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Dr.Schlomo · Mar 17, 2014

mack said:
I'm not sure any of that is on the level of hate MS is experiencing now. All I see is threads full of people who can't wait to shout them down.

Just glance through the Xbox sales up 96% thread. It doesn't look like there's many in there would be shedding a tear if MS pulled out the market. Can't wait to pour more gloom on any positive headline.

bishoptl said:
I love your avatar, but you literally must have just showed up on these forums. Sony took it in the ear from all and sundry during the PS3 era on GAF. Suck it up.

This is true. Even though I am a junior I have been lurking for a long time. The most important thing to remember is that gaf is a very very large forum with a lot of different opinions. I have an X1 and I really enjoy it but the truth is Microsoft has a made A LOT of mistakes with the console. Sony has a done a lot of great things with the ps4 and they deserve to be praised for their efforts in making a quality gamer focused console. If people think gaf is just some Sony fanboy playground that loves to bash Microsoft for no reason...they need to open their eyes and look at the rest of the world. The general consensus of the ps4 and x1 is pretty much the same on gaf and around the world.

Sure gaf has problems but for its size, it's an excellent forum. If the negativity towards Microsoft hinders your enjoyment than maybe you should take a break for awhile. I'm not trying to be rude but getting upset over other peoples opinion isn't a good thing.

-Plasma Reus- · Mar 17, 2014

mack said:
The hate that MS is getting from this forum lately is breathtaking. I prefered it before it became the official sony board. Competition is healthy you know.

This is what competition does. It allows us to distinguish bad service from good service. Consumers have the right to point out how damaging to consumers and flawed a competitor's strategy is.Competition is healthy, putting our fingers in our ears and pretending the value one competitor is providing consumers is the same as what the other competitor is providing, is the exact opposite of healthy competition.

rokkerkory · Mar 17, 2014

I support MS and am VERY glad they are getting all the heat they are getting. They used to be a humble and competitive company that gave birth to games like Halo, Gears, Viva Pinata and services like Live and XBLA.

The humble pie they are eating is deserved and will make it better for consumers. I won't buy an X1 until games are there and price/value is right for console and Live.

Seeing them react to consumers buying PS4 more is just great. It'll be good for consumers and the industry if they become humble again.

Conversely, last gen was a huge humble pie for Sony and I am just loving what they have done for this gen.

Nintendo needs to eat the biggest humble pie however and yet they are refusing to so far.

xn0 · Mar 17, 2014

I'm one of them for sure.

level44 · Mar 17, 2014

mack said:
The hate that MS is getting from this forum lately is breathtaking. I prefered it before it became the official sony board. Competition is healthy you know.

Ugh, this crap again....

Memorabilia · Mar 17, 2014

graywolf323 said:
didn't Spencer just say something recently that shows Microsoft still feels the only reason it didn't work was how they tried to share the message and not the message itself?

that's the problem, they still don't get it

Exactly right, they definitely dont get it. And they likely wont ever get it with this current group in leadership positions at MS.

Short term, I'm enjoying both consoles. Titanfall, for example, is a blast (especially given that for me there's literally nothing else on the console I want to play...I finished Ryse in 7 hrs and, well, meh).

But, I'm under no delusions: Titanfall itself is a bit of a trojan-horse experiment, in my estimation, to gauge the viability of "online required" game sales. Theres absolutely no reason Respawn couldnt have included an offline mode a la the Left 4 Dead series. And for all we know, they may have wanted to but my guess is EA decision-makers forced the "only online" thing 100%. The AI of the grunts/spectres is absolutely brain-dead, so any claims of "the magical cloud" being necessary to offload AI computation are a straight up joke. More likely this is just a smoke screen to cover up the fact that Titanfall is a "tip of the spear" harbinger of things to come should the sales be good enough. When you step back and look at the big picture, its obvious MS and EA (and likely Activision) were all behind the online only DRM push from the start. They all stand to gain from it, at the expense of consumers rights and pocket-books. Credit Sony for at least holding off to gauge public reaction. Meanwhile, EA (and MS) are still pushing the idea, but as Titanfall shows rather than implement it hardware side, they will implement it game by game.

It's a bit of an irony that I'm enjoying Titanfall so much (despite its glaring technical and design flaws), and yet am happy the sales are projecting out as underwhelming or even disappointing. I dont think I've ever rooted against a game I find this fun and addictive. The problem is that as a proof of concept the long term implication of Titanfall hitting COD sales numbers is a major problem for gaming and gamers.

So, its no surprise gamers are leaving the Xbox eco-system in droves to buy the system that at least for now doesnt force DRM (and happens to be cheaper/more powerful to boot). And perhaps its a good sign that Titanfall is selling less than expected. But you can bet this wont be MS's or EA's last attempt to trojan-horse anti-consumer DRM onto our consoles. The fact of the matter is I hate their philosophy but had literally nothing else to play on my new Xbone, so felt like I had to buy it to justify the console purchase. Its a blast, yes, but I'm already questioning its long term viability for me due to a lack of SP campaign/story-line. Its a fun but ultimately hollow/shallow game universe with no meaning beyond the next kill. So, once there are more games to play on PS4 that presumably wont require online access or paying for XBL Gold, I will likely drop Titanfall pretty quickly. Hell, I'm only on there now because I have a handful of Gold 7 and 14 day passes...I hate paying for Gold...so am not sure if I'll bother with Titanfall even after my passes are all used up in a couple months.

In other words, MS has a perception problem in a few different ways in that the public doesnt want to buy what they are trying to sell, even if their leadership seems incapable or unwilling to accept this fact for now. I'm one of the exceptions who bought the system and game anyway. But they cant win a console race or even have a successful platform/ecosystem selling to the exceptions. They need to make the system more appealing to a lot more people. DRM is just one of the many perception problems MS is dealing with (others being price, power, forced/useless Kinect, a cavalier attitude towards gamers, etc...).

InsaneLuchador · Mar 17, 2014

Yeah, Xbox has been my console of choice since the days of the "Duke" controller, but I ended up getting a PS4 first this generation with plans to get an X1 soon after. But now I just don't see myself making that second purchase this year. I refuse to give MS money for Kinect, a device they can't even seem to justify.

cakely · Mar 17, 2014

mack said:
The hate that MS is getting from this forum lately is breathtaking. I prefered it before it became the official sony board. Competition is healthy you know.

Pretty good, but I think you forgot to refer to this board as "SonyGAF".

joecanada · Mar 17, 2014

Amir0x said:
Describes me. Primary 360 and PC gamer, 90% of all my online time on the 360, most of all my gaming purchases there.

Now I am primary PS4 and PC gamer, and like how I waited until Uncharted 2 came out before jumping on PS3, I don't intend to jump to XBO until it's $299.99. I simply go where the environment for gaming is best, companies don't concern me

Wait for the expected posts about how xbox will never be 299...

Describes me too except I didn't get a 360 until 2009. 10O bucks

...problem with Ms is you can afford to wait for next gears, halo, fable cycle which occurs every 2 years

eddfromtheriver · Mar 17, 2014

It's happening with a lot of guys i know as well.

Memorabilia · Mar 17, 2014

InsaneLuchador said:
Yeah, Xbox has been my console of choice since the days of the "Duke" controller, but I ended up getting a PS4 first this generation with plans to get an X1 soon after. But now I just don't see myself making that second purchase this year. I refuse to give MS money for Kinect, a device they can't even seem to justify.

Its baffling to me how they thought it was a good idea to force Kinect into every Xbone box at the expense of a better GPU or RAM and make the price higher than their competition...but then not have a single game out at launch to showcase why people should want/need a Kinect. Simply mind-boggling.

jhmtehgamr20xx · Mar 17, 2014

LowEndTorque said:
Official Sony board in action.

I know, right? Either kiss MS's ass or you're part of Sony's Defense Force.

Apparently...

Rockandrollclown · Mar 17, 2014

All MS has to do is greenlight the Phantom Dust sequel and I'm on board. I prefer MS consoles by a decent margin. I think the Xbone currently has a much better games library than the PS4. I am still PS4 exclusive for the moment. Its really hard to justify paying $100 more for the console they released, my irrational love of Phantom Dust would get me to drop $500, but in the meantime PC is tiding me over just fine while I wait for PS4 games to come out.

Memorabilia · Mar 17, 2014

jhmtehgamr20xx said:
I know, right? Either kiss MS's ass or you're part of Sony's Defense Force.

Apparently...

Yeah, the backlash against people calling it like it is on GAF is pretty silly. I own both new systems and have enjoyed a few experiences on each despite the expected launch drought. But if I call it like I see it in terms of MS's *obvious* and glaring design and PR mistakes - driven by a flawed underlying leadership philosophy - somehow I'm "anti-MS", eh? Mmmm-kay, then. Lol

oconnomiyaki · Mar 17, 2014

Microsoft has a few issues to address, such as price, but the main issue they have is an image one. Stories like this only compound the notion the One is a dud.

They could probably start helping themselves with price. Ditch the Kinect. I was a supporter of it until I got a PS4. Then I saw that Sony was able to offer voice commands in New Zealand through any headset, whereas Microsoft has them disabled and doesn't seem to give a shit. So not only are voice commands disabled in games, but you have to navigate that UI without Kinect anyway. With no voice commands, it's a fancy Skype camera, and then Skype is behind a paywall!

If the ditch Kinect, drop the price, and start getting some great exclusives out the door, being weaker isn't going to matter. But for now, the narrative is the PS4 is the cheaper, more powerful, and more popular machine. And at the end of the day, people are going to go where their friends are. I know I did. I sold my Xbox One and got a PS4.

TS-08 · Mar 17, 2014

Memorabilia said:
Its baffling to me how they thought it was a good idea to force Kinect into every Xbone box at the expense of a better GPU or RAM and make the price higher than their competition...but then not have a single game out at launch to showcase why people should want/need a Kinect. Simply mind-boggling.

I want to give them the benefit of the doubt and say they simply underestimated Sony's ability to release a system like the PS4 for that price point, but maybe they really did think the Xbox name and Kinect would be enough to overcome whatever Sony did. To be honest, I don't think it really matters at this point what they try to do with Kinect. I just don't see it as a system seller, especially not at this price. When a brand new IP, releasing on two other platforms, that doesn't use Kinect at all, is going to attract many more people to your console than the Kinect-only game being released in a few weeks that is already a part of a successful and established franchise, that tells you what you need to know about the appeal of the device.

Frillen · Mar 17, 2014

Just talked to a childhood friend of mine who was an avid 360 owner last gen. Apparently he had just received his PS4 and he had no desire to buy the Bone. He's like a semi hardcore gamer but knew all about the hardware differences.

George Claw M.D. · Mar 17, 2014

oconnomiyaki said:
Microsoft has a few issues to address, such as price, but the main issue they have is an image one. Stories like this only compound the notion the One is a dud.

They could probably start helping themselves with price. Ditch the Kinect. I was a supporter of it until I got a PS4. Then I saw that Sony was able to offer voice commands in New Zealand through any headset, whereas Microsoft has them disabled and doesn't seem to give a shit. So not only are voice commands disabled in games, but you have to navigate that UI without Kinect anyway. With no voice commands, it's a fancy Skype camera, and then Skype is behind a paywall!

If the ditch Kinect, drop the price, and start getting some great exclusives out the door, being weaker isn't going to matter. But for now, the narrative is the PS4 is the cheaper, more powerful, and more popular machine. And at the end of the day, people are going to go where their friends are. I know I did. I sold my Xbox One and got a PS4.

Who are you, and what did you do with the real Oconnomiyaki? ;P

You know, I was shocked yesterday when one of my friends told me he had just bought a PS4. It was the first one he saw in the wild. He was asking me what games I have/recommend for the system, and during the conversation the subject of Xbone comes up, and he said he'll never get one because Microsoft pissed him off with their DRM policies, especially the part about physical discs being worthless and being unable to buy/sell used games. The shocking part is that he still thought those policies were in effect! Seems everyone and their mothers had heard about the whole DRM controversy, but Microsoft weren't nearly as effective at informing people about their 180s.

BruiserBear · Mar 17, 2014

AJanitor said:
Backlash? I'm not sure if it's backlash anymore (some of it is). Much of it at this point is MS made their bed, now they must lie in it.

It's not backlash that a console that is weaker and higher priced is losing nearly 2/1 world wide. It's people seeing one console as more valuable than the other. Did backlash cause some of this disparity? Sure. But at this point, MS has made their choice and the hardware cannot be changed.

Now, other aspects of the X1 can be reversed and the price can be dropped to make consumers feel more comfortable with the purchase. But let's not equate perceived consumer value with backlash.

There is very clearly a backlash. It's people wanting to make a big deal out of those differences that exist. To talk about them on, and on, and on. Sure, you could just call it the typical fanboy wars, but some people seem to have made a sport out of it with the XB1. It's inflamed even further when a game like Titanfall is involved.

LowEndTorque said:
Official Sony board in action.

You replied to a comment about Microsoft hate with that link? Are you suggesting people voted the PSN hack because of "hate"? The terrible Skyrim port on PS3 is "hate"?

No, those were factually terrible things, that were rightfully voted as such. In other words, they had rational reasoning behind them. Much of the XB1/Microsoft/Titanfall hate on this board over the past few months is completely and utterly irrational.

Quadraphonic · Mar 17, 2014

Memorabilia said:
Its baffling to me how they thought it was a good idea to force Kinect into every Xbone box at the expense of a better GPU or RAM and make the price higher than their competition...but then not have a single game out at launch to showcase why people should want/need a Kinect. Simply mind-boggling.

I want to think it's because the people who'd want a kinect buy more games on average.

That's the only reason.

I think they failed to calculate the lost sales due to the higher cost and the fact that the people who like the Kinect are the exact opposite of early adopters.

Chettlar · Mar 17, 2014

I have a question.

In your mind, what does Microsoft need to do to fix this bad image they have? Aside from Kinect. I know that seems like a ridiculous question, but I'm trying to hone it down to a specific one.

MS got a lot of really bad rep for the DRM stuff. Concerning that, what does MS need to do to fix their reputation?

I'm asking to keep Kinect out of it to keep it focused. I know a ton of people (including myself) were mad about the DRM, so concerning that, what does MS need to do?

TheOctodad · Mar 17, 2014

BruiserBear said:
There is very clearly a backlash. It's people wanting to make a big deal out of those differences that exist. To talk about them on, and on, and on. Sure, you could just call it the typical fanboy wars, but some people seem to have made a sport out of it with the XB1. It's inflamed even further when a game like Titanfall is involved.

Even in my quote I said there are some people that do that. But that's the same on both sides.

The majority of the people are criticizing the X1 not because there is some sort of emotional revenge sentiment, but because it's perceived (emphasis on perceived) to be an inferior console due to all the reasons listed by many of the posters here.

I owned only MS before this gen, I have no loyalty. I go where the best deal and the most consumer friendly policies for my needs are. That was the 360 last gen and it's the PS4 this gen.

Dragonborn · Mar 17, 2014

BruiserBear said:
There is very clearly a backlash. It's people wanting to make a big deal out of those differences that exist. To talk about them on, and on, and on. Sure, you could just call it the typical fanboy wars, but some people seem to have made a sport out of it with the XB1. It's inflamed even further when a game like Titanfall is involved.

People are happy that MS is getting what they deserve because it'll send a very clear message.

Now personally, I wouldn't shed a single tear if they left the console space. I think it'd send a very clear message that we won't take BS easily.

With that said, I don't want them to leave, I want them to make another Xbox and really deliver a successor to the 360 (2006-2009 360, not that crap we had the last 4 years). I want them to learn from this and turn things around. Sony's fuck ups gave us the PS4, I'm hoping the X1 failing has a similar effect on MS. (though at the very least, Sony main issue was arrogance, thinking we'd buy whatever crap they put out, they didn't try to completely screw us over like MS did).

Then again, I'm not very hopeful of them doing that since they show no indication of actually doing anything about it (Black Tusk gets turned into a Gears studio, that says a lot). They'll continue with their BS moneyhats and they'll keep recycling the same games over and over again and if that's all they'll do then honestly, I don't care if they leave. Someone else can take their place. I'll always remember the original Xbox and the first four years of the 360 very fondly.

level44 · Mar 17, 2014

AJanitor said:
Even in my quote I said there are some people that do that. But that's the same on both sides.

The majority of the people are criticizing the X1 not because there is some sort of emotional revenge sentiment, but because it's perceived (emphasis on perceived) to be an inferior console due to all the reasons listed by many of the posters here.

I owned only MS before this gen, I have no loyalty. I go where the best deal and the most consumer friendly policies for my needs are. That was the 360 last gen and it's the PS4 this gen.

I'd even go as far to say it started happening around 2009 during the PS3/360 gen.

Quadraphonic · Mar 17, 2014

Chettlar said:
I have a question.

In your mind, what does Microsoft need to do to fix this bad image they have? Aside from Kinect. I know that seems like a ridiculous question, but I'm trying to hone it down to a specific one.

MS got a lot of really bad rep for the DRM stuff. Concerning that, what does MS need to do to fix their reputation?

I'm asking to keep Kinect out of it to keep it focused. I know a ton of people (including myself) were mad about the DRM, so concerning that, what does MS need to do?

Just like the Wii U, there is not one specific thing. It's not possible to make it concise.

TheLaughingStock · Mar 17, 2014

PhantomFear said:
Oh boy...another "we're all better off is MS does well" thread.

Don't people realize that MS getting it's ass handed to it in worldwide sales is the direct result of Sony being very competitive this gen? Equality of sales that result by willfully ignoring product/service/price differences doesn't benefit anyone except the company that offers the least value.

Releasing a console at the same time and at a competitive price made it an easy W for Sony. Virtually unwinnable due to Sony addressing the head start and price disparity.

Marco1 · Mar 17, 2014

People say dropping kinect and lowering the price is the answer but I think they need to keep kinect but make it the reason you want a xbone.
It needs to work as they advertise it, voice and gesture control need to be flawless. What happened to the scanning items in feture shown at E3 for kinect1?
How about incorporating it into apps that are still not up such as facebook and twitter or maybe instagram, isn't selfies the rage amongst young people now?
Kinect sports rivals is a small step in the right direction but it's just a re-hash of what they did before.

jhmtehgamr20xx · Mar 17, 2014

Memorabilia said:
driven by a flawed underlying leadership philosophy

This is still the biggest mystery atm; Nadella seems he'll do better for the company (and for Xbox division) than Ballmar and Mattrick, but Elop is a complete mystery right now. He's the guy who sped up the death of Nokia to sell them to MS, after all.

That could be read one of two ways, and right now I'm reading it as he did that as a favor to get in MS's good graces, not that he actually operates like that usually. But again, we'll see during the course of the gen, or however long he sticks around there.

Whichever is longer.

BruiserBear said:
You replied to a comment about Microsoft hate with that link? Are you suggesting people voted the PSN hack because of "hate"? The terrible Skyrim port on PS3 is "hate"?

No, those were factually terrible things, that were rightfully voted as such. In other words, they had rational reasoning behind them. Much of the XB1/Microsoft/Titanfall hate on this board over the past few months is completely and utterly irrational.

Well, do you think people liked their credit info being compromised and paying full price for a shoddy port?

All the same way, if someone did that list for 2013 you'd think XBO DRM would fall at the top because people were "just a little disappointed" ?

TS-08 · Mar 17, 2014

Chettlar said:
I have a question.

In your mind, what does Microsoft need to do to fix this bad image they have? Aside from Kinect. I know that seems like a ridiculous question, but I'm trying to hone it down to a specific one.

MS got a lot of really bad rep for the DRM stuff. Concerning that, what does MS need to do to fix their reputation?

I'm asking to keep Kinect out of it to keep it focused. I know a ton of people (including myself) were mad about the DRM, so concerning that, what does MS need to do?

I find the reputation aspect to be overblown. Some people, like yourself, may be mad/upset about the DRM, but the majority of people in the market for consoles aren't going to let that be a factor in their decision (if they ever even knew about it). There is a tendency to make MS's issues more complicated than they are. For the most part, the power/price disparity between it and the PS4 is the main culprit. If the specs and prices were reversed, you'd be asking what Sony could do to keep their system competitive with MS. Obviously there are other factors. MS needs to make XBL's value more closely match PS+'s as far as free game and discounts, and removing the paywall on apps like Netflix. There are other factors they can't really change, like some territories just being in the bag for one console or the other. But in my mind, getting the price down to PS4 levels or below needs to be the immediate goal. If they can't do that, then I hope they have something great cooking for Kinect, or some amazing exclusive game lineup that will blow Sony's out of the water, because they won't keep up otherwise. Actually they will probably need the latter regardless, to mitigate as much as possible the power discrepancy.

BruiserBear · Mar 17, 2014

Dragonborn said:
People are happy that MS is getting what they deserve because it'll send a very clear message.

Now personally, I wouldn't shed a single tear if they left the console space. I think it'd send a very clear message that we won't take BS easily.

With that said, I don't want them to leave, I want them to make another Xbox and really deliver a successor to the 360 (2006-2009 360, not that crap we had the last 4 years). I want them to learn from this and turn things around. Sony's fuck ups gave us the PS4, I'm hoping the X1 failing has a similar effect on MS. (though at the very least, Sony main issue was arrogance, thinking we'd buy whatever crap they put out, they didn't try to completely screw us over like MS did).

Then again, I'm not very hopeful of them doing that since they show no indication of actually doing anything about it (Black Tusk gets turned into a Gears studio, that says a lot). They'll continue with their BS moneyhats and they'll keep recycling the same games over and over again and if that's all they'll do then honestly, I don't care if they leave. Someone else can take their place. I'll always remember the original Xbox and the first four years of the 360 very fondly.

Microsoft has already been slapped back IMO. They reversed all the policies people rejected. That's when I became open to buying the console, and I did at launch. I'm thrilled to see them investing in creative IP like Titanfall, Sunset Overdrive, and Quantum Break. I guess that's why I'm more excited about that platform right now, because of those new games.

I want to see the same from Sony, and hopefully I'll get that at E3. I really don't know what you're talking about exactly when you say the Xbox of 2006-2009. I see a very similar Microsoft right now. They just need to get their price $100 lower.

javie3d · Mar 17, 2014

fist actually sony console ive owned, was an xbox fanboy all last generation. sounds about right

Amentallica · Mar 17, 2014

BruiserBear said:
Microsoft has already been slapped back IMO. They reversed all the policies people rejected. That's when I became open to buying the console, and I did at launch. I'm thrilled to see them investing in creative IP like Titanfall, Sunset Overdrive, and Quantum Break. I guess that's why I'm more excited about that platform right now, because of those new games.

I want to see the same from Sony, and hopefully I'll get that at E3. I really don't know what you're talking about exactly when you say the Xbox of 2006-2009. I see a very similar Microsoft right now. They just need to get their price $100 lower.

I really don't think Microsoft are known for really investing in their studios. You mentioned Titanfall and that's definitely not one, either.

Edit: And are you really suggesting that Sony doesn't invest in their studios?

Man...

jryi · Mar 17, 2014

mack said:
It doesn't look like there's many in there would be shedding a tear if MS pulled out the market.

I don't know if it were such a bad thing, if Microsoft pulled out of console hardware business. They were a much better game company before Xbox. (OK, maybe in the early days of Xbox, too.) I really liked Age of Empires and Close Combat was cool, as well. Back then Microsoft Game Studios made money with games.

Audible Phonetics · Mar 17, 2014

Dragonborn said:
People are happy that MS is getting what they deserve because it'll send a very clear message.

Now personally, I wouldn't shed a single tear if they left the console space. I think it'd send a very clear message that we won't take BS easily.

With that said, I don't want them to leave, I want them to make another Xbox and really deliver a successor to the 360 (2006-2009 360, not that crap we had the last 4 years). I want them to learn from this and turn things around. Sony's fuck ups gave us the PS4, I'm hoping the X1 failing has a similar effect on MS. (though at the very least, Sony main issue was arrogance, thinking we'd buy whatever crap they put out, they didn't try to completely screw us over like MS did).

Then again, I'm not very hopeful of them doing that since they show no indication of actually doing anything about it (Black Tusk gets turned into a Gears studio, that says a lot). They'll continue with their BS moneyhats and they'll keep recycling the same games over and over again and if that's all they'll do then honestly, I don't care if they leave. Someone else can take their place. I'll always remember the original Xbox and the first four years of the 360 very fondly.

Exactly Microsoft has not shown any indication that they plan to change their strategic outlook for 2014. We keep getting stories of moneyhats, new iterations of OLD games, no new exclusives. It is clearly not a formula that'll help them carve out more of a share in the console space.

The current war's results are evident of that.

The only two Sony Exclusives currently out are KZSF and Knack, with a slew of Indie games...Yet the PS4 is stomping the One despite the One having a more robust library. That should tell you something.

rudieboy77 · Mar 17, 2014

Only had a 360 last gen and didn't buy either console, but if I did it would've been a PS4.

joecanada · Mar 17, 2014

Amentallica said:
I really don't think Microsoft are known for really investing in their studios. You mentioned Titanfall and that's definitely not one, either.

Edit: And are you really suggesting that Sony doesn't invest in their studios?

Man...

I'm still not even sold on any MS exclusives anyway, I was sold Crackdown 2 by a friend, it was utter garbage , 2/10... Alan Wake was meh, fable was kinda cool for about one entry , then progressively worse and worse.

I'm not sure anyone should even mention MS exclusives until they actually make one that is really good , other than that, if you are really into the forza, fable, gears, halo cycle then that's great. I just feel like I'm not missing out if I wait until the second ffgh cycle in say 2017... hopefully by then MS will have got their head on right and taken kinect out of the box at 299. Otherwise, whatever, maybe I will skip it this gen.

The fact they backburnered black tusk project that people raved on about sight unseen for another gears is all I need to know for now....

Memorabilia · Mar 17, 2014

Audible Phonetics said:
Exactly Microsoft has not shown any indication that they plan to change their strategic outlook for 2014. We keep getting stories of moneyhats, new iterations of OLD games, no new exclusives. It is clearly not a formula that'll help them carve out more of a share in the console space.

The current war's results are evident of that.

The only two Sony Exclusives currently out are KZSF and Knack, with a slew of Indie games...Yet the PS4 is stomping the One despite the One having a more robust library.That should tell you something.

From MS's perspective, this has to be the single most troubling factor so far. Although I've enjoyed multiplats on PS4 their exclusive list cant hold a candle to the Xbone right now for most gamers (I recognize there are always exceptions who will prefer KZ, Knack, indies vs whats on the Xbone). And, yet, here we sit with PS4 having a nearly 2:1 global sales advantage. This is like a basketball team shooting 70% from the floor in the first half but somehow being behind 50-30. Its not an impossible comeback, but given historical precedence and statistics its damn close.

Sydle · Mar 17, 2014

Dragonborn said:
People are happy that MS is getting what they deserve because it'll send a very clear message.

Now personally, I wouldn't shed a single tear if they left the console space. I think it'd send a very clear message that we won't take BS easily.

With that said, I don't want them to leave, I want them to make another Xbox and really deliver a successor to the 360 (2006-2009 360, not that crap we had the last 4 years). I want them to learn from this and turn things around. Sony's fuck ups gave us the PS4, I'm hoping the X1 failing has a similar effect on MS. (though at the very least, Sony main issue was arrogance, thinking we'd buy whatever crap they put out, they didn't try to completely screw us over like MS did).

Then again, I'm not very hopeful of them doing that since they show no indication of actually doing anything about it (Black Tusk gets turned into a Gears studio, that says a lot). They'll continue with their BS moneyhats and they'll keep recycling the same games over and over again and if that's all they'll do then honestly, I don't care if they leave. Someone else can take their place. I'll always remember the original Xbox and the first four years of the 360 very fondly.

What MS publishes in the last 3 years and what's upcoming: Alan Wake, Forza Horizon (different from Motorsport), Killer Instinct, Crimson Dragon Max: Curse of Brotherhood, Happy Wars, Kinect Sports, Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive, Zoo Tycoon, Project Spark, Ryse: Son of Rome, Kinect+ Nike Training, JoyRide Turbo, Dance Central, Kinect Sesame Street, The Gunstringer, LocoCycle, Super Time Force, et al

All GAF sees: Gears, Halo, Forza, and Fable

smh @ how so many on GAF continue to ignore all the other stuff MS tries.

As for BlackTusk, Gears is one of the most popular IP made last gen. It has fans and BlackTusk has ex-GoW devs in the studio. It just says that MS is going to service a fan base and not just let a good IP go.

TheOctodad · Mar 17, 2014

BruiserBear said:
Microsoft has already been slapped back IMO. They reversed all the policies people rejected. That's when I became open to buying the console, and I did at launch. I'm thrilled to see them investing in creative IP like Titanfall, Sunset Overdrive, and Quantum Break. I guess that's why I'm more excited about that platform right now, because of those new games.

I want to see the same from Sony, and hopefully I'll get that at E3. I really don't know what you're talking about exactly when you say the Xbox of 2006-2009. I see a very similar Microsoft right now. They just need to get their price $100 lower.

A) The IPs you listed are not really "investments" they are purchased exclusivity.

B) Even if they have been slapped back? So what? Their console is weaker, more expensive and isn't compelling enough for me yet. Obviously the majority of the current consumers feel the same way.

C) How are you excited about Sunset and Quantum when you have seen almost zero info from those titles? Is it mainly just being excited about the concept? Because neither of those studios have a very promising past.

PhatSaqs · Mar 17, 2014

Audible Phonetics said:
The only two Sony Exclusives currently out are KZSF and Knack, with a slew of Indie games...Yet the PS4 is stomping the One despite the One having a more robust library. That should tell you something.

It's confusing a little IMO but I guess the old adage that "it's all about the games" doesnt really ring truest these days. Of course I get that some peeps will hold the DRM fiasco against MS for the rest of their lives, but still..... That said, it would be even more interesting if MS didnt basically give the PS4 a price drop out of the gate which is just another (really easy) reason to choose a PS4 over an X1 if you have to make a choice.

A_Gorilla · Mar 17, 2014

oconnomiyaki said:
Microsoft has a few issues to address, such as price, but the main issue they have is an image one. Stories like this only compound the notion the One is a dud.

They could probably start helping themselves with price. Ditch the Kinect. I was a supporter of it until I got a PS4. Then I saw that Sony was able to offer voice commands in New Zealand through any headset, whereas Microsoft has them disabled and doesn't seem to give a shit. So not only are voice commands disabled in games, but you have to navigate that UI without Kinect anyway. With no voice commands, it's a fancy Skype camera, and then Skype is behind a paywall!

If the ditch Kinect, drop the price, and start getting some great exclusives out the door, being weaker isn't going to matter. But for now, the narrative is the PS4 is the cheaper, more powerful, and more popular machine. And at the end of the day, people are going to go where their friends are. I know I did. I sold my Xbox One and got a PS4.

Dude didn't you swear to never show your face here again after you were stalking that guy?

ryuken-d · Mar 17, 2014

Ovek said:
Well yeah, thing is I really wanted a xbone (well before the announcements anyway) and the biggest hold back is the fucking ridiculous design of the box itself... Everything about it is so piss poorly done it untrue, from making it horizontal only (fuckng dumb) to the stupid external PSU everything about it makes me scratch my head in dumbfounded amazement that someone though this box was the one to go with.

it really does say something about the systems/companys when you look at how they were put together the PS4 is so small and everything inside is intergrated perfectly no traped volume. Just a perfectly designed box. I cant believe the xbox1 still has the power brick and AA batteries in the controller its ridiculous.

I get two controllers and always leave one plugged in and switch them when one dies, sure the DS4 doesnt last as long but I always have one ready to go in no time at all.

The xbox is huge and will void the warrenty if you stand it up..

.. not cool MS.

TheOctodad · Mar 17, 2014

Paco said:
What MS publishes in the last 3 years and what's upcoming: Alan Wake, Forza Horizon (different from Motorsport), Killer Instinct, Crimson Dragon Max: Curse of Brotherhood, Happy Wars, Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive, Zoo Tycoon, Project Spark, Ryse: Son of Rome, Kinect+ Nike Training, JoyRide Turbo, Dance Central, Kinect Sesame Street, The Gunstringer, LocoCycle, Super Time Force, et al

All GAF sees: Gears, Halo, Forza, and Fable

smh @ how so many on GAF continue to ignore all the other stuff MS tries.

As for BlackTusk, Gears is one of the most popular IP made last gen. It has fans and BlackTusk has ex-GoW devs in the studio. It just says that MS is going to service a fan base and not just let a good IP go.

A ton of those games you listed are not very good at all. People don't list them because they aren't seen as worth mentioning (cough Lococycle cough). And publishing is very different than developing and publishing. Moneyhatting an external studio is not viewed with the same admiration as internal developing a game.

xxracerxx · Mar 17, 2014

PhatSaqs said:
It's confusing a little IMO but I guess the old adage that "it's all about the games" doesnt really ring truest these days. Of course I get that some peeps will hold the DRM fiasco against MS for the rest of their lives, but still..... That said, it would be even more interesting if MS didnt basically give the PS4 a price drop out of the gate which is just another (really easy) reason to choose a PS4 over an X1 if you have to make a choice.

Except it is still about the games. Most of the third party games run slightly better on PS4, then there is the future game releases (both third party and exclusive) that people consider.

Hoo-doo · Mar 17, 2014

And again, let's all act like third party multiplats don't exist.

Let's face it, both consoles have junk exclusives and are only now slightly getting some worth buying in Titanfall and inFAMOUS.
To the vast majority, it's still going to be all about the Maddens, the FIFA's, the Assassin's Creeds and Battlefields.

Dragonborn · Mar 17, 2014

Paco said:
What MS publishes in the last 3 years and what's upcoming: Alan Wake, Forza Horizon (different from Motorsport), Killer Instinct, Crimson Dragon Max: Curse of Brotherhood, Happy Wars, Kinect Sports, Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive, Zoo Tycoon, Project Spark, Ryse: Son of Rome, Kinect+ Nike Training, JoyRide Turbo, Dance Central, Kinect Sesame Street, The Gunstringer, LocoCycle, Super Time Force, et al

All GAF sees: Gears, Halo, Forza, and Fable

smh @ how so many on GAF continue to ignore all the other stuff MS tries.

As for BlackTusk, Gears is one of the most popular IP made last gen. It has fans and BlackTusk has ex-GoW devs in the studio. It just says that MS is going to service a fan base and not just let a good IP go.

That isn't exactly a compelling list, which is exactly my point. Black Tusk shows that MS would rather recylce the same stuff rather than go in for a brand new IP. that's sends the kind of signal that puts me off from the Xbox in general.

joecanada · Mar 17, 2014

Paco said:
What MS publishes in the last 3 years and what's upcoming: Alan Wake, Forza Horizon (different from Motorsport), Killer Instinct, Crimson Dragon Max: Curse of Brotherhood, Happy Wars, Quantum Break, Sunset Overdrive, Zoo Tycoon, Project Spark, Ryse: Son of Rome, Kinect+ Nike Training, JoyRide Turbo, Dance Central, Kinect Sesame Street, The Gunstringer, LocoCycle, Super Time Force, et al

All GAF sees: Gears, Halo, Forza, and Fable

smh @ how so many on GAF continue to ignore all the other stuff MS tries.

As for BlackTusk, Gears is one of the most popular IP made last gen. It has fans and BlackTusk has ex-GoW devs in the studio. It just says that MS is going to service a fan base and not just let a good IP go.

well honestly, I'm not surprised when I look at that list I'm seeing nothing that jumps out at me at all, I mean honestly that list is embarassing...
Ryse - meh
Nike Training - cell phone app
kinect sesame street - not sure if serious
Dance Central - you must be joking or I come back at you with singstar lol
zoo tycoon - isn't this a pc game?
Alan wake - unproven, was ok last gen but not mindblowing.
LocoCycle - no
Killer Instinct - just one of many fighters and not the best one.
Project Spark - little big planet 10 years too late.

I mean this is just a gut reaction, I'm sure some of those games will be good , but I really don't feel like I am missing out at all. And when are any of these games even due?

Deadlysword · Mar 17, 2014

Rockandrollclown said:
I think the Xbone currently has a much better games library than the PS4.

Which is more or less what happened at the start of last gen, MS had a 'better' library( better being completely subjective) but ps3 wound up with the 'better' lineup at the end( again 'better' being subjective). So far, even this early into the current gen there's little reason to think Ps4 won't have the 'better' overall lineup 5 years from now, based on history and the way things are shaking out right now saleswise.

Marco1 · Mar 17, 2014

I've read that second place desperate MS will be a good MS but I actually think that a desperate MS will just sell the xbox division and move on.
Three times they've been at this and they still only exist in UK and US. It seems they underestimated the power behind the playstation brand ot they succeeded in stalling Sony in taking over the living room.
What baffles me is that it's obvious all of the functions of the xbone OS are nothing more than apps working together but why didn't it launch with a huge store of apps? Where are they?

uncledonnie · Mar 17, 2014

PhatSaqs said:
It's confusing a little IMO but I guess the old adage that "it's all about the games" doesnt really ring truest these days. Of course I get that some peeps will hold the DRM fiasco against MS for the rest of their lives, but still..... That said, it would be even more interesting if MS didnt basically give the PS4 a price drop out of the gate which is just another (really easy) reason to choose a PS4 over an X1 if you have to make a choice.

Yeah until they get to price parity it's difficult to speculate about the impact of other factors like exclusives. I could make the argument that a subjectively better library of exclusives is the only thing keeping the XB1 afloat.

They need to get to $399. Most have maintained, and I agree, that the $100 price difference has a far bigger impact on sales compared to the PS4 than anything else. This is something Microsoft themselves should know very well from the 360.

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