Grover Cleveland
Member
I've heard that Johnson will also write the initial story treatment for Trevorrow to work with for IX.
So if he takes it too far left field in VIII at least Trevorrow will have some proper guidance on how to continue it.
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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
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I've heard that Johnson will also write the initial story treatment for Trevorrow to work with for IX.
So if he takes it too far left field in VIII at least Trevorrow will have some proper guidance on how to continue it.
Yeah, the movie could've actually benefited, bizarrely, from a small number of additional scenes of slow, "boring" exposition. This felt a little like Prequel Reaction Syndrome actually- there's like literally nothing in TFA that doesn't need to be there.
Glass Shark
Banned
Regardless of who Rey's parents are, the new team in charge clearly knows what they're doing in the sense that we'll all be debating it for the next two years.
Raitosaito
Member
I would say If Kasdan did streamline the film it was the right decision. Since the film set a tone on visual explanations taking precedent all the way up to the closing scene, I argue the lines would have actually felt out of place. You as the audience just understands that Rey is now in tuned with something beyond herself, and to add any dialogue would negatively impact the overall film.
formasymphonic
Member
Literally just saw it.
Personally I was worried about how they would Handle Ren. They did a really good job of portraying how intimidating he was.
I like that wookie.
Personally I was worried about how they would Handle Ren. They did a really good job of portraying how intimidating he was.
In regards to Kylo Ren, I thought the movie did a pretty good job of showing that he's only in control when shits going his way. When it doesn't, he throws a tantrum, he loses his focus and he becomes weak willed. This is why I think Rey bested him at the end. Ren is frazzled, he's wounded, his opponent is fighting back, the good side in him (though small) is completely distraut over what he did.
Kylo Ren is Vader's number 1 fan, but he is not Vader. Also Luke was able to keep up with Vader in Empire despite not ever being in a light saber dual prior to that (going by current canon). I know Vader was not trying to kill him, but Luke still kept him off guard.
Kylo Ren is Vader's number 1 fan, but he is not Vader. Also Luke was able to keep up with Vader in Empire despite not ever being in a light saber dual prior to that (going by current canon). I know Vader was not trying to kill him, but Luke still kept him off guard.
Yep. It's intentional in that regard. They want the fan debate.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
20 years down the line Star Wars is going to be hilarious for new people.
"Ok, first you watch the middle movies which is the original trilogy, then the first three which is the second trilogy then the last three which is the third. Also there are 200,000 spin off movies. Good luck."
"Ok, first you watch the middle movies which is the original trilogy, then the first three which is the second trilogy then the last three which is the third. Also there are 200,000 spin off movies. Good luck."
Bobby Roberts
Banned
There's a cut between when Poe tells everyone "As long as we have light, we have a chance" and then immediately "We've got a lot of company" that feels like there was a scene or even a full sequence in there. That one jumped out on second view.
Glass Shark
Banned
Rey is actually Snap Wexley's secret little sister
Raitosaito
Member
It's cool. We'll all be in the movies VR style.
ryutaro's mama
Member
I was gonna write a long review of my thoughts on the film but most of it has been covered here in this thread. Simply put, I thought it was good but not great, mostly because of the weird editing, the shit re-tread of the Death Star and the mind boggling waste of Phasma.
I actually think the movie would have been stronger without the DS 3.0 battle. If you needed to give Poe something to do in the 3rd act, maybe give him Leia's ship being under attack by the First Order (a parallel to ANH)? That gives us a risk that would have the audience wondering if the movie will also take Leia from us (as it just took Han). IDK.
The "Luke is missing" motivation seemed flimsy too.
As for the good, the entire first half of the film felt like Star Wars. The banter was great (except that 'Droid, please' nonsense), the set pieces and action incredible (loved the reveal of the Falcon). I really liked the first half of the film a lot.
I'm seeing it again on Sunday so maybe it will change in my head for the better. Oh and opening night crowds fucking ROCK. My theater was so amped.
BobbyRoberts, what do you think the chances are that the Max Von Sydow character is in Rogue One and better fleshed out more there? :O
I actually think the movie would have been stronger without the DS 3.0 battle. If you needed to give Poe something to do in the 3rd act, maybe give him Leia's ship being under attack by the First Order (a parallel to ANH)? That gives us a risk that would have the audience wondering if the movie will also take Leia from us (as it just took Han). IDK.
The "Luke is missing" motivation seemed flimsy too.
As for the good, the entire first half of the film felt like Star Wars. The banter was great (except that 'Droid, please' nonsense), the set pieces and action incredible (loved the reveal of the Falcon). I really liked the first half of the film a lot.
I'm seeing it again on Sunday so maybe it will change in my head for the better. Oh and opening night crowds fucking ROCK. My theater was so amped.
BobbyRoberts, what do you think the chances are that the Max Von Sydow character is in Rogue One and better fleshed out more there? :O
TheOctodad
Member
I feel like this movie could go from a 9.5 to a 10 in my book if they just released an extended edition that was about 20 minutes more.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
In a film that was concieved and executed as homage as much as it was resetting the table, I don't think having wise words from a force-sensitive mystic echoing in the hero's ears during a climactic moment would have at all felt out of place. Nobody would have blinked.
Oh shit, Adam Driver is 32 years old in real life.
When I came out of the theater I was wondering if Rey might have been left on Jakku because of Kylo fucking up the new Jedi order but I figured the timeline couldn't work out. But if he's supposed to be around 30 in the movie as well then I could see that fitting the timeline with how old Rey looked in her flashback.
When I came out of the theater I was wondering if Rey might have been left on Jakku because of Kylo fucking up the new Jedi order but I figured the timeline couldn't work out. But if he's supposed to be around 30 in the movie as well then I could see that fitting the timeline with how old Rey looked in her flashback.
Yep. After percolating on the movie over my work day, I really dug this movie. Easy 8.5, really solid and a great framework for the series going forward. Also, man do I like Kylo Ren as a character. More I reflect on him, I can't way to see what he does next. This how Anakin should have been fucking handled. I love how he's struggling so hard with falling to the damn Light Side. Very conflicted character. Found it very compelling.
Obi-Wan had trained Luke with the little lazer droid at least.
The whole thing with light sabers is they're fucking weird. The blade is weightless and super treacherous. You don't actually have to make big wind up sweeping strikes because you don't need to put any momentum behind the blade. Maneuvering a light saber is totally unlike maneuvering any other melee weapon.
Ah... Good catch.
Imagine what he can do if learns proper control. He'll be a terrifying enemy.
Glass Shark
Banned
I don't think the line was actually in the movie, but in the novelization Kylo refers to him as a "solider of fortune" so there's clearly some ground to be trod there if they want to.
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
They should have waited until the Han confrontation to remove Ren's mask. It would have been more impactful to see his face for the first time and notice he's about the same age as Rey and Fin.
Lifejumper
Member
Jj confirmed somewhere that there was 10-20 min of deleted footage.
Anton Sugar
Member
Oh, I agree--it's clear that Lucas either isn't good with actors or he was so rusty that he wasn't good.
Still--Driver runs *circles* around Christensen. I've seen him act outside of the prequels--it's much better, but not on Driver's level by a long shot.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I don't think he is. There's some speculation that the character was supposed to be Wedge at one point, and when Denis Lawson declined, they turned it into Lor San Tekka. I dunno about that, I figure the "Wedge" role ended up becoming Miles from LOST's. But I guess it could be either. Or neither, too.
But I don't think they're going to try and directly tie Rogue One to Force Awakens. They don't really need to - it's already a direct prequel to Star Wars as it is.
I agree. The film moves at a rapid pace after the fight between Kylo and Rey concludes. They fly off, get back, R2 is activated, the map is complete, Rey leaves without saying anything, shot of Luke, credits.
There are plenty of films that have ~150 minute runtimes.
GodParticle
Member
It's just my opinion, and no, I can't really point out what's different. Don't piss your pants...
FUBAR McDangles
Member
Got this book and lots of really fantastic stuff about the concept stages of the movie. Lots and lots and lots of fantastic art as well. Here are some things that stuck out to me:
- Finn's original name was Sam, then Skylar. He was a white guy who was basically a new Han Solo
- BB8 Was originally a flying droid of size of BB's head
- Poe Dameron was originally called John Doe, and was a black guy.
- Poe was a Jedi, then a bounty hunter, then had his own Wookie pal
- Rey was originally called Kira, and then Thea in the storyboard phase
- Rey's planet underwent a ton of changes. Desert planet, jungle planet, at one point the Imperial ruins were actually the remains of the second Death Star and everything was underwater, she went diving all the time for salvage
- Han and Chewie show up in the Millenium Falcon to go looking for something hidden in the remains of the Death Star. Falcon goes underwater.
- Speaking of Han, he was supposed to have a sick beard + long trenchcoat
- Kylo Ren was originally a bounty hunter who idolized Vader - went around destroying Jedi relics, killing any Jedi he found, and keeping their lightsabers as trophies. Eventually that evolved into him leading a group of bounty hunters around, then that evolved to a group of stormtroopers, then it evolved into a formal organization
- When it was still a pirate group, they used a broken down old Star Destroyer as their moving base
- A huge theme of everything was fire and ice. Blue and red contrasting everywhere. Lava on snow planets, red and blue lightsabers, and so on
- At some point someone was supposed to have a double bladed lightsaber. But one blade was red, the other was blue
- There was supposed to be a new Yoda character. Younger than TPM Yoda, but has a sick beard
- At some point, I think an old climax, has a huge army of like 100s of Red-lightsaber wielding fighters go up against about 20 or so Jedi on a field next to a huge crashed Star Destroyer
- At a different point, the remnants of the Empire used the remains of the Rebel base that was destroyed/mentioned on Dantooine in ANH as their main base of operations. Cool callback.
- Starkiller was originally a new Death Star (dubbed Doom Star), then evolved into a moving weapon that just absorbed/killed planets and then moved on, destroying entire systems. Then went back to a new Death Star. Then a combo (which we got with TFA)
I'll post more later. All of this is from the first 1/3rd of the book. It is well worth the money bros. Check it out.
And here is more:
- Maz's bar was supposed to have a robot-fighting ring where people take bets and gamble and all that
- In the background of the bar there were a bunch of animal trophies like how hunters hang deer heads on their walls. Wampa, Rancor, sarlacc tentacles, and a gungan head are shown
- Jakku, once a water planet, then a swamp, eventually turned into a huge junk planet similar to Coruscant, just a massive junk yard. Obviously turned into a desert eventually
- Hayden Christensen was supposed to come back as a Anakin/Vader ghost who speaks to Kylo
- He was supposed to constantly fade between human Anakin and robotic Vader. Constantly shifting, like a chameleon
- Kylo constantly watches hologram images/videos of Luke just to hype himself up and get mad and hate Luke more and more
- BB8, originally called 'Surly', was sketched out by Abrams himself
- First shot of BB was supposed to be BB, owned by First Order, broken down and not able to be repaired so they throw him in a furnace
- New indigenous sand people on Jakku were basically lobster-people
- Van Sydow's character in the movie, the old guy at the beginning, was originally a super old alien guy
- Jedi Killer (Kylo) originally had his own droid too.
- That giant alien guy with robot arms in the Jakku village that is hauling junk just like Rey is named Roodown
- One of the artists went through the entire alphabet and designed starfighters based on each letter. L Wing, k wing, v wing so on
- Remember that huge hippo looking thing that was drinking water with Finn at the beginning? To get that design approved, the costume team got into that and charged at Abrams when he was touring the workshop
- Originally, Jedi Killer (Kylo) was in on the final battle and used the Force to throw boulders up at the X-Wings and destoys a few
- the First Order attack on Maz's castle originally had the crew in the catacombs beneath the castle when they attack. First Order uses a giant AT-AT-esque drill thing to go through the ground and attack
- Before Kylo's helmet was chrome-accented, it was a metal yellow/gold
- Everyone decided that for the final battle they only wanted X-Wings vs TIE Fighters because leadership decided that ROTJ's final space battle was too confusing with how many types of ships were around
- At one point, the Resistance had this absolutely massive ship called the Warhammer, which was shaped like a giant arrow. Point of arrow pierces shields of a planet/Death Star and doors open in tip to let out hundreds of starfighters. Cool concept
- On the Starkiller planet, there was supposed to be a big chase scene at one point with Snowtroopers in a snowspeeder and Finn/Rey/whoever else in another
- In Maz's castle, there is that huge guy lounging in the chair and the girl who rats on Finn and co. Guy is named Grummgar, girl is named Bazine Netal.
That's it for now. Most of the stuff in the rest of the book is things changed after production/filming started, so nothing too radical I think.
I think the difference is that ANH wasn't filled with mysteries and nebulous stuff, it doesn't really leave you hanging with questions. Among other things, in TFA the main character is a total enigma and it ends with a cliffhanger.
Frustrated_me
Member
Rey's theme.. Incredible.
keltickennedy
Member
We don't know yet if Rey had training or not. She was left on a planet by someone for some reason. Was Luke training kids before Kyle went bad? I remember Kyle reading her mind and talking about an island and an ocean. Did Luke separate the remaining children and attempted to wipe their minds?
ryutaro's mama
Member
That reminds me. It would have been SOOOOOO awesome if Poe mentioned he learned to be the great pilot he is today under the instruction of Wedge.
If Snoke is going to be a new character at least do something new with him. Right now he is Palpatine 2.0 while being half as menacing. He is already pulling the bring her to me so she can replace you bullshit.
At least Palpatine would have super motivation after having his Sith Empire destroyed to really want to fuck the skywalkers over.
At least Palpatine would have super motivation after having his Sith Empire destroyed to really want to fuck the skywalkers over.
oh my god. such fail
wholly disagree.
That would go against everything we know about Star Wars though.
Spehornoob
Member
Okay, I gotta ask, because I swear to God I heard it but no one else I was with in the theater did.
When Rey was having the "flashback" moment when she touched Luke's saber, did anyone else hear an Obi-Wan Kenobi-esque voice say "Rey"?
I swear to got I heard some Alec Guinness soundalike say "Rey".
When Rey was having the "flashback" moment when she touched Luke's saber, did anyone else hear an Obi-Wan Kenobi-esque voice say "Rey"?
I swear to got I heard some Alec Guinness soundalike say "Rey".
Glass Shark
Banned
Oh btw for anyone who didn't see, it's confirmed that Snap (Greg Grunberg's character) is Temmin from Aftermath. Cool connection.
I personally don't think Kylo getting a beat down is jarring, at all.
For a start, there's the Bowcaster shot, a weapon we've seen send stormtroopers flying.
Then there's the nature of the character; bad tempered and emotionally unstable. He admits to his dad that he's going through an internal conflict, being "torn apart". Killing Han, which he thought would bring closure, seemed to do the exact opposite. Couple that with the fact that he's partly responsible for failing Snoke, his master, it's fair to say his head is fucked by the time he reaches the forest.
I love that whole scene; it's so raw and emotional. He immediately lashes out a Rey, and Finn confronts the demon he was trying to run away from. He went to Starkiller base purely to rescue Rey, not confront Kylo. In that duel, he's always on the defensive, and only gets a hit in on his shoulder as Kylo's getting wreckless. Kylo responds and burns Finn's shoulder, before totally overpowering him and nearly cutting him in half.
The first half of the Rey fight is all Kylo; she's back peddling till they reach the chasm edge. Only then, once the Rey realizes her latest ally (the Force) can help her, is Kylo bested. Now there's an obvious boost Rey gets from further unlocking her potential, but by now Kylo is wounded in multiple places, and totally losing it. We saw his reaction to even mentioning "a girl". There's a history there, and an established fear. Though nothing was said, I'd speculate that he or Snoke have foreseen the threat she poses. He acknowledges her potential on the ledge, asking her to be trained by him, but is denied.
For a mentally unstable, wounded, emotional, wreckless and arrogant character to lose in a quick flurry of defiance, isn't too far fetched IMO.
For a start, there's the Bowcaster shot, a weapon we've seen send stormtroopers flying.
Then there's the nature of the character; bad tempered and emotionally unstable. He admits to his dad that he's going through an internal conflict, being "torn apart". Killing Han, which he thought would bring closure, seemed to do the exact opposite. Couple that with the fact that he's partly responsible for failing Snoke, his master, it's fair to say his head is fucked by the time he reaches the forest.
I love that whole scene; it's so raw and emotional. He immediately lashes out a Rey, and Finn confronts the demon he was trying to run away from. He went to Starkiller base purely to rescue Rey, not confront Kylo. In that duel, he's always on the defensive, and only gets a hit in on his shoulder as Kylo's getting wreckless. Kylo responds and burns Finn's shoulder, before totally overpowering him and nearly cutting him in half.
The first half of the Rey fight is all Kylo; she's back peddling till they reach the chasm edge. Only then, once the Rey realizes her latest ally (the Force) can help her, is Kylo bested. Now there's an obvious boost Rey gets from further unlocking her potential, but by now Kylo is wounded in multiple places, and totally losing it. We saw his reaction to even mentioning "a girl". There's a history there, and an established fear. Though nothing was said, I'd speculate that he or Snoke have foreseen the threat she poses. He acknowledges her potential on the ledge, asking her to be trained by him, but is denied.
For a mentally unstable, wounded, emotional, wreckless and arrogant character to lose in a quick flurry of defiance, isn't too far fetched IMO.
WHAT. That's so cool.
MMBosstones86
Member
Really enjoyed it. Surprised that the hype held up for me. Loved the new characters and thought they mostly nailed it.
I think the Kylo Ren 'reveal' to Rey was the most disappointing moment of the movie. I thought Driver absolutely nailed the brooding bad guy with an anger problem, but when he took off his mask...all I saw was that fucking guy from Girls. Would have appreciated a scar or SOMETHING.
Han dying sucked, even if I figured it was coming soon as we went out on the bridge. Bummed that we'll never get a Han/Luke meet-up.
The story was basically a retread of Ep4, and I'm ok with that. I thought it worked out well and most of all....the movie was damn fun.
I don't know if the Han line about always negotiating first was a jab at 'Han shot first', but it was damn funny.
I think the Kylo Ren 'reveal' to Rey was the most disappointing moment of the movie. I thought Driver absolutely nailed the brooding bad guy with an anger problem, but when he took off his mask...all I saw was that fucking guy from Girls. Would have appreciated a scar or SOMETHING.
Han dying sucked, even if I figured it was coming soon as we went out on the bridge. Bummed that we'll never get a Han/Luke meet-up.
The story was basically a retread of Ep4, and I'm ok with that. I thought it worked out well and most of all....the movie was damn fun.
I don't know if the Han line about always negotiating first was a jab at 'Han shot first', but it was damn funny.
Ren is fucking OP he caught lightning with his mind.
It's just weird that he's inconsistently powered.
I like these ideas, maybe VIII will have them
Answering shit like this is what got us the prequels.
Not everything has to be shown on screen in 5000pt Times New Roman.
half a moon
Banned
Someone needs to make a video of the cut trailer footage.
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