a new studio that has an interesting track record, known for their quality story and characters, who try and change things up. And I'll admit that Ninja Theory is not known for their quality marketing, but I will at least give them the benefit of the doubt before screaming betrayal.
This video is fucking embarrassing. Dante was always an obnoxious asshole, especially in DMC3. Maybe not so much in 4, but he's older there, and Nero took the obnoxious role. I really don't see how this Dante is any worse, and why blame so much of it on Ninja Theory? This video makes it sound like Ninja Theory spat on the holy altar of DMC, and must be killed for it. They've spent years making this game, and they've changed a lot of their original vision to appease the fans. It's amazing, but this whole damn thing could have been avoided if Dante just had white hair and a somewhat redder jacket, lol.
I once joined the army and saved the world when i was 13
*edit* Oh wait, it might have been my clone. Or am i the clone? I forget.
He didn't mention the hair or jacket in the video... Did you even see it?
Actually, your stance is illogical to the letter. And I'm sure you have contradicted yourself countless times on this forum. Anytime you saw a press release anything and posted about it favorably/unfavorably, you just completely invalidated yourself.
You can chuckle though, I don't mind.
Why are you making an observation of something 3 pages ago, and not even responding to anything in particular?
EDIT: Oh wait, there were two conversations on Cloud, and I was involved in both, lol. One was just in the previous page. My bad.
For a guy who actually works in game development, you sure are ignorant.
FlashbladeGAF
Member
do you like it when a movie studio announces a remake of a movie you used to love back in the day.
Total Recall for instance stars the same character doing and acting basically the same thing, but the actors own personality shines thru with the role making the character their own.
Colin Farell's representation of the character may be considered more realistic and down to earth, but Arnold Schwarzenegger's version of the character was more engaging making him more fun to watch.
OG Dante is goofball fun where this new Dante is trying to hard to be hip and edgy. If you like that thats fine. But don't sit there an act like the only difference between the two is simply cosmetic and that people should just forget about the OG Dante that defined a genre.
First Name
Member
A more accurate title would be "Why DmC's Dante Looks Like He'll be a Bad Character." I think that's implied but eh...
Good video though. The OP should definitely do one after the game is out if he can.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people posting here didn't watch it.
edit: I don't think the video itself is premature.
Good video though. The OP should definitely do one after the game is out if he can.
I'm pretty sure a lot of people posting here didn't watch it.
edit: I don't think the video itself is premature.
Vampirolol
Member
I've always found really stupid and "foregone" the original Dante, but my friends loved him. You know, they were like 13/14. Now I find really stupid the new Dante and my friends agree with me... It's kinda like the story of Ewoks and Jar Jar. Ewoks were annoying but many kids liked'em, then they grew up and you know... everyone hates Jar Jar.
Ok, Ewoks ARE better than Jar Jar and Dante seems better than this. I'm not defending the new Dante, I'm just explaining why he is really starting on the wrong foot and "everyone" hates him.
Now you can say "f**k you" to me but you already know my answer
Ok, Ewoks ARE better than Jar Jar and Dante seems better than this. I'm not defending the new Dante, I'm just explaining why he is really starting on the wrong foot and "everyone" hates him.
Now you can say "f**k you" to me but you already know my answer
I take the stance that the look of the character, the writing in all previous games, the one liners...none of that stuff mattered to me. I don't look down on people who find the story important, but I think it would be more useful to go back and look at those games and ask yourself whether that stuff was actually well done. The video is well made and cut, but I really find serious criticism tough when the game isn't even out yet. None of Bayonetta outside of gameplay was good and most people look past that.
It's such an ignorant view of what being cool is... what the fuck does that even mean?
"FLOCK OFF FEATHER FACE!!!"
"FLOCK OFF FEATHER FACE!!!"
R_thanatos
Member
love the guys attacking the video or the fact that he made a video , without doing any opposition to the points made in the video , except "it's too soon to judge "
When it's ok to judge ?
The game will be out in january , isn't it ( seeing as it's close to the release date ) time to give our impression on the new character ... or does this only character ( dante ) the only one that have an immunity ?
It's a reboot or a side story whatever ... why this one should be left alone when the others game that got rebooted got the very same treatment ?
When it's ok to judge ?
The game will be out in january , isn't it ( seeing as it's close to the release date ) time to give our impression on the new character ... or does this only character ( dante ) the only one that have an immunity ?
It's a reboot or a side story whatever ... why this one should be left alone when the others game that got rebooted got the very same treatment ?
"Interesting track record" Well that's one way of putting it , another way is they have an awful track record of making games that almost completely fail at the whole "gameplay" part. Bad/unresponsive controls, bad cameras, shallow etc. You really that surprised that people would be wary of them taking on a series such as DMC?