There are certain devs that rely heavily on the "retro" look when in reality they are not talented enough to be able to do 3D game engines. I wasn't suggesting that was the case in this specific game or Fez for example and, but just in the general 2D is way easier than 3D it's the whole reason 1 person can make a "retro" game but there are cases like Dust an elysian tale where it was also 1 guy but he made the graphics and animations gorgeous.
Er...okay. Though if you didn't think that was the case with Axiom Verge then I'm a little confused as to why you brought it up here....
I still maintain that talent and effort doesn't even remotely factor into this discussion. You seem to personally dislike retro art styles, and that's fine, but that's just a subjective preference. And something being more modern in its visual style doesn't automatically make it better to everyone. Like I loved Dust as a game and how it looked, but Axiom Verge's visuals are just as effective and interesting to me, if not more so.
You maybe right in that talent is not the word I should have used in this case, but there are certain games were a lack of talent is made up with "retro" graphics.
I just think that even 1 person can make what I would consider a good looking game like Dean Dodrill did with Dust and not have to rely on a "retro" art style.
You maybe right in that talent is not the word I should have used in this case, but there are certain games were a lack of talent is made up with "retro" graphics.
I just think that even 1 person can make what I would consider a good looking game like Dean Dodrill did with Dust and not have to rely on a "retro" art style.
If you admit that talent is not the right word, then why do you keep using it?
Here's what's okay in my book: "Retro art styles aren't my thing. I wish there were less of them."
Here's where you start to get on the crazy train: "Developers who use retro art styles are less talented. If they were better developers they wouldn't have to rely on retro art styles." Why is this crazy? You're assuming that what you like requires less effort.
Game developers pick the tools they can use to communicate their product. Some developers are more successful than others at doing so, regardless of the art style. But picking a retro art style is not always a benefit, just like going with a more lavish art style like Dust doesn't mean the developer was more talented. If you want to keep making that talent argument, you're going to have to cite some evidence, because you're arguing against several developers with experience with 2D and 3D art who are flat out telling you that you're wrong.
One guy makes a game by himself that currently has a Metacritic score of 88, making it one of the highest rated PS4 games of all-time so obviously he's a talentless hack who had to hide behind retro graphics to hide his incompetence.
Give me a break.
Do you know what we call indie games with retro graphics made by talentless people? Ugly.
There are certain devs that rely heavily on the "retro" look when in reality they are not talented enough to be able to do 3D game engines. I wasn't suggesting that was the case in this specific game or Fez for example and, but just in the general 2D is way easier than 3D it's the whole reason 1 person can make a "retro" game but there are cases like Dust an elysian tale where it was also 1 guy but he made the graphics and animations gorgeous.
It's also a lot of the time just so the devs could say they were going for the "retro" look when they didn't want to put the effort in or have the talent.
2D and 3D art is pretty different, and nobody can put out good 2D art without practice and talent. Nevermind all the other skills to put a game together.
And the whole effort thing? Just no, that is ridiculous and shows how little you know.
Similarly, with the shoulder buttons and triggers used for the drill and other tools, jumping and shooting at the same time is a bit of a fumble, as your thumb hops between X and Square.
You maybe right in that talent is not the word I should have used in this case, but there are certain games were a lack of talent is made up with "retro" graphics.
I just think that even 1 person can make what I would consider a good looking game like Dean Dodrill did with Dust and not have to rely on a "retro" art style.
So you subjectively prefer one form of "not-3D" art style over another, but yet the dev that creates the style you subjectively dislike, objectively "lacks talent" and is hiding it with his game's "retro" graphics? Come on, you gotta see where the problem is here.
The only possible explanation for this madness that I can come up with is that this reviewer started gaming last gen and primarily played FPS games, where the shoulder buttons perform your primary actions. That might lead a person to never develop the basic thumb technique that is essential to so many 2D games.
I can't think of any other excuse for using your thumb tip to hit each button rather than using the knuckle to hit X and tip to hit square.
"Hopping" between X and Square? Does the writer not have a big enough thumb to press two buttons at once? I mean, I was 7 and doing that. Maybe I misunderstand what they are saying.
I just cannot condone this mass acceptance of knockoffs and clones. From Monster Hunter to Dark Souls. This trend of acceptance and praise for games that just rip off the ideas of others saddens me.
I think its cancer on the games industry, because people are more interest in seeing the same thing that they saw over there now than they are in seeing new and original concepts. Guess this is the state of gaming in this age.
To be honest, I thought this was a parody of the guy who said that PSABR literally made him sick and that Nintendo should sue Sony. It makes me sad that it isn't.
And good god, are all review threads like this? The amount of irrational hate is disconcerting.
Anyways, I'm looking forward to buying the game tomorrow. It'll be the first game I've picked up day 1 in a long time (talking years).
To be honest, I thought this was a parody of the guy who said that PSABR literally made him sick and that Nintendo should sue Sony. It makes me sad that it isn't.
And good god, are all review threads like this? The amount of irrational hate is disconcerting.
Anyways, I'm looking forward to buying the game tomorrow. It'll be the first game I've picked up day 1 in a long time (talking years).
I'd say this review thread is pretty mild. I'm glad there's traffic though, so everyone sees the goodness of Axiom Verge on the front page of GAF.
This is easily my most anticipated game in a long while. I was cautiously hoping it would be as good as a full on Metroid game from Nintendo and the early word points to YES. I've even seen some buzz of Twitter of reviewers publicly debating if it's better than SOTN or Super Metroid. That it's even mentioned in the same sentence gives me a massive game boner.
The only possible explanation for this madness that I can come up with is that this reviewer started gaming last gen and primarily played FPS games, where the shoulder buttons perform your primary actions. That might lead a person to never develop the basic thumb technique that is essential to so many 2D games.
I can't think of any other excuse for using your thumb tip to hit each button rather than using the knuckle to hit X and tip to hit square.
"Hopping" between X and Square? Does the writer not have a big enough thumb to press two buttons at once? I mean, I was 7 and doing that. Maybe I misunderstand what they are saying.
These types of games generally stiill cost me around the same price to play.
I'm sorry that I don't have nostalgia clouding my feelings on a whole set of games. I enjoyed these types of games as a kid but I grew up and want new experiences and better graphics, not being reminded how shitty they would look if I went back to them.
It's also a lot of the time just so the devs could say they were going for the "retro" look when they didn't want to put the effort in or have the talent.
To be honest, I thought this was a parody of the guy who said that PSABR literally made him sick and that Nintendo should sue Sony. It makes me sad that it isn't.
And good god, are all review threads like this? The amount of irrational hate is disconcerting.
Anyways, I'm looking forward to buying the game tomorrow. It'll be the first game I've picked up day 1 in a long time (talking years).
I'm not sure about review threads in general, but every Axiom Verge thread seems to turn into this sort of thing. People act like the mere existence of the game offends them deeply in some way. It's gotten pretty annoying.
I was going to wait to buy this game. Because I have too much to play right now. But seeing the high reviews and knowing this game will be on discount tomorrow. I have to pick it up day one.
I'm not sure about review threads in general, but every Axiom Verge thread seems to turn into this sort of thing. People act like the mere existence of the game offends them deeply in some way. It's gotten pretty annoying.
The only possible explanation for this madness that I can come up with is that this reviewer started gaming last gen and primarily played FPS games, where the shoulder buttons perform your primary actions. That might lead a person to never develop the basic thumb technique that is essential to so many 2D games.
I can't think of any other excuse for using your thumb tip to hit each button rather than using the knuckle to hit X and tip to hit square.
I just cannot condone this mass acceptance of knockoffs and clones. From Monster Hunter to Dark Souls. This trend of acceptance and praise for games that just rip off the ideas of others saddens me.
I think its cancer on the games industry, because people are more interest in seeing the same thing that they saw over there now than they are in seeing new and original concepts. Guess this is the state of gaming in this age.
You have a serious issue with "clones", but I've seen you talk positively about Shovel Knight and Fast Racing Neo, both games which are very directly channeling other games.
You have a serious issue with "clones", but I've seen you talk positively about Shovel Knight and Fast Racing Neo, both games which are very directly channeling other games.
It's not like Nintendo is actually trying, at least since... Zero mission?
To me I think it's unfair to compare this game to games like Super Metroid and SotN and say it's better, when they are such different games outside or the general structure and setting (metroid?).
Super metroid is much more fluid, specially with the way the map is designed and the speed booster, space jump, wall jumping, screw attack in mind. All that made it go from a nice game, to OMG I love this game. Specially discovering new ways of reaching places(like breaking the glass tube) and all the different ways you can sequence break the game, like the speed booster with the morph ball or just simple wall jumping, and it still works perfectly.
and damn it's hard to master
But as I said, it's unfair to compare, since it's aiming to be a different game. There is no best game, just two good games and we should be happy for that instead of discussing which is better than the other. I dont see no one discussing if SotN is better than Super Metroid haha
I'm hype this game is getting great reviews, cant wait to play it on my PC, but I guess I'll finish Zero Mission on the VC first? Dunno
I just cannot condone this mass acceptance of knockoffs and clones. From Monster Hunter to Dark Souls. This trend of acceptance and praise for games that just rip off the ideas of others saddens me.
I think its cancer on the games industry, because people are more interest in seeing the same thing that they saw over there now than they are in seeing new and original concepts. Guess this is the state of gaming in this age.
Haha you're right! I think that was something I had scribbled down in my notes when I was playing through the game and never thought to actually go back and reread the opening statement. I'll definitely fix it here soon. Thanks!
